Can I get through step one without calling myself an alcoholic?
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Can I get through step one without calling myself an alcoholic?
Hi,
I have been sober for 24 days, and I'm going to at least one AA meeting a week. At the start I was going to 4 or 5 a week. I am feeling at loose ends with the AA program because I feel like I need to admit I'm an alcoholic in order to move on to the other steps.
I know I can't drink at alland that I need to stop completely. This I fully accept.
But the whole disease thing, and the word 'alcoholic' just does not resonate with me. Mainly because I think my drinking is a personality thing, not a disease thing. I am neurotic, anxious, introverted (you get the picture) and substances are a way to let the air out of the tires, and check out from life. That being said, I don't think my personality is flawed or diseased.
I smoked cigarettes when I was very young the same way I drink. I smoked weed for 3 years the same way I drink. If cocaine was legal and freely accessable, then I'd be doing that the same way I'm drinking. I don't even like alcohol!
The last week I am feeling a little bit of optimism about the future, and I feel that trying to talk myself into the reality that I have an incurable disease is not helpful. And I also don't think it's true.
I am balking at this word: alcoholic. Am I just in denial? Or is this normal? Has anyone had a similar experience?
I have been sober for 24 days, and I'm going to at least one AA meeting a week. At the start I was going to 4 or 5 a week. I am feeling at loose ends with the AA program because I feel like I need to admit I'm an alcoholic in order to move on to the other steps.
I know I can't drink at alland that I need to stop completely. This I fully accept.
But the whole disease thing, and the word 'alcoholic' just does not resonate with me. Mainly because I think my drinking is a personality thing, not a disease thing. I am neurotic, anxious, introverted (you get the picture) and substances are a way to let the air out of the tires, and check out from life. That being said, I don't think my personality is flawed or diseased.
I smoked cigarettes when I was very young the same way I drink. I smoked weed for 3 years the same way I drink. If cocaine was legal and freely accessable, then I'd be doing that the same way I'm drinking. I don't even like alcohol!
The last week I am feeling a little bit of optimism about the future, and I feel that trying to talk myself into the reality that I have an incurable disease is not helpful. And I also don't think it's true.
I am balking at this word: alcoholic. Am I just in denial? Or is this normal? Has anyone had a similar experience?
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Originally Posted by spryte 
I know I can't drink at alland that I need to stop completely. This I fully accept.
Lets analyze your statement. . .
Given what you know, is that enough to keep you sober?
In otherwords, You know you can't drink. You know you need to stop.
With that self knowledge, do you believe you can stay sober?
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What is your definition of an alcoholic?
What is AA's (The Big Book's) definition of an alcoholic?
Do they match?
If, when you try to quit drinking but can't quit for anything like a year, or once you start drinking you lose control over how many drinks you have (not every time, even sometimes, normal drinkers don't typically lose control) you may be an alcoholic.
If you find you need to go to AA meetings to stop drinking you may be an alcoholic.
Have you tried the twenty questions?
20 Questions of Alcoholics Anonymous
It's up to you to decide if you are an alcoholic or not, but it's fairly rare for non alcoholics to wonder if they are alcoholics, usually it's just an alcoholic trying to beat the rap.
What is so important about not admitting you are an alcoholic?
Would you rather be a non-alcoholic that can't quit drinking, which ALWAYS gets worse, or an alcoholic that doesn't drink?
up to you, but yes, in order to recover from alcoholism, you first have to admit you have it, that's the whole point of the first step.
What is AA's (The Big Book's) definition of an alcoholic?
Do they match?
If, when you try to quit drinking but can't quit for anything like a year, or once you start drinking you lose control over how many drinks you have (not every time, even sometimes, normal drinkers don't typically lose control) you may be an alcoholic.
If you find you need to go to AA meetings to stop drinking you may be an alcoholic.
Have you tried the twenty questions?
20 Questions of Alcoholics Anonymous
It's up to you to decide if you are an alcoholic or not, but it's fairly rare for non alcoholics to wonder if they are alcoholics, usually it's just an alcoholic trying to beat the rap.
What is so important about not admitting you are an alcoholic?
Would you rather be a non-alcoholic that can't quit drinking, which ALWAYS gets worse, or an alcoholic that doesn't drink?
up to you, but yes, in order to recover from alcoholism, you first have to admit you have it, that's the whole point of the first step.
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Originally Posted by Ago
Yes, in order to recover from alcoholism, you first have to admit you have it, that's the whole point of the first step.
