Really struggling.
saoutchik
Join Date: Jan 2015
Location: London
Posts: 16,205
Trying to quit alcohol AND tobacco, it is no wonder you are finding it hard to concentrate Meraviglioso
I feel uncomfortable writing this because quitting smoking is absolutely a good thing to do, principally for health reasons but financial and social reasons as well. However, speaking from my own perspective, quitting alcohol was really hard, I was totally consumed by the struggle for the first few months. The thought of trying to take on another addiction simultaneously would have seemed a step too far and maybe I would have been setting myself up for failure.
For the sake of clarification I should say that I was not a smoker when I quit alcohol so I am not speaking from experience but I did quit smoking (before I became an alcoholic) so I do know that quitting ciggies is not peanuts
Perhaps you could set a date at the beginning of the New Year to quit tobacco when you have a bit more sober time in the bank?
One last thing, again this is only my opinion, I don't state it as fact, quitting something primarily for partners, loved ones , family etc is not an ideal scenario, if you succeed it can sometimes be a source of future resentment. I think people can only quit for themselves, not meaning that in a selfish way. Obviously as spur then pleasing others is great
I feel uncomfortable writing this because quitting smoking is absolutely a good thing to do, principally for health reasons but financial and social reasons as well. However, speaking from my own perspective, quitting alcohol was really hard, I was totally consumed by the struggle for the first few months. The thought of trying to take on another addiction simultaneously would have seemed a step too far and maybe I would have been setting myself up for failure.
For the sake of clarification I should say that I was not a smoker when I quit alcohol so I am not speaking from experience but I did quit smoking (before I became an alcoholic) so I do know that quitting ciggies is not peanuts
Perhaps you could set a date at the beginning of the New Year to quit tobacco when you have a bit more sober time in the bank?
One last thing, again this is only my opinion, I don't state it as fact, quitting something primarily for partners, loved ones , family etc is not an ideal scenario, if you succeed it can sometimes be a source of future resentment. I think people can only quit for themselves, not meaning that in a selfish way. Obviously as spur then pleasing others is great
Member
Thread Starter
Join Date: Jul 2014
Posts: 4,251
And to be clear, I am not some noble person with overly laudable levels of honesty. A huge part of that is selfish too- I am trying of living in the nightmare of a lie. I smoked earlier in the day today and now and scheduled to see him for dinner in 20 minuets. I have scrubbed myself int he shower, taken a detox bath with salts and apple cider vinegar, re-scrubbed myself in the shower again, put on a face mask, brushed my teeth 100 times, eaten odorous food like olives and onion slices trying to mask the smell. BUT WILL HE SMELL IT? The world is not going to end if he does. he is not going to leave me either. But he is going to be angry- more so about the lies than the actual smoking. Living a lie is hell. Why so much energy? Just quit both of the bad things and live an honest life, something I have much less harder time doing when not in active addiction to alcohol and now, so it seems, tobacco.
Member
Join Date: Dec 2012
Location: Melbourne, Victoria Australia
Posts: 1,202
Mera, luv - catching up the posts that came in overnight (my time): well, I hear you, meaning I hear you getting very wound up. I say this as a sufferer of 'how many ways can I punish myself today?', thoughts and feelings which are almost always subliminal and based on old entrenched brain habits. Early sobriety (through which I've travelled more times than I care to count, and where I'm at again currently, just like you) is a time of rawness, quite logically.
As others have pointed out, and especially Anna, it's essentially a time to focus on self-care in lots of small but significant ways, by stepping through each moment each day noticing what's going on within. We then practice, over and over again, whatever ways we're able - short of drinking! - to soothe, take a beneficial action, simplify the landscape (my notion of Keep It Simple), get grounded again in just this moment, etc etc etc.
Everything I'm suggesting is stuff that I try to do for myself these days, and it often really helps. Simplicity for complicated people works. As do blessed post-it notes! Bought a stack of 'em (or actually, a few small notebooks for reminders) only last week in fact :-)
Keep on truckin', dear Mera. You ARE OK, right now.
ps I too just pop in and out of the very fast moving threads, but only when I can. Have done so for most of the years I've been here, and it's ok to do that. Pipe up when you can for others, and then excise the words 'failure' and 'selfishness' from their prominent positions - reframe them to something more human-scale and comforting. Rinse and repeat :-)
x Vic
As others have pointed out, and especially Anna, it's essentially a time to focus on self-care in lots of small but significant ways, by stepping through each moment each day noticing what's going on within. We then practice, over and over again, whatever ways we're able - short of drinking! - to soothe, take a beneficial action, simplify the landscape (my notion of Keep It Simple), get grounded again in just this moment, etc etc etc.
