My 20 year old Son
Member
Join Date: Nov 2013
Location: USA
Posts: 2,393
Originally Posted by AWorriedFather 
The @#$% Car: Our agreement is that I'm not paying or loaning one single dime directly towards his car. I would rather pay outright for his bus fees. This required him to find a job, and he did. He found a great job in fact. He is working as an intern near his home and school that directly matches his field of study, and that works around his school schedule when that time comes. And he enjoys his job! We are happy and proud about acquiring this job. It is way more than we ever expected.
Repayment: He has no money. His job pays roughly $400 per month during the summer, and will be reduced during the school year. Most of his job money will be applied to his car, -two new tires already purchased (two more needed), muffler, new head gasket, and new a/c clutch bearing, etc. Plus he pays for his insurance. Plus the car needs an inspection soon. etc. etc.
The $100 per week allowance will be reduced to something less, likely $50 to $75. We will reestablish this amount by Sunday night. His allowance must cover all expenses aside from the cell phone and rent (rent covers utilities). We have access to his checking account to ensure he spends our money wisely (this is how we discovered he was taking in other money and spending unwisely.)
I'm mot sure what else I can do. And again, I am not yet throwing in the towel with paying for his college. This plan supports him going to school which we all want.
Repayment: He has no money. His job pays roughly $400 per month during the summer, and will be reduced during the school year. Most of his job money will be applied to his car, -two new tires already purchased (two more needed), muffler, new head gasket, and new a/c clutch bearing, etc. Plus he pays for his insurance. Plus the car needs an inspection soon. etc. etc.
The $100 per week allowance will be reduced to something less, likely $50 to $75. We will reestablish this amount by Sunday night. His allowance must cover all expenses aside from the cell phone and rent (rent covers utilities). We have access to his checking account to ensure he spends our money wisely (this is how we discovered he was taking in other money and spending unwisely.)
I'm mot sure what else I can do. And again, I am not yet throwing in the towel with paying for his college. This plan supports him going to school which we all want.
Member
Thread Starter
Join Date: Apr 2015
Posts: 91
Refiner,
Oh boy. Your perception of my financial status, my spoiling him, and how we got here is very wrong. I've taken this to the point of actually letting him walk on the streets until he met my demands, and even needing to call his bluff on threatening to jump off a bridge (and calling 9-1-1 just in case I was wrong).
I am firing my financial shots where I believe they are most effective. I have limited ammo.
My son's recovery center deemed "Getting a job" and "living in a sober living environment" as two very important steps my son needed to take, -more important than going to school. I influenced my son towards taking these steps using my money as leverage with his desire to finish school and drive.
"I'm not paying for school or anything unless you live in a sober living house, with $100/wk" was one financial shot. I believe we won. Remember, he was not thinking properly at that time and he believed/knew he could be making more money selling drugs (while still not comprehending or fearing the consequences). He wants to complete college but he did NOT want to live in the sober house.
Furthermore, "I'm not paying for your car at all, so you will need to find a job to pay for it." was another shot. I believe we won here as well. He already owns his car. He earned the money to buy it while working during high school. The car needs significant maintenance. He stored his car at our home. He found a job. The job barely pays for the car but he met his part of the deal.
Two shots, two battle won, I believe.
Yes, of course he agreed to pay back the lawyer fees. He was more inclined not to acquire a lawyer because of the expenses and needing to ask us for more money. We talked about it, it seemed like a mature conversation, he insisted he would pay back the money, but he has no money (so we thought). Later we caught him spending hidden money on a new car stereo he didn't need, which generated this new concern. At first I thought maybe he was selling drugs again. No so. Happy about this. but the resulting disappointment is still, if he was a perfect new boy, he would have given us this money. I'm still not sure whether he was outright playing us or just plain clueless of the impact, or whether or not there really is a difference.
Oh boy. Your perception of my financial status, my spoiling him, and how we got here is very wrong. I've taken this to the point of actually letting him walk on the streets until he met my demands, and even needing to call his bluff on threatening to jump off a bridge (and calling 9-1-1 just in case I was wrong).
I am firing my financial shots where I believe they are most effective. I have limited ammo.
