Clicks/Hierarchy in AA?
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Thread Starter
Join Date: Jul 2017
Posts: 22
Clicks/Hierarchy in AA?
Maybe it's just my mind (and probably my anit socialness working) but I'm seeing where there's "the cool kids" of AA. I've always struggled with this concept and it baffles me. I don't want to be in a place of acceptance if the acceptance is only amongst the "old timers". Maybe I need to work on my social skills more but I'm looking down the barrel of what's familiar to me and why I've drank for so long.
Feeling on an island...
Feeling on an island...
Member
Join Date: Oct 2015
Posts: 2,393
The 'cool kids' don't really run things. Nor did they in school. You are bigger, and your sobriety is bigger, than that. Look deeper, look further, there are others. Try other meetings. Don't let the a$$es put you off.
Canine Welfare Advocate
Join Date: Sep 2010
Location: Norfolk, VA
Posts: 10,962
AA is just a bunch of people who desire sobriety. They come to AA with all their failings and shortcomings. So yes, maybe you have found a cliquish group.
But then, you say you've always felt the outsider? Always? Then maybe, just maybe, it's a "you" problem.
But then, you say you've always felt the outsider? Always? Then maybe, just maybe, it's a "you" problem.
Member
Join Date: Aug 2012
Location: Planet Earth (most days)
Posts: 1,596
Carl is right. It's probably a "you" problem. I, too, have always felt like an outsider. In adulthood, I've simply learned to accept that fact that I likely won't ever feel like one of the "cool kids." And, you know what? I could care less! I've actually taken on my own sort of "social experiment" lately and started joining in on groups, etc. (mostly work related) in order to stretch my own limits and get outside of my head a little bit. Through this exercise, I've challenged myself, grown as a person and also realized I freakin' LOVE being an outsider. It's awesome.
Member
Thread Starter
Join Date: Jul 2017
Posts: 22
Thanks for the quick responses and yes I do believe this is a me problem. I love being an outsider too and I guess I'm expecting something different in AA. I want to feel apart of the family but it's a two way street. I know I'm the kind of person that warms up to people and that takes time.
But who am I to blame these guys for being like this though? They've had to rely on each other to survive this disease for years so they have a special bond. I guess in a lot of ways I just see this as my last my job where the cliques ran everything and I was never really "in" and didn't want to conform or kiss ass. AA is different and I just have to go for myself and let my past be that. I've let stupid stuff and people stop me from other things and sobriety won't be one of those things.
I'll eventually make those connections and to be honest I'm hoping for the kind that will save my life, not help me to get a promotion at my job.
But who am I to blame these guys for being like this though? They've had to rely on each other to survive this disease for years so they have a special bond. I guess in a lot of ways I just see this as my last my job where the cliques ran everything and I was never really "in" and didn't want to conform or kiss ass. AA is different and I just have to go for myself and let my past be that. I've let stupid stuff and people stop me from other things and sobriety won't be one of those things.
I'll eventually make those connections and to be honest I'm hoping for the kind that will save my life, not help me to get a promotion at my job.
Member
Join Date: Jun 2017
Location: Pittsburgh, PA
Posts: 132
I go to 3 different meetings at 3 different churches.
There are so many people with so much clean time, they do tend to gravitate towards each other. Think of the things they have shared and learned about each other over the years!
I have always felt welcome at every single meeting, even my first one.
It's never occurred to me to think of those that know each other for many years, are part of a clique. I think we are all part of a program to keep us sober.
Tons of strength in that concept.
Are you sharing at meetings? Have others introduced themselves?
Have you gotten numbers?
Try a different place, try 2 or even 3.
If you get the feeling people are cliquish in all those places, it might be you and not them.
In your first post you mentioned something about this being a familiar thing with you and why you drank. Can you elaborate on this?
Keep going to the meetings and I guarantee you will get to know these people.
That is what AA is about
Good luck to you
There are so many people with so much clean time, they do tend to gravitate towards each other. Think of the things they have shared and learned about each other over the years!
