For those tortured by PAWS (Post Acute Withdrawal Symptoms) and who fear they might go mad Part 5
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Join Date: Dec 2020
Location: Boston, MA
Posts: 326
Happy Thanksgiving a little late to everyone :-D
The PAWS symptoms coming up after traveling and the beach - normal. I think before getting sober none of us realized how much energy and stress a lot of things we just did normally actually exacted on our bodies. Traveling, while fun, is physically and emotionally exhausting and while you're healing from PAWS you just don't have the regular reserves of a "normal" person. It's discouraging, but it does not last forever. But in the meantime, overstimulation is a real thing and give yourself permission and space to rest when you're having symptoms and feeling worn out - your brain needs it to heal.
Also, for anyone struggling with anxiety and intrusive thoughts during PAWS - caffeine is your enemy. At least for the first two years. I know this is tragic, and if you go to AA meetings everyone is chugging the coffee, but it's just not for you at this time. Caffeine promotes the release of glutamate, which is your number one enemy during PAWS. I did a lot of yawning (and still do) but it's way better than having panic attacks in the middle of Target :-)
The PAWS symptoms coming up after traveling and the beach - normal. I think before getting sober none of us realized how much energy and stress a lot of things we just did normally actually exacted on our bodies. Traveling, while fun, is physically and emotionally exhausting and while you're healing from PAWS you just don't have the regular reserves of a "normal" person. It's discouraging, but it does not last forever. But in the meantime, overstimulation is a real thing and give yourself permission and space to rest when you're having symptoms and feeling worn out - your brain needs it to heal.
Also, for anyone struggling with anxiety and intrusive thoughts during PAWS - caffeine is your enemy. At least for the first two years. I know this is tragic, and if you go to AA meetings everyone is chugging the coffee, but it's just not for you at this time. Caffeine promotes the release of glutamate, which is your number one enemy during PAWS. I did a lot of yawning (and still do) but it's way better than having panic attacks in the middle of Target :-)
Member
Join Date: Nov 2020
Posts: 200
Happy Thanksgiving!
I can confirm Betty's words above are 100% accurate in my case as well. I've been quit as long as Betty, so it's been quite a while. However I went travelling for a few weeks around the US and in one instance I was surrounded by a large crowd of family and friends and I depersonalized/derealized so hard that I had to grab my head, my friend looked at me and asked if I was ok and I just said soemthing along the lines of I got bit by a mosquito on the forehead and I had to slap it. That said, I haven't had a depersonalization/derealization episode in probably at least 6 months if not a year, which is good because that means it's abating, but clearly overstimulation can still trigger it.
Likewise with caffeine. I mostly do not get panic episodes but in the rare instance that I do, it tends to be after I overloaded with caffeine. Like Betty mentioned, it works on the same neurotransmitters as alcohol and it exacerbates anxiety. I try to contain myself in caffeine intake for now AND I try to drink more decaf (ew, I know.)
What I found really helps is drinking lots of sparkling water. You don't want to drink too much pop or juice because it's pure sugar but sparkling water tastes good and will keep you hydrated. I still can't fix my oral fixation where I have to constantly be drinking something (used to be beer and wine, now it's decaf and sparkling water).
Stay sober folks.
I can confirm Betty's words above are 100% accurate in my case as well. I've been quit as long as Betty, so it's been quite a while. However I went travelling for a few weeks around the US and in one instance I was surrounded by a large crowd of family and friends and I depersonalized/derealized so hard that I had to grab my head, my friend looked at me and asked if I was ok and I just said soemthing along the lines of I got bit by a mosquito on the forehead and I had to slap it. That said, I haven't had a depersonalization/derealization episode in probably at least 6 months if not a year, which is good because that means it's abating, but clearly overstimulation can still trigger it.
Likewise with caffeine. I mostly do not get panic episodes but in the rare instance that I do, it tends to be after I overloaded with caffeine. Like Betty mentioned, it works on the same neurotransmitters as alcohol and it exacerbates anxiety. I try to contain myself in caffeine intake for now AND I try to drink more decaf (ew, I know.)
What I found really helps is drinking lots of sparkling water. You don't want to drink too much pop or juice because it's pure sugar but sparkling water tastes good and will keep you hydrated. I still can't fix my oral fixation where I have to constantly be drinking something (used to be beer and wine, now it's decaf and sparkling water).
