Blogs


Notices

Alkie v. Normie

Old 02-13-2010, 04:10 PM
  # 1 (permalink)  
Member
Thread Starter
 
SkiStop's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2010
Location: Northeast, US
Posts: 30
Alkie v. Normie

Black vs. White? You are vs. You aren't?

Is there a gray area?

I ask, because just about everyone I know drinks to some degree. I've been reading on here about "normies" who drink 1-2 and don't have a desire to drink more. Then there's the "alkies" who drink 1-2 and can't stop. According to what I have read, there is a physiological difference between the two.

But, I seem to know a lot of people who fall somewhere in the middle. In fact, most of my friends and acquaintances seem to fall in there. Most of my close friends have no problem going out and getting wasted on a Friday night, but they don't drink daily and they don't drink alone just for the fun of it. But they'll drink with the best of them, when the time is right.

So, who are these people in the middle? The lucky ones? Why can they get wasted at appropriate times, and be a moderate or non-drinker otherwise?
SkiStop is offline  
The Following User Says Thank You to SkiStop For This Useful Post:
freespirit78 (02-14-2010)
Old 02-13-2010, 04:20 PM
  # 2 (permalink)  
Administrator
 
Dee74's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2007
Location: Australia
Posts: 204,005
Blog Entries: 1
If I read you right, I call them binge drinkers.
It's not healthy and I don't think they're lucky.

D
Dee74 is offline  
The Following 3 Users Say Thank You to Dee74 For This Useful Post:
humblestudent (02-13-2010), least (02-13-2010), Omega10 (02-13-2010)
Old 02-13-2010, 04:23 PM
  # 3 (permalink)  
bona fido dog-lover
 
least's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2008
Location: SF Bay area, CA
Posts: 96,365
Blog Entries: 32
So, who are these people in the middle? The lucky ones?
I don't know who they are, but I know I'm not one of them. As to their being 'lucky'... well, maybe, maybe not. Alcohol is a toxin and does cause brain changes and damages to health, so maybe us recovered alcoholics are really the lucky ones.
least is online now  
Old 02-13-2010, 04:32 PM
  # 4 (permalink)  
Member
Thread Starter
 
SkiStop's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2010
Location: Northeast, US
Posts: 30
Maybe "lucky" wasn't a good word.

I'm just trying to understand why a lot of my friends can go out and have a fun night of drinking, but not end up drinking regularly. Not ending up being "alkie."

The thinking seems to be, you're alkie or normie. I know I'm alkie--but I see a lot of others who don't seem to fit either definition.
SkiStop is offline  
The Following User Says Thank You to SkiStop For This Useful Post:
penny74 (02-14-2010)
Old 02-13-2010, 04:50 PM
  # 5 (permalink)  
Administrator
 
Dee74's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2007
Location: Australia
Posts: 204,005
Blog Entries: 1
I spent years wondering that Ski - I never got any real answers.
Drinking while looking for the answers all those years nearly killed me.

In the end, I just know if I ever want any happiness and peace in my life I can't drink.
D
Dee74 is offline  
Old 02-13-2010, 05:40 PM
  # 6 (permalink)  
Member
 
Omega10's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2010
Location: Toronto
Posts: 318
Blog Entries: 233
Originally Posted by SkiStop View Post
I'm just trying to understand why a lot of my friends can go out and have a fun night of drinking, but not end up drinking regularly. Not ending up being "alkie."
I used to be like that, drinking only on Friday nights. Then something would happen and Thursdays got added in, because I needed a "fun night of drinking". Then something would happen and another "fun night of drinking" was added in. Then the drinking stopped being fun and started to be a requirement.

When I look back on my "fun nights of drinking" with my friends, what made it fun was not the drinking at all. It was the conversations we had, the jokes that we told, and the general bonding that we did. The beverages were just an accessory.

Perhaps you may want to look at what really made their evening fun. Was it really what they drank, or was it what they did? Then try to emulate that without the assistance of alcohol.
Omega10 is offline  
The Following 2 Users Say Thank You to Omega10 For This Useful Post:
angharad (02-14-2010), freespirit78 (02-14-2010)
Old 02-13-2010, 07:24 PM
  # 7 (permalink)  
Member
 
Mark75's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2008
Posts: 6,947
I believe there is a difference down inside. I was like those you describe for many years. There came a time when I drank for reasons that were not about having fun with the guys... Wasn't about having a few after a good day on the mountain. It was about an uneasiness that opened up inside, trying to fill it... A hole in my soul, as they say... Kind of like pornography... I knew it when I saw it

Good question.
Mark75 is offline  
Old 02-13-2010, 07:37 PM
  # 8 (permalink)  
6/20/08
 
Join Date: Sep 2008
Posts: 4,467
Could be your friends are drinking 'normally' around you....then going home and getting drunk.

