post rehab contract
Member
Join Date: Dec 2008
Posts: 583
Time to walk away. That simple.
Originally Posted by madisonblake 
Long story short, my boyfriend (who I knew for many years before we dated) had a serious addiction to opiates. He finally went into rehab last December and finally I got the person back that I always knew. He made all the right steps, got sponsor, went to meetings every day, etc. We did have a few arguments a month ago over trust issues (not shocking.) He said they did tell them in rehab that a "contract" with those who have trust issues with you is a good idea. He did that for me. Make a long story short, it was telling me he would no longer delete texts out of his phone, delete call histories, block certain individuals, etc. Everything was going better than it ever has since we started dating a few years ago.
Fast forward to the last month. You know when you just get a weird feeling in your gut? Nothing even happened but I looked at the phone just to see if he was really holding up to the contract. The text and call histories had been deleted. Contract violation #1. When asked about this, he reacted with anger. Apparently his sponsor had been asking him to borrow money, his sponsor had fallen off the wagon, etc and he just didn't want any of those texts that were arguments even in his phone. I honestly don't need any of you to make me feel dumb right now. Just looking back, he seemed to be really well in every way, shape and form. There was nothing really there to make me believe he was using.
This past weekend, I unplug his phone to charge mine on his charger and I see missed call from the one person I know has no business contacting him who use to do drugs and sell drugs to him. Several months ago my ex told him to no longer contact him and that he would physically hurt him if he did (this druggie friend threatened me at one point.) My ex had called his phone company and blocked several people from texting him and calling (supposedly from calling.) This druggie friend called twice with no voicemail that night. He called again the next day. When this happened, I clicked answer and gave the phone to my ex and told him to answer and see what he wanted. He hung it up. He went on a major rampage about how I should never have done that, this person is from his past drug days, he wants nothing to do with him, if he does talk to him he will just want to attack him, I shouldn't expect this, bla bla bla bla bla.
There's so much detail I'm leaving out but the important part is this. If that were me, if I had been the one who destroyed someone's trust, if I had something to really prove to someone I loved, I would have answered that phone, put it on speaker for him to hear and have had that conversation. Period. I also would not have blocked this guys texts but continued to allow him to call me. We both have sprint phones. I know that you can block calls just as easily as you can block texts. Am I being paranoid? i just think he blocked the texts so I would never be able to see anything I shouldn't see. If I were a recovering addict doing what I needed to do to regain trust, this person would be blocked, period, including voice calls and I certainly wouldn't hesitate to answer the phone to the person who was supposedly the "most important person in my life" and have that conversation.
I don't know what I'm looking for here. I feel stupid that I let this person back in just to have this happen again. I just don't get it. You make a contract and you fail to follow through on it on many levels and you fail to make a simple move to make the person you're with feel more comfortable. What am I supposed to think? I'm so angry.
Fast forward to the last month. You know when you just get a weird feeling in your gut? Nothing even happened but I looked at the phone just to see if he was really holding up to the contract. The text and call histories had been deleted. Contract violation #1. When asked about this, he reacted with anger. Apparently his sponsor had been asking him to borrow money, his sponsor had fallen off the wagon, etc and he just didn't want any of those texts that were arguments even in his phone. I honestly don't need any of you to make me feel dumb right now. Just looking back, he seemed to be really well in every way, shape and form. There was nothing really there to make me believe he was using.
This past weekend, I unplug his phone to charge mine on his charger and I see missed call from the one person I know has no business contacting him who use to do drugs and sell drugs to him. Several months ago my ex told him to no longer contact him and that he would physically hurt him if he did (this druggie friend threatened me at one point.) My ex had called his phone company and blocked several people from texting him and calling (supposedly from calling.) This druggie friend called twice with no voicemail that night. He called again the next day. When this happened, I clicked answer and gave the phone to my ex and told him to answer and see what he wanted. He hung it up. He went on a major rampage about how I should never have done that, this person is from his past drug days, he wants nothing to do with him, if he does talk to him he will just want to attack him, I shouldn't expect this, bla bla bla bla bla.