Everything I'm suggesting is stuff that I try to do for myself these days, and it often really helps. Simplicity for complicated people works. As do blessed post-it notes! Bought a stack of 'em (or actually, a few small notebooks for reminders) only last week in fact :-)
Keep on truckin', dear Mera. You ARE OK, right now.
ps I too just pop in and out of the very fast moving threads, but only when I can. Have done so for most of the years I've been here, and it's ok to do that. Pipe up when you can for others, and then excise the words 'failure' and 'selfishness' from their prominent positions - reframe them to something more human-scale and comforting. Rinse and repeat :-)
x Vic
Member
Join Date: Oct 2013
Location: Midwest
Posts: 4,860
Hi, Mera. I've been wondering how you're doing and send my very kindest thoughts to you. Like others, I hope that you'll look further into treatment for depression. The fact that you're not exercising rang a bell. Well, more than that. Same thing happened here. I've been getting help for depression and it has made a big difference in my life.
Take care, sweet lady.
Take care, sweet lady.
Member
Join Date: May 2012
Location: canada
Posts: 7,242
yes, so glad to see you posting again.
and thinking it is just fine to be selfish in early sobriety, selfish in the sense of looking out for and after yourself. self-centered in the most positive sense.
and being of possible use to others in places like SR or others is a huge part of that.
and thinking it is just fine to be selfish in early sobriety, selfish in the sense of looking out for and after yourself. self-centered in the most positive sense.
and being of possible use to others in places like SR or others is a huge part of that.
Member
Join Date: Feb 2016
Location: middle of nowhere
Posts: 2,849
Mera, why don't you come clean with him and tell him you lied?
Get it off your chest instead of letting it fester.
And I agree- trying to quit two things at once is hard!
I've given myself a lot of leeway with the smoking- I think you should too. Get some GOOD sobriety under your belt then consider tackling the smoking.
And if he gives you flack for it, too frikken bad!! It's YOUR body, and I for one think as long as you are keeping yourself sober and sane, you don't need to answer to anyone as to your smoking.
You are still miles away and doing much better than you were at the beginning
of the year, and you should be proud of yourself for how far you've come. Sometimes we have to stumble and fall before we can figure out the how of keeping us from stumbling in the first place.
Take care Mera
Get it off your chest instead of letting it fester.
And I agree- trying to quit two things at once is hard!
I've given myself a lot of leeway with the smoking- I think you should too. Get some GOOD sobriety under your belt then consider tackling the smoking.
And if he gives you flack for it, too frikken bad!! It's YOUR body, and I for one think as long as you are keeping yourself sober and sane, you don't need to answer to anyone as to your smoking.
You are still miles away and doing much better than you were at the beginning
of the year, and you should be proud of yourself for how far you've come. Sometimes we have to stumble and fall before we can figure out the how of keeping us from stumbling in the first place.
Take care Mera
Member
Join Date: Sep 2009
Posts: 709
Hi Mera, sorry to hear that you're having a rough time. I agree, quitting two habits at virtually the same time is a tall order. Maybe tell your boyfriend you're trying to quit smoking and some days you're doing great, other days not so great. (Rather than having to keep a running inventory on the times you do/don't smoke.)
I also second Anna's suggestion to be kind to yourself. You certainly are kind to other people. Sobriety is not always a straight line, it can come in fits and starts.
Does the rehab you went to offer a "tune up"? When I was in rehab, a woman I became very good friends with was there for the 2nd time, and after I left she came in for her 3rd. It was only for a week, not 6 weeks, but it was something she needed. Of course, it's difficult when you have kids and a job!
Despite a few setbacks, you are heading the right way. You've had a good amount of sober time, so you know you can do this. See what your doctor says...keep us posted here, we care.
I also second Anna's suggestion to be kind to yourself. You certainly are kind to other people. Sobriety is not always a straight line, it can come in fits and starts.
Does the rehab you went to offer a "tune up"? When I was in rehab, a woman I became very good friends with was there for the 2nd time, and after I left she came in for her 3rd. It was only for a week, not 6 weeks, but it was something she needed. Of course, it's difficult when you have kids and a job!