My son's recovery center deemed "Getting a job" and "living in a sober living environment" as two very important steps my son needed to take, -more important than going to school. I influenced my son towards taking these steps using my money as leverage with his desire to finish school and drive.
"I'm not paying for school or anything unless you live in a sober living house, with $100/wk" was one financial shot. I believe we won. Remember, he was not thinking properly at that time and he believed/knew he could be making more money selling drugs (while still not comprehending or fearing the consequences). He wants to complete college but he did NOT want to live in the sober house.
Furthermore, "I'm not paying for your car at all, so you will need to find a job to pay for it." was another shot. I believe we won here as well. He already owns his car. He earned the money to buy it while working during high school. The car needs significant maintenance. He stored his car at our home. He found a job. The job barely pays for the car but he met his part of the deal.
Two shots, two battle won, I believe.
Yes, of course he agreed to pay back the lawyer fees. He was more inclined not to acquire a lawyer because of the expenses and needing to ask us for more money. We talked about it, it seemed like a mature conversation, he insisted he would pay back the money, but he has no money (so we thought). Later we caught him spending hidden money on a new car stereo he didn't need, which generated this new concern. At first I thought maybe he was selling drugs again. No so. Happy about this. but the resulting disappointment is still, if he was a perfect new boy, he would have given us this money. I'm still not sure whether he was outright playing us or just plain clueless of the impact, or whether or not there really is a difference.
Member
Join Date: Nov 2013
Location: USA
Posts: 2,393
Thanks AWF. I see what you're saying. Gosh, the fact that he has a job in the field he's interested in and actually likes it is amazing in itself, I guess so one can only hope he grows up a bit soon realizing that being a responsible adult with a career type job is the right thing to do. And he keeps it on the straight and narrow and stays away from the drugs! I hope he gets things turned around for your family's sake.
Member
Thread Starter
Join Date: Apr 2015
Posts: 91
Yes his job is a gift from above. Way more than we expected. Of course the business owner takes advantag of the "Internship" status and pays only minimum wage knowing the work experience and the association with the school is worth way more. He is working in a commuter store fixing computers and cell phones. His knowledge of this stuff is how he got away with his mischief.
And another thing I should mention about the lawyer and my sons old thinking. One week after my son got busted, he asked that I pay for a lawyer. I talked to the lawyer I found out that my son lied to him. My son was merely trying to get out of his tickets. I refused to pay. My requirement for loaning money for a lawyer is that the lawyer knows the full thruth, and that he is representing my son only to insure he gets a fair penalty, not off. And I will not be paying for the second state lawyer such that he can drive to and from work and school, as I have already stated I will not pay for his car, period. The car is a luxury I will not directly pay for. I will pay for a city bus instead while he's living in the sober house which btw is 2 bus routes and three miles away from his work and school. I also provided him with a $150 used bicycle for travel.
I feel like I'm in a complex war that requires winning several mini battles in order. I'm starting to understand that getting him to think properly, I.e, parenting him, will be the toughest final battle, and I have only three more years while he's attending school to make this happen if its possible. I will loose my leverage once he graduates.. He might fall then but at least I will be comfortable with myself knowing that I was the best parent I could possibly be based on what I believed was right then. Hard work, love, and facing the pain his done well for me up to this point on other issues.
Appreciate your input Refiner. I have learned to move towards things that make me uncomfortable, and you were definately making me uncomfortable. Keep chiming in if my direction does not match your opinion
And another thing I should mention about the lawyer and my sons old thinking. One week after my son got busted, he asked that I pay for a lawyer. I talked to the lawyer I found out that my son lied to him. My son was merely trying to get out of his tickets. I refused to pay. My requirement for loaning money for a lawyer is that the lawyer knows the full thruth, and that he is representing my son only to insure he gets a fair penalty, not off. And I will not be paying for the second state lawyer such that he can drive to and from work and school, as I have already stated I will not pay for his car, period. The car is a luxury I will not directly pay for. I will pay for a city bus instead while he's living in the sober house which btw is 2 bus routes and three miles away from his work and school. I also provided him with a $150 used bicycle for travel.
I feel like I'm in a complex war that requires winning several mini battles in order. I'm starting to understand that getting him to think properly, I.e, parenting him, will be the toughest final battle, and I have only three more years while he's attending school to make this happen if its possible. I will loose my leverage once he graduates.. He might fall then but at least I will be comfortable with myself knowing that I was the best parent I could possibly be based on what I believed was right then. Hard work, love, and facing the pain his done well for me up to this point on other issues.
