Thought on meaning of AA
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Join Date: Sep 2010
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Thought on meaning of AA
I'm fairly new to the program and have been working the steps. What a difference, the promises are coming true for me. I went to the doors of AA to stop drinking, period.
I found in the steps and turning my will over to my HP a different meaning of AA. In my opinion, AA is about the 12 steps and growing along spiritual lines along with a fellowship and to quite drinking. The main reason for my drinking I found was a symptom. When I got sober, I couldn't stand myself, ridden with self-hatred, resentments, judgements, negativity, remorse only to name a few. I had a sober problem! I ran and hid from problems by the escape of alcohol much of my life. I am learning now how to deal with these emotions, problems sober now where I never dealt with before and subsequently never grew or matured on.
I had a major VOID in my life and that void was my HP. So many things are changing for me after I am filling this void, my attitude, perceptions, defects of character are being removed, etc., just like promised. I have inner peace, not all of the time but sometimes and am working every 24 hours to keep it and grow along spiritual lines. I've heard so many others with a good amount of sobriety say that everything that happened to them, the living hell was the best thing that ever happened to them and it was a blessing. They are happier sober now than they have ever been. I don't want to just "stop drinking" and be miserable, suffering and white knuckling as I see some others are. I want to be recovered, content, happy and change who I am, a personality change.
I spoke in a meeting yesterday on this and another old timer rebutted and said AA was about stop drinking, period, nothing else. He wouldn't be there if it wasn't. This may be his experience and opinion. I took slight offense to it but shouldn't have, it is none of my business. This is another character defect I need to work on.
I've found that my HP is the only one who has the power to help me stop drinking and remove my defects. I still have many and I work every day to try and have them removed. I know it's not easy but it is well worth it, I hope I have the strength to not let other opinions influence what is working for me so far. It's been a short time and I've had some major positive changes happen but I'm stay very cautious because of it. I'm a little afraid that my open mindness at this stage may take in some bad information also
I found in the steps and turning my will over to my HP a different meaning of AA. In my opinion, AA is about the 12 steps and growing along spiritual lines along with a fellowship and to quite drinking. The main reason for my drinking I found was a symptom. When I got sober, I couldn't stand myself, ridden with self-hatred, resentments, judgements, negativity, remorse only to name a few. I had a sober problem! I ran and hid from problems by the escape of alcohol much of my life. I am learning now how to deal with these emotions, problems sober now where I never dealt with before and subsequently never grew or matured on.
I had a major VOID in my life and that void was my HP. So many things are changing for me after I am filling this void, my attitude, perceptions, defects of character are being removed, etc., just like promised. I have inner peace, not all of the time but sometimes and am working every 24 hours to keep it and grow along spiritual lines. I've heard so many others with a good amount of sobriety say that everything that happened to them, the living hell was the best thing that ever happened to them and it was a blessing. They are happier sober now than they have ever been. I don't want to just "stop drinking" and be miserable, suffering and white knuckling as I see some others are. I want to be recovered, content, happy and change who I am, a personality change.
I spoke in a meeting yesterday on this and another old timer rebutted and said AA was about stop drinking, period, nothing else. He wouldn't be there if it wasn't. This may be his experience and opinion. I took slight offense to it but shouldn't have, it is none of my business. This is another character defect I need to work on.
I've found that my HP is the only one who has the power to help me stop drinking and remove my defects. I still have many and I work every day to try and have them removed. I know it's not easy but it is well worth it, I hope I have the strength to not let other opinions influence what is working for me so far. It's been a short time and I've had some major positive changes happen but I'm stay very cautious because of it. I'm a little afraid that my open mindness at this stage may take in some bad information also
Member
Join Date: Oct 2008
Posts: 6,947
Good stuff Sean.
I too have heard those with many years of sobriety who's (spoken) message in meetings is "don't drink no matter what"... sometimes I find that message disappointing....is that really all there is? Where is the message of hope?
It is, of course, requisite to recovery, but it is only that. Sponsors and support groups and SR have given me the message of hope. Sometimes, well, often times, I hear that message in meetings, thank God.