Despite a few setbacks, you are heading the right way. You've had a good amount of sober time, so you know you can do this. See what your doctor says...keep us posted here, we care.
Member
Join Date: Apr 2014
Location: Alberta, Canada
Posts: 556
Hi Mera,
I have been following your thread and enjoy your commentary very much.
Your last post included this;
One day smoking, one not.
I wonder if the quitting smoking or the smoking as a bit has something to do with these cognitive problems? I can say I felt really much, much better while smoke free- even after just one day. Does anyone have experiences to share related to that.
I have been trying to quit smoking myself this past month. More off than on, but every few days I am indulging ( guilty )
I am finding my thought process very eratic, most ADHD like. I can't focus on one thing more than 15 minutes. I have the attention span and memory of a gnit.
I am positive it is withdrawels, as I have quit dozens of times and this always happens.
I just read on another thread that L-Glutimine is very good for repairing brain pathways, so i am going to try that.
I am going to see if I can find that post again, as the writer had excellent suggestions for nutrition in recovery (& why)
I will copy and paste.
I have been following your thread and enjoy your commentary very much.
Your last post included this;
One day smoking, one not.
I wonder if the quitting smoking or the smoking as a bit has something to do with these cognitive problems? I can say I felt really much, much better while smoke free- even after just one day. Does anyone have experiences to share related to that.
I have been trying to quit smoking myself this past month. More off than on, but every few days I am indulging ( guilty )
I am finding my thought process very eratic, most ADHD like. I can't focus on one thing more than 15 minutes. I have the attention span and memory of a gnit.
I am positive it is withdrawels, as I have quit dozens of times and this always happens.
I just read on another thread that L-Glutimine is very good for repairing brain pathways, so i am going to try that.
I am going to see if I can find that post again, as the writer had excellent suggestions for nutrition in recovery (& why)
I will copy and paste.
Member
Join Date: Apr 2014
Location: Alberta, Canada
Posts: 556
Posted by CAPTAINZING2000
According to Dr. Domenic Ciraulo of Boston Medical Center, alcohol causes a chemical imbalance in the brain involving the neurotransmitters dopamine and serotonin. While alcohol initially leads to an increase in dopamine, chronic alcohol consumption eventually causes dopamine levels to fall, leading to a more anxious craving for alcohol and requiring larger amounts of alcohol to get the same effect. Bananas and sunflower seeds are effective in raising dopamine levels. Caffeine can trigger dopamine release in your body for a short time, but results in a drop in the long term.
Vegetables and Fruits
Fill your daily diet with fresh vegetables and fruits. These plant-based foods are packed with fiber, which aids your body in maintaining a stable blood sugar level, helping to curb alcohol craving. In addition, these nutrient-rich foods help strengthen your immune system and protect your liver, which are both negatively impacted when you consume excess alcohol. Eating a diet rich in fresh fruits and vegetables helps replace essential vitamins that your body loses through malabsorption when drinking alcohol, helping to prevent vitamin deficiencies.
L-Glutamine-Containing Foods
L-glutamine is an amino acid that helps improve your brain functioning. Along with glucose, it's one of the main fuels for your brain cells. It improves your ability to sleep, decreases anxiety and reduces cravings. According to the Breining Institute, L-glutamine decreases sugar cravings and your desire for alcohol and is useful for recovering alcoholics. L-glutamine is easily destroyed by cooking. Fresh, raw spinach and parsley are good sources. Consult your physician before taking a glutamine supplement, since ammonia accumulation in the blood could result if you have cirrhosis of the liver.
According to Dr. Domenic Ciraulo of Boston Medical Center, alcohol causes a chemical imbalance in the brain involving the neurotransmitters dopamine and serotonin. While alcohol initially leads to an increase in dopamine, chronic alcohol consumption eventually causes dopamine levels to fall, leading to a more anxious craving for alcohol and requiring larger amounts of alcohol to get the same effect. Bananas and sunflower seeds are effective in raising dopamine levels. Caffeine can trigger dopamine release in your body for a short time, but results in a drop in the long term.
Vegetables and Fruits
Fill your daily diet with fresh vegetables and fruits. These plant-based foods are packed with fiber, which aids your body in maintaining a stable blood sugar level, helping to curb alcohol craving. In addition, these nutrient-rich foods help strengthen your immune system and protect your liver, which are both negatively impacted when you consume excess alcohol. Eating a diet rich in fresh fruits and vegetables helps replace essential vitamins that your body loses through malabsorption when drinking alcohol, helping to prevent vitamin deficiencies.