Appreciate your input Refiner. I have learned to move towards things that make me uncomfortable, and you were definately making me uncomfortable. Keep chiming in if my direction does not match your opinion
Member
Join Date: Feb 2015
Posts: 203
AWF- People will probably disagree but in my opinion, your son is doing what most 20 year olds do- he wanted a stereo, he knew you'd be pissed, so he secretly bought it. Had he not been in recovery how would you have handled the situation? 20 year olds do dumb stuff, its part of being 20. It took me a long time to figure out that just because she was a recovering addict didn't take away from that fact that she was a young adult prone to making dumb financial decisions.
Hell, when I was 20, I secretly spent money "ear-marked" for text books on the most gorgeous Coach purse you ever wanted to see! I didn't use drugs. I also had to drop the course because I didn't have the book. All my dad said was "figure it out". I did. And boy did I look good with that purse by my side going to summer school! Live and learn.
You seem to have a good handle on things.
Hell, when I was 20, I secretly spent money "ear-marked" for text books on the most gorgeous Coach purse you ever wanted to see! I didn't use drugs. I also had to drop the course because I didn't have the book. All my dad said was "figure it out". I did. And boy did I look good with that purse by my side going to summer school! Live and learn.
You seem to have a good handle on things.
Member
Join Date: Sep 2014
Posts: 328
AWF,
I understand exactly where you are coming from. I also have a 20 yr old son who brings me to this forum. My only concern for you is that maybe you are trying to control things a little too much. Have you tried Al-Anon? It is definitely a life saver for me. I know I drive myself crazy trying to control everything and everyone around me (my husband is an alcoholic also) that I let my life become unmanageable. We trick ourself into believing that "we" can make things just right and they will finally see the light. It's just not true, only they can make the changes needed. No judgement here, just food for thought. Take care of YOU. I know it's easier said than done but I'm working on it.
Jaeger
I understand exactly where you are coming from. I also have a 20 yr old son who brings me to this forum. My only concern for you is that maybe you are trying to control things a little too much. Have you tried Al-Anon? It is definitely a life saver for me. I know I drive myself crazy trying to control everything and everyone around me (my husband is an alcoholic also) that I let my life become unmanageable. We trick ourself into believing that "we" can make things just right and they will finally see the light. It's just not true, only they can make the changes needed. No judgement here, just food for thought. Take care of YOU. I know it's easier said than done but I'm working on it.
Jaeger
Member
Join Date: Jun 2012
Location: USA
Posts: 574
yes to what Jaeger wrote
I have kept up with your posts AWF. I feel your angst. It is in your words. I am a parent and take expectations very seriously. but ......
your son needs to be allowed to make his own decisions. He will know when to come to you for advice. I understand that you feel (from a previous post) that you have some things to 'fix'. Things that you feel you did not do properly the first time around. Parenting stuff that you may not feel you did well enough.
Well let me tell you - kids are resilient. And the only thing they need is a conscience. They need to feel the full effect of making a decision from not eating their beans to driving and texting to how to spend their money.
Your son demonstrated that he was able to obtain funds to buy a stereo that he KNEW you would control if you had known about it ahead of time. He KNOWS you and he was aware of his choice. Let him suffer the consequences. Let him feel that he must stand on his own two feet NOW vs. never.
I hear fear and control and anxiety and that you need peace.
You need peace from the guilt that you feel.
Even if you disagree with my words - go back to the beginning of your posts here and read them as if it was someone else writing them. Not you. Another parent. A friend. A neighbor.
One of the most difficult things for us to do is look at our lives objectively. Like it is happening to someone else. Don't cripple your son. Let him make his next choice all on his own. He will perhaps fail in your eyes but never truly as he will gain so much more.
He has time to get to college and continue and finish one day. He needs this time to decide what he would like his life to be like. He will grow proud of his independence and choices. Let this lil bird fly. Take a few steps back and let him call his shots - let him ASK you what you think or if you will help him. Instead of monitoring his days. It causes you so much anxiety and there are other people in your life who need you. Just need you to be there for them and with a peaceful heart.
