Backwards question...
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Thread Starter
Join Date: Feb 2011
Posts: 103
Backwards question...
Hi everyone, I am jumping over again from F&F of alcoholics section! Feel free to browse my other posts if you would like to catch up on my story- the short of it is I am now "spending time" at my mom's house to take some space and get some clarity on my relationship with ABF after trying couples therapy, me going to alanon, me trying to give up drinking to support him while he abstained for 2 months, me reading books and coming here, and that's about it.
While I have been taking my space and reflecting on my relationship with my ABF... something occurred to me. He is trying to make this all about me, me leaving him, me taking a break, me being the one with the problem (problem being, I won't accept his drinking). I have been working my program of recovery, so part of it IS about me. But, I am beginning to feel as though he is not claiming ANY responsibility in this whole thing. The lines of communication are still open between us at this point and there is not any animosity or hostlity, and I am wondering if you all have some suggestions of good questions to ask my ABF to get a better idea of what HE wants out of our relationship. If its satisfying to him. How's it working for him. Because, I'm not ready to simply walk away and take 100% responsibility for it going down. I mean yes, I know I am responsible for my part, and I own that. But what about his part? So, any discussion prompting questions? Oh, and I am asking here because I'm sure a lot of you went through a period of time where someone was trying to get you to stop drinking, trying to convince you you had a problem, and I'm sure that didn't feel good. So- I guess if I were going to rephrase- how did you feel when you were in that situation? How was it working for you? Thanks in advance for your replies!
While I have been taking my space and reflecting on my relationship with my ABF... something occurred to me. He is trying to make this all about me, me leaving him, me taking a break, me being the one with the problem (problem being, I won't accept his drinking). I have been working my program of recovery, so part of it IS about me. But, I am beginning to feel as though he is not claiming ANY responsibility in this whole thing. The lines of communication are still open between us at this point and there is not any animosity or hostlity, and I am wondering if you all have some suggestions of good questions to ask my ABF to get a better idea of what HE wants out of our relationship. If its satisfying to him. How's it working for him. Because, I'm not ready to simply walk away and take 100% responsibility for it going down. I mean yes, I know I am responsible for my part, and I own that. But what about his part? So, any discussion prompting questions? Oh, and I am asking here because I'm sure a lot of you went through a period of time where someone was trying to get you to stop drinking, trying to convince you you had a problem, and I'm sure that didn't feel good. So- I guess if I were going to rephrase- how did you feel when you were in that situation? How was it working for you? Thanks in advance for your replies!
Life the gift of recovery!
Join Date: Aug 2007
Location: Home is where the heart is
Posts: 7,061
Welcome to our Alcoholism forum. It is a positive thing to try and see things from another persons point of view.
I wish I had some real experience to share but the closest thing I have is my oldest daughter, when I finally sought sobriety, expressed her concerns that I might relapse. Each time I would leave the house she would beg me not to drink. I truly appreciate her concern and love she showed me by doing that. I hate the fact that I could never make a guarantee to her that I would not drink but I had to be honest with her since we have always worked on having an open honest relationship. If it was not for her sharing her concerns for me in my early sobriety I don't know that I would have made it to where I am today which is over 10 years sobriety.
I hope you are able to find some answers to your concerns and questions. I am sure someone will be along soon who can shed more light on this than I can.
Again welcome to our forum
I wish I had some real experience to share but the closest thing I have is my oldest daughter, when I finally sought sobriety, expressed her concerns that I might relapse. Each time I would leave the house she would beg me not to drink. I truly appreciate her concern and love she showed me by doing that. I hate the fact that I could never make a guarantee to her that I would not drink but I had to be honest with her since we have always worked on having an open honest relationship. If it was not for her sharing her concerns for me in my early sobriety I don't know that I would have made it to where I am today which is over 10 years sobriety.
I hope you are able to find some answers to your concerns and questions. I am sure someone will be along soon who can shed more light on this than I can.