I have always felt welcome at every single meeting, even my first one.
It's never occurred to me to think of those that know each other for many years, are part of a clique. I think we are all part of a program to keep us sober.
Tons of strength in that concept.
Are you sharing at meetings? Have others introduced themselves?
Have you gotten numbers?
Try a different place, try 2 or even 3.
If you get the feeling people are cliquish in all those places, it might be you and not them.
In your first post you mentioned something about this being a familiar thing with you and why you drank. Can you elaborate on this?
Keep going to the meetings and I guarantee you will get to know these people.
That is what AA is about
Good luck to you
AA Member
Join Date: Mar 2016
Location: Silicon Valley
Posts: 2,984
Originally Posted by doggonecarl 
They come to AA with all their failings and shortcomings.
any knucklehead like me can go to a meeting
it's supposed to be principles before personalities but unfortunately where ever I go, there I am
for me taking the good and leaving the rest is paramount
i have a good life today because of my AA involvement
Member
Join Date: Jan 2014
Posts: 8,666
I've sometimes felt that way in AA.
I've sometimes felt really wonderful in AA.
I've sometimes felt lots of things in between.
But the overall balance of the thing is that I laid aside those doubts and those concerns and frustrations and resolved to take what I could learn from everyone in AA, from the program, the book, the steps.
And when I did that, it became a valuable tool for my recovery.
It doesn't always leave me feeling GOOD. But it does always leave me with something new, something I can use in my growth and in deepening my sobriety. My own frustrations with AA generally - when I'm honest - are signposts guiding me to my own opportunities to grow.
I've sometimes felt really wonderful in AA.
I've sometimes felt lots of things in between.
But the overall balance of the thing is that I laid aside those doubts and those concerns and frustrations and resolved to take what I could learn from everyone in AA, from the program, the book, the steps.
And when I did that, it became a valuable tool for my recovery.
It doesn't always leave me feeling GOOD. But it does always leave me with something new, something I can use in my growth and in deepening my sobriety. My own frustrations with AA generally - when I'm honest - are signposts guiding me to my own opportunities to grow.
Member
Join Date: Apr 2012
Location: northern michigan. not the U.P.
Posts: 15,281
Originally Posted by tr4vionz
Thanks for the quick responses and yes I do believe this is a me problem. I love being an outsider too and I guess I'm expecting something different in AA. I want to feel apart of the family but it's a two way street. I know I'm the kind of person that warms up to people and that takes time.
But who am I to blame these guys for being like this though? They've had to rely on each other to survive this disease for years so they have a special bond. .
But who am I to blame these guys for being like this though? They've had to rely on each other to survive this disease for years so they have a special bond. .
-it takes we who have been in AA for some time to warm up to newcomers. we are there to share our experience,strength, and hope with the newcomer. THAT is our PRIMARY purpose at meetings. we see a LOT of people come through the doors. yup, we'll be friendly, but most of us aint gonna go gettin all buddybuddy with someone thats there to save their job, get their husband/wife off their back, appease the courts, etc.
-the friendships are something that are built over time.
i didnt have much said to me before or after meetings for some time. i still showed up early ,stayed after, and listened. i heard a lot of laughter and freedom.
- we dont rely on each other to "survive" the disease. on that, its important to know what the disease concept is that is referred to- a spiritual disease. the program helps us find a power greater than ourselves, and NOT another person, to help us recover from the hopeless state of mind and body.
we come to rely on that power greater than ourselves. not other humans.