My ex-husband and I had saved money for our girls future. During their youth. Every bottle return, every found dollar, at least half of any money given to them, working with me making a small stipend each week for REAL work even when I needed it more. It had been such a sacrifice. And the amount wasn't so huge but it's a lot when you think about college and a car etc. So my youngest turns 15 and starts asking for nail money, clothes, $s to go do fun things ... she begins to borrow from the fund which was in both of our names. The constant barrage and harassment became too much for me. I was in the throes of the divorce and I think she was also.
One day I sat back and decided that if she wanted this and knew full well - or as well as a 15 yr old could - I would let her feel the effects of her choices. Each time she asked - I gave it to her. I put hundreds into her single account. She took as she wished. She spent it all during the summer. She later admits that she spent a bunch of it on weed. Alcohol. Cigarettes. Friends.
I was heartbroken for a bit but was proud for letting her have her time to make her own choice. To face the reality of that as she continued her transition into an adult. I had begun to let go of my little girl.
She would say to me later, 'how could you let me do that?' 'why would you let me spend my college and car money like that?'
She didn't need my answer - but she knew full well that she wanted to play adult and I let her - and she would carry that choice forever.
She has grown into a beautiful person. Responsible. Independent. Thinks out every choice. They aren't always what I would want for her but it's a gift that we give them. She doesn't smoke weed, no drugs, drinks responsibly.
I used to ask my parents to let me make my own mistakes. Even if they could see that it would hurt me and hurt them too. I begged. And they gave me that. It was a gift. It truly make me into who I am and I wanted my daughter to have that too.
We don't have instruction books and each child, each home, each parent is different. We do our best and give our best and try to put a bandaid on every wound. But ..... often, we just need to let them experience 'life' on their own.
I expect to catch a bit of ire from you and that's okay. This journey is yours. And I feel how conscientious you are as a father and as a man. I know the pride of raising a child. (my other is less responsible, so I am speaking from experience!). During that first fall - tell them to get up and brush it off - they learn pretty quickly - it's your son's turn to be able to make his own decisions.
Pretend it's someone else's son - and you are telling that parent what you think they should do. Pretend it's not you. Like all of the people here who have been victims of their own loved ones theft. They don't prosecute but if a stranger walked into their home and took jewelry, money, car keys - you would definitely call the police.
Your son is resourceful. He will accomplish what he wants to. We don't always have the answers, we just need to look at it objectively and make decisions so that our children are making themselves happy and building their own great lives - like we did. I have a feeling that your son will stumble but it should be HIS choice to do so. Addictions are a battle best fought by the addict. He has to want sobriety for his own sake.
I'm sorry that this chose you. That you feel responsible and carry some guilt. We all do and it's a horrible feeling. Heal yourself and it will be well worth it. Alanon can help you to discover what you are responsible for and what is up to others. It can bring you peace as you walk thru this difficult time. We all care about you because we have been there, one way or another, it chose us.
I have kept up with your posts AWF. I feel your angst. It is in your words. I am a parent and take expectations very seriously. but ......
your son needs to be allowed to make his own decisions. He will know when to come to you for advice. I understand that you feel (from a previous post) that you have some things to 'fix'. Things that you feel you did not do properly the first time around. Parenting stuff that you may not feel you did well enough.
Well let me tell you - kids are resilient. And the only thing they need is a conscience. They need to feel the full effect of making a decision from not eating their beans to driving and texting to how to spend their money.
Your son demonstrated that he was able to obtain funds to buy a stereo that he KNEW you would control if you had known about it ahead of time. He KNOWS you and he was aware of his choice. Let him suffer the consequences. Let him feel that he must stand on his own two feet NOW vs. never.
I hear fear and control and anxiety and that you need peace.
You need peace from the guilt that you feel.
Even if you disagree with my words - go back to the beginning of your posts here and read them as if it was someone else writing them. Not you. Another parent. A friend. A neighbor.
One of the most difficult things for us to do is look at our lives objectively. Like it is happening to someone else. Don't cripple your son. Let him make his next choice all on his own. He will perhaps fail in your eyes but never truly as he will gain so much more.
