Crossing the line from hangovers to withdrawals - a permanent state?
under new management
Join Date: Jun 2015
Location: Calgary, Alberta
Posts: 2,339
Briansy, it doesn't need to be depressing. Sobriety was the best thing that ever happened to me. It has changed my life into one worth getting up for every day.
"especially as I was starting to feel quite healthy and balanced emotionally over the last few days"
Feeling healthy and emotional balance - priceless.
"especially as I was starting to feel quite healthy and balanced emotionally over the last few days"
Feeling healthy and emotional balance - priceless.
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Join Date: May 2012
Location: Wisconsin, USA
Posts: 16,945
Originally Posted by Briansy 
Well, just to provide some feedback on this "test". I regret to say that the transition to withdrawals (even after just one drinking session) does indeed appear to be permanent. I'm amazed that there are not more threads on this phenomenon.
So what is your conclusion from your "experiment"? You have the results but you now need to do something with them.
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Join Date: Apr 2012
Location: northern michigan. not the U.P.
Posts: 15,281
Originally Posted by Briansy
Well, just to provide some feedback on this "test". I regret to say that the transition to withdrawals (even after just one drinking session) does indeed appear to be permanent. I'm amazed that there are not more threads on this phenomenon. I suspect no going back to hangovers. Anxiety, restlessness, depression. All there. Defo not a standard hangover! It's definitely at the point where I'd need to know for sure I had some benzos in my possession before even considering drinking again. A depressing thought but it's certainly a good way for the body to force you to stop.
Admittedly the original premise had me not drinking for 6 weeks and then seeing how I reacted so perhaps I didn't allow my brain enough time to "settle" but my gut tells me differently - especially as I was starting to feel quite healthy and balanced emotionally over the last few days after the withdrawal phase completed - so the brain had settled - just not the part that responds to the intake of alcohol. All very depressing really...
Admittedly the original premise had me not drinking for 6 weeks and then seeing how I reacted so perhaps I didn't allow my brain enough time to "settle" but my gut tells me differently - especially as I was starting to feel quite healthy and balanced emotionally over the last few days after the withdrawal phase completed - so the brain had settled - just not the part that responds to the intake of alcohol. All very depressing really...
i have no idea why ya feel it necessary to "test".
other than maybe terminal uniqueness. maybe rationalization.
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Thread Starter
Join Date: May 2017
Posts: 1,602
Originally Posted by ScottFromWI
There actually are hundreds of threads on this phenomenon, and it was brought to your attention many times right here in your own thread. Just search the site for "kindling" and you'll find thousands of posts on it.
So what is your conclusion from your "experiment"? You have the results but you now need to do something with them.
So what is your conclusion from your "experiment"? You have the results but you now need to do something with them.
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Join Date: May 2017
Posts: 1,602
Originally Posted by tomsteve
beings how there have been thousands of studies on alcoholism and its effects, alcoholism has been effecting people the same way for thousands of years, and theres a thread or 500 here alone on it,
i have no idea why ya feel it necessary to "test".
other than maybe terminal uniqueness. maybe rationalization.
i have no idea why ya feel it necessary to "test".
other than maybe terminal uniqueness. maybe rationalization.
Forum Leader
Join Date: May 2012
Location: Wisconsin, USA
Posts: 16,945
Originally Posted by Briansy
Nowhere could I find any thread that confirmed: once you cross the line, there is no going back.
So the bottom line is - you have your results now. The overwhelming evidence around you shows you that you can never go back to having
"regular hangovers". Your personal experiments confirm this as well.
What is your next step?
Member
Join Date: Apr 2012
Location: northern michigan. not the U.P.
Posts: 15,281
Originally Posted by Briansy
Every case is different that's why. Also, better to learn from personal experience than that of others
or maybe its just a case of terminal,deadly, uniqueness?
Member
Join Date: Oct 2012
Location: Dublin, Ireland.
Posts: 739
Well I drank about a half bottle of vodka yesterday.
And I do not have a hangover today.
I have withdrawal symptoms.
No amount of water and bananas are shifting what I have today.
The rationalising you are doing is not helpful for you.
I absolutely appreciate you want to question your situation and evaluate it scientifically.
But the evidence seems to be that you can't turn this train around.