Again welcome to our forum
i've done my almost
Join Date: Aug 2009
Location: Atlanta, GA
Posts: 1,934
Hi CN-
This is hard to give advice on simply b/c it's impossible to know all the details, but every relationship I ever had was negatively affected by my partying, with 2 major girlfriends breaking up with me as a direct result of my alcoholism.
Now, they weren't angels themselves, but their drinking was nothing compared to mine and I also engaged in drug abuse as well.
At the time, each one broke my heart, and I took it hard, but since becoming sober and working all 12 steps in AA, I'm happy they did. I don't ever want to negetively affect anyone like that again.
Just some food for thought.
Kjell~
This is hard to give advice on simply b/c it's impossible to know all the details, but every relationship I ever had was negatively affected by my partying, with 2 major girlfriends breaking up with me as a direct result of my alcoholism.
Now, they weren't angels themselves, but their drinking was nothing compared to mine and I also engaged in drug abuse as well.
At the time, each one broke my heart, and I took it hard, but since becoming sober and working all 12 steps in AA, I'm happy they did. I don't ever want to negetively affect anyone like that again.
Just some food for thought.
Kjell~
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Join Date: Aug 2009
Location: The Sunny South
Posts: 1,666
Good Question..
My husband asked me to "stop drinking" several times, and several times I did stop drinking.
I am not sure I was completely ready to, or if I did it because I knew my life was spiraling out of control, but, I did stop, for quite a few 24 hours.
However, until I found a program of recovery in the rooms and fellowship of AA, I always had my magic magnifying glass. I chose to look at my hubbys faults, and the faults of others because, well, who wanted to look at themselve and realize they were a mess, as an active alcoholic?
When we are actively in our disease, we never really look at ourselves, our part in anything. We deflect it off to everyone and anything else.
And why not..it was too scarey to look at me, and look at all the chaos I had caused.
Working the steps of AA have allowed me to own my part, my HUGE part in why my life was in the shape it was in. Until I really committed myself to this, I never truly owned up to my part, my faults, my shortcomings.
So...I am not sure if that answers anything for you, but, that is what this alcoholic has experienced.
Peace..
My husband asked me to "stop drinking" several times, and several times I did stop drinking.
I am not sure I was completely ready to, or if I did it because I knew my life was spiraling out of control, but, I did stop, for quite a few 24 hours.
However, until I found a program of recovery in the rooms and fellowship of AA, I always had my magic magnifying glass. I chose to look at my hubbys faults, and the faults of others because, well, who wanted to look at themselve and realize they were a mess, as an active alcoholic?
When we are actively in our disease, we never really look at ourselves, our part in anything. We deflect it off to everyone and anything else.
And why not..it was too scarey to look at me, and look at all the chaos I had caused.
Working the steps of AA have allowed me to own my part, my HUGE part in why my life was in the shape it was in. Until I really committed myself to this, I never truly owned up to my part, my faults, my shortcomings.
So...I am not sure if that answers anything for you, but, that is what this alcoholic has experienced.
Peace..
Your attitude, not your aptitude, will determine your altitude
Join Date: Dec 2006
Location: Oxnard (The Nard), CA, USA.
Posts: 13,955
When I was in active addiction and my family was tying to get me to either see their POV or ask me questions about my addiction, my tactic was deflection. I would do whatever it took to take the focus off of me and put it on someone or something else.
As long as I could do as I liked in addiction and not give anyone the chance to confront me about my actions...I thought I was winning another game call 'complication'. I would try to make any discussions about my addiction so contemplated and confusing that nothing would get resolved.
As long as I could do as I liked in addiction and not give anyone the chance to confront me about my actions...I thought I was winning another game call 'complication'. I would try to make any discussions about my addiction so contemplated and confusing that nothing would get resolved.
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Join Date: Nov 2010
Location: Indiana
Posts: 706
Concerned Nurse-
Not sure if this helps, but it's kind of like this...