There's so much detail I'm leaving out but the important part is this. If that were me, if I had been the one who destroyed someone's trust, if I had something to really prove to someone I loved, I would have answered that phone, put it on speaker for him to hear and have had that conversation. Period. I also would not have blocked this guys texts but continued to allow him to call me. We both have sprint phones. I know that you can block calls just as easily as you can block texts. Am I being paranoid? i just think he blocked the texts so I would never be able to see anything I shouldn't see. If I were a recovering addict doing what I needed to do to regain trust, this person would be blocked, period, including voice calls and I certainly wouldn't hesitate to answer the phone to the person who was supposedly the "most important person in my life" and have that conversation.
I don't know what I'm looking for here. I feel stupid that I let this person back in just to have this happen again. I just don't get it. You make a contract and you fail to follow through on it on many levels and you fail to make a simple move to make the person you're with feel more comfortable. What am I supposed to think? I'm so angry.
Member
Join Date: Jan 2009
Posts: 864
Madison...
Pupils.
Did you know they constrict when you are turned off, or are disgusted by something?
Also they do with age, they don’t go through huge changes between light and dark as you grow older and stay smaller.
Look it is real simple, get some good boundaries. And if you can’t live with an addict, then you can’t.
A couple of mine.
I do not assume anything or live my life each day looking for signs of use. I believe what I see, I trust I have seen enough to know the difference between actively using and recovery.
I will not be fuel to any fire that might burn out as fast as it is lit, or was never lit to begin with until I opened my mouth accusing. ( not reacting is an action )
I do not interfere with another’s path, or their learning, I have my own path, my own learning I need to be most concerned with.
I know exactly what it is like to be accused of using when you haven’t, after a while if it doesn’t stop, well then why not use if you are always going to treated as if you are. For parents reading this is huge with teens and young adults, they will spite you and parents make the best fuel out there to say F it…
I am going to share some things. I would hope that you use the information wisely to detach totally and see you have no control at all. I don’t care if you stay or go that is on you, just know that running won’t save you, you will still have to do the work.
I don’t know what type of opiates your bf was/is using but it is all fairly the same, wd, recovery, rituals apply for some, the brain is hijacked the same way and the longer you are in the harder it is to get out.
I know what it is like to live with a heroin addict and watch through it all, very removed from the situation because I was detached. The struggle is like nothing I have ever seen before. They chip, and are notorious for it. Yes a heroin addict can use today and not for a few days and do it again, especially if they just kicked, they literally walk backwards to get well, or from what I have seen here…. They carry incredible guilt because they can’t get it right and when they do, they go sometimes over a year or more fighting demons in their heads before the voices start to subside.
They lie, there are many reasons why ... the lies they tell everyone around aren’t nearly as bad as the ones they are telling themselves, and we all do this.
It isn’t the lies told to us but the ones we tell ourselves ... So are you telling yourself any lies?
Oh very important there are good and evil people in this world and some happen to be addicts...
And, is it the drug or the person to begin with? Oh such a fun question, so many drive themselves insane with just this one alone!
Which brings back the lies ... simply getting honest with yourself and those around can save you no matter what side you sit on.
In the most simplest of terms ... in the brain we are wired to seek out water, food, shelter, companionship, and sex to survive … for opiate users those things become replaced with ... well like for my husband it was replaced with heroin, heroin, heroin, heroin, heroin. So nothing feels good and for a long time. Also everyone who looks at wd and thinks it will stop someone from using, that they will not want to go through it again, that isn’t true. Withdrawal is an incentive to use, it always was and always will be.
And wd is fascinating in it’s own right. It takes what they hate the most about it and compounds that eating at them, making them crazy, working hard to get them to use. The brain doesn’t forget it gets worse each time they go through it again and gets longer. Making it more insane, the physical is a piece of cake compared to the mental part.
Also the brain never forgets where you left off either. So if you pick back up, within days you are right where you left off…
Relapse is a learning tool, they learn through each one, find their own sickness in their own thinking IF THEY ARE ALLOWED TO. It isn’t the end of the world, it is part of the learning process they need to go through, and for some they need to go through it over and over for their best chance. The hope always is in the breathing, if they are breathing, there is hope.