L-Glutamine-Containing Foods
L-glutamine is an amino acid that helps improve your brain functioning. Along with glucose, it's one of the main fuels for your brain cells. It improves your ability to sleep, decreases anxiety and reduces cravings. According to the Breining Institute, L-glutamine decreases sugar cravings and your desire for alcohol and is useful for recovering alcoholics. L-glutamine is easily destroyed by cooking. Fresh, raw spinach and parsley are good sources. Consult your physician before taking a glutamine supplement, since ammonia accumulation in the blood could result if you have cirrhosis of the liver.
Member
Thread Starter
Join Date: Jul 2014
Posts: 4,251
Thanks for taking the time to seek that out and post StormiNormi, some good information there. I'm hesitant to add in anything else to my medication/vitamin regime as I am up to swallowing a good number of pills these days. But I will definitely ask my psychiatrist about it as it sounds like it could really help. I just want to be sure it wouldn't conflict with anything I am currently taking.
Uncorked, I liked what you said about just coming out and saying "I am doing my best here" My goad is to be smoke free- for me, not for him. I feel better, it is goof for my health, even if I don't smoke in the house I want to raise my kids in a smoke free environment and be a smoke free role model for them. I consider going rom a pack a day to quitting cold turkey for a week and now smoking a handful every other day forward progress.
Though, given what we know about alcohol addiction, moderation is not the goal here and not ideal. But I'm getting there. I'm doing my best.
Thanks Delizadee for you words, I do feel miles away from where I was at the beginning of the year. I know I am nearing success, I have already made huge progress and am proud of that despite all the self criticism.
Thanks venecia, I have an appointment next week. I skipped out on some time with him in order to take a breather. But it turned out not to be a good idea and he thankfully and professionally has included me back in his client roster.
Soachick, you are so right that quitting smoking is not peanuts. If I were really struggling I might put the idea of quitting off, but it is something I have wanted to do for a long time and for whatever reason, despite total perfection, has been relatively easy for me. My cravings are mild, I would categorise them as annoying more than anything, but nothing unnameable. The times I have gone to smoking have been out of habit, giving in for no real reason, not because the craving for tobacco was so overwhelming I felt I couldn't handle it. I believe that my use of Campral has something to do with this- either legitimately pharmacological or placebo.
Thanks bemyself. Self care is an important time of my plan right now. My boyfriend sat down with me and helped me make a list of areas to address in order to be the person I want to be. We included not drinking at the top, followed by not smoking, exercising, eating a healthy diet, etc. Included in that was a visit to a medical esthetician to treat some mild scarring I have on my face and generally get my skin in better condition after years of abuse. He also encouraged me to take some of the money I am having and buy some new clothing. I very rarely buy new clothes but he said when making such huge changes it is also good to have something tangible to hold on to and signify this change. A clean face, a new outfit might be a visible way of showing I am in a moment of change. I don't know. He did buy me a air of gorgeous Italian boots this past weekend!
Heavyn,fini, thank you for coming here with your support, it truly means a lot.
Needmyfamily, thank you for the compliment. How are you doing? Your support means a lot and if I can offer it back to you reach out anytime.
Uncorked, I liked what you said about just coming out and saying "I am doing my best here" My goad is to be smoke free- for me, not for him. I feel better, it is goof for my health, even if I don't smoke in the house I want to raise my kids in a smoke free environment and be a smoke free role model for them. I consider going rom a pack a day to quitting cold turkey for a week and now smoking a handful every other day forward progress.
Though, given what we know about alcohol addiction, moderation is not the goal here and not ideal. But I'm getting there. I'm doing my best.
Thanks Delizadee for you words, I do feel miles away from where I was at the beginning of the year. I know I am nearing success, I have already made huge progress and am proud of that despite all the self criticism.
Thanks venecia, I have an appointment next week. I skipped out on some time with him in order to take a breather. But it turned out not to be a good idea and he thankfully and professionally has included me back in his client roster.
Soachick, you are so right that quitting smoking is not peanuts. If I were really struggling I might put the idea of quitting off, but it is something I have wanted to do for a long time and for whatever reason, despite total perfection, has been relatively easy for me. My cravings are mild, I would categorise them as annoying more than anything, but nothing unnameable. The times I have gone to smoking have been out of habit, giving in for no real reason, not because the craving for tobacco was so overwhelming I felt I couldn't handle it. I believe that my use of Campral has something to do with this- either legitimately pharmacological or placebo.