He has time to get to college and continue and finish one day. He needs this time to decide what he would like his life to be like. He will grow proud of his independence and choices. Let this lil bird fly. Take a few steps back and let him call his shots - let him ASK you what you think or if you will help him. Instead of monitoring his days. It causes you so much anxiety and there are other people in your life who need you. Just need you to be there for them and with a peaceful heart.
My ex-husband and I had saved money for our girls future. During their youth. Every bottle return, every found dollar, at least half of any money given to them, working with me making a small stipend each week for REAL work even when I needed it more. It had been such a sacrifice. And the amount wasn't so huge but it's a lot when you think about college and a car etc. So my youngest turns 15 and starts asking for nail money, clothes, $s to go do fun things ... she begins to borrow from the fund which was in both of our names. The constant barrage and harassment became too much for me. I was in the throes of the divorce and I think she was also.
One day I sat back and decided that if she wanted this and knew full well - or as well as a 15 yr old could - I would let her feel the effects of her choices. Each time she asked - I gave it to her. I put hundreds into her single account. She took as she wished. She spent it all during the summer. She later admits that she spent a bunch of it on weed. Alcohol. Cigarettes. Friends.
I was heartbroken for a bit but was proud for letting her have her time to make her own choice. To face the reality of that as she continued her transition into an adult. I had begun to let go of my little girl.
She would say to me later, 'how could you let me do that?' 'why would you let me spend my college and car money like that?'
She didn't need my answer - but she knew full well that she wanted to play adult and I let her - and she would carry that choice forever.
She has grown into a beautiful person. Responsible. Independent. Thinks out every choice. They aren't always what I would want for her but it's a gift that we give them. She doesn't smoke weed, no drugs, drinks responsibly.
I used to ask my parents to let me make my own mistakes. Even if they could see that it would hurt me and hurt them too. I begged. And they gave me that. It was a gift. It truly make me into who I am and I wanted my daughter to have that too.
We don't have instruction books and each child, each home, each parent is different. We do our best and give our best and try to put a bandaid on every wound. But ..... often, we just need to let them experience 'life' on their own.
I expect to catch a bit of ire from you and that's okay. This journey is yours. And I feel how conscientious you are as a father and as a man. I know the pride of raising a child. (my other is less responsible, so I am speaking from experience!). During that first fall - tell them to get up and brush it off - they learn pretty quickly - it's your son's turn to be able to make his own decisions.
Pretend it's someone else's son - and you are telling that parent what you think they should do. Pretend it's not you. Like all of the people here who have been victims of their own loved ones theft. They don't prosecute but if a stranger walked into their home and took jewelry, money, car keys - you would definitely call the police.
Your son is resourceful. He will accomplish what he wants to. We don't always have the answers, we just need to look at it objectively and make decisions so that our children are making themselves happy and building their own great lives - like we did. I have a feeling that your son will stumble but it should be HIS choice to do so. Addictions are a battle best fought by the addict. He has to want sobriety for his own sake.
I'm sorry that this chose you. That you feel responsible and carry some guilt. We all do and it's a horrible feeling. Heal yourself and it will be well worth it. Alanon can help you to discover what you are responsible for and what is up to others. It can bring you peace as you walk thru this difficult time. We all care about you because we have been there, one way or another, it chose us.
Member
Join Date: May 2010
Location: USA
Posts: 13,560
I think you are doing great AWF! It's a day at a time, that is all we get, and all we are equipped to deal with. Unfortunately, as humans, we future trip all the time. However, what you do ON THIS DAY is what counts!!!!
Member
Join Date: Oct 2011
Posts: 1,698
I would whole heartedly agree with Ileana. 20 year olds are selfish and still fear the "no" that we parents impose so they do things without our knowledge.
Joie, thank you for that insightful post. It is the hardest thing us parents ever do: let our kids choose for themselves.
AWF, you are doing great. keep the communication lines open with your son. Let him know the boundaries. Love him.
Joie, thank you for that insightful post. It is the hardest thing us parents ever do: let our kids choose for themselves.
AWF, you are doing great. keep the communication lines open with your son. Let him know the boundaries. Love him.
Member
Join Date: Jun 2010
Location: USA
Posts: 2,684
Originally Posted by JOIE12
We all care about you because we have been there, one way or another, it chose us.