-the special bond is called friendship, which i learned real quick i had no idea what friendship was. that friendship goes way beyond the doors of an AA meeting. there is a lot that we help each other through.
the old saying
theres strength in numbers
shows true in AA.
when i was going through a serious cancer fight( which started 13 months into recovery) i was blessed to have people from the fellowship that rode with me to my appointments, showed up in the hospital when i was going through chemo, visited after one of the 6 surgeries- even brought a meeting to my house a few times- both after a surgery and while recooperating from chemo and while going through a clinical trial-, cleaned my house, brought me meals, cut my grass, did some shopping for me....
and more importantly- listened to me when i was having rough times. the REAL friends didnt just let me go into pity parties about it all- they gave me solutions.
and soemtimes broke out their crowbars to pop my head back out of my ass!
those friendships didnt happen overnight. they took time to build.
and personally i can count on 1 hand the amount of true friends i have. yeah, i know people in AA and talk to quite a few. but theres only a couple that truly know ME.
keep going back,tr4vionz! go to different meetings. get the big book and read it( check out the chapter" a vision for you"). find a sponsor and work the steps.
the best years of your life lie ahead.
Life Health Prosperity
Join Date: Sep 2011
Location: Louisana
Posts: 6,752
Tr4vionz, any time a group of humans form a pecking order will happen. Maybe an island is where you need to be. I'm 7 years sober and the only place I hang for sobriety is right here on SR. Rootin for ya. 
Member
Thread Starter
Join Date: Jul 2017
Posts: 22
Thanks again for the responses. It's really helping me and I do agree with you guys. I'm so glad I asked this question now!
Are you sharing at meetings?
I did my first share today and it felt good. A woman somewhat responded to me and I wasn't sure how to take her comment. The end was basically her sponsor helped her with what to say and what not to say and I kinda felt odd like maybe I said something wrong. I'm not too sure if there's stuff you're supposed to say or not but at this point but right now I'm just listening and soaking up all this knowledge, wisedom and experience.
Have others introduced themselves?
Yes plenty of people have
Have you gotten numbers?
Yes I have plenty of numbers. Im at that 500 lb phone stage and I gotta let my pride down.
If you get the feeling people are cliquish in all those places, it might be you and not them.
In your first post you mentioned something about this being a familiar thing with you and why you drank. Can you elaborate on this?
Long story short coming from a small private school to a large public high school was huge for me. I wanted to be popular and in the in crowd and dissed my childhood friends for that. I was an outsider and square until one day I made friends...so I thought. I was a huge people pleaser and did anything to make friends. I did things that were or of my character and from that I feel I've always run away from true self who at this point I can't even remember who that is.
I always changed and made myself whoever others wanted me to be. So when the drinking turned from social to a way to cope is when I started seeing that those friends were only using me. That I was never cool and was always the nerd or weirdo. That cycle repeated itself until maybe 2010 when my sons mother all but used me up too and I got hustled.
I'm very much to blame because I was too dumb, naive and just wanted to be cool. So now I'm leery, untrusting, and I don't want to be in the cool crowd. So now as I'm 30 the cool crowd doesn't accept me and I unmercifully bullied, punked and made fun of...why I drink now.
I'm 3 days sober and I see the same thing again and I'm just praying that it's my mind at this point....not the bullying...just the clique.
What I mean by hierarchy is like a pecking order.
Are you sharing at meetings?
I did my first share today and it felt good. A woman somewhat responded to me and I wasn't sure how to take her comment. The end was basically her sponsor helped her with what to say and what not to say and I kinda felt odd like maybe I said something wrong. I'm not too sure if there's stuff you're supposed to say or not but at this point but right now I'm just listening and soaking up all this knowledge, wisedom and experience.
Have others introduced themselves?
Yes plenty of people have
Have you gotten numbers?
Yes I have plenty of numbers. Im at that 500 lb phone stage and I gotta let my pride down.
If you get the feeling people are cliquish in all those places, it might be you and not them.
In your first post you mentioned something about this being a familiar thing with you and why you drank. Can you elaborate on this?
Long story short coming from a small private school to a large public high school was huge for me. I wanted to be popular and in the in crowd and dissed my childhood friends for that. I was an outsider and square until one day I made friends...so I thought. I was a huge people pleaser and did anything to make friends. I did things that were or of my character and from that I feel I've always run away from true self who at this point I can't even remember who that is.
I always changed and made myself whoever others wanted me to be. So when the drinking turned from social to a way to cope is when I started seeing that those friends were only using me. That I was never cool and was always the nerd or weirdo. That cycle repeated itself until maybe 2010 when my sons mother all but used me up too and I got hustled.