I too have heard those with many years of sobriety who's (spoken) message in meetings is "don't drink no matter what"... sometimes I find that message disappointing....is that really all there is? Where is the message of hope?
It is, of course, requisite to recovery, but it is only that. Sponsors and support groups and SR have given me the message of hope. Sometimes, well, often times, I hear that message in meetings, thank God.
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Join Date: Apr 2009
Posts: 3,095
Powerful stuff, Sean. I came into AA for one reason, to stop drinking. Period. I was desperate and that's all I wanted. And what I found as the result of the Steps was so much more. I didn't want any of that, but I sure am grateful it was given to me.
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Join Date: Apr 2010
Location: CA
Posts: 268
I never understood that phrase, don't drink no matter what, either. If I am powerless over alcohol, then in the heck do I NOT drink? I wish people would stop saying that, it's hard on the newcomer who CAN'T not drink no matter what.
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Join Date: Sep 2010
Location: Mgm, AL
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Most emphatically we wish to say that any alcoholic capable of honestly facing his problems in the light of our experience can recovery, provided he doesn't not close his mind to all spiritual concepts. He can only be defeated by an attitude of intolerance and belligerent denial.
We find that no one need have difficulty with the spirituality of the program. Willingness, honesty and open mindedness are the essentials of recovery. But these are indispensable.
"There is a principle which is a bar against all information, which is proof against all arguments and which cannot fail to keep a man in everlasting ignorance--that principle is contempt prior to investigation." Herbert Spencer (pp568, Alcoholics Anonymous 4th Edition--Appendix II)
We find that no one need have difficulty with the spirituality of the program. Willingness, honesty and open mindedness are the essentials of recovery. But these are indispensable.
"There is a principle which is a bar against all information, which is proof against all arguments and which cannot fail to keep a man in everlasting ignorance--that principle is contempt prior to investigation." Herbert Spencer (pp568, Alcoholics Anonymous 4th Edition--Appendix II)
Abandon yourself to God as you understand God. Admit your faults to Him and to your fellows. Clear away the wreckage of your past. Give freely of what you find and join us. We shall be with you in the Fellowship of the Spirit, and you will surely meet some of us as you trudge the Road of Happy Destiny.
May God bless you and keep you--until then. pp 164
May God bless you and keep you--until then. pp 164
"A.A.'s Twelve Steps are a group of principles, spiritual in their nature, which, if practiced as a way of life, can expel the obsession to drink and enable the sufferer to become happily and usefully whole." Foreword to the Twelve Steps and Twelve Traditions
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Join Date: Mar 2010
Posts: 385
Originally Posted by nacona 
I never understood that phrase, don't drink no matter what, either. If I am powerless over alcohol, then in the heck do I NOT drink? I wish people would stop saying that, it's hard on the newcomer who CAN'T not drink no matter what.
blessings
zbear
12-Step Recovered Alkie
Join Date: May 2010
Location: West Bloomfield, MI
Posts: 5,797
Good stuff Sean... you've got it!
heh, I didn't even come to aa to quit drinking! I came a couple times on my own but didn't come with any regularity until a judge ordered me to be here. I didn't really want to stop doing everything I was doing but I knew something had to change or I was done for.
Little did I know that by taking the action, working the steps, putting others first (as much as I could in those early days) - WORKING the program, I'd get those same promises.
Now, I can't hardly imagine going back to that old life. I HAVE been reborn. It's a heckuva deal, that's for sure.
heh, I didn't even come to aa to quit drinking! I came a couple times on my own but didn't come with any regularity until a judge ordered me to be here. I didn't really want to stop doing everything I was doing but I knew something had to change or I was done for.
Little did I know that by taking the action, working the steps, putting others first (as much as I could in those early days) - WORKING the program, I'd get those same promises.
Now, I can't hardly imagine going back to that old life. I HAVE been reborn. It's a heckuva deal, that's for sure.
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Join Date: Oct 2008
Location: far far from home
Posts: 373
Thats one awesome post Sean, good on you.