Stay sober folks.
Member
Join Date: Nov 2022
Posts: 59
I only drink the coffee so that I have energy, but I have noticed that it does effect the way that I feel. Approaching 19 months and although the symptoms are not as bad they are present much of the time. Currently I am eliminating sugar, and attempting to cut down on coffee. I had been drinking 3 to 4 K-cups of light roast coffee daily to help lift my mood, and provide some energy. Currently, the energy void is the most difficult hurdle for me, followed by the morning negative thoughts. I am not sure if anyone else here experiences the following but I am curious to know...I have negative thoughts on subjects that do not have reason to be negative. I am not sure if I am describing this accurately, but on some occasions I can have negative thoughts about a subject/person/activity/thing that is not negative. Your thoughts/responses/experiences appreciated...
Member
Join Date: Nov 2020
Posts: 200
Yeah, morning anxiety is a normal thing (even for people that never had a drinking problem), it's called a cortisol spike, feel free to check out some medical articles on it. However people that have not had a drinking or a drug problem are usually not as sensitive to it. Everything you say is pretty normal for 19 months. It will go away
Penelope
Join Date: Nov 2023
Posts: 7
First Post 🖤
Hello all!
I have been reading from this forum for a few months now and I swear it has saved me. I am making my first post today because I am just absolutely drained and feeling defeated. I am 5 months sober now as of the 21st and PAWS is taking over my life. I keep telling myself this is PAWS and it will go away. It’s just a bad wave. But when these waves come and stay for days on end my mind starts to travel down a dark hole. I start thinking something else is going such as a brain tumor or permanent brain damage. It’s hard not too think that when you are dealing with this torture that is so hard to explain. I have seen numerous doctors, cardiologist and neurologists crying for help trying to explain something is wrong with me. Everything comes back normal which eases my mind back to thinking “this is PAWS” I am currently dealing with dizziness and a dull pressure in my head that remains pretty constant. My eyes have a hard time focusing on things because of the way my head feels. The fatigue that I feel is unexplainable. It feels like I could close my eyes and just simply pass away. I have never felt so tired in my life. I also still feel an out of body experience, I’ve seen some say depersonalization and I would think that’s a good way to explain it. I struggle with brain fog and memory loss. I feel like I’m constantly at battle with my mind and body and I am always losing. I do have small windows where I feel pretty normal but I have more bad days than good. I guess I finally caved and made a post so I could hear some feed back and have it ease my mind.
I have been reading from this forum for a few months now and I swear it has saved me. I am making my first post today because I am just absolutely drained and feeling defeated. I am 5 months sober now as of the 21st and PAWS is taking over my life. I keep telling myself this is PAWS and it will go away. It’s just a bad wave. But when these waves come and stay for days on end my mind starts to travel down a dark hole. I start thinking something else is going such as a brain tumor or permanent brain damage. It’s hard not too think that when you are dealing with this torture that is so hard to explain. I have seen numerous doctors, cardiologist and neurologists crying for help trying to explain something is wrong with me. Everything comes back normal which eases my mind back to thinking “this is PAWS” I am currently dealing with dizziness and a dull pressure in my head that remains pretty constant. My eyes have a hard time focusing on things because of the way my head feels. The fatigue that I feel is unexplainable. It feels like I could close my eyes and just simply pass away. I have never felt so tired in my life. I also still feel an out of body experience, I’ve seen some say depersonalization and I would think that’s a good way to explain it. I struggle with brain fog and memory loss. I feel like I’m constantly at battle with my mind and body and I am always losing. I do have small windows where I feel pretty normal but I have more bad days than good. I guess I finally caved and made a post so I could hear some feed back and have it ease my mind.
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see if this rings any bells for you Short94pennym
https://web.archive.org/web/20160316...r-immediately/
Welcome to the posting side of SR
D
https://web.archive.org/web/20160316...r-immediately/
Welcome to the posting side of SR
D
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Join Date: Jan 2021
Location: NC
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Hi all and especially to "Shortpenny". I can so relate to what you are going through. I had a ton of neurological symptoms in early PAWS like dizziness, numbness, tingling, head pressure and many more like sense of doom and intrusive thoughts. I went to doctors and had lots of tests including an MRI of my brain because I thought I had MS but everything came back normal. All your experiences sound like PAWS to me. Be patient and you will feel better. Just don't drink or that will set you back. Keep reading and posting. This thread saved me so many times and gave me hope.