I'm very much to blame because I was too dumb, naive and just wanted to be cool. So now I'm leery, untrusting, and I don't want to be in the cool crowd. So now as I'm 30 the cool crowd doesn't accept me and I unmercifully bullied, punked and made fun of...why I drink now.
I'm 3 days sober and I see the same thing again and I'm just praying that it's my mind at this point....not the bullying...just the clique.
What I mean by hierarchy is like a pecking order.
Member
Thread Starter
Join Date: Jul 2017
Posts: 22
Originally Posted by tomsteve
couple things about that:
-it takes we who have been in AA for some time to warm up to newcomers. we are there to share our experience,strength, and hope with the newcomer. THAT is our PRIMARY purpose at meetings. we see a LOT of people come through the doors. yup, we'll be friendly, but most of us aint gonna go gettin all buddybuddy with someone thats there to save their job, get their husband/wife off their back, appease the courts, etc.
-the friendships are something that are built over time.
i didnt have much said to me before or after meetings for some time. i still showed up early ,stayed after, and listened. i heard a lot of laughter and freedom.
- we dont rely on each other to "survive" the disease. on that, its important to know what the disease concept is that is referred to- a spiritual disease. the program helps us find a power greater than ourselves, and NOT another person, to help us recover from the hopeless state of mind and body.
we come to rely on that power greater than ourselves. not other humans.
-the special bond is called friendship, which i learned real quick i had no idea what friendship was. that friendship goes way beyond the doors of an AA meeting. there is a lot that we help each other through.
the old saying
theres strength in numbers
shows true in AA.
when i was going through a serious cancer fight( which started 13 months into recovery) i was blessed to have people from the fellowship that rode with me to my appointments, showed up in the hospital when i was going through chemo, visited after one of the 6 surgeries- even brought a meeting to my house a few times- both after a surgery and while recooperating from chemo and while going through a clinical trial-, cleaned my house, brought me meals, cut my grass, did some shopping for me....
and more importantly- listened to me when i was having rough times. the REAL friends didnt just let me go into pity parties about it all- they gave me solutions.
and soemtimes broke out their crowbars to pop my head back out of my ass!
those friendships didnt happen overnight. they took time to build.
and personally i can count on 1 hand the amount of true friends i have. yeah, i know people in AA and talk to quite a few. but theres only a couple that truly know ME.
keep going back,tr4vionz! go to different meetings. get the big book and read it( check out the chapter" a vision for you"). find a sponsor and work the steps.
the best years of your life lie ahead.
-it takes we who have been in AA for some time to warm up to newcomers. we are there to share our experience,strength, and hope with the newcomer. THAT is our PRIMARY purpose at meetings. we see a LOT of people come through the doors. yup, we'll be friendly, but most of us aint gonna go gettin all buddybuddy with someone thats there to save their job, get their husband/wife off their back, appease the courts, etc.
-the friendships are something that are built over time.
i didnt have much said to me before or after meetings for some time. i still showed up early ,stayed after, and listened. i heard a lot of laughter and freedom.
- we dont rely on each other to "survive" the disease. on that, its important to know what the disease concept is that is referred to- a spiritual disease. the program helps us find a power greater than ourselves, and NOT another person, to help us recover from the hopeless state of mind and body.
we come to rely on that power greater than ourselves. not other humans.
-the special bond is called friendship, which i learned real quick i had no idea what friendship was. that friendship goes way beyond the doors of an AA meeting. there is a lot that we help each other through.
the old saying
theres strength in numbers
shows true in AA.
when i was going through a serious cancer fight( which started 13 months into recovery) i was blessed to have people from the fellowship that rode with me to my appointments, showed up in the hospital when i was going through chemo, visited after one of the 6 surgeries- even brought a meeting to my house a few times- both after a surgery and while recooperating from chemo and while going through a clinical trial-, cleaned my house, brought me meals, cut my grass, did some shopping for me....
and more importantly- listened to me when i was having rough times. the REAL friends didnt just let me go into pity parties about it all- they gave me solutions.
and soemtimes broke out their crowbars to pop my head back out of my ass!
those friendships didnt happen overnight. they took time to build.
and personally i can count on 1 hand the amount of true friends i have. yeah, i know people in AA and talk to quite a few. but theres only a couple that truly know ME.
keep going back,tr4vionz! go to different meetings. get the big book and read it( check out the chapter" a vision for you"). find a sponsor and work the steps.
the best years of your life lie ahead.
