Humility vs. Humiliation
Laozi Old Man
Thread Starter
Join Date: May 2008
Location: Detroit, MI
Posts: 6,665
Humility vs. Humiliation
Why is it that a person deprived of food for as little as 3 days can starve to death while another person can voluntarily fast for as much as 100 days and still survive? The answer to this physical question remains a medical mystery. The answer to the psychic riddle lies in something known as the power of intention.
The power of intention, in a nutshell says that the motives and expectations of a persons actions have an impact on their performance and outcome. Take for example optimism vs. pessimism. Countless songs, books and movies recount some person, group or team to having overcome seemingly overwhelming obstacles simply because they had the right attitude. While optimism can be used to explain the success of the fasting individual described above, there remains the question of where the optimism comes from in the first place. Optimism is not a simple matter of will-power or groundless positive thinking. Optimism cannot be pulled out of a hat so to speak; it has to be founded on something. St. Augustine said, “If you want to build a tower of virtue, you must start with a foundation of humility”.
How can the power of intention be used to described the various levels of success within the addiction recovery movement and, more importantly, how can it be applied in such a way as to increase ones chances in getting lasting benefits from recovery treatment therapies such as 12 step programs.
For example; how can we pry people’s perception away from the misconception that humility is synonymous with humiliation? These two words sound pretty much the same to the casual listener and have definitions, which to some degree, overlap with each other. The difference in most circumstances is quite subtle and therefore not always worth arguing about. It the case described above, the starving man feels humiliation where the fasting man feels humility. Same circumstances, different intentions. The humble man survives 97 more days on the same diet as the humiliated man.
By the same token a timid person may appear humble while a humble person may appear to be timid. Same behavior, different intentions. While the timid individual has had his or her pride taken away from them and thus feels humiliated, the humble person surrenders their pride freely. This same behavior can also be looked at from the standpoint of courage. The timid man has no courage and chooses to procrastinate. Conversely, the humble man has plenty of courage but chooses to focus it on patiently waiting for Gods guidance. Procrastination and patience may look to be identical responses to the same stimulus, however; in this case, patience takes the form of delayed action rather than no action.
In a recovery program there can be a world of difference between suffering humiliation and gaining humility. Again the difference lies in the intention on the part of the subject in question rather than the actual observable event from the perspective of an outside observer (one mans ceiling is another man’s floor). The person who feels that they are just a victim of circumstances has far less optimism than the person who feels that they can simply face the problem with some degree of humility. In other words, the humiliated person sees the cup half empty whereas the humble person sees the same cup half full.
There is also a perception difference regarding the degree of control between the two individuals. The humiliated person feels that they are in a completely helpless situation without any rights or alternative choices whatsoever. The humble person recognizes that he or she has at least one option even if it is merely a change of attitude on their part. The humble person has the ability to recognize that there is always a possibility to gain a valuable lesson from the experience. They are willing to at least take a “wait and see” attitude toward their adverse condition before passing judgment on their situation.
In addition to the psychological differences between these two words there is a spiritual connotation to the word humility that its near cousin, humiliation, never benefits from. Humility contains within it a seed of positive potential that can turn it around into a growth opportunity for the person. The Chinese use the same word for disaster as they do for opportunity because they see the loss of one man’s business as the growing market for the entrepreneur. A typhoon or tsunami wipes an area clean of exiting businesses and allows entrepreneurs to come in and operate with little or no competition. In the ancient Greek language the same word used for meek (synonymous with humility) was also used for clean or cleansing. It is no stretch to see a similar meaning to the common phrase “no pain, no gain”.
Bodybuilders are not generally know for their humility but when they are working-out they see the truth about themselves, their body and the their potential to gain from a seemingly painful experience. They know the secret to fatiguing a muscle to the point of failure is to work it until they experience the pain. That is; working it to the point that it breaks down and is forced to rebuild itself. A muscle that has broken down spreads apart and opens up new pathways to let blood circulate through the middle of it. It then gains new nutrients in its interior and reassembles itself in such a way that it has fortified itself. The body-builders temporary sacrifice ends up gaining them muscles that are bigger, better and stronger than before, provided that the bodybuilder is humble enough to have the patience to allow the muscle time to heal properly. Delayed gratification is also a form of humility. Some would call this behavior masochistic but it is true humility in the sense that the athlete can see “Without pain there is no gain”.
In the philosophical context, humility is synonymous with teach-ability. The old adage, “you can’t teach an old dog new tricks” is commonly used among Doctors, Psychiatrists and Psychologists. So much so, that it is a rule of thumb in some circles. The exception to this rule is humility. It is easy to see why the Greeks saw meekness as having a cleansing effect on the human soul. It, in effect, turned meekness into a “Tabula Rosa” (clean slate) allowing new knowledge to be written on the blackboard of the soul.