Thanks bemyself. Self care is an important time of my plan right now. My boyfriend sat down with me and helped me make a list of areas to address in order to be the person I want to be. We included not drinking at the top, followed by not smoking, exercising, eating a healthy diet, etc. Included in that was a visit to a medical esthetician to treat some mild scarring I have on my face and generally get my skin in better condition after years of abuse. He also encouraged me to take some of the money I am having and buy some new clothing. I very rarely buy new clothes but he said when making such huge changes it is also good to have something tangible to hold on to and signify this change. A clean face, a new outfit might be a visible way of showing I am in a moment of change. I don't know. He did buy me a air of gorgeous Italian boots this past weekend!
Heavyn,fini, thank you for coming here with your support, it truly means a lot.
Needmyfamily, thank you for the compliment. How are you doing? Your support means a lot and if I can offer it back to you reach out anytime.
Member
Join Date: Nov 2016
Location: Australia
Posts: 131
Ah sorry for butting in here but I'm just wondering around and dropped in on this thread.
Campral???
I have heard very bad things about this medication and would think it pretty likely that the things you are experiencing may be side effects of that.
Not a doctor but reckon you should check that out!
Campral???
I have heard very bad things about this medication and would think it pretty likely that the things you are experiencing may be side effects of that.
Not a doctor but reckon you should check that out!
Member
Thread Starter
Join Date: Jul 2014
Posts: 4,251
Thanks Miramar, I will mention it to my doctor when I see him, I don't want to make any changes without his input. I have taken it before without these symptoms. I think it is kindling/paws related and will settle down.
As for the Campral I have had some success with it. I think it is a hit or miss. Some people really benefit from it with little to no side effects, others do not benefit at all an have terrible side effects.
Sorry for all the typos in my early morning post earlier, I hope you were able to follow along!
As for the Campral I have had some success with it. I think it is a hit or miss. Some people really benefit from it with little to no side effects, others do not benefit at all an have terrible side effects.
Sorry for all the typos in my early morning post earlier, I hope you were able to follow along!
Member
Join Date: Jun 2014
Posts: 1,869
Hi Mera:
I'm here too watching out for you. I post here and there when I can (my SR is kind of like s secret in my life, my hubby knows I read but I don't think he thinks about me posting) and I have never felt pressured of bad for not participating. People here aren't like that, at all. Sometimes I don't post because I don't have the time to put the effort that I would like to give into a post but I think that just by dropping a few lines I feel connected. There are so many of us that read mostly and we are so greatful for those who post.
I'm sorry that you are feeling crappy but give yourself some credit. You have been through A LOT this year. It's normal to feel bad sometimes but definitely check out your meds and any side effects. The other thing is that you MUST exercise. I know it's important to you because you have mentioned it several times before. You enjoy it.
Take it slow, one day at a time!!!
You are a wonderful and beautiful person! In and out (I saw your pic from in-patient, and I feel like I know you a bit because I have always read your post).
Hang here with us. We have missed you but don't feel pressured. We are always here to support you. Please don't forget that ever!
We are on your side!!!
Ciao.
I'm here too watching out for you. I post here and there when I can (my SR is kind of like s secret in my life, my hubby knows I read but I don't think he thinks about me posting) and I have never felt pressured of bad for not participating. People here aren't like that, at all. Sometimes I don't post because I don't have the time to put the effort that I would like to give into a post but I think that just by dropping a few lines I feel connected. There are so many of us that read mostly and we are so greatful for those who post.
I'm sorry that you are feeling crappy but give yourself some credit. You have been through A LOT this year. It's normal to feel bad sometimes but definitely check out your meds and any side effects. The other thing is that you MUST exercise. I know it's important to you because you have mentioned it several times before. You enjoy it.
Take it slow, one day at a time!!!
You are a wonderful and beautiful person! In and out (I saw your pic from in-patient, and I feel like I know you a bit because I have always read your post).
Hang here with us. We have missed you but don't feel pressured. We are always here to support you. Please don't forget that ever!
We are on your side!!!
Ciao.
EndGame
Join Date: Jun 2013
Location: New York, NY
Posts: 4,677
I'm surprised that it hasn't appeared in this thread so far, Mera, but we've been down this road before.