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Join Date: May 2015
Posts: 32,382
Originally Posted by Short94pennym 
Hi Caramel!
thank you for replying! I have had so much blood work done lately. Everything comes back normal. Do you think these are PAWS symptoms?
thank you for replying! I have had so much blood work done lately. Everything comes back normal. Do you think these are PAWS symptoms?
I'd go with the article Dee linked to
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Join Date: Nov 2022
Posts: 59
GRACEFUL123 did you notice that you worried more about what people thought of you then you ever did prior to PAWS? I can be looking at something which is not related to anyone, and get a quick negative feeling related to someone, which said object is not related to. I also have brain fog revisiting, and the occasional temporary loss of balance for no apparent reason. I thought that I had gotten past most of this, but I guess not..Can any of you remember these symptoms coming and going returning at 18 months and hanging around for a while?? As always I appreciate every one of you!
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Join Date: Nov 2022
Posts: 59
CBS62
Hi all and especially to "Shortpenny". I can so relate to what you are going through. I had a ton of neurological symptoms in early PAWS like dizziness, numbness, tingling, head pressure and many more like sense of doom and intrusive thoughts. I went to doctors and had lots of tests including an MRI of my brain because I thought I had MS but everything came back normal. All your experiences sound like PAWS to me. Be patient and you will feel better. Just don't drink or that will set you back. Keep reading and posting. This thread saved me so many times and gave me hope.
How long did it take for you to feel normal?
Hi all and especially to "Shortpenny". I can so relate to what you are going through. I had a ton of neurological symptoms in early PAWS like dizziness, numbness, tingling, head pressure and many more like sense of doom and intrusive thoughts. I went to doctors and had lots of tests including an MRI of my brain because I thought I had MS but everything came back normal. All your experiences sound like PAWS to me. Be patient and you will feel better. Just don't drink or that will set you back. Keep reading and posting. This thread saved me so many times and gave me hope.
How long did it take for you to feel normal?
Member
Join Date: Nov 2020
Posts: 200
Originally Posted by rothmaninc
GRACEFUL123 did you notice that you worried more about what people thought of you then you ever did prior to PAWS? I can be looking at something which is not related to anyone, and get a quick negative feeling related to someone, which said object is not related to. I also have brain fog revisiting, and the occasional temporary loss of balance for no apparent reason. I thought that I had gotten past most of this, but I guess not..Can any of you remember these symptoms coming and going returning at 18 months and hanging around for a while?? As always I appreciate every one of you!
Yes, all sorts of anxiety, depression and just general negative feelings were present (including worrying what others thought of me), I'm now about 36 months quit and I can tell you it does go away with time.
Member
Join Date: Nov 2020
Posts: 200
Originally Posted by Short94pennym
Hello all!
I have been reading from this forum for a few months now and I swear it has saved me. I am making my first post today because I am just absolutely drained and feeling defeated. I am 5 months sober now as of the 21st and PAWS is taking over my life. I keep telling myself this is PAWS and it will go away. It’s just a bad wave. But when these waves come and stay for days on end my mind starts to travel down a dark hole. I start thinking something else is going such as a brain tumor or permanent brain damage. It’s hard not too think that when you are dealing with this torture that is so hard to explain. I have seen numerous doctors, cardiologist and neurologists crying for help trying to explain something is wrong with me. Everything comes back normal which eases my mind back to thinking “this is PAWS” I am currently dealing with dizziness and a dull pressure in my head that remains pretty constant. My eyes have a hard time focusing on things because of the way my head feels. The fatigue that I feel is unexplainable. It feels like I could close my eyes and just simply pass away. I have never felt so tired in my life. I also still feel an out of body experience, I’ve seen some say depersonalization and I would think that’s a good way to explain it. I struggle with brain fog and memory loss. I feel like I’m constantly at battle with my mind and body and I am always losing. I do have small windows where I feel pretty normal but I have more bad days than good. I guess I finally caved and made a post so I could hear some feed back and have it ease my mind.