Also relapse isn't about just the act of not taking a drug, it is the thinking, you can be very active in your addiction and not be using at the time... so assigning the label of relapse means there had to be some recovery.
Any reactions to the one who relapsed is on the one reacting! Everyone chooses to react, they never had to.
I find understanding their part can help us let go, really get we have no control at all, that there are things going on we can not know or even begin to understand…to know that it isn‘t a done and over thing, to stop expecting them to be ok because they haven‘t used in a week or two, or a month or 6 months… like they magically go back to normal, when they most likely never knew what normal was to begin with.
So now a different question …. Can you have a relationship knowing his process, what it will entail for him to have the best chance?
Your process, any work you need to do on you, you have to do whether you stay or go because if you don’t you will just go on to repeat it all again and again and again in all your relationships. It really isn’t him, never was. All your actions and reactions based on his addiction have to do with you, something in you totally….and any answer you need is in you as well not based on him, so look within for any enlightenment.
Pupils.
Did you know they constrict when you are turned off, or are disgusted by something?
Also they do with age, they don’t go through huge changes between light and dark as you grow older and stay smaller.
Look it is real simple, get some good boundaries. And if you can’t live with an addict, then you can’t.
A couple of mine.
I do not assume anything or live my life each day looking for signs of use. I believe what I see, I trust I have seen enough to know the difference between actively using and recovery.
I will not be fuel to any fire that might burn out as fast as it is lit, or was never lit to begin with until I opened my mouth accusing. ( not reacting is an action )
I do not interfere with another’s path, or their learning, I have my own path, my own learning I need to be most concerned with.
I know exactly what it is like to be accused of using when you haven’t, after a while if it doesn’t stop, well then why not use if you are always going to treated as if you are. For parents reading this is huge with teens and young adults, they will spite you and parents make the best fuel out there to say F it…
I am going to share some things. I would hope that you use the information wisely to detach totally and see you have no control at all. I don’t care if you stay or go that is on you, just know that running won’t save you, you will still have to do the work.
I don’t know what type of opiates your bf was/is using but it is all fairly the same, wd, recovery, rituals apply for some, the brain is hijacked the same way and the longer you are in the harder it is to get out.
I know what it is like to live with a heroin addict and watch through it all, very removed from the situation because I was detached. The struggle is like nothing I have ever seen before. They chip, and are notorious for it. Yes a heroin addict can use today and not for a few days and do it again, especially if they just kicked, they literally walk backwards to get well, or from what I have seen here…. They carry incredible guilt because they can’t get it right and when they do, they go sometimes over a year or more fighting demons in their heads before the voices start to subside.
They lie, there are many reasons why ... the lies they tell everyone around aren’t nearly as bad as the ones they are telling themselves, and we all do this.
It isn’t the lies told to us but the ones we tell ourselves ... So are you telling yourself any lies?
Oh very important there are good and evil people in this world and some happen to be addicts...
And, is it the drug or the person to begin with? Oh such a fun question, so many drive themselves insane with just this one alone!
Which brings back the lies ... simply getting honest with yourself and those around can save you no matter what side you sit on.
In the most simplest of terms ... in the brain we are wired to seek out water, food, shelter, companionship, and sex to survive … for opiate users those things become replaced with ... well like for my husband it was replaced with heroin, heroin, heroin, heroin, heroin. So nothing feels good and for a long time. Also everyone who looks at wd and thinks it will stop someone from using, that they will not want to go through it again, that isn’t true. Withdrawal is an incentive to use, it always was and always will be.
And wd is fascinating in it’s own right. It takes what they hate the most about it and compounds that eating at them, making them crazy, working hard to get them to use. The brain doesn’t forget it gets worse each time they go through it again and gets longer. Making it more insane, the physical is a piece of cake compared to the mental part.