For me to recover, I had to admit it.
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hmmm....I don't know....I have 'known' this for several years, yet I have not been able to quit. AA seems to be working, but all parts of it don't fit like a glove, so to speak.
I'll give that some more thought, basIam
I'll give that some more thought, basIam
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Originally Posted by spryte
Mainly because I think my drinking is a personality thing, not a disease thing.
That being said, I don't think my personality is flawed or diseased.
I am balking at this word: alcoholic. Am I just in denial? Or is this normal? Has anyone had a similar experience?
I don't think I am any more or less flawed than the next guy.
I am an alcoholic. You got a problem with that word? I am at home, by the christmas tree in front of the fire and my wife is baking, listening to some christmas jazz... I am one grateful son of a b1tch... I am many other things... Father, Husband, Breadwinner, Guitarist... lots more... and, I am an alcoholic... I can't drink at all either...
Welcome, friend.
Mark
same planet...different world
Join Date: Sep 2006
Location: Butte, America
Posts: 10,946
I suppose you could, but then..,. what would be the point?
I've watched people try to dance around the simple, carefully laid out steps
for years.
None of them succeeded.
"We admitted we were alcoholic, that our lives had become unmanageable."
I'm grateful today to be an alcoholic.
It's something that fully explains
my personality
and I know there's a simple
(but not necessarily EASY)
treatment for it.
Becauswe I"m an alcoholic
the sky is just a bit bluer
my emotions are a bit deeper
my LOVE is more intense than others.
For me,
music is that much more spiritual in origin
spring is thatmuch more exciting.
I'm truly grateful for this condition.
I've watched people try to dance around the simple, carefully laid out steps
for years.
None of them succeeded.
"We admitted we were alcoholic, that our lives had become unmanageable."
I'm grateful today to be an alcoholic.
It's something that fully explains
my personality
and I know there's a simple
(but not necessarily EASY)
treatment for it.
Becauswe I"m an alcoholic
the sky is just a bit bluer
my emotions are a bit deeper
my LOVE is more intense than others.
For me,
music is that much more spiritual in origin
spring is thatmuch more exciting.
I'm truly grateful for this condition.
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Thread Starter
Join Date: Nov 2009
Posts: 1,006
Ago, this is embarassing to admit, but I haven't even got a copy of the big book. Someone lent one to me at the meetings but I gave it back and said I was getting my own copy. Answering the 20 questions - I am definately an alcoholic.
I need to get a copy of the big book and read the darn thing. It's hard to argue that this is not denial when I haven't even familiarized myself with the concepts that I am arguing against / denying. I don't even like the idea of having the book in my possession. Oy....
I need to get a copy of the big book and read the darn thing. It's hard to argue that this is not denial when I haven't even familiarized myself with the concepts that I am arguing against / denying. I don't even like the idea of having the book in my possession. Oy....
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For me, this is the essence of powerlessness refered to in the first step.
Setting aside whatever label we want to put on the condition, there is a certain class of drinkers, some heavy drinkers and some not, who are incapable of staying sober on the basis of self knowledge. While our personal escapades may differ, we share this aspect in common. For me, thats the only part that must "fit like a glove."
I urge you to reread the big book starting at "The Doctors Opinion". . . do you experience the phenomenon of craving? Meaning, does your body have an abnormal reaction to drinking in that you desire more and end up drinking more than you intended once you start? Perhaps not all the time, but sometimes. Is drinking for you the equivalent of playing russian roulette?
I then urge you to read "More about alcoholism" . . . read about the man who stopped for a while only to start again after being bone dry for 20 years. Do periods of sobriety lead you to believe you can drink safely? read about jim the auto salesman. have you ever told yourself, and believed, a silly lie to justify taking a drink? Read about the jaywalker. . does that apply to you? What about Fred, the business man. Have you ever started drinking without any consideration of the consequences?
Again, forget about the word alcoholic. . . thats just a matter of semantics.
BTW, I urge you to write out the answers to these questions with explicit examples if you can.
Setting aside whatever label we want to put on the condition, there is a certain class of drinkers, some heavy drinkers and some not, who are incapable of staying sober on the basis of self knowledge. While our personal escapades may differ, we share this aspect in common. For me, thats the only part that must "fit like a glove."