Living the life of a perfectionist guarantees at least two things. By virtue of never living up to unrealistic and punitive standards, you will always and ever view yourself as a failure. Second, your self-esteem will remain hostage to and suffer from your misperceptions of what it means to be a good person. You even use your inability to "keep up" with another thread as a reason to defend yourself against some nameless, faceless executioner. It's a lifestyle that not only invites periods of anxiety and depression, but also makes them inevitable. We all pay a heavy price for rejecting or erasing who we are, and doing so reliably takes its toll on other people as well.
But there's more. Just look at all the time and energy you invested in making yourself "perfect" for your boyfriend. How did it come to be that all that frantic preparation came to be necessary for you just to feel okay? How is it that you've come to a place where you've surrendered in thought and deed to living someone else's life? To go very far out of your way to please someone with a sketchy history in terms of supporting you in your struggle to get sober? When does the person who you truly are and who you are becoming get any meaningful attention from the rest of you? And what will it take for you to give up the destructive notion that you have to prepare yourself to be something you're not in order to meet the demands of both what you think other people will need so that they will not reject or abandon you, and the part of you that seems not to care for who you are as an individual?
There is no such thing as an act or a behavior that is executed without an intention or a motive. Everything we do fulfills a particular need. In the end, each of us needs to ask what personal need or needs we are neglecting by engaging in so much unnecessary activity that is both self-destructive and depleting.
Living the life of a perfectionist guarantees at least two things. By virtue of never living up to unrealistic and punitive standards, you will always and ever view yourself as a failure. Second, your self-esteem will remain hostage to and suffer from your misperceptions of what it means to be a good person. You even use your inability to "keep up" with another thread as a reason to defend yourself against some nameless, faceless executioner. It's a lifestyle that not only invites periods of anxiety and depression, but also makes them inevitable. We all pay a heavy price for rejecting or erasing who we are, and doing so reliably takes its toll on other people as well.
But there's more. Just look at all the time and energy you invested in making yourself "perfect" for your boyfriend. How did it come to be that all that frantic preparation came to be necessary for you just to feel okay? How is it that you've come to a place where you've surrendered in thought and deed to living someone else's life? To go very far out of your way to please someone with a sketchy history in terms of supporting you in your struggle to get sober? When does the person who you truly are and who you are becoming get any meaningful attention from the rest of you? And what will it take for you to give up the destructive notion that you have to prepare yourself to be something you're not in order to meet the demands of both what you think other people will need so that they will not reject or abandon you, and the part of you that seems not to care for who you are as an individual?
There is no such thing as an act or a behavior that is executed without an intention or a motive. Everything we do fulfills a particular need. In the end, each of us needs to ask what personal need or needs we are neglecting by engaging in so much unnecessary activity that is both self-destructive and depleting.
Member
Thread Starter
Join Date: Jul 2014
Posts: 4,251
Just wanted to say thank you EndGame, you know I always appreciate your support and your contributions. I don't know if it has to do with my cognitive state or your words are more complicated than usual but I'll need another read or two to make sure I understood everything you wrote correctly.
Member
Join Date: Mar 2012
Location: California
Posts: 13,044
Hi Mera,
Just finished reading through this thread. I'm sorry you are having such a tough time right now.
Sounds like you need to takesome time to just breathe.
Reading through your posts, you are doing many things to please your boyfriend. I think it is wonderful you are trying to quit smoking, but do it for you. You were so worried he would smell the smoke on you that you went to extremes to ensure he didn't. That alone can be mentally exhausting.
I also think you need to be kind to yourself. You made lost of things you want to change, I also think you should make a list of your many wonderful qualities. You are kind, generous, funny, ... and those are just a few of the many wonderful qualities you have.
Glad you are here, and looking forward to seeing you more on SR, you have been missed.
❤️ Delilah
Just finished reading through this thread. I'm sorry you are having such a tough time right now.
Sounds like you need to takesome time to just breathe.
Reading through your posts, you are doing many things to please your boyfriend. I think it is wonderful you are trying to quit smoking, but do it for you. You were so worried he would smell the smoke on you that you went to extremes to ensure he didn't. That alone can be mentally exhausting.
I also think you need to be kind to yourself. You made lost of things you want to change, I also think you should make a list of your many wonderful qualities. You are kind, generous, funny, ... and those are just a few of the many wonderful qualities you have.