Q-How many alcoholics does it take to change lightbulb?
A-Only one to hold the bulb in place and wait for the rest of the world to revolve around him.
Q-How many Al-Anon's does it take to change a lightbulb?
A-None! Change it yourself.
The point is, Concernednurse, we're alcoholics...selfish and self centered to the extreme. I don't know if you can singlehandedly change that. As alcoholics even WE can't singlehandedly change that...we rely on a power greater than ourselves to restore us to sanity AFTER admitting we are powerless over alcohol and our lives have become unmanageable.
My advice, keep working your own program of recovery, and maybe plant the seed for his. Buy him a copy of Alcoholics Anonymous, and leave it with him. Leave it at that for now. If he picks up the book, and shows any interest whatsoever, I'm sure that somebody in Al-Anon could put you or your ABF into contact with an AA'er who would be more than happy to extend a hand of hope.
Keep in mind...you can carry the message, but you cannot carry the Alcoholic.
Best of luck to you,
Zube
Not sure if this helps, but it's kind of like this...
Q-How many alcoholics does it take to change lightbulb?
A-Only one to hold the bulb in place and wait for the rest of the world to revolve around him.
Q-How many Al-Anon's does it take to change a lightbulb?
A-None! Change it yourself.
The point is, Concernednurse, we're alcoholics...selfish and self centered to the extreme. I don't know if you can singlehandedly change that. As alcoholics even WE can't singlehandedly change that...we rely on a power greater than ourselves to restore us to sanity AFTER admitting we are powerless over alcohol and our lives have become unmanageable.
My advice, keep working your own program of recovery, and maybe plant the seed for his. Buy him a copy of Alcoholics Anonymous, and leave it with him. Leave it at that for now. If he picks up the book, and shows any interest whatsoever, I'm sure that somebody in Al-Anon could put you or your ABF into contact with an AA'er who would be more than happy to extend a hand of hope.
Keep in mind...you can carry the message, but you cannot carry the Alcoholic.
Best of luck to you,
Zube
Member
Thread Starter
Join Date: Feb 2011
Posts: 103
How bout these? How he answers these will tell me a lot about what he wants from the relationship.. And if he simply wants a life where he can drink with his friends and "have fun," well, that's his choice and he's entitled to it. Thanks for the info, everyone!
How do YOU feel about everything that’s happened the last couple of months?
Do you think our relationship is emotionally healthy for you? Why or why not?
What do YOU want to see happen with our relationship?
Do you want it to continue exactly as is?
Do you want a break?
Do you want something to change? If so, what?
Do you want something else that I didn’t mention above?
Is it acceptable for you to be in a relationship with me if I will never accept your drinking? Why or why not?
What are your goals in life?
In what ways does our relationship hinder and/or help you achieve your goals?
Is there anything that you do or I do in life that is getting in the way of YOU achieving your goals?
How do YOU feel about everything that’s happened the last couple of months?
Do you think our relationship is emotionally healthy for you? Why or why not?
What do YOU want to see happen with our relationship?
Do you want it to continue exactly as is?
Do you want a break?
Do you want something to change? If so, what?
Do you want something else that I didn’t mention above?
Is it acceptable for you to be in a relationship with me if I will never accept your drinking? Why or why not?
What are your goals in life?
In what ways does our relationship hinder and/or help you achieve your goals?
Is there anything that you do or I do in life that is getting in the way of YOU achieving your goals?
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Join Date: Sep 2007
Location: Atlanta
Posts: 31,179
(((Concernednurse))) - had anyone asked me those questions when I was still using my thought would probably have been "I want to keep doing what I'm doing and you to be here, and stop giving me a hard time about my drinking".
Sorry, I know that sounds harsh, but it's what most of us A's want when we aren't ready to change. I could TELL you goals, TELL you what you wanted to hear, but until I was in recovery and actually DOING the work of recovery, my words meant nothing.