I urge you to reread the big book starting at "The Doctors Opinion". . . do you experience the phenomenon of craving? Meaning, does your body have an abnormal reaction to drinking in that you desire more and end up drinking more than you intended once you start? Perhaps not all the time, but sometimes. Is drinking for you the equivalent of playing russian roulette?
I then urge you to read "More about alcoholism" . . . read about the man who stopped for a while only to start again after being bone dry for 20 years. Do periods of sobriety lead you to believe you can drink safely? read about jim the auto salesman. have you ever told yourself, and believed, a silly lie to justify taking a drink? Read about the jaywalker. . does that apply to you? What about Fred, the business man. Have you ever started drinking without any consideration of the consequences?
Again, forget about the word alcoholic. . . thats just a matter of semantics.
BTW, I urge you to write out the answers to these questions with explicit examples if you can.
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Thanks for your messages, cubile75 and barb dwyer
It's nice to hear people speaking about 'this' in a positive way
I still say 'this' and not the 'a word', but I have some food for thought, and I'm going to get a copy of the big book.
It's nice to hear people speaking about 'this' in a positive way
I still say 'this' and not the 'a word', but I have some food for thought, and I'm going to get a copy of the big book.
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Join Date: Oct 2008
Posts: 6,947
Hey Spryte...
My experience is that it took a lot rigorous honesty with myself, it took some leveling of my pride and much prayer and meditation to get to where I am now, and I have a long way to go... I have learned to be in the moment and thank God for who and what I am...
As Barb said, it is a simple program, but not easy. It is meaningful beyond words and it's a worthwhile journey. Get started now. basIam and Ago had some mighty good suggestions for you.
Mark
My experience is that it took a lot rigorous honesty with myself, it took some leveling of my pride and much prayer and meditation to get to where I am now, and I have a long way to go... I have learned to be in the moment and thank God for who and what I am...
As Barb said, it is a simple program, but not easy. It is meaningful beyond words and it's a worthwhile journey. Get started now. basIam and Ago had some mighty good suggestions for you.
Mark
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Join Date: Dec 2009
Location: sick, sicker
Posts: 1
You have found the rooms of A.A. and like many of us probably earned a seat. Some fellows have "get well cards" from the judge, others a demand from a loved one etc...The alcoholic "mind" is very powerful and in the beginning, mine was very hesitant to the suggestion that I "admit" to my innermost self that I am alcoholic.
I was convinced to a man that regardless of my life becoming more and more unmanageable, I still could someday control my drinking. So, if your not alcoholic your life (most of the time) is manageable, your rested, happy and content. From the way you speak, the seed has already been planted and it will never leave you...I hope you decide to water it.
I was convinced to a man that regardless of my life becoming more and more unmanageable, I still could someday control my drinking. So, if your not alcoholic your life (most of the time) is manageable, your rested, happy and content. From the way you speak, the seed has already been planted and it will never leave you...I hope you decide to water it.
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Spryte
I have yet to meet someone who grew up wanting to be an alcoholic. I knew sometime in me was different and didn't know what. I found my answer in AA. I am a alcoholic. Now for me that means many things but I know I don't have to fit every glove but have common aspects and the 'thinking' and 'actions'.
I am certain IF you are an alcoholic by saying you are will be huge in recovery.
If you are not an alcoholic, why on earth would you posting on this site?
Like I said, for me it was the light bulb moment explaining many things. I don't see it as handycap or but something that can be treated. Oh! And the treatment goes WAY beyond just being sober so be open to some cool stuff.
AG
I have yet to meet someone who grew up wanting to be an alcoholic. I knew sometime in me was different and didn't know what. I found my answer in AA. I am a alcoholic. Now for me that means many things but I know I don't have to fit every glove but have common aspects and the 'thinking' and 'actions'.
I am certain IF you are an alcoholic by saying you are will be huge in recovery.
If you are not an alcoholic, why on earth would you posting on this site?
Like I said, for me it was the light bulb moment explaining many things. I don't see it as handycap or but something that can be treated. Oh! And the treatment goes WAY beyond just being sober so be open to some cool stuff.
AG
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Join Date: Sep 2008
Location: The Swish Alps, SF CA
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If it's just my pride getting in my way of calling myself an alcoholic, the truth of the matter is throughout history everybody I ever found interesting was an alcoholic, this includes great men like Churchill, it includes all the great artists IMO, The Great Authors, and in my present life, the truth of the matter is I find "normal" people boring and without some sort of "program" where personal accountability plays a part just about impossible to have any sort of meaningful dialog or relationship with.
