Don W

Hi, Thought I'd put this out for feedback.
I am approaching 6 months. I remember this happening before when I put some time together but, was told it shouldn't matter. After I am off alcohol for a length of time I start to have problems with products that contain any form of alcohol.Not, just aftershave but, soap, hand lotion etc. My wife bought some liquid soap and I was having problems with jitters, rash etc.I read the back of the bottle and there were about 5 or 6 ingredients that were alcohol based. I have noticed the same problem at the hospital with alcohol based hand sanitizers. I know I had a problem with Old Spice. I changed to alcohol free Old Spice and I no longer had these red bloches on my face. Sometimes I look
and feel like I have been drinking after their use. I started to check and I was surprised to find how many things we had in the house with alcohol. I guess my question is can my body become so sensitive to alcoho that it reacts to the smallest amount? Could this cofirm that I in fact have an allergy to alcohol. With all the alcohol I drank it is hard to believe that a little in a bottle of soap
cause a problem. Although, I've heard of people on anti-buse having a reaction to aftershave. Do any of you have this problem or the symptoms and didn't make the connection? Like I said a counslor at the VA told me she never heard of it. I will check in Thursday night. Anyway, I am going to start reading the labels and buy alcohol free
products. I will then see if all my symptoms dissappear. Don Wl

Peter

I never gave much thought to products containing alcohol before I stopped drinking. Then after only a few weeks sober I noticed I was developing a very close relationship with a bottle of listerine. I was washing my mouth with listerine a dozen times a day before I realized the product was alcohol based. Since then I have become a lot more vigilant of the products I use.
Even so called "non alcoholic beveragges" sometimes contain small amounts of alcohol.

Vanilla extract contains alcohol. So does angostura bitters.Some breath freshish gum also contains alcohol so it is really very important to watch what I consume. Not that I will relapse if I happen to pop a piece of gum in my mouth but remaining vigilant is a good exercise for me and it can only help me in maintaining a good recovery programme.

DolphinBlue

The thing that took me by suprise was Angostura Bitters. I had two of those a couple of months apart without realising it contained alcohol. A lot too! Something like 44.7% Of course I freaked out when I found out and it was interesting how quick my head was to tell me "see Amy, you CAN have just one drink, you're not like them - just as you suspected." But I think that because such a tiny amount is used, it hardly counts as a drink.

Anyway, I am a lot more vigilant and although I doubt that tiny amounts can cause a problem, I don't know for sure. Its a lot easier to steer clear of any alcohol than to try and guess how much will trigger me and how much I can get away with. And a lot less risky.

Amy

Jayhay

Hi Don,

It surely sounds like some kind of reaction to the alcohol. It could be an allergy, but like you said after so many years of use, it's surprising that such a little topical application would cause a reaction.

The only other thing I can think of would be an interaction with a medication you are taking. Antabuse surely can cause reactions to tiny amounts of alcohol - even in lotions, cough syrups, etc. But I don't recall you saying you were taking that. Could it be interacting with some other meds? Prescribed or OTC? Or some vitamins, herbs, etc? I'm not anywhere close to being in the medical field, but I would suggest investigating that. Perhaps a pharmacist an/or a dermatologist would be of some help?

Jayhay

Chy

I've heard of that happening with people who take antabuse but not after getting sober.

Though I don't go checking out all lables I do remain cautious especially around the sweets, cakes, and cookies. I can smell it a mile away now... where in the past people could probably smell me a mile a way! *LOL*