Funny thing for me is I came to AA to just stop drinking, it's all I wanted. I went to AA for the second time because the judge sent me, I did not even want to stop that time. 2 and 1/2 years later I am shocked by the life AA gave me and I never asked for it.
I guess my question is this, how do I say it? mmmmmmmm
Maybe DT can help me here, I never wanted anything else other than not to drink, did the steps because of a sponsor who is a book zealot, in a way I find myself resentful of a program (that saved my life) that gives me more than I want. Does this make sense? I sometimes get annoyed that AA is more than a not drinking program.
I believe in everything the book says, but I don't like it, even if I am trying to my best to follow it I am still resenting the hell out of it at times.
Not trying to thread hi-jack but sometimes I read posts like Sean's and then responses like Keith's and DT's and say, why I am not thinking like that?
Funny thing for me is I came to AA to just stop drinking, it's all I wanted. I went to AA for the second time because the judge sent me, I did not even want to stop that time. 2 and 1/2 years later I am shocked by the life AA gave me and I never asked for it.
I guess my question is this, how do I say it? mmmmmmmm
Maybe DT can help me here, I never wanted anything else other than not to drink, did the steps because of a sponsor who is a book zealot, in a way I find myself resentful of a program (that saved my life) that gives me more than I want. Does this make sense? I sometimes get annoyed that AA is more than a not drinking program.
I believe in everything the book says, but I don't like it, even if I am trying to my best to follow it I am still resenting the hell out of it at times.
Not trying to thread hi-jack but sometimes I read posts like Sean's and then responses like Keith's and DT's and say, why I am not thinking like that?
Member
Join Date: Apr 2010
Location: Cary, NC
Posts: 715
Hey Chops I'm going to take a crack I hope you don't mind.
My ego doesn't like change. Not even a little. It thrived off my character defects, my terrible habits and thoughts and beliefs, even if these things were killing me. See, these things were a part of my conception of myself, my self-importance, and by giving these things ups, my ego would diminish. So it fights.
To be reborn, I had to let myself die.
I dunno if that help--just my ESH.
I hope you don't mind.My ego doesn't like change. Not even a little. It thrived off my character defects, my terrible habits and thoughts and beliefs, even if these things were killing me. See, these things were a part of my conception of myself, my self-importance, and by giving these things ups, my ego would diminish. So it fights.
To be reborn, I had to let myself die.
I dunno if that help--just my ESH.
Member
Join Date: Dec 2008
Location: uk
Posts: 2,548
Ive attended AA for many reasons in the past.....
i used to think something finally struck me...
Now i think, i arrived the last time with a level of desperation that truly did open my ears and my mind.....what i had before that was reservations..
maybe that had to happen, to be beaten beyond my own self importance.
who knows?
Silkworth was stunned when those hopeless drunks recovered.
im still stunned.....my wifes still stunned.......my kids are still stunned.
I remember this......"GOD COULD AND WOULD IF HE WAS SOUGHT"
I am no longer sceptical about the 12 steps.....now i have experience and go to AA to give it to anyone that wants to listen.
i used to think something finally struck me...
Now i think, i arrived the last time with a level of desperation that truly did open my ears and my mind.....what i had before that was reservations..
maybe that had to happen, to be beaten beyond my own self importance.
who knows?
Silkworth was stunned when those hopeless drunks recovered.
im still stunned.....my wifes still stunned.......my kids are still stunned.
I remember this......"GOD COULD AND WOULD IF HE WAS SOUGHT"
I am no longer sceptical about the 12 steps.....now i have experience and go to AA to give it to anyone that wants to listen.
12-Step Recovered Alkie
Join Date: May 2010
Location: West Bloomfield, MI
Posts: 5,797
Chops, I've only recently been able to make posts like that and mean them. I might have said stuff like that in the past but it would have only been half-true. ......and don't get me wrong, I have plennnnnnnnnnty of times where I hate my life and hate myself. It's not always a bed of roses.