I've been on both sides of the fence..have three XABF's, and I had to learn, the hard way, that it doesn't really matter what they say..it's what they do. If he has goals, he would probably be working on them.
I just don't think any answers you get are going to satisfy you, as he is still at the point that it's all YOUR fault, and doesn't seem to be accepting any responsibility for his actions that brought you to this point.
Hugs and prayers,
Amy
Sorry, I know that sounds harsh, but it's what most of us A's want when we aren't ready to change. I could TELL you goals, TELL you what you wanted to hear, but until I was in recovery and actually DOING the work of recovery, my words meant nothing.
I've been on both sides of the fence..have three XABF's, and I had to learn, the hard way, that it doesn't really matter what they say..it's what they do. If he has goals, he would probably be working on them.
I just don't think any answers you get are going to satisfy you, as he is still at the point that it's all YOUR fault, and doesn't seem to be accepting any responsibility for his actions that brought you to this point.
Hugs and prayers,
Amy
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Join Date: Nov 2010
Location: Indiana
Posts: 706
You know the saying "Be careful what you ask for..."
I'm sorry, I don't know that I'll ever feel your pain, but I know that I've caused pain that you are feeling.
If you gave me a list like that while I was drinking I'd have used it as a coaster for my beer. But again, remember that you are dealing with an alcoholic, selfish and self-centered to the extreme.
I don't know, maybe I'm wrong...try the list...but at least run the list by your Al-Anon group first. My wife goes to Al-Anon, and I have a huge amount of respect for their opinion on alcoholisma nd the alcoholic.
Best Wishes,
Zube
Zube
I'm sorry, I don't know that I'll ever feel your pain, but I know that I've caused pain that you are feeling.
If you gave me a list like that while I was drinking I'd have used it as a coaster for my beer. But again, remember that you are dealing with an alcoholic, selfish and self-centered to the extreme.
I don't know, maybe I'm wrong...try the list...but at least run the list by your Al-Anon group first. My wife goes to Al-Anon, and I have a huge amount of respect for their opinion on alcoholisma nd the alcoholic.
Best Wishes,
Zube
Zube
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Thread Starter
Join Date: Feb 2011
Posts: 103
Originally Posted by Impurrfect 
(((Concernednurse))) - had anyone asked me those questions when I was still using my thought would probably have been "I want to keep doing what I'm doing and you to be here, and stop giving me a hard time about my drinking".
Sorry, I know that sounds harsh, but it's what most of us A's want when we aren't ready to change.
Sorry, I know that sounds harsh, but it's what most of us A's want when we aren't ready to change.
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Thread Starter
Join Date: Feb 2011
Posts: 103
Added, i mean if he answers like this:
I feel like you've really needed to get some help for yourself over the last couple months to protect yourself because you were upset by my drinking.
Yes, I think our relationship is emotionally healthy (well this would be delusional, because its not)
What do you want to see happen? Nothing, I like it the way it is
Would you change anything? No
Is it acceptable for you to be in a relationship with someone who will never accept your drinking? if he says yes here, says a lot about what he's willing to settle for.
What are your goals? to marry you and have children.
How does our relationship help or hinder those goals? It helps because you have the same goals, we both want to be married and have children.
Does our relationship hinder those goals? No-- again, if he answered this way it would be delusion because our relationship is just about over because I can't accept the drinking.
So you see, its just a matter of getting him to be honest about his responsibility in the matter-- or if nothing else, to allow me to realize that when presented with the opportunity to be open and honest without judgement and reaction, if he still deludes himself, I will have my answers. I am not looking for the answers I WANT, I am truth seeking!
I feel like you've really needed to get some help for yourself over the last couple months to protect yourself because you were upset by my drinking.
Yes, I think our relationship is emotionally healthy (well this would be delusional, because its not)
What do you want to see happen? Nothing, I like it the way it is
Would you change anything? No
Is it acceptable for you to be in a relationship with someone who will never accept your drinking? if he says yes here, says a lot about what he's willing to settle for.