Music

Hi all,
Please don't take this the wrong way. I'm in no way condoning the use of alcohol, saying that anyone who is cautious is crazy, or that any and all of us shouldn't be careful. However, as I understand it, alcoholism is a three fold disease. Physical, mental, and spiritual. I've taken communion with grapejuice(preferred)and the real stuff(wine.) When grapejuice is used, I drink from the cup. If wine is used, I dip instead of sip. My choice. The first time I took communion, I was with my sponsor on Christmas Eve about 20 years ago. I came back to my seat scared to death because I had just sipped some wine. I expressed my fear to him and he said simply, "remember where you are and why you're here." I knew what he meant. I believe that for me to go back out, there has to be a sequence of events that will lead me back out. I will have to revert back into the disease, spiritually, mentally, and finally physically. The Big Book talks about being fit spiritually and I would add, mentally. The physical damage would occur after I take that first drink. If I injest anything with the knowledge that there's alcohol in it and with the intention of copping a high, I'm well on the way. That sequence of events has taken place and if I don't do something quick, the next step is a drink. That's my belief. I don't believe in enduring pain just for the sake of my sobriety date. I don't believe in not eatting something for that same reason....besides, by the time it gets to me the alcohol has cooked out of it. Just the taste may or may not remain.
In short, my motives are what I have to be in check with at all times. I have to be vigilant about where I'm at mentally and spiritually. I believe that God and AA eventually lead me to a way of life that is as "normal" as my life can be short of taking that first drink. I, in no way believe that God and AA mean for me to run fearful, full of paranoia for the rest of my life. This does not mean that I take anything over the counter indiscriminately. On the contrary, I seldom take anything, including aspirin or the non stuff. What it does mean is that when I do take something, I take it properly, according to the directions.
Now, this is my thing and I don't expect anyone else to grab on for the ride. This is my take, and it's worked well for some time now.

Don W

Thanks for your postings. Like I said it may not make a difference. I was looking at some of the aftershave, looking for alcohol free. Some of that stuff is 40 percent or more. It has only been 3 days but, I feel better. Maybe it is just in my head , it's good to have something in there these days. Someone even told me the companies put alcohol in the hand creams etc., to dry you out so you'll buy more. Don W

Chy

Thanks for that Music! I have avoided taking the communal wine at mass out of fear. Now I have some peace on this matter.

3donut-ed

I feel the same about this topic as Music but I know people who cannot tolerate any alcohol in their aftershave or anything else. I guess some alcoholics are more sensitive to it than others.The only thing I avoid is so called "non-alcoholic beer" since it does contain a very small percentage of alcohol.

A couple of years into my sobriety I tried drinking an occasional NA beer because "it tasted good with pizza" Then I tried drinking two in a row on an empty stomach which was obviously "with the knowledge that there's alcohol in it and with the intention of copping a high" Fortunately for me it had no effect except that it made me realize that I was dancing with the devil so I have never picked up another one.

Jayhay

Hi,

I am early in recovery, and may not always think this way - but - I think that each person is going to react differently to a tiny amount of alcohol in various products. I would never think that eating something that had wine in it, such as a stew or soup, or marinade for meat, would be a "violation" of sobriety. If your body reacts to it, then obviously stay away from it. If your body reacts to lotions, or what have you, don't use it.

As far as NA beer, If a person recovering from alcoholism wants to drink a couple, or even a few NA beers - fine! Unless they go way overboard and start drinking like 24 NA beers to feel a little buzz - that's crazy of course. The amount of alcohol in NA beer is so little (to me) that I would not view it as not being sober. I have tried NA beer when I was pregnant, and didn't like the taste, so I don't drink it for that reason (I'm a micro-brew snob

I know others think differently, and that's fine - to each his/her own.

Jay

Bradley004

i agree with Music on this one...as I always do! To me it's a good check when you are literally afraid of EVERYTHING that your thinking is amuck. God did not come to give us the spirit of fear but of love, strength and a SOUND MIND. There is something to say about moderation. Drinking to drink is already over the limit as we abuse it. But it's a whole different story when your mind/motives are not there.

I'm surprised your church uses real wine???? But that is another discussion. lol

panadolsandwich

This might be controversial. And believe me I'm no expert on sobriety. And I've touched on this before - alcohol is everywhere. In my detox I amused fellow drunks by telling them how we could make 'home' brew if we really wanted to (with all the fruit, sugar, and food we were provided with). I could brew or distill alcohol right now if I wanted to and it would cost next to nothing.

I could be drunk for the rest of my life on the meagre savings I've managed. C2H5OH - ethanol, ethyl alcohol, grain alcohol.

I have that power. Just like the time I picked up a tiny wounded bird on a walk through the rainforest, and realised how easy it would be to just crush it in my hand, it was so fragile. Yes nothing would be simpler than crushing that bird to death - and actually feeling I'd done good, by putting it out of it's misery. I'm not like that thank god, I made a little stretcher from twigs, and strips of fabric torn from from my shirt. I took the bird to National Parks and Wildlife. Then went off and drank myself to oblivion.