Another big advantage for those in recovery is that humility serves as an instrument for seeing through the ego’s attempt to deny the severity of the sufferer’s addiction. No matter how much one suffers as the result of addictive behavior, pride will always grow back, not unlike a weed, and attempt to cover up the damage with denial. Humility serves as the perfect gardening tool for this relentless emotional weed by pruning pride and allowing the truth to show through about this disease.
Einstein defined insanity as doing the same thing over and over again but expecting different results. Humility is seeing the truth about ourselves and the truth about our potential to change (the truth shall set you free). Paradoxically, there is an ancient proverb that is the functional equivalent to the Greeks “Tabula Rosa”. It goes something like this; “you must suffer to get well, you have to surrender to win and you must give it away to keep it”.
The power of intention, in a nutshell says that the motives and expectations of a persons actions have an impact on their performance and outcome. Take for example optimism vs. pessimism. Countless songs, books and movies recount some person, group or team to having overcome seemingly overwhelming obstacles simply because they had the right attitude. While optimism can be used to explain the success of the fasting individual described above, there remains the question of where the optimism comes from in the first place. Optimism is not a simple matter of will-power or groundless positive thinking. Optimism cannot be pulled out of a hat so to speak; it has to be founded on something. St. Augustine said, “If you want to build a tower of virtue, you must start with a foundation of humility”.
How can the power of intention be used to described the various levels of success within the addiction recovery movement and, more importantly, how can it be applied in such a way as to increase ones chances in getting lasting benefits from recovery treatment therapies such as 12 step programs.
For example; how can we pry people’s perception away from the misconception that humility is synonymous with humiliation? These two words sound pretty much the same to the casual listener and have definitions, which to some degree, overlap with each other. The difference in most circumstances is quite subtle and therefore not always worth arguing about. It the case described above, the starving man feels humiliation where the fasting man feels humility. Same circumstances, different intentions. The humble man survives 97 more days on the same diet as the humiliated man.
By the same token a timid person may appear humble while a humble person may appear to be timid. Same behavior, different intentions. While the timid individual has had his or her pride taken away from them and thus feels humiliated, the humble person surrenders their pride freely. This same behavior can also be looked at from the standpoint of courage. The timid man has no courage and chooses to procrastinate. Conversely, the humble man has plenty of courage but chooses to focus it on patiently waiting for Gods guidance. Procrastination and patience may look to be identical responses to the same stimulus, however; in this case, patience takes the form of delayed action rather than no action.
In a recovery program there can be a world of difference between suffering humiliation and gaining humility. Again the difference lies in the intention on the part of the subject in question rather than the actual observable event from the perspective of an outside observer (one mans ceiling is another man’s floor). The person who feels that they are just a victim of circumstances has far less optimism than the person who feels that they can simply face the problem with some degree of humility. In other words, the humiliated person sees the cup half empty whereas the humble person sees the same cup half full.
There is also a perception difference regarding the degree of control between the two individuals. The humiliated person feels that they are in a completely helpless situation without any rights or alternative choices whatsoever. The humble person recognizes that he or she has at least one option even if it is merely a change of attitude on their part. The humble person has the ability to recognize that there is always a possibility to gain a valuable lesson from the experience. They are willing to at least take a “wait and see” attitude toward their adverse condition before passing judgment on their situation.
In addition to the psychological differences between these two words there is a spiritual connotation to the word humility that its near cousin, humiliation, never benefits from. Humility contains within it a seed of positive potential that can turn it around into a growth opportunity for the person. The Chinese use the same word for disaster as they do for opportunity because they see the loss of one man’s business as the growing market for the entrepreneur. A typhoon or tsunami wipes an area clean of exiting businesses and allows entrepreneurs to come in and operate with little or no competition. In the ancient Greek language the same word used for meek (synonymous with humility) was also used for clean or cleansing. It is no stretch to see a similar meaning to the common phrase “no pain, no gain”.
Bodybuilders are not generally know for their humility but when they are working-out they see the truth about themselves, their body and the their potential to gain from a seemingly painful experience. They know the secret to fatiguing a muscle to the point of failure is to work it until they experience the pain. That is; working it to the point that it breaks down and is forced to rebuild itself. A muscle that has broken down spreads apart and opens up new pathways to let blood circulate through the middle of it. It then gains new nutrients in its interior and reassembles itself in such a way that it has fortified itself. The body-builders temporary sacrifice ends up gaining them muscles that are bigger, better and stronger than before, provided that the bodybuilder is humble enough to have the patience to allow the muscle time to heal properly. Delayed gratification is also a form of humility. Some would call this behavior masochistic but it is true humility in the sense that the athlete can see “Without pain there is no gain”.