I haven't posted until now, holding out since I felt others responded so well AND it's sometimes hard for me to put into words what I want to express; to express well and try to be concise, lol.
There are similarities in things you share to what I've experienced as a parent. I also have an adult son, who is 23.
Many times I've shared the (maybe cliché) phrase "one day at a time." Though, truly, when I do approach the day that way, it puts me in a better frame of mind and I can cope with what is now -- try to not jump ahead and become fixated on the future. I tend to obsess.
Have a great weekend all. And, again,
one day at a time.
Last edited by Anaya; 07-11-2015 at 12:45 PM. Reason: Not concise ;)
Member
Join Date: Jun 2010
Location: USA
Posts: 2,684
Originally Posted by AWorriedFather
He might fall then but at least I will be comfortable with myself knowing that I was the best parent I could possibly be based on what I believed was right then. Hard work, love, and facing the pain his done well for me up to this point on other issues.
When feeling down about my son and his choices, I remind myself of all the untroubled years of his life, the positive influences in his environment, the love, and the discipline he'd received and know that those experiences are also a big part of who my son is. One can certainly hope and pray for the best.
Member
Join Date: May 2014
Location: irvington, ny
Posts: 30
my 20 yr old son
Dear AWF
Our journey is different, the feelings not so much.
This is my story:
My husband and I accepted very quickly that addiction was not going to be a "done deal" after my daughter "completed" the first few months of treatment.
I am grateful that we trusted others (the professionals and other parents) to advise us on how to empower, rather than enable, our daughter.
We learned that having a "recovery" job (not too stressful and demanding) , living a simple life (humility), relying on sober support rather than "dumping" her emotional issues on us, were the priorities once she left the program
As a result, she has become more confident about her ability to live life, and my fear that she is "incapable" and defective have lessened.
Two years after the beginning of this journey, with the "blessing" of her therapist, she is back in school, one day and one class at a time.
I will always be concerned, she is my daughter, but I am learning to let go of the illusion of control
I wish you the best
Our journey is different, the feelings not so much.
This is my story:
My husband and I accepted very quickly that addiction was not going to be a "done deal" after my daughter "completed" the first few months of treatment.
I am grateful that we trusted others (the professionals and other parents) to advise us on how to empower, rather than enable, our daughter.
We learned that having a "recovery" job (not too stressful and demanding) , living a simple life (humility), relying on sober support rather than "dumping" her emotional issues on us, were the priorities once she left the program
As a result, she has become more confident about her ability to live life, and my fear that she is "incapable" and defective have lessened.
Two years after the beginning of this journey, with the "blessing" of her therapist, she is back in school, one day and one class at a time.
I will always be concerned, she is my daughter, but I am learning to let go of the illusion of control
I wish you the best
Member
Join Date: Mar 2015
Posts: 20
They really make us crazy these 20 year old baby men. I know you are not spoiling him. It sounds like you live in a high cost of living area like me, so I think I can relate to the money situation more than some others can. I too, allowed my son the f'n car so he could go to work. Public transportation just doesn't work for what he's doing. Have you looked into collegiate recovery programs? Sober houses on campus and because they understand where you are coming from, can help you get admission with poor grades. I know of 2, Rutgers and Fairfield U. The problem with me letting my son do that, is that I won't pay for anymore school. He had 2 years of money that he got from an injury as a child. And I don't feel comfortable cosigning any student loans. He would get no merit aid, and because we make "too much money" would not qualify for any financial aid. So he was able to get into a union apprentice program and is begrudgingly joining the working world. I am expecting $100 week as soon as he gets his first paycheck.
Member
Thread Starter
Join Date: Apr 2015
Posts: 91
Wow, I need to slow down and reflect on the many insightful messages recently posted. I will later this weekend.
Just an update:
Son is taking a summer class. Failed the first exam but it sounds like many students didn't do well and failed. At least this is his story. Better news is that he believes he aced the second test. We will find out on Monday.
We have reduced the amount of spending money we give him from $100 down to $50 per week. This reduction is to address the last shenanigans and him now having a job. He has cut down on vape juice but is still spending $25/week on it.
He has asked to leave the sober house because he is now the most senior person there. Sorry son. I requested that he obtain endorsement from the house boss and then, only then, I might listen.