The point is I don't need to fear alcohol being in my house. It's such a common chemical. I even feel that by trying not having any form of alcohol in the house is admitting defeat prematurely. To me it's a chemical. By trying to eliminate all forms of alcohol is surrendering yourself, and to my mind is damaging mentally. I've grown to realise it's something *I* have to avoid, and reasonably expect it to be a part of life. I mean christ! I'm not going to start to drink my aftershave, or drink my girlfriend's toner!

By all means avoid it if you think you can't control yourself. But that's the crux of my message. Ultimately what will set you free is being able to control yourself, and hold a firm belief in the integrity of your own ethical code. Be what you want to be.

And ask yourself - would you have crushed that wounded bird? Would you really dare to do that? I always wonder what happened to that bird. You have the power to decide what you want to do. I know I would never of crushed that bird, just like I know I'll never drink my aftershave.

Music

Hi there pandol,
You wrote:
C2H5OH=Ethyol alcohol. Now take it one step further and compare this to Ether which is used to anesthetize us under surgical circumstances. You might find that the only difference is a molecule of H2O.

You also wrote:
The point is I don't need to fear alcohol being in my house. It's such a common chemical. I even feel that by trying not having any form of alcohol in the house is admitting defeat prematurely. To me it's a chemical. By trying to eliminate all forms of alcohol is surrendering yourself, and to my mind is damaging mentally. I've grown to realise it's something *I* have to avoid, and reasonably expect it to be a part of life. I mean christ! I'm not going to start to drink my aftershave, or drink my girlfriend's toner!

I have a couple problems with what you said here. First, instead of saying, "I think" you said "I feel." Stop the feeling BS and start thinking. Take a look at step 1 of AA. It says, "POWERLESS" over alcohol. For someone so new to sobriety, I'd suggest you stop thinking about being "powerless" and start remembeing that all your best "thinking" got you here. Don't know about you but I couldn't "think" myself out of taking that first drink, but I can sure "think" my way out of staying sober by the kind of rationalizing you're doing here. Don't count out drinking aftershave or your girlfriends toner. I've know drunks who strained shoe polish through cheese cloth to get the alcohol. I've also know drunks who drank rubbing alcohol by mixing it with cool aide. Ever heard of GI gin?
Second,don't forget, grain alcohol and ethyl alcohol is used in all sorts of removal processes. Stain from furniture, and if left long enough....the wood. It also removes paint from cars, girlfriends, friends, kids, jobs, finances....I can go on ad-nausium. You'd best admit defeat, and surrender or there is scant chance of success.
Of course, you do what you "think" is best. Far be it for me to tell you what to do.
Have a great day.

PS-If someone is holding a gun to your head with the hammer back, how can you admit defeat "prematurely?

CarolD

everyone may do as they choose.

I perfer ....

to not drink..eat.....serve or smell alcohol.

Hemlock is quicker.

spirit

i was always aware of bitters, often served in lemon, lime and bitters. a couple of weeks ago i ordered one innocently in a pub, completely forgot. then i felt a bit weird and remembered, but then i thought - ok that is done - probably more psychosomatic than anything when i remembered.

is there a list anywhere or a site that lists products with alcohol in them????

kath

CarolD

not that I know of. Here in the US the contents are listed on the products.

Maybe another member has a list to share? :shades:

Patsyd1

I had an experience in very early recovery that stays with me even today.

I had a sore throat and went to purchase something for it. I bought a tin can of Ciprocol <--- I think thats how you spell it lol

Well being the alky that I am, I had one, and then another and another and I ended up using the entire tin can in about a 4 hour period. Talk about all or nothing LOL

Well I began to feel this edgy feeling.... that progressed to a feeling of being jiggery, and I began to feel very anxious and discontent. I began pacing and not knowing what the heck was going on.