In the philosophical context, humility is synonymous with teach-ability. The old adage, “you can’t teach an old dog new tricks” is commonly used among Doctors, Psychiatrists and Psychologists. So much so, that it is a rule of thumb in some circles. The exception to this rule is humility. It is easy to see why the Greeks saw meekness as having a cleansing effect on the human soul. It, in effect, turned meekness into a “Tabula Rosa” (clean slate) allowing new knowledge to be written on the blackboard of the soul.
Another big advantage for those in recovery is that humility serves as an instrument for seeing through the ego’s attempt to deny the severity of the sufferer’s addiction. No matter how much one suffers as the result of addictive behavior, pride will always grow back, not unlike a weed, and attempt to cover up the damage with denial. Humility serves as the perfect gardening tool for this relentless emotional weed by pruning pride and allowing the truth to show through about this disease.
Einstein defined insanity as doing the same thing over and over again but expecting different results. Humility is seeing the truth about ourselves and the truth about our potential to change (the truth shall set you free). Paradoxically, there is an ancient proverb that is the functional equivalent to the Greeks “Tabula Rosa”. It goes something like this; “you must suffer to get well, you have to surrender to win and you must give it away to keep it”.
Member
Join Date: Feb 2008
Location: Cape Town - South Africa
Posts: 47
Thanks Boleo,
I seem to be practicing this in life and I definately feel more humiliated and meek as a result of my addiction. I cant wait for my courage to return but I want to be a better person at the end of this trial. All I can say is that this time I am heading in the right direction and I have many people telling me so and that time is on my side.
I seem to be practicing this in life and I definately feel more humiliated and meek as a result of my addiction. I cant wait for my courage to return but I want to be a better person at the end of this trial. All I can say is that this time I am heading in the right direction and I have many people telling me so and that time is on my side.
Member
Join Date: Jun 2008
Location: Minnesota
Posts: 24
Originally Posted by Sugah 
Heard in the rooms: "Humility isn't thinking less of myself. It's thinking of myself less."
Peace & Love,
Sugah
Peace & Love,
Sugah
Member
Join Date: May 2013
Location: NYC, NY
Posts: 1
I can't even begin to tell you how much I appreciate this posting. It is thought-provoking and insightful. Grateful doesn't even begin to express how I feel.
Is it part of "AA-approved" material? Would love to use it as a qualification to be read in a meeting. Does anyone know whether that is approved by the AA powers that be?
Is it part of "AA-approved" material? Would love to use it as a qualification to be read in a meeting. Does anyone know whether that is approved by the AA powers that be?
Laozi Old Man
Thread Starter
Join Date: May 2008
Location: Detroit, MI
Posts: 6,665
Originally Posted by pansypunzy
Is it part of "AA-approved" material? Would love to use it as a qualification to be read in a meeting. Does anyone know whether that is approved by the AA powers that be?
Member
Join Date: Mar 2013
Location: Michigan
Posts: 243
Originally Posted by Boleo
I have tried talking about this subject at meetings but have never gotten any positive feedback from old-timers as a result. Their standard response to it is "Keep it simple".
Member
Join Date: Oct 2011
Location: Vancouver BC Canada
Posts: 384
Interesting post with lots to consider.
I view humility is a gift that awareness and mindfulness brings and that moves your own ego out of the way to see the more complete and truthful conditions of situations that occur in life. Your response to the situation evolves with a consideration to more than simply your own desires and considerations influencing your action or inaction.
Humiliation comes from many places , some external to one's self and some internal to one's self. I believe each stems from a lack of awareness or mindfulness which distorts situations and beliefs about oneself or creates reactions and actions which considers only one's own needs at a particular time to the disregard of others. The awareness occurs after the fact and creates a negative feeling including shame , guilt and a lower opinion of oneself.
Sound and positive intention , I believe is rooted in awareness and mindfulness. The outcome of success or failure are still quite possible regardless of intention. Should failure be the outcome then it forms a lesson which can be accepted as the intention was considered with thought prior to the action. The outcome is not internalized as a merit or demerit of self as a whole nor is used for merit or demerit about one's self , as a whole,going forward.
With little or no awareness the actions taken can often tend to produce , in the case of failure , humiliation. The second guessing nature in the post mortem of what occurred along with the shame and overwhelming concern of what others think of you may lead to a lesson and acceptance but more often the tendency is denial or misdirection as to the cause of the failure.