Sometimes, I start the day out great but within an hour or so I'm nervous, worried, feeling like a failure, feeling like a fraud, convinced I never really will amount to anything, etc. Full of doubt, fear, and resentment. I've learned that's just my psyche (or ego, as some like to call it) bucking this new way of life. I'm still not 100% accustomed to looking for the positives, not focusing on myself but on others, or being thankful for what I have when I really want to throw a temper tantrum over the stuff I don't have (but am DAMN sure I deserve...lol).
Some days....they're just great, yanno. I'm in a good mindset, I'm a "glass half full" guy all day, I do my stuff and help others along the way........and everything ends wonderfully. Other days......well.......they're not so good. MY thinking used to focus on those "off" days and, especially if I caught myself in the middle of one of those bad days, decide I'm a piece of sh**, and then I'd be off spinning into another death-spiral of shame.
I think it just takes practice......and time. I spent probably my ENTIRE first 2 1/2 - 3 years reeeeeeeeally mad at myself for "not getting this stuff faster." Every time I'd catch myself in a resentment, being afraid, retaking the reigns of my life, or not "getting" something in the book that I felt I should have already understood and incorporated into my life, I'd get down on myself.
Long story short, I had to surrender control of my path in sobriety too. I had believed that IF I did these steps I'd get all this stuff....and some of the stuff was missing.....and I was mad as hell about it. Once I surrendered though (ie. Step one for about the 100th time - lol) that stuff started to happen.
...It was like God waited until I gave up trying - and, for now, I think that's what He did. See, I think He knew I was "using" the steps with secretive selfish motives. The only reason I was doing a lot of the stuff I was doing was because I felt AA was a tool to use to GET me happy. I missed that section (well, just disregarded it) that says something about/like (I looked and looked but can't find it right now) my recovery can serve as evidence to those around me of His power and His grace.
Sometimes, I start the day out great but within an hour or so I'm nervous, worried, feeling like a failure, feeling like a fraud, convinced I never really will amount to anything, etc. Full of doubt, fear, and resentment. I've learned that's just my psyche (or ego, as some like to call it) bucking this new way of life. I'm still not 100% accustomed to looking for the positives, not focusing on myself but on others, or being thankful for what I have when I really want to throw a temper tantrum over the stuff I don't have (but am DAMN sure I deserve...lol).
Some days....they're just great, yanno. I'm in a good mindset, I'm a "glass half full" guy all day, I do my stuff and help others along the way........and everything ends wonderfully. Other days......well.......they're not so good. MY thinking used to focus on those "off" days and, especially if I caught myself in the middle of one of those bad days, decide I'm a piece of sh**, and then I'd be off spinning into another death-spiral of shame.
I think it just takes practice......and time. I spent probably my ENTIRE first 2 1/2 - 3 years reeeeeeeeally mad at myself for "not getting this stuff faster." Every time I'd catch myself in a resentment, being afraid, retaking the reigns of my life, or not "getting" something in the book that I felt I should have already understood and incorporated into my life, I'd get down on myself.
Long story short, I had to surrender control of my path in sobriety too. I had believed that IF I did these steps I'd get all this stuff....and some of the stuff was missing.....and I was mad as hell about it. Once I surrendered though (ie. Step one for about the 100th time - lol) that stuff started to happen.
...It was like God waited until I gave up trying - and, for now, I think that's what He did. See, I think He knew I was "using" the steps with secretive selfish motives. The only reason I was doing a lot of the stuff I was doing was because I felt AA was a tool to use to GET me happy. I missed that section (well, just disregarded it) that says something about/like (I looked and looked but can't find it right now) my recovery can serve as evidence to those around me of His power and His grace.
Member
Join Date: Sep 2010
Location: Mgm, AL
Posts: 1,000
Chops,
I've heard that pride is competitive in all things in all ways at all times. Humility is a terrible thing to waste on the proud, and when I started getting sober, the term 'right-sized' used to jerk me out of a restful sleep in sweats and tremors. Or it could have been flashbacks--I'll never know...