Member
Join Date: Jan 2014
Posts: 3,293
Originally Posted by tomsteve
p.s.
yes, there are cliques in AA.
hierarchy? never heard that.
we are not saints,just humans being.
i suggest keeping everyone off the pedastal.
yes, there are cliques in AA.
hierarchy? never heard that.
we are not saints,just humans being.
i suggest keeping everyone off the pedastal.
John
Member
Join Date: Sep 2009
Location: Miami, FL
Posts: 1,701
Yes, people are not going to open their arms till you have proven that you are around to stay.
Yes, there are cliques.
Yes, there is a hierarchy.
But this is an organization made up of human beings. They are going to organize themselves socially the way people do--for good and for ill.
Unfortunately, you can search for a perfect organization and miss out on a good one.
Yes, there are cliques.
Yes, there is a hierarchy.
But this is an organization made up of human beings. They are going to organize themselves socially the way people do--for good and for ill.
Unfortunately, you can search for a perfect organization and miss out on a good one.
Member
Join Date: Jan 2014
Posts: 3,293
Originally Posted by miamifella
Yes, people are not going to open their arms till you have proven that you are around to stay.
Yes, there are cliques.
Yes, there is a hierarchy.
But this is an organization made up of human beings. They are going to organize themselves socially the way people do--for good and for ill.
Unfortunately, you can search for a perfect organization and miss out on a good one.
Yes, there are cliques.
Yes, there is a hierarchy.
But this is an organization made up of human beings. They are going to organize themselves socially the way people do--for good and for ill.
Unfortunately, you can search for a perfect organization and miss out on a good one.
Member
Join Date: Sep 2009
Location: Miami, FL
Posts: 1,701
Originally Posted by 2muchpain
Don't want to get into a debate on this subject, so this will be my last opinion on this subject. You can be going to a meeting for a long time and do all the things you are suppose to do, and still not be accepted. I'm speaking not only from personal experience but also observations of others. Sad but true. Just is. John
And I think there are many valid reasons to reject 12-step recovery, but I do not think the fact that members are average humans is one of them. And I think that is what OP was upset with. He may eventually leave the program for another reason, or may find it is the thing that helps him the most. But I would hate to have anyone not give it a try because the social structure is too similar to that of most other groups.
Member
Join Date: Jan 2014
Posts: 3,293
Originally Posted by miamifella
Yes, I had a similar experience. But I still got a lot out of the the program, even if in the end it was not for me.
And I think there are many valid reasons to reject 12-step recovery, but I do not think the fact that members are average humans is one of them. And I think that is what OP was upset with. He may eventually leave the program for another reason, or may find it is the thing that helps him the most. But I would hate to have anyone not give it a try because the social structure is too similar to that of most other groups.
And I think there are many valid reasons to reject 12-step recovery, but I do not think the fact that members are average humans is one of them. And I think that is what OP was upset with. He may eventually leave the program for another reason, or may find it is the thing that helps him the most. But I would hate to have anyone not give it a try because the social structure is too similar to that of most other groups.
Member
Join Date: Jun 2017
Posts: 2,909
tr4vionz, I can very much relate to your feelings. I felt the same way much of my life and yes, even in AA.
All I can tell you is that the combination of working the twelve steps and time have totally dissipated those feelings.
They have been replaced with serenity and comfort in my own skin.
All I can tell you is that the combination of working the twelve steps and time have totally dissipated those feelings.
They have been replaced with serenity and comfort in my own skin.
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