And in fact, trying to do so is horrible and painful.
I wish you well, comrade.
And I do not have a hangover today.
I have withdrawal symptoms.
No amount of water and bananas are shifting what I have today.
The rationalising you are doing is not helpful for you.
I absolutely appreciate you want to question your situation and evaluate it scientifically.
But the evidence seems to be that you can't turn this train around.
And in fact, trying to do so is horrible and painful.
I wish you well, comrade.
Forum Leader
Join Date: May 2012
Location: Wisconsin, USA
Posts: 16,945
Several posts have been removed. Please use the ignore feature or report posts that are disagreeable rather than arguing openly in the public forums.
We are a community focused on recovery and support, not personal arguments.
We are a community focused on recovery and support, not personal arguments.
Member
Join Date: Jan 2018
Posts: 26
Originally Posted by Briansy
Well, just to provide some feedback on this "test". I regret to say that the transition to withdrawals (even after just one drinking session) does indeed appear to be permanent. I'm amazed that there are not more threads on this phenomenon. I suspect no going back to hangovers. Anxiety, restlessness, depression. All there. Defo not a standard hangover! It's definitely at the point where I'd need to know for sure I had some benzos in my possession before even considering drinking again. A depressing thought but it's certainly a good way for the body to force you to stop.
Admittedly the original premise had me not drinking for 6 weeks and then seeing how I reacted so perhaps I didn't allow my brain enough time to "settle" but my gut tells me differently - especially as I was starting to feel quite healthy and balanced emotionally over the last few days after the withdrawal phase completed - so the brain had settled - just not the part that responds to the intake of alcohol. All very depressing really...
Admittedly the original premise had me not drinking for 6 weeks and then seeing how I reacted so perhaps I didn't allow my brain enough time to "settle" but my gut tells me differently - especially as I was starting to feel quite healthy and balanced emotionally over the last few days after the withdrawal phase completed - so the brain had settled - just not the part that responds to the intake of alcohol. All very depressing really...
You're making yourself sick. Is it really relevant whether you're experiencing a hangover or withdrawal?
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Join Date: Jan 2018
Posts: 26
Originally Posted by Briansy
Every case is different that's why. Also, better to learn from personal experience than that of others
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Join Date: Jul 2017
Posts: 3,027
Originally Posted by ScottFromWI
I've got to be honest Brian, when you say things like this after all the advice you've been given - it's almost as if you are just here to yank people's chains. I don't say that to further an argument, but it simply doesn't make any sense. The concept you describe above is pretty much the textbook definition of alcoholism. Pretty much the entire recovery community and this site is dedicated to helping people accept the fact that you can "never go back" to normal or moderated drinking. Whether it's "can i go back to regular hangovers" or "can I go back to just drinking 3 beers at a time" or "can I go back to drinking just beer and not booze" - they are all the same thing.
So the bottom line is - you have your results now. The overwhelming evidence around you shows you that you can never go back to having
"regular hangovers". Your personal experiments confirm this as well.
What is your next step?
So the bottom line is - you have your results now. The overwhelming evidence around you shows you that you can never go back to having
"regular hangovers". Your personal experiments confirm this as well.
What is your next step?
As someone with just shy of four months of sobriety I need the strength of conviction this forum affords me, as a "real" alcoholic, and as someone who has accepted that and is not in denial, my life depends on it.
I'm healthy and sane today and my family is peaceful in part because this forum is focused on recovery.
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Join Date: May 2017
Posts: 1,602
Apologies for any tetchiness in my last messages. You are right, Scott. It was a pointless exercise. It appears I can no longer do one night of boozing in isolation anymore. It just turns into a several day binge every time now. This weekend was grim and I embarassed myself sending drunken texts and FB updates. Ugh. Back to day one. Got some diazepam to ease the pain of the next couple of days. I was really starting to feel properly healthy again too! Anyway, this is all positive if it strengthens my resolve to stay the course this time. Wish me luck.