I have been reading from this forum for a few months now and I swear it has saved me. I am making my first post today because I am just absolutely drained and feeling defeated. I am 5 months sober now as of the 21st and PAWS is taking over my life. I keep telling myself this is PAWS and it will go away. It’s just a bad wave. But when these waves come and stay for days on end my mind starts to travel down a dark hole. I start thinking something else is going such as a brain tumor or permanent brain damage. It’s hard not too think that when you are dealing with this torture that is so hard to explain. I have seen numerous doctors, cardiologist and neurologists crying for help trying to explain something is wrong with me. Everything comes back normal which eases my mind back to thinking “this is PAWS” I am currently dealing with dizziness and a dull pressure in my head that remains pretty constant. My eyes have a hard time focusing on things because of the way my head feels. The fatigue that I feel is unexplainable. It feels like I could close my eyes and just simply pass away. I have never felt so tired in my life. I also still feel an out of body experience, I’ve seen some say depersonalization and I would think that’s a good way to explain it. I struggle with brain fog and memory loss. I feel like I’m constantly at battle with my mind and body and I am always losing. I do have small windows where I feel pretty normal but I have more bad days than good. I guess I finally caved and made a post so I could hear some feed back and have it ease my mind.
Welcome to the battlefield.
Yes, your experience does not surprise me whatsoever. 5 months is very early sobriety. Do not expect to be 100% well at this time.
Doom and gloom will come and go as it pleases. Same with anxiety, depression, all sorts of intrusive thoughts etc... etc... etc...
I googled "brain cancer", "early onset dementia" and "schizophrenia symptoms" more times than I can remember at month 5.
These symptoms will slowly but surely go away!!!
This will not be an easy journey, it was certainly not easy for me. And it will be long.
But you will come out the other end and you will be happier than ever before because you will value feeling normal so much more than you did in the past. Trust me, feeling normal now during the day without having to drink is euphoric to say the least. You will get there in due time.
Stay strong and don't drink!
Penelope
Join Date: Nov 2023
Posts: 7
Originally Posted by Graceful123
Hello friend,
Welcome to the battlefield.
Yes, your experience does not surprise me whatsoever. 5 months is very early sobriety. Do not expect to be 100% well at this time.
Doom and gloom will come and go as it pleases. Same with anxiety, depression, all sorts of intrusive thoughts etc... etc... etc...
I googled "brain cancer", "early onset dementia" and "schizophrenia symptoms" more times than I can remember at month 5.
These symptoms will slowly but surely go away!!!
This will not be an easy journey, it was certainly not easy for me. And it will be long.
But you will come out the other end and you will be happier than ever before because you will value feeling normal so much more than you did in the past. Trust me, feeling normal now during the day without having to drink is euphoric to say the least. You will get there in due time.
Stay strong and don't drink!
Welcome to the battlefield.
Yes, your experience does not surprise me whatsoever. 5 months is very early sobriety. Do not expect to be 100% well at this time.
Doom and gloom will come and go as it pleases. Same with anxiety, depression, all sorts of intrusive thoughts etc... etc... etc...
I googled "brain cancer", "early onset dementia" and "schizophrenia symptoms" more times than I can remember at month 5.
These symptoms will slowly but surely go away!!!
This will not be an easy journey, it was certainly not easy for me. And it will be long.
But you will come out the other end and you will be happier than ever before because you will value feeling normal so much more than you did in the past. Trust me, feeling normal now during the day without having to drink is euphoric to say the least. You will get there in due time.
Stay strong and don't drink!
Thank you for replying! This is what keeps me going! Knows that I’m not alone and crazy. And knowing that it will pass!
I know everybody’s journey is different. But did you experience a lot of headaches and head pressure? Walking up and down stairs or any type of exertion makes it worse as well.
Member
Join Date: Nov 2020
Posts: 200
Originally Posted by Short94pennym
Graceful,
Thank you for replying! This is what keeps me going! Knows that I’m not alone and crazy. And knowing that it will pass!
I know everybody’s journey is different. But did you experience a lot of headaches and head pressure? Walking up and down stairs or any type of exertion makes it worse as well.
Thank you for replying! This is what keeps me going! Knows that I’m not alone and crazy. And knowing that it will pass!
I know everybody’s journey is different. But did you experience a lot of headaches and head pressure? Walking up and down stairs or any type of exertion makes it worse as well.