What are your goals? to marry you and have children.
How does our relationship help or hinder those goals? It helps because you have the same goals, we both want to be married and have children.
Does our relationship hinder those goals? No-- again, if he answered this way it would be delusion because our relationship is just about over because I can't accept the drinking.
So you see, its just a matter of getting him to be honest about his responsibility in the matter-- or if nothing else, to allow me to realize that when presented with the opportunity to be open and honest without judgement and reaction, if he still deludes himself, I will have my answers. I am not looking for the answers I WANT, I am truth seeking!
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Join Date: Aug 2009
Location: The Sunny South
Posts: 1,666
concernednurse..
If he is an active alcoholic, the truth isn't in him, it wasn't in any of us.
We can't be honest with our loved ones, because we can't be honest with ourselves.
We don't want to lose our loved ones...
But, if truly addicted our choice in drinking/using in no longer a choice. It is our lifes blood, for to be without it, means withdrawal, fear, etc...
If he is drinking, the choice is yours to stay with him or not.
It is also his choice to stop drinking or not.
That plain, and that simple.
If he is an active alcoholic, the truth isn't in him, it wasn't in any of us.
We can't be honest with our loved ones, because we can't be honest with ourselves.
We don't want to lose our loved ones...
But, if truly addicted our choice in drinking/using in no longer a choice. It is our lifes blood, for to be without it, means withdrawal, fear, etc...
If he is drinking, the choice is yours to stay with him or not.
It is also his choice to stop drinking or not.
That plain, and that simple.
Canine Welfare Advocate
Join Date: Sep 2010
Location: Norfolk, VA
Posts: 10,962
Are you prepared NOT to get the answers you seek (for the reasons anewaugust has pointed out regarding honesty), because more than likely, you aren't.
You can no more align his thinking to yours than you can make him stop drinking.
So stop. Answer your own questions and move on from there.
Good luck.
You can no more align his thinking to yours than you can make him stop drinking.
So stop. Answer your own questions and move on from there.
Good luck.
Canine Welfare Advocate
Join Date: Sep 2010
Location: Norfolk, VA
Posts: 10,962
Originally Posted by concernednurse
So in other words, I can choose to walk away from the relationship taking 100% of the blame for the downfall, or choose to stay. Sucks.
Member
Join Date: Aug 2009
Location: The Sunny South
Posts: 1,666
If you choose to walk away, because you have decided that who and what he is, isn't what you are seeking in a partner, that is simply a choice.
No blame needs to be assigned, no he did, you didn't kind of thing. If he drinks alcholically, and that is a dealbreaker in a realtionship for you, then, there is your answer.
Your decision can only be based on the here and now, what you already know.
When we are actively drinking, we almost live in a fantasy land. We want you, but, we don't want to give you up alcohol. Ask us to change...well, we want to know why you can't accept that is who we are.
It is just addiction at its finest.
No blame needs to be assigned, no he did, you didn't kind of thing. If he drinks alcholically, and that is a dealbreaker in a realtionship for you, then, there is your answer.
Your decision can only be based on the here and now, what you already know.
When we are actively drinking, we almost live in a fantasy land. We want you, but, we don't want to give you up alcohol. Ask us to change...well, we want to know why you can't accept that is who we are.
It is just addiction at its finest.
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Join Date: Oct 2009
Posts: 694
i didnt quit till my wife left, i had all those questions asked... i never wanted change, things were perfect in my sick mind.
i kept promising this was it, after this weekend, then since i was quiting i would just drink this last week but it never ended until she walked out, i pleaded with her but she walk out, i finanly realized i wanted her more than the booze.
ive been sober for 72 days, and i have had many excuses to go back to drinking, i am having a really hard time now but i know that i would only be re-setting what i have worked so hard for if i gave in, she may walk out forever next time.
i dont know that leaving is the right answer for you but if my wife had not left, id still be drinking.
i kept promising this was it, after this weekend, then since i was quiting i would just drink this last week but it never ended until she walked out, i pleaded with her but she walk out, i finanly realized i wanted her more than the booze.
ive been sober for 72 days, and i have had many excuses to go back to drinking, i am having a really hard time now but i know that i would only be re-setting what i have worked so hard for if i gave in, she may walk out forever next time.
i dont know that leaving is the right answer for you but if my wife had not left, id still be drinking.