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Join Date: May 2012
Location: Wisconsin, USA
Posts: 16,945
Originally Posted by Briansy
Apologies for any tetchiness in my last messages. You are right, Scott. It was a pointless exercise. It appears I can no longer do one night of boozing in isolation anymore. It just turns into a several day binge every time now. This weekend was grim and I embarassed myself sending drunken texts and FB updates. Ugh. Back to day one. Got some diazepam to ease the pain of the next couple of days. I was really starting to feel properly healthy again too! Anyway, this is all positive if it strengthens my resolve to stay the course this time. Wish me luck.
You are a very intelligent and thoughtful person, that comes through in your writing. That can be a detriment at times, especially when we try to "outsmart" our addiction as you have been for a while. You can make real change and it can start today...but you'll have to accept/let go of some of that "control" that we addicts so desperately seek with alcohol or other drugs.
Are you ready? Detox is one thing - sounds like you have that covered. Be careful with the Benzos - hope they are prescribed for this use. The real work starts in a few days.
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Thread Starter
Join Date: May 2017
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Originally Posted by dwtbd
Briansy
What's your plan for alcohol use ?
What's your plan for alcohol use ?
quat
Join Date: Jul 2013
Location: terra (mostly)firma
Posts: 4,823
"I've given up on any plans other than to not do it"
That is actually the best plan, I made a Big Plan, which in essence is the same thing. Learning about AVRT really helped cement that plan for me, check out the threads here on SR in the Secular Connections forum on those ideas.
wish you well and hope to see you around
That is actually the best plan, I made a Big Plan, which in essence is the same thing. Learning about AVRT really helped cement that plan for me, check out the threads here on SR in the Secular Connections forum on those ideas.
wish you well and hope to see you around
Member
Join Date: Dec 2016
Posts: 57
What I've learned/heard
I was
Originally Posted by Briansy
I in out patient a few weeks this summer and learned a lot of frightening things about alcoholic disease progression...and personally I see myself needing to drink more and more to just feel "normal." The best I've done lately is 6 days and after 4 I physically started to feel better but the smallest thing could / does trigger huge anxiety. I think I know I need to give it up entirely or I'll never see my grandchildren. Am 44 and have been steadily drinking more for last 10 years. I can easily drink 4 glasses of wine with no hangover, but always want more and usually drink 6 or 7 if I think I can "get away with it." But I never do...feel sick & sluggish the entire next day and have a horrible headache. I know this is going to stop someday...Q is will it be my effort or by my body giving up? absolutely hear you and thanks so much for your response, but it doesn't really address the issue of whether my "GABA receptors" have been permanently altered or whether it is possible for them to be repaired to the point where I can still enjoy occasional social levels of drinking. I know, I know, people will say I'm in denial. I just want to know if it is actually physically possible.
Member
Join Date: Dec 2016
Posts: 57
Done the drunken text/FB stuff
I'm starting afresh today...that's all I can hope for and aim for...hope you do too. Was suppose to start 2 weeks ago, then last week after my birthday...latest excuse was after dinner with my dad last Saturday. I'll always have an excuse, but I might not be around tomorrow to give it. Stay on this forum and check in when you want to drink. I plan on doing the same. May not sleep much next few days but have to know it will get better, but only if I give it time to.
Originally Posted by ScottFromWI
I may be correct, but remember I made the same mistake many times myself, along with a lot of others here on SR ( and everywhere in the world for that matter ). So it's not really about me being "right"...it's about you recognizing the problem and doing something about it - accepting it for what it is. We can certainly wish you luck but your actions will be much more influential than luck or well wishes. You will find both of those here in unlimited supply.
You are a very intelligent and thoughtful person, that comes through in your writing. That can be a detriment at times, especially when we try to "outsmart" our addiction as you have been for a while. You can make real change and it can start today...but you'll have to accept/let go of some of that "control" that we addicts so desperately seek with alcohol or other drugs.
Are you ready? Detox is one thing - sounds like you have that covered. Be careful with the Benzos - hope they are prescribed for this use. The real work starts in a few days.
You are a very intelligent and thoughtful person, that comes through in your writing. That can be a detriment at times, especially when we try to "outsmart" our addiction as you have been for a while. You can make real change and it can start today...but you'll have to accept/let go of some of that "control" that we addicts so desperately seek with alcohol or other drugs.
Are you ready? Detox is one thing - sounds like you have that covered. Be careful with the Benzos - hope they are prescribed for this use. The real work starts in a few days.
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