Humility is founded upon gratitude, and I had to develop, "A clear understanding of who and what I was FOLLOWED BY a sincere effort to be all that I could." That requires me to learn to be grateful, not great-full, and to accept others' journeys as their own rather than constantly comparing theirs to mine. That 'clear understanding' has come as a result of working steps four through nine of the Twelve Steps, and the 'sincere effort' is coming in 10-12. Progress, not perfection...
I've heard that pride is competitive in all things in all ways at all times. Humility is a terrible thing to waste on the proud, and when I started getting sober, the term 'right-sized' used to jerk me out of a restful sleep in sweats and tremors. Or it could have been flashbacks--I'll never know...
Humility is founded upon gratitude, and I had to develop, "A clear understanding of who and what I was FOLLOWED BY a sincere effort to be all that I could." That requires me to learn to be grateful, not great-full, and to accept others' journeys as their own rather than constantly comparing theirs to mine. That 'clear understanding' has come as a result of working steps four through nine of the Twelve Steps, and the 'sincere effort' is coming in 10-12. Progress, not perfection...
Member
Join Date: Mar 2008
Location: UK
Posts: 4,682
I didn't go to AA to stop drinking...i went to change my life as i didn't know how to myself...they said i had to stop drinking in order to work the steps to change so i did ...
Pay no attention to old timers that make inane and insane statements, there are lots about and thats just the way it is...keep on your path and people looking for what you've got will come to you:-)
Pay no attention to old timers that make inane and insane statements, there are lots about and thats just the way it is...keep on your path and people looking for what you've got will come to you:-)
Member
Join Date: Apr 2009
Posts: 3,095
Originally Posted by DayTrader
Long story short, I had to surrender control of my path in sobriety too.
My experience is that surrender is not a one time deal at the beginning. It's over and over into a continual state of surrender. Just to the extent that my reliance is on a higher power, do I find that serenity and peace. The more I give up control over, the happier I get. The spiritual principle of detachment. Even for my own life and its direction.
12-Step Recovered Alkie
Join Date: May 2010
Location: West Bloomfield, MI
Posts: 5,797
Originally Posted by DayTrader
I missed that section (well, just disregarded it) that says something about/like (I looked and looked but can't find it right now) my recovery can serve as evidence to those around me of His power and His grace.
Take away my difficulties, that victory over them may bear witness to those I would help of Thy Power, Thy Love, and Thy Way of life.
Adventures In SpaceTime
Join Date: Jun 2008
Location: Ottawa, Canada
Posts: 5,827
Originally Posted by Sean4988
I'm fairly new to the program and have been working the steps. What a difference, the promises are coming true for me. I went to the doors of AA to stop drinking, period.
I spoke in a meeting yesterday on this and another old timer rebutted and said AA was about stop drinking, period, nothing else. He wouldn't be there if it wasn't. This may be his experience and opinion. I took slight offense to it but shouldn't have, it is none of my business. This is another character defect I need to work on.
I've found that my HP is the only one who has the power to help me stop drinking and remove my defects. I still have many and I work every day to try and have them removed. I know it's not easy but it is well worth it, I hope I have the strength to not let other opinions influence what is working for me so far. It's been a short time and I've had some major positive changes happen but I'm stay very cautious because of it. I'm a little afraid that my open mindness at this stage may take in some bad information also
I spoke in a meeting yesterday on this and another old timer rebutted and said AA was about stop drinking, period, nothing else. He wouldn't be there if it wasn't. This may be his experience and opinion. I took slight offense to it but shouldn't have, it is none of my business. This is another character defect I need to work on.
I've found that my HP is the only one who has the power to help me stop drinking and remove my defects. I still have many and I work every day to try and have them removed. I know it's not easy but it is well worth it, I hope I have the strength to not let other opinions influence what is working for me so far. It's been a short time and I've had some major positive changes happen but I'm stay very cautious because of it. I'm a little afraid that my open mindness at this stage may take in some bad information also
Great share, thanks. IMO, being open minded will never be a problem in itself, or lead you into greater dangers, please believe that. Sadly, some sorry members (including some old-timers) have closed their minds, and the fruits of their sobriety bear witness to their sorrows. They've become good examples of what not to do with alcoholism nonetheless, and so we have compassion on their lot, we help where we can, and we serve, and we move on with grace. Your taking slight offence, knowing its really from your own defects, and honestly dealing with your own difficulties and then moving on is wonderful, and a joy to hear. Live and let live.