Member
Join Date: Aug 2009
Location: The Sunny South
Posts: 1,666
Concernednurse..
I can feel the love and compassion in your post for your BF. I am truly sorry that you are in relationship with someone who is an alcoholic.
I wish I could give you some magic insight into our minds that would help ease what you are going thru. Sadly, I can't.
Each of us had to hit our own bottoms, then, and only then could we begin to recover.
It just doesn't sound like your ABF is ready to stop drinking and recover.
The best advice I can give you is to detach as best you can from him, and continue on your journey to recovery.
Stepping out of the way of the alcoholic and their choice may just allow him to find his bottom, or not.
I can feel the love and compassion in your post for your BF. I am truly sorry that you are in relationship with someone who is an alcoholic.
I wish I could give you some magic insight into our minds that would help ease what you are going thru. Sadly, I can't.
Each of us had to hit our own bottoms, then, and only then could we begin to recover.
It just doesn't sound like your ABF is ready to stop drinking and recover.
The best advice I can give you is to detach as best you can from him, and continue on your journey to recovery.
Stepping out of the way of the alcoholic and their choice may just allow him to find his bottom, or not.
Member
Join Date: Jan 2011
Location: God's Grace
Posts: 2,464
If he is still drinking...then he is not rational...and if he chooses to get sober...he may not be rational for awhile either...it takes awhile once getting sober for the brain to clear out. All my prayers that you may find peace and happiness in your decisions.
SR Fan
Join Date: Apr 2010
Location: Mississippi
Posts: 7,910
I think your list of questions are good questions, but it seems that those same questions are the ones you're really asking of yourself......
I can feel the limbo you're in and I've been there (it's miserable!)..... it would be nice to have someone tell us what to do, or be able to look down the road and see how things work out, but there's a lot more messy, gray area in life than black and white.
I read a few of your posts - is your bf drinking again or is he still sober? Even aside from the drinking, do you trust him in general? Does he hide things from you?
I'm throwing some thoughts out here, which may or may not be valid/helpful. I truly do hope you can find the answers you need......:ghug3
How do YOU feel about everything that’s happened the last couple of months?
Do you think our relationship is emotionally healthy for you? Why or why not?
What do YOU want to see happen with our relationship?
Do you want it to continue exactly as is?
Do you want a break?
Do you want something to change? If so, what?
Do you want something else that I didn’t mention above?
Is it acceptable for you to be in a relationship with me if I will never accept your drinking? Why or why not?
What are your goals in life?
In what ways does our relationship hinder and/or help you achieve your goals?
Is there anything that you do or I do in life that is getting in the way of YOU achieving your goals?
Do you think our relationship is emotionally healthy for you? Why or why not?
What do YOU want to see happen with our relationship?
Do you want it to continue exactly as is?
Do you want a break?
Do you want something to change? If so, what?
Do you want something else that I didn’t mention above?
Is it acceptable for you to be in a relationship with me if I will never accept your drinking? Why or why not?
What are your goals in life?
In what ways does our relationship hinder and/or help you achieve your goals?
Is there anything that you do or I do in life that is getting in the way of YOU achieving your goals?
I read a few of your posts - is your bf drinking again or is he still sober? Even aside from the drinking, do you trust him in general? Does he hide things from you?
I'm throwing some thoughts out here, which may or may not be valid/helpful. I truly do hope you can find the answers you need......:ghug3
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