I did that for years. Not ONE of my friends would call me an alcoholic. Not one. I was a very good alcoholic and hid it very well.
coffeenut is offline  
The Following 2 Users Say Thank You to coffeenut For This Useful Post:
daisy1 (02-17-2010), Dee74 (02-13-2010)
Old 02-13-2010, 07:49 PM
  # 9 (permalink)  
Member
 
Join Date: Mar 2009
Location: ozstrayleeya
Posts: 2,950
..most of my 'lucky' drinking friends are either divorced,unemployed,
sick,business failing..infact my 34yr old daughter is one of them..

IMO..i ain't touchin' the stuff..I thought it was great to be able
to party and flip out on week-ends..but it's what you get up to??

..that can affect you,sometimes..for ever..Oz
OZboy is offline  
The Following 2 Users Say Thank You to OZboy For This Useful Post:
Dee74 (02-13-2010), yeahgr8 (02-13-2010)
Old 02-13-2010, 08:31 PM
  # 10 (permalink)  
Member
 
Join Date: Feb 2010
Location: Southern US
Posts: 5
I couldn't tell you for sure. That is certainly how it started for me, though.

I ask myself all the time, if it had not been for all those late nights partying it up at the clubs, would I be an alcoholic today?

I have heard of the term "functional alcoholic", though. People who meet the general medical definition of alcoholism, but seem to have pretty darn successful lives, in spite of it. (I'm think of quite a few of the politicians out there).
DreadPirateJay is offline  
Old 02-13-2010, 08:42 PM
  # 11 (permalink)  
Member
 
Join Date: Mar 2008
Location: UK
Posts: 4,682
Blog Entries: 8
Originally Posted by OZboy View Post
..most of my 'lucky' drinking friends are either divorced,unemployed,
sick,business failing..
In my experience these are the lucky ones i have known too, get to know them and everything is not rosy even if it appears to be on the surface.

There are no normies IMO, just people and they are either happy with their lives/themselves to varying degrees or not again to varying degrees...i have met a lot of, what we would consider, happy (both spiritually and materialistically and a mixture of the two) people in my lifetime and none of them go out and get wasted, why would they? These are people that have no need for any form of escape...their lives are pretty whole and satisying...
yeahgr8 is offline  
The Following User Says Thank You to yeahgr8 For This Useful Post:
OZboy (02-14-2010)
Old 02-13-2010, 08:55 PM
  # 12 (permalink)  
Member
 
humblestudent's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2010
Posts: 256
Originally Posted by SkiStop View Post
Maybe "lucky" wasn't a good word.

I'm just trying to understand why a lot of my friends can go out and have a fun night of drinking, but not end up drinking regularly. Not ending up being "alkie."
Honestly, Ski, I think you haven't known them long enough or well enough...I used to appear to be like that, 20 years ago. Sometime around 10 years ago, things changed drastically, and anyone caring to look would've said, "Whoa, she's got a problem." So, had you been observing me 20 years ago, if I had a crystal ball, I would've said, "Stick around for the really ugly stuff..."

It can take years and years and years for the disease to progress to a point where it's not the best kept secret anymore. I can say that no one that I consider to be a normal drinker gets totally wasted regularly. They don't want to. As for me, I could never ever see the point in having just 1 or 2. Still don't, actually...
humblestudent is offline  
The Following User Says Thank You to humblestudent For This Useful Post:
OZboy (02-14-2010)
Old 02-14-2010, 03:54 AM
  # 13 (permalink)  
Guest
 
Join Date: May 2009
Posts: 2,013
Someone asked me yesterday what was it that made me turn out so I can't drink alcohol anymore. My answer was that it was nothing but the way that I am. Acceptance.

Regardless of circumstances or situations I would still be an alcoholic. When I drink "I ain't leaving till I'm Heaving!" That is a physical difference for me so that would have always been there regardless.

My 'recovery' has stopped me from asking/pondering questions like this as they do nothing for my recovery.