Sadly, not all alcoholics will enjoy sobriety. Too many of our brothers and sisters continue to suffer from alcoholism, even those with many years of staying alcohol free. I have seen sober alcoholics do well for years, then have some horrible tragedy in their lives occur; and they never really get back to where they were. It happens all to often. They don't drink, but they don't really live sober spiritual lives either. They have given up, and yet they have not drank. How sad. I have nothing but compassion for such sorry alcoholics. Alcoholism is a horrible, cunning, powerful illness. I have that illness of alcoholism too, and so I'm always aware of how at risk I am of being lost myself if i don't stay spiritually healthy and fit.
Please completely embrace being open-minded, and do not fear being overwhelmed by others behaviours or opinions, for they shall be easily known by the fruits of their lives, and so you'll always be guided to do the right thing at the right time with help from your own HP. So be of good cheer! Trust your own honest open-minded journey and compassionately be of service to others as you can, and you'll never have to be yourself found lost in that terrible place of just exisiting, of being enslaved between "just not drinking" vs living (being) spiritually sober with an exciting and powerful free life just as was promised.
You're on the right path. Stay with it. Godspeed.
Robby
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Thread Starter
Join Date: Sep 2010
Location: DE
Posts: 48
Thanks everyone for the responses and encouragement, I really appreciate it and am grateful for everyone and SR!
Some of the messages hit the nail on the head for me how I am feeling at this point of my journey. It's real easy to make a committment and surrender fully when your at a low point. That said, I've hit some pink clouds followed by depression, anxiety and apathy.... all over the f***ing place really.
I'm learning every single day some additional insight and messages that my HP is putting in front of me. My main struggle now is going through the peaks and valleys, like DT said, it's not all roses and I've been damn frustrated that it's not all clicking all the time. Letting go and fully surrendering is something I did, but yes, self-centeredness, selfishness is rearing it's ugly head again and again, along with the many other defects and their different forms. It's hard recognizing it at times because my old ways are so ingrained, sometimes I forget that I'm living in a new way now. It really seems like a paradox that in order to ultimately be free, you really have to let go, stop fighting and fully surrender. Like the BB says, we cease to fight anyone or anything.
Some of the messages hit the nail on the head for me how I am feeling at this point of my journey. It's real easy to make a committment and surrender fully when your at a low point. That said, I've hit some pink clouds followed by depression, anxiety and apathy.... all over the f***ing place really.
I'm learning every single day some additional insight and messages that my HP is putting in front of me. My main struggle now is going through the peaks and valleys, like DT said, it's not all roses and I've been damn frustrated that it's not all clicking all the time. Letting go and fully surrendering is something I did, but yes, self-centeredness, selfishness is rearing it's ugly head again and again, along with the many other defects and their different forms. It's hard recognizing it at times because my old ways are so ingrained, sometimes I forget that I'm living in a new way now. It really seems like a paradox that in order to ultimately be free, you really have to let go, stop fighting and fully surrender. Like the BB says, we cease to fight anyone or anything.
Member
Join Date: Oct 2002
Location: Zion, Illinois
Posts: 3,411
Let's stop trying to pick the fly poop out of the pepper. AA means to me, what it means to me. That's it! Of course I came here to stop drinking. I couldn't stop on my own accord. I found out that AA is way more than just not drinking. Having said that, "just don't drink" implies that if I have the urge to drink, I have other options. I stopped being a victom the night I went to my first meeting 'cause I heard in that meeting that now that I'm in AA, I have a choice whether to drink or not. Instead of drinking, I can call my sponsor, I can call friends in AA, I can pray, I can go to a meeting and talk about how I feel, etc. The only way the steps will work for me is if I'm not drinking when I work them.
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