Glad you are here, and looking forward to seeing you more on SR, you have been missed.
❤️ Delilah
Member
Join Date: Oct 2016
Posts: 38
Hello,. I'm new here and hesitated to reply. I was kind of concerned here before I read EndGameNYC's reply because no one was addressing the obvious people pleasing codependency.
I believe that doing anything because of external pressure to live up to the expectations of another is a lousy way to live your life, and is actually just abusive.
I would hope that your actions would be based on love for yourself, and not fear of abandonment or rejection.
I believe that doing anything because of external pressure to live up to the expectations of another is a lousy way to live your life, and is actually just abusive.
I would hope that your actions would be based on love for yourself, and not fear of abandonment or rejection.
Member
Thread Starter
Join Date: Jul 2014
Posts: 4,251
SassyGrace, Delilah, and others, just to be clear I am quitting smoking first and foremost for myself. It is something I have wanted to do for years but never did- due to addiction, due to not caring enough, due to not putting in the effort, due to whatever. He is not making me quit and he has not threatened to end our relationship if I do not quit. But he also wants me to quit #1 for myself, my health; #2 because he is a healthy person himself and wants to be with someone who shares those qualities and #3 because he does not enjoy being around a smoker, despite loving her. He can smell tobacco on my clothing, on my breath (despite a rigid hygiene regimen) and around me. It is irritating and disgusting to him to smell/taste tobacco and I think he is within every right to ask for a compromise from me if I am able to execute it.
You have brought this up with me before EndGame and I appreciate your patience as I take my time working on this and getting there. I think I understand the majority of what you are saying. I do have perfectionist qualities and though to some extent I disagree with your idea that they are always negative, I know I need to just chill the F*c% out sometimes. Despite reading and re-reading I'm not sure I follow all you have written though, particularly the last sentence above. In what way am I "tak[ing] [a] toll on other people" by "rejecting or erasing who [I am]?"
Again, much appreciated. However, and forgive me if I am missing something, but isn't perfection an inherent part of sobriety or being a non smoker? I would say it is part of the definitions of these two goals/traits and the most critical one at that.
Some goals and traits do not require perfectionism. Allow me to quote one of the greatest baseball players in history here "I've missed more than 9000 shots in my career. I've lost almost 300 games. 26 times, I've been trusted to take the game winning shot and missed. I've failed over and over and over again in my life. And that is why I succeed." Michael Jordan
We see he has failed, it not perfect but he has still gained immense success as a basketball player despite this. Being sober is much different.
If we took the quote above an related it to alcoholism would it read the same way, with such grandeur? "I've drank more than 9000 times during my sobriety, I've suffered almost 300 devastating binges. 26 times I've blacked out in public and woken up in a hospital. I've failed over and over again in my sobriety and in my life and that is why I have succeeded" So, the point here is that I still keep coming back and trying to be sober, and yes, that cannot be seen as a final failure because I am still trying, but yet I wouldn't call my sobriety a "success" Either I drink or I don't drink. Period. Here, not drinking, not even once, a perfect record, matters. Same with being a non smoker. Either I am or I am not, and by definition, perfection is a part of that quality. Moderation is not the goal, nor acceptable when it comes to the achievement of being sober or a non smoker.
Please do correct me if I'm wrong, but this is how I see it.
Again, as it pertains to sobriety or quitting smoking I have not been convinced otherwise that perfection is the only way. That said, I don't think you ever write something on here without it having an important and valuable meaning so I will think on this and how it relates to other parts of my life and/or personality. No doubt this idea of perfectionism is casing problems for me. I do not see myself as a perfect person, far from it, but I will try to look at why I feel I need to be and how that is destructive for me. Thank you.
Originally Posted by EndGameNYC 
I'm surprised that it hasn't appeared in this thread so far, Mera, but we've been down this road before.
Living the life of a perfectionist guarantees at least two things. By virtue of never living up to unrealistic and punitive standards, you will always and ever view yourself as a failure. Second, your self-esteem will remain hostage to and suffer from your misperceptions of what it means to be a good person. You even use your inability to "keep up" with another thread as a reason to defend yourself against some nameless, faceless executioner. It's a lifestyle that not only invites periods of anxiety and depression, but also makes them inevitable. We all pay a heavy price for rejecting or erasing who we are, and doing so reliably takes its toll on other people as well.