Some wisdom I picked up from an AA meeting a few months back for the first time was "Live in the Solution...not in the problem"

I am alcoholic and for me drinking would wreck my life and send me back to living to get wasted immediately. I know this with 100% certainty. Like I say I am physically different to most people when it comes to booze. I have always been able to hold rediculous levels of booze and I am only slightly built. Most people would die if they drank a 750ML bottle of whiskey or equivalent but not me from a young age 16+. That was pretty much without tolerance built up too.

When I take a drink I am powerless over taking more untill I blackout. I won't be able to not get more unless you lock me in a room and bolt it shut. Which incidentally I was told happened on numerous occassions... I don't remember any of it but I bet it wasn't pretty!! Not good. Like I say I'm an alcoholic and most binge-drinkers are just that... binge-drinkers not alcoholics. Sure I was always a binge drinker too, thats the only way I ever drank but I would drink as soon as I woke up which they wouldn't dream of and also I wouldn't want to participate in life as it just seemed sh*t unless I could get wasted.

One is too many 10000 never enough for this 'recovering' alcoholic. I knew I was different and so did everyone else I was drinking around too tbh, that includes some scumbag dealers too! LOL. Even they refused to sell me more drugs! LOL. you know you're bad when that happens! Haha.


peace...
NEOMARXIST is offline  
The Following User Says Thank You to NEOMARXIST For This Useful Post:
OZboy (02-14-2010)
Old 02-14-2010, 05:48 AM
  # 14 (permalink)  
Don't resist, allow
 
intention's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2010
Location: South East of England
Posts: 1,521
Originally Posted by NEOMARXIST View Post
My 'recovery' has stopped me from asking/pondering questions like this as they do nothing for my recovery.

Some wisdom I picked up from an AA meeting a few months back for the first time was "Live in the Solution...not in the problem"

Well said.

Don't let alcohol trick you back into drinking searching for answers to questions which cannot be answered. If you are an alcoholic, you can't drink. It is irrelevant what other people can do.
intention is offline  
The Following 2 Users Say Thank You to intention For This Useful Post:
NEOMARXIST (02-14-2010), OZboy (02-14-2010)
Old 02-14-2010, 06:37 AM
  # 15 (permalink)  
Member
Thread Starter
 
SkiStop's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2010
Location: Northeast, US
Posts: 30
Well, I can see it was not a very popular question. And I understand why. I'm not looking for a reason to drink again. Just to understand why I am different. Why it's progressive for me, and seemingly not for others. Fact is, a lot of people party in their 20s, and go on to have no issues with alcohol later in life. If that wasn't true, nearly my entire college of 2000 students would now be alcoholics.

Honestly, Ski, I think you haven't known them long enough or well enough
I'm talking about some of my closest friends, that I've known since high school, or before. The majority of my life. And I know who turned Alkie (trust me; I've learned to spot a good drinking buddy). But the majority of my friends partied through our 20s, and I know they don't have that same "hole" inside as I do. I suspect that drinking will naturally diminish as people start families and get older. Just does not work that way for me.

Anyway, thanks for the insights.
SkiStop is offline  
Old 02-14-2010, 07:49 AM
  # 16 (permalink)  
Guest
 
Join Date: May 2009
Posts: 2,013
It is what it is. You're an alkie and they ain't.

Like Mick sang "you can't always get what you want"

I know for a fact that the majority of people "partying" don't party like I did. When they were going home at 6.30am and happy to accept this and be back to work Monday morning I was on the phone to a dealer to get just one more gram (yer right!) and screw work or anything in the world I just want to get drunk again more than anything.

I accept I am an alcoholic and drug addict. Now 'recovering' and grateful and proud of this.

Maybe you ain't like me but I guarantee I drink/drug differently to nearly all of those 2000 college students you refer to. I have also partied with a lot many different people/stuents and only found 2 who were on the same wavelength when it came to drinking. Even they didn't lose control in the same way as I do.

Binge-drinkers can leave it behind and move on with life but for this alcoholic I wake from a binge-drink passout craving another drink and cracking a can with my first action. They don't in my experince. They accept a hangover, I don't, I want to drink it away again and again and again. i want to drink life away for no reason at all reason. i couldn't often explain why I did what I did. There is a quote in the BB which sums this feeling up well.

I am an alcoholic. What anyone else is or isn't doesn't concern me. They won't be there for me when I'm sitting in a police cell or when I'm down and out homeless. Thats the reality of my alcoholism.