Had all sorts of nasty headaches and head pressure. A lot of is anxiety (your fight or flight reflex can't turn off by itself like it would normally because of long withdrawals so it's constantly creating adrenaline and glutamate (anxiety hormone), fun, right?)
Anyways, those stress hormones increase your heart beat and dilate your blood vessels which can put pressure on your brain and cause headaches.
All fun stuff!!!
Once your PAWS comes under some control, you will notice they will go away just like anxiety.
Make sure you drink lots of water though. I know people say that all the time but for recovering folk it's ten times more important. Right now your kidneys and liver are healing and they need water for their regular filtering process and recovery.
Member
Join Date: Nov 2022
Posts: 59
For the veterans of the PAWS war; during the 16-19 month period was lack of energy a large problem? When I was early on in my PAWS war I was anxious daily. Last year when I hit about 8 months into the journey, I felt pretty good. Several months later lack of energy became the most prevalent symptom. Currently I continue to battle the lack of energy, unless (as previously mentioned), I drink a few cups of coffee. Your thoughts?
Member
Join Date: Nov 2022
Posts: 32
Hi, People
23 months Sober!!! One month before "level 2 years"
Before 1 week i had bad expirience with sugar intake.
4 days in a row, 4 choko bars per evening (100gr). I had bruttal cravings for sugar, but it was a trap. After that i was a mess 4-5 days 🤣🤣🤣. I know that this is industrial intake of sugar and its stupid.
Hight sugar intake= dopamine rush=>Wave or feeling bad! 😪
In my 1 year when i ate something sweet immediately after that i had Wave of Paws.
Be carefull with the sugar!! 23 months without drinking and still sugar intolerance.
I wish everybody smooth recovery and trust the process!! 😇❤️
Before 1 week i had bad expirience with sugar intake.
4 days in a row, 4 choko bars per evening (100gr). I had bruttal cravings for sugar, but it was a trap. After that i was a mess 4-5 days 🤣🤣🤣. I know that this is industrial intake of sugar and its stupid.
Hight sugar intake= dopamine rush=>Wave or feeling bad! 😪
In my 1 year when i ate something sweet immediately after that i had Wave of Paws.
Be carefull with the sugar!! 23 months without drinking and still sugar intolerance.
I wish everybody smooth recovery and trust the process!! 😇❤️
Member
Join Date: Mar 2014
Posts: 25,373
Yeah, food is a huge trigger. Lots of addicted people have blood sugar problems and that's part of the original trigger for using mind altering substances in the first place. The substances give energy, happy feelings, explode the dopamine. Of course, then the horrible bits happen later on down the line.
I'd say there are three legs to this stool and all of them are super important. 1.) Good nutrition, stay away from sugar and drink lots of water. Vegetables, protein, fats. 2.) Exercise. Even a 30 minute walk daily is huge. 3.) Sleep. 7-9 hours daily.
It sounds basic, but it is key.
I'd say there are three legs to this stool and all of them are super important. 1.) Good nutrition, stay away from sugar and drink lots of water. Vegetables, protein, fats. 2.) Exercise. Even a 30 minute walk daily is huge. 3.) Sleep. 7-9 hours daily.
It sounds basic, but it is key.
Penelope
Join Date: Nov 2023
Posts: 7
Yesterday was horrible. My partner and I decided to go Christmas shopping, which I couldn't even get myself to be excited for. I woke up feeling anxious, which is normal because I never know how my day is going to go or how I am going to feel. Once we started our day I started to feel spaced out. Like I was there but I really wasn't. My memory was so horrible today, we would be walking down an aisle and I couldn't even remember what we just came down the aisle for. I don't remember half the day it seems. This depressed me so much because i want these memories damnit. We stopped for a bite to eat, steak hoagies and my God did I feel like **** afterwards. My world literally came crashing in on me. My head was buzzing like a mad man. I felt so much pressure and buzzing and these HUGE bouts of dizziness we had to call it a night. I felt like I could pass out. I tried so hard not to panick in that moment while we were in the store. I'm SO thankful my partner is patient with me because it makes me feel awful and useless. Now I lay here again because I can't sleep full of anxiety because I yet again don't know how today will go. I hate it. I wish PAWS wasn't real.
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