I do often hear people interchange these words but they are quite different in my mind.
I will say I would agree with old timers that perhaps a general open meeting with someone at the first meeting ever or someone very new is not the proper place to go into an in depth discussion which enters the realms of theology and philosophy. Step group or an interested set of folks who desire an in depth look at humility and its true benefit to recovery is probably a better place for the topic. Its a good topic but some folks do not need to go this deep into the concept of humility to practice humility which should be a goal of most folks seeking recovery IMHO.
And while we do not need to be controlled by our thoughts , to stop thinking , IMHO is a cop out line , used too often , without consideration of others...just try step 4 and 5 without thinking....and see what the results are like.
I view humility is a gift that awareness and mindfulness brings and that moves your own ego out of the way to see the more complete and truthful conditions of situations that occur in life. Your response to the situation evolves with a consideration to more than simply your own desires and considerations influencing your action or inaction.
Humiliation comes from many places , some external to one's self and some internal to one's self. I believe each stems from a lack of awareness or mindfulness which distorts situations and beliefs about oneself or creates reactions and actions which considers only one's own needs at a particular time to the disregard of others. The awareness occurs after the fact and creates a negative feeling including shame , guilt and a lower opinion of oneself.
Sound and positive intention , I believe is rooted in awareness and mindfulness. The outcome of success or failure are still quite possible regardless of intention. Should failure be the outcome then it forms a lesson which can be accepted as the intention was considered with thought prior to the action. The outcome is not internalized as a merit or demerit of self as a whole nor is used for merit or demerit about one's self , as a whole,going forward.
With little or no awareness the actions taken can often tend to produce , in the case of failure , humiliation. The second guessing nature in the post mortem of what occurred along with the shame and overwhelming concern of what others think of you may lead to a lesson and acceptance but more often the tendency is denial or misdirection as to the cause of the failure.
I do often hear people interchange these words but they are quite different in my mind.
I will say I would agree with old timers that perhaps a general open meeting with someone at the first meeting ever or someone very new is not the proper place to go into an in depth discussion which enters the realms of theology and philosophy. Step group or an interested set of folks who desire an in depth look at humility and its true benefit to recovery is probably a better place for the topic. Its a good topic but some folks do not need to go this deep into the concept of humility to practice humility which should be a goal of most folks seeking recovery IMHO.
And while we do not need to be controlled by our thoughts , to stop thinking , IMHO is a cop out line , used too often , without consideration of others...just try step 4 and 5 without thinking....and see what the results are like.
12 Step Recovered Alcoholic
Join Date: Apr 2012
Location: New Zealand
Posts: 6,613
I'm probably in the camp of the keep it simple old timers. But, you see, sloth - faint hearted in matters that are morally or spiritually difficult - is one of my character defects. I lack the intellectual capacity to engage in this debate, but I find my actions rather than my intellectual ability (with the 12 steps) seem to have brought me a modicum of humility, at least sufficient to recover from a seemingly hopeless state of mind and body.
Your attitude, not your aptitude, will determine your altitude
Join Date: Dec 2006
Location: Oxnard (The Nard), CA, USA.
Posts: 13,955
to SR pansypunzy.
Originally Posted by Boleo
No matter how much one suffers as the result of addictive behavior, pride will always grow back, not unlike a weed, and attempt to cover up the damage with denial. Humility serves as the perfect gardening tool for this relentless emotional weed by pruning pride and allowing the truth to show through about this disease.
A wonderful and inspiring post 
BoleoIMO, I can see that humiliation bolsters the ego so as to cover up any charter defects. Seeing the truth about oneself may be the necessary 'shock' that reviles, one nature of the ego, as a defense mechanism. Being exposed to my; vulnerabilities, weakness, a ego that shields me from the truth about myself and the situations around me, to understand the ego as a root cause of suffering. Helps me understand the cause of my suffering. Intention is the dedication of committing to a mindset that encourages change or hope or possibility or openness, or detachment from the ego and letting go of all control.
~sb
Join Date: Jul 2011
Location: MD
Posts: 15,967
Laozi Old Man
Thread Starter
Join Date: May 2008
Location: Detroit, MI
Posts: 6,665
Originally Posted by Zencat
... Being exposed to my; vulnerabilities, weakness, a ego that shields me from the truth about myself and the situations around me, to understand the ego as a root cause of suffering. Helps me understand the cause of my suffering.
"...humility -a word often misunderstood. To those who have made progress in A.A., it amounts to a clear recognition of what and who we really are, followed by a sincere attempt to become what we could be."
(12&12 page 58)
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