Car is running good, getting him to work and school. Our head gasket replacement work is holding. He got a driving ticket in late June, of which he forgot to pay, and now his ticket will cost has doubled. No sympathy here.
He's still drug free as far as I can tell, has a job, and he's attending school so I am grateful.
Just an update:
Son is taking a summer class. Failed the first exam but it sounds like many students didn't do well and failed. At least this is his story. Better news is that he believes he aced the second test. We will find out on Monday.
We have reduced the amount of spending money we give him from $100 down to $50 per week. This reduction is to address the last shenanigans and him now having a job. He has cut down on vape juice but is still spending $25/week on it.
He has asked to leave the sober house because he is now the most senior person there. Sorry son. I requested that he obtain endorsement from the house boss and then, only then, I might listen.
Car is running good, getting him to work and school. Our head gasket replacement work is holding. He got a driving ticket in late June, of which he forgot to pay, and now his ticket will cost has doubled. No sympathy here.
He's still drug free as far as I can tell, has a job, and he's attending school so I am grateful.
Member
Thread Starter
Join Date: Apr 2015
Posts: 91
Joie12,
Your heartfelt post deserves a response. I appreciate your concern for me and the time you spent responding.
Yes, there is more to the story.
I will only say, Mom had significant FOO issues and partook in a mini out of marriage mid-life crisis, and I abused alcohol to medicate my pain during the trouble, and our kids are a lot smarter than we think. As much as we thought we were, my wife and I were not very successful with hiding our personal and marital problems. Our home environment negatively affected our son’s development during his critical years. My wife and I have since fully and completely reconciled. I no longer abuse alcohol. We are both incredibly wiser, happier, and more at peace now. Our marriage and life in general is incredible now. Our new wisdom that was earned by resolving our problems is what fuels our passion for "helping" our son. Yes, we are remorseful. Yes, we are we concerned. Yes, we are controlling. But honestly, our efforts do not tire us. I think our situation is best explained by Gary Zukav, -that when our thoughts, emotions, and actions are aligned with the highest part of ourselves, it fills us with enthusiasm, purpose, and meaning. Our son is our legacy and we love him for it. It drives us to “help” him.
So what is help?…….At this point, we strongly believe NOT turning away, not yet, is best for our son. We agree at some point if our son becomes non-receptive that we must turn away and let him fall harder. We actually did this last January and he fell very hard. We suspected “something” might happen but we didn’t realize the extent of his issues. We needed something significant to happen to make things clearer. Boy, we got clarity, and within two months. Always trust your gut!
My wife and I know that we must not enable our son. It’s not best for him. We get this. We also know that he needs to learn life’s lessons on his own; that he must fail on his own to become wiser. Wisdom is earned, not taught. We get this too. We believe right now that living in a sober house is best for him. It’s the best environment for him experiencing life’s lessons and collecting wisdom. We are wise and humble enough to know we cannot help him in the department of drugs. We do not have the clout or experience, or the trust to help him. His house will help him reflect. We are sure of this, to the extent we are not afraid of relapses anymore, except for safety. Relapses are opportunities for learning. He must learn. He will learn, if he relapses again, and btw, we also know that pain is required in order to learn, and so, our “help” must be painful, ie., -must not enable, -must take away, or turn away, or walk away, dependent on the situation of his fall and his acceptance of it, and note, we didn't give in last time when he threatened to jump off a bridge. That situation required tough love and we held.
My wife and I agree, -we are controlling. We are intervening. This is because we believe him living in a sober house is the best right now whether he wants to or not. He’s back on the wooden labyrinth. We will continue paying for his college while he lives in this sober house (thank god he wants to go to college), and we will keep prying into his sh-t as required to validate his progress, because, if he becomes non receptive at any time we will fully cut our funding and further distance ourselves, again. All the while, our efforts do not tire us because we strongly believe our current actions are best for him, for now.
This is where we are at with our son. We are grateful for everyone’s concerns and suggestions, and each and every one will be deeply considered.
Your heartfelt post deserves a response. I appreciate your concern for me and the time you spent responding.
Yes, there is more to the story.