So I did what was suggested to me in the first few months of sobriety, when ever I felt off....... I went and called my sponsor and told her how I was feeling. She asked me if anything was going on? I said no, nothing at all. She then asked me what I had eaten during the day. So I gave her a whole list of what I had eaten. She then asked me if I had used any new products at all, like mouth wash?
I said no that I hadn't. Then I remembered the ciprocol and I told her that I ate the entire tin can because my throat was sore.

She asked me to go and get the tin can and read the ingredients in this product. I thought she had lost her mind LOL , but I went and dug it out of the trash barrell anyways.

As I read, there it was..... each lozenger contained 3% alcohol. Well there were 15 lozengers in this container and I ate them all. So thats 15 x 3%..... = 45% alcohol that i had consumed in about a 4 hour period. WOW...... that shocked me, because at that point I recognized what I was feeling.....that same feeling that always hit me when I had the first drink....... the jiggery feeling that came and went away only as I consumed MORE alcohol.

From that moment to today.....I check and read all ingredients on anything new that I am about to purchase.

I have no fear today of alcohol at all...... it simply doesn't bother me to be around it, or to be around those who are drinking. Its just not a problem for me today. I can share this though, that since that incident in my early sobreity with the tin can of ciprocol, I do have a very deep respect for what alcohol, in any form can do to this drunk once I ingest it.
I honestly believe that my body doesn't distinquish between whether I ingest it innocently or with motives. It simply sets up a reaction for MORE. I do not play around today with any "thinking" regarding ingesting alcohol, with motives or without motives........ I simply do not want to put my sobriety at risk, at all. With or without "reasonable explanations" doesn't seem to matter to my body....... once I ingest any alcohol at all into my body....... my body reacts...... it wants MORE.

Love
Patsy

panadolsandwich

Music,

I've heard of Gi gin or whatever you call it. I've known they strain Brasso though a piece of bread. And what's more caught them at it! This is what I hate most about the AA. The duelling banjos of who had it worse.

If you have a semantic grievance about whether I 'think' or 'feel' well how can I answer that? And what's that all about ? Thinking in inverted commas.

Look mate, perhaps I've crossed a border that intimidates you. I'm certainly not here to argue.

But you've basically told me that my 'thinking' has got me where I am today. And you are correct. But what's going to get me out of this? I don't proclaim any form of authority, I've made that clear.

Are you suggesting that I'd best abandon my thinking and blindly accept the doctrines of an institutional organisation?

And that last rejoinder about someone holding a gun to my head? What the fu*k was that about? I really want to know. Because I don't understand what you mean. If someone held a gun to my head, I'm fairly sure they wouldn't get very far. I've been an officer in the Australian army, and I know when someone's prepared to kill. I don't know you or your history, but it takes a lot to kill a person.

And mate, you can take that have a great day and shove it up your arse.

steve4432

The big book says we should not fear alcohol and some of us keep it in our house to help wean off the drunks that are trying to sober up. Dont go out and buy booze we have medical detox and a better understanding now. However if we still have a compulsion to drink we have a battle in the mind and we are not working the program we may be working our program but the difference is huge. Amounts in cooking and communion are highly unlikely to cause us to flounder you will intuitively know when you are ready to face these things. If you doubt you are ready to taste the wine at church give yourself more clan time.
Steve

Music

Hi again panadol,
No sir, you didn't offend me. You can't offend me! It's just that coming from someone who just came out of detox about 7 days ago, I thought your take on surrendering and admitting defeat rather entertaining.
Just a couple questions. Did drinking alcohol ever cause you to do something you wouldn't normally do? Has drinking alcohol caused your life to become something other than what you'd intended? If the answer to these questions is "yes" then I'd submit to you that you're powerless over alcohol and that in order for you to stay out of detox, I'd suggest you admit that alcohol can and will defeat you again in the future if you should decided to try some more research.
Of course, this suggestion is only coming from a retired enlisted person in the US military so I don't expect that you'll take much interest in the suggestion being an officer and all. I drank with some Aussie sailors at King's Cross back in the 60s and you're a proud, hardheaded bunch.
Good luck with your "thinking." Let me know how it works for you.
Oh, and by the way, AA is the only method I know about, and the only method I care to know about. It's worked for me for a few 24s and like they say, "If it works, don't fix it!!"
Again, have a blessed day.