Living the life of a perfectionist guarantees at least two things. By virtue of never living up to unrealistic and punitive standards, you will always and ever view yourself as a failure. Second, your self-esteem will remain hostage to and suffer from your misperceptions of what it means to be a good person. You even use your inability to "keep up" with another thread as a reason to defend yourself against some nameless, faceless executioner. It's a lifestyle that not only invites periods of anxiety and depression, but also makes them inevitable. We all pay a heavy price for rejecting or erasing who we are, and doing so reliably takes its toll on other people as well.
But there's more. Just look at all the time and energy you invested in making yourself "perfect" for your boyfriend. How did it come to be that all that frantic preparation came to be necessary for you just to feel okay? How is it that you've come to a place where you've surrendered in thought and deed to living someone else's life? To go very far out of your way to please someone with a sketchy history in terms of supporting you in your struggle to get sober? When does the person who you truly are and who you are becoming get any meaningful attention from the rest of you? And what will it take for you to give up the destructive notion that you have to prepare yourself to be something you're not in order to meet the demands of both what you think other people will need so that they will not reject or abandon you, and the part of you that seems not to care for who you are as an individual?
Some goals and traits do not require perfectionism. Allow me to quote one of the greatest baseball players in history here "I've missed more than 9000 shots in my career. I've lost almost 300 games. 26 times, I've been trusted to take the game winning shot and missed. I've failed over and over and over again in my life. And that is why I succeed." Michael Jordan
We see he has failed, it not perfect but he has still gained immense success as a basketball player despite this. Being sober is much different.
If we took the quote above an related it to alcoholism would it read the same way, with such grandeur? "I've drank more than 9000 times during my sobriety, I've suffered almost 300 devastating binges. 26 times I've blacked out in public and woken up in a hospital. I've failed over and over again in my sobriety and in my life and that is why I have succeeded" So, the point here is that I still keep coming back and trying to be sober, and yes, that cannot be seen as a final failure because I am still trying, but yet I wouldn't call my sobriety a "success" Either I drink or I don't drink. Period. Here, not drinking, not even once, a perfect record, matters. Same with being a non smoker. Either I am or I am not, and by definition, perfection is a part of that quality. Moderation is not the goal, nor acceptable when it comes to the achievement of being sober or a non smoker.
Please do correct me if I'm wrong, but this is how I see it.
There is no such thing as an act or a behavior that is executed without an intention or a motive. Everything we do fulfills a particular need. In the end, each of us needs to ask what personal need or needs we are neglecting by engaging in so much unnecessary activity that is both self-destructive and depleting.
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Hey Mera
I wasn't at all arguing that you are experiencing big issues with PAWS. My point was that I do know someone who seemed equally perplexed by their problems but did see relief over time. It just took a couple years of complete abstinence! Which sucks for sure.
Your reply to Endgame, IMO, is a bit of an over complication of the OP. The very basic foundation of recovery, not drinking, is the part one has to get 'perfectly'. That's why Step 1 of AA is truly the most important part. But the rest of life and one's efforts to live in honesty and spirituality do not need perfection. I think he might have been referring to your post about your hygiene ritual to remove any sign of tobacco smoke. It seemed a bit extreme. I think the posts about simply being honest with your boyfriend made the most sense. You spent a lot of time, effort and mental obsession trying to rid yourself of the evidence. Being honest would have been a heck of a lot easier
I don't know if you're a perfectionist or not. You do seem to be hard on yourself. Honesty to oneself and to others is something I definitely need to strive for if I'm to recover.
I wasn't at all arguing that you are experiencing big issues with PAWS. My point was that I do know someone who seemed equally perplexed by their problems but did see relief over time. It just took a couple years of complete abstinence! Which sucks for sure.
Your reply to Endgame, IMO, is a bit of an over complication of the OP. The very basic foundation of recovery, not drinking, is the part one has to get 'perfectly'. That's why Step 1 of AA is truly the most important part. But the rest of life and one's efforts to live in honesty and spirituality do not need perfection. I think he might have been referring to your post about your hygiene ritual to remove any sign of tobacco smoke. It seemed a bit extreme. I think the posts about simply being honest with your boyfriend made the most sense. You spent a lot of time, effort and mental obsession trying to rid yourself of the evidence. Being honest would have been a heck of a lot easier
I don't know if you're a perfectionist or not. You do seem to be hard on yourself. Honesty to oneself and to others is something I definitely need to strive for if I'm to recover.
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