I will only say, Mom had significant FOO issues and partook in a mini out of marriage mid-life crisis, and I abused alcohol to medicate my pain during the trouble, and our kids are a lot smarter than we think. As much as we thought we were, my wife and I were not very successful with hiding our personal and marital problems. Our home environment negatively affected our son’s development during his critical years. My wife and I have since fully and completely reconciled. I no longer abuse alcohol. We are both incredibly wiser, happier, and more at peace now. Our marriage and life in general is incredible now. Our new wisdom that was earned by resolving our problems is what fuels our passion for "helping" our son. Yes, we are remorseful. Yes, we are we concerned. Yes, we are controlling. But honestly, our efforts do not tire us. I think our situation is best explained by Gary Zukav, -that when our thoughts, emotions, and actions are aligned with the highest part of ourselves, it fills us with enthusiasm, purpose, and meaning. Our son is our legacy and we love him for it. It drives us to “help” him.
So what is help?…….At this point, we strongly believe NOT turning away, not yet, is best for our son. We agree at some point if our son becomes non-receptive that we must turn away and let him fall harder. We actually did this last January and he fell very hard. We suspected “something” might happen but we didn’t realize the extent of his issues. We needed something significant to happen to make things clearer. Boy, we got clarity, and within two months. Always trust your gut!
My wife and I know that we must not enable our son. It’s not best for him. We get this. We also know that he needs to learn life’s lessons on his own; that he must fail on his own to become wiser. Wisdom is earned, not taught. We get this too. We believe right now that living in a sober house is best for him. It’s the best environment for him experiencing life’s lessons and collecting wisdom. We are wise and humble enough to know we cannot help him in the department of drugs. We do not have the clout or experience, or the trust to help him. His house will help him reflect. We are sure of this, to the extent we are not afraid of relapses anymore, except for safety. Relapses are opportunities for learning. He must learn. He will learn, if he relapses again, and btw, we also know that pain is required in order to learn, and so, our “help” must be painful, ie., -must not enable, -must take away, or turn away, or walk away, dependent on the situation of his fall and his acceptance of it, and note, we didn't give in last time when he threatened to jump off a bridge. That situation required tough love and we held.
My wife and I agree, -we are controlling. We are intervening. This is because we believe him living in a sober house is the best right now whether he wants to or not. He’s back on the wooden labyrinth. We will continue paying for his college while he lives in this sober house (thank god he wants to go to college), and we will keep prying into his sh-t as required to validate his progress, because, if he becomes non receptive at any time we will fully cut our funding and further distance ourselves, again. All the while, our efforts do not tire us because we strongly believe our current actions are best for him, for now.
This is where we are at with our son. We are grateful for everyone’s concerns and suggestions, and each and every one will be deeply considered.
Member
Join Date: Apr 2013
Location: Mmmmmm
Posts: 3,178
It is a fine balance. Worried Father, I think you and your wife are really doing a fine job. I think the key is you have learned the 2 step. You state your boundaries. Then you enforce your boundaries.
Thank you for sharing a bit about your history. My RAH and I both qualify as ACOA. Do you both relate to ACOA?
Thank you for sharing a bit about your history. My RAH and I both qualify as ACOA. Do you both relate to ACOA?
Member
Thread Starter
Join Date: Apr 2015
Posts: 91
Codejob,
My wife maybe, but alcoholism was the least of her tragic childhood experiences. A person could be writing a book about her childhood experiences, whereas my childhood was quit the opposite (opposites attract!). In any case, she has spent loads of hours with her IC and has since changed herself and her beliefs. I have too. I was a virgin to emotionl pain and needed to attended IC to heal from our marital problems. We are both very strong now.
My wife maybe, but alcoholism was the least of her tragic childhood experiences. A person could be writing a book about her childhood experiences, whereas my childhood was quit the opposite (opposites attract!). In any case, she has spent loads of hours with her IC and has since changed herself and her beliefs. I have too. I was a virgin to emotionl pain and needed to attended IC to heal from our marital problems. We are both very strong now.
Member
Join Date: Jun 2012
Location: USA
Posts: 574
Thank you AWF. Words are for thought - but most importantly, you know your situation and your son better than anyone else, stand strong - no one said being a parent was going to be an easy job ! I will keep you and your family in my prayers. Best wishes to you, your wife and your son. Hugs 
Joie
Joie
Currently Active Users Viewing this Thread: 1 (0 members and 1 guests)