Over the years I have met incredible people in meetings, interesting people, well known people, crazy people, I find the type of personality that pushes things to the edge of the envelope and has pushed so hard they lost everything far more interesting then the man who lives a life of quiet desperation because he never tried anything.
Crazy Mohawk having street people that have PHD's now, filmmakers, actors, singers, professional sports players, the trials and suffering we endured together made our common bond deeper and richer then anything else I have ever experienced, a meeting of AA is the only place in the world we can go reminisce and not know a single person in the room.
Whatever our faults, we alcoholics are witty, funny, well traveled, and have great stories, and we are in great company. From the alcoholic Judge passing sentence on the alcoholic defendent while the alcoholic attorney listens....
The truth of the matter is every single true friend I have in the whole world is a sober alcoholic, I value the friends I have made over the decades over my biological family even, and my life is much richer for it.
I never minded people seeing me light a fire in the wastepaper bin in the bar and then urinating on it to put it out while we all laughed and then going home with a different girl every night even though they all knew my girlfriend, and crashing my car on a regular basis, but I sure was embarrassed to be seen going to meetings.
someone might think I had a problem.
strange values
Come on in, the waters great, and like Woody Allen says, I'd never want to join a club that would have me as a member is all of our motto. so we all fit in.
Over the years I have met incredible people in meetings, interesting people, well known people, crazy people, I find the type of personality that pushes things to the edge of the envelope and has pushed so hard they lost everything far more interesting then the man who lives a life of quiet desperation because he never tried anything.
Crazy Mohawk having street people that have PHD's now, filmmakers, actors, singers, professional sports players, the trials and suffering we endured together made our common bond deeper and richer then anything else I have ever experienced, a meeting of AA is the only place in the world we can go reminisce and not know a single person in the room.
Whatever our faults, we alcoholics are witty, funny, well traveled, and have great stories, and we are in great company. From the alcoholic Judge passing sentence on the alcoholic defendent while the alcoholic attorney listens....
The truth of the matter is every single true friend I have in the whole world is a sober alcoholic, I value the friends I have made over the decades over my biological family even, and my life is much richer for it.
I never minded people seeing me light a fire in the wastepaper bin in the bar and then urinating on it to put it out while we all laughed and then going home with a different girl every night even though they all knew my girlfriend, and crashing my car on a regular basis, but I sure was embarrassed to be seen going to meetings.
someone might think I had a problem.
strange values
Come on in, the waters great, and like Woody Allen says, I'd never want to join a club that would have me as a member is all of our motto. so we all fit in.
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Join Date: Jan 2009
Location: NSW, Australia
Posts: 197
I'm a co-dependent & was a barmaid for many years. I have to admit, I have a soft spot for alcoholics that is separate from my co-dependency.
I agree there's something "extra" & "special" about most of them. They seem, as a whole, to be more intelligent, more sensitive, funnier & more alive than "regular" people.
I've also attended a few AA open meetings & I have to admit I've laughed till I cried at lots of the outrageous "before" stories.
This is not to condone any of the behavior nor to take away from the seriousness of the condition - it's just my personal observation, which may be colored by my own issues.
I guess the most important thing to take from this story is that the brilliant comet blazing across the horizon will eventually burn out & become a pile of ash falling gracelessly to earth. So - celebrate being a brilliant comet, but make sure you have an exit strategy & use it before disintegration!
I agree there's something "extra" & "special" about most of them. They seem, as a whole, to be more intelligent, more sensitive, funnier & more alive than "regular" people.
I've also attended a few AA open meetings & I have to admit I've laughed till I cried at lots of the outrageous "before" stories.
This is not to condone any of the behavior nor to take away from the seriousness of the condition - it's just my personal observation, which may be colored by my own issues.
I guess the most important thing to take from this story is that the brilliant comet blazing across the horizon will eventually burn out & become a pile of ash falling gracelessly to earth. So - celebrate being a brilliant comet, but make sure you have an exit strategy & use it before disintegration!
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Well, I composed a reply to everyone, and it is lost in cyberspace. I thought I clicked post but it didn't seem to go anywhere.
GettinDifferent, AlwaysGrowing, barb dwyer, Cubile75, Ago, and Helenlee - thank you all for your posts. My feelings about this have changed a lot in just one day.
GettinDifferent, AlwaysGrowing, barb dwyer, Cubile75, Ago, and Helenlee - thank you all for your posts. My feelings about this have changed a lot in just one day.
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