Peace.
NEOMARXIST is offline  
The Following 3 Users Say Thank You to NEOMARXIST For This Useful Post:
intention (02-15-2010), keithj (02-15-2010), Omega10 (02-14-2010)
Old 02-14-2010, 10:50 AM
  # 17 (permalink)  
Don't resist, allow
 
intention's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2010
Location: South East of England
Posts: 1,521
Originally Posted by SkiStop View Post
Well, I can see it was not a very popular question. And I understand why. I'm not looking for a reason to drink again. Just to understand why I am different.

Hi SkiStop

In that case I would recommend reading Beyond the Influence by Katherine Ketcham and William Ashbury.

There is a lot of information in there with scientific studies to back it up discussing alcoholism as a disease and how the alcoholic differs from the normie.
intention is offline  
Old 02-14-2010, 11:43 AM
  # 18 (permalink)  
Member
 
parasol's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2009
Posts: 26
This is an interesting question. I think some people do "age out" of heavy drinking. In fact, I've seen it with my own eyes. And then there are people like me who continue to drink heavily until one day they realize that they must quit altogether. And then there are the people you're taking about -- the occasional heavy drinkers who do not appear to suffer all the bad consequences as the alcoholic drinkers. I definitely know some of this latter group, and I think for them the good of drinking (as they see it) still outweighs the bad. And I think we'd be lying to ourselves if we didn't acknowledge that we do experience some good things about drinking, or else why would it be so hard to stop? I definitely remember being in that phase, and the idea of quitting for good just seemed too depressing to seriously contemplate, even though I was bemoaning the hangovers, missed classes, and other bad consequences. The good was still outweighing the bad for me, as I assume it's dtill doing for my hard-partying friends.

But now I'm seeing that the balance sheet is racking up more negative entries for some of these friends of mine: bad hangovers at work, DWI's, embarrassing nights out, regretful hook-ups, etc. A lot of it has to do with age as well. What is "cute" and forgiven at 25 is kind of pathetic at 35 or 40. Hell, just continuing that kind of lifestyle as you get older is pretty sad. It's like Chris Rock says: "No one wants to be the old guy in the club." And like some of the other posters have said, you don't know how these people are drinking when you're not with them. It's an eye-opening experience to spend several days at a beach house with someone you always thought was just a normal, couple-of-glasses-of-wine-a-night drinker only to discover that they drink far more than that. I think my in-laws had no idea how much I drank until a family vacation revealed the truth!

Anyway, I do think there is a big progressive element of alcohol dependency, and for some of these friends the balance sheet will continue to have more negative entries until they are forced to make a major life decision. At least that's how it worked for me.
parasol is offline  
The Following User Says Thank You to parasol For This Useful Post:
freespirit78 (02-14-2010)
Old 02-14-2010, 01:20 PM
  # 19 (permalink)  
Member
 
coming_clean's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2008
Location: Europe
Posts: 1,355
Originally Posted by Dee74 View Post
If I read you right, I call them binge drinkers.
It's not healthy and I don't think they're lucky.

D
hahaha agreed..........clever
coming_clean is offline  
Old 02-14-2010, 05:22 PM
  # 20 (permalink)  
Member
 
Join Date: Feb 2010
Posts: 48
Originally Posted by parasol View Post
This is an interesting question. I think some people do "age out" of heavy drinking.

But now I'm seeing that the balance sheet is racking up more negative entries for some of these friends of mine: bad hangovers at work, DWI's, embarrassing nights out, regretful hook-ups, etc. A lot of it has to do with age as well. What is "cute" and forgiven at 25 is kind of pathetic at 35 or 40. Hell, just continuing that kind of lifestyle as you get older is pretty sad. It's like Chris Rock says: "No one wants to be the old guy in the club." And like some of the other posters have said, you don't know how these people are drinking when you're not with them. It's an eye-opening experience to spend several days at a beach house with someone you always thought was just a normal, couple-of-glasses-of-wine-a-night drinker only to discover that they drink far more than that. I think my in-laws had no idea how much I drank until a family vacation revealed the truth!
So right on!!!!

And I have to agree with one of the earlier posters....it's "binge drinking"....that is what I was....I could go weeks with out drinking but then a reason to party or celebrate came up...and it was time to drink and not just drink but get wasted......
And most recently I was only doing that once a month maybe twice a month...still not good at all...in my eyes. Thats not normal behavior either or shouldn't be. plus as pointed out the effects of even binge drinking are negative....
freespirit78 is offline  

Currently Active Users Viewing this Thread: 1 (0 members and 1 guests)
 
Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are On
Pingbacks are On
Refbacks are Off




All times are GMT -7. The time now is 12:44 PM.