Also the brain never forgets where you left off either. So if you pick back up, within days you are right where you left off…
Relapse is a learning tool, they learn through each one, find their own sickness in their own thinking IF THEY ARE ALLOWED TO. It isn’t the end of the world, it is part of the learning process they need to go through, and for some they need to go through it over and over for their best chance. The hope always is in the breathing, if they are breathing, there is hope.
Also relapse isn't about just the act of not taking a drug, it is the thinking, you can be very active in your addiction and not be using at the time... so assigning the label of relapse means there had to be some recovery.
Any reactions to the one who relapsed is on the one reacting! Everyone chooses to react, they never had to.
I find understanding their part can help us let go, really get we have no control at all, that there are things going on we can not know or even begin to understand…to know that it isn‘t a done and over thing, to stop expecting them to be ok because they haven‘t used in a week or two, or a month or 6 months… like they magically go back to normal, when they most likely never knew what normal was to begin with.
So now a different question …. Can you have a relationship knowing his process, what it will entail for him to have the best chance?
Your process, any work you need to do on you, you have to do whether you stay or go because if you don’t you will just go on to repeat it all again and again and again in all your relationships. It really isn’t him, never was. All your actions and reactions based on his addiction have to do with you, something in you totally….and any answer you need is in you as well not based on him, so look within for any enlightenment.
Member
Join Date: Jan 2012
Posts: 445
Originally Posted by incitingsilence
Oh very important there are good and evil people in this world and some happen to be addicts...
And, is it the drug or the person to begin with? Oh such a fun question, so many drive themselves insane with just this one alone!
And, is it the drug or the person to begin with? Oh such a fun question, so many drive themselves insane with just this one alone!
"Am I a good person that sometimes does bad things?"
or....
"Am I a bad person that sometimes does good things"
I agree this one can cause insanity..... and I think it often pulls a recovering addcit back into active addiction.
Member
Join Date: Mar 2012
Posts: 11
Hi madison,
I once felt similar about my husband (while he was actively using, but fooling me the whole time) when I was suspecting him of using (heroin) and he was denying it and I had no proof. I felt like I had to sneak around and go through his stuff, I had to check his phone when he wasn't looking, I would look in the trash to see what the heck it was that he just threw away. I was trying to find something, to prove that he was lying.
My husband is not living with me right now, because he finally got sick of my behavior and he just told me & I told him to leave so he is living with his mother.
I really should have just stepped back and just looked at everything, not these little picky things. I should have stepped back and said "Would he have pawned that to "help his friend with his rent payment" a year ago?" "Would he be getting this angry at me for asking a question a year ago?" I should have gotten around all the little things that were adding up and I should have just asked "Who is this man and is he the same as he was a year ago?"
The answer was that I didn't know this man and I didn't know the lies and tricks he was capable of and he was not the same as he used to be. Instead I went crazy. I went crazy and I followed him around and I, in turn, was lying to him about why I was in the laundry room so long (going through each and every one of his pockets, socks, anything, extremely thoroughly) I lied to him about suspecting him. I didn't want him to know that I was suspecting him and I wanted him to make a mistake, and I wanted to catch it. I was flipping insane, and I think I've gotten better. I still don't trust him and I can't believe a word he says, but I have been away from him for several months now and I have been relaxing, I think.
My problem is that I still love this man so much, and I want everything to go back to how it was before heroin, but I don't know that it ever can. It makes me extremely depressed when I think about it, but I'm dealing with it. He is still using, and I talk to him on the phone occasionally, I probably shouldn’t. If he were to all of sudden be 100% clean and over it, and if he were to come back home, I still don’t know what my behavior would be like. I just don’t have the trust in him.
I’m not sure n the contract idea, I don’t think it would work for me. It would just be a set up for me to go crazy making sure he is sticking to the contract, and a set up for him to come up with more elaborate lies.
What I am really saying is that he can’t hide it forever, you’ll know. Just don’t go crazy and spy on his phone, or sneak around in his pockets or decide follow him around making sure he isn’t screwing up. You’ll know when he screws up, and you might know that already, and you feel like you just need proof. Proof or not, if you know it’s there, then it’s there. Driving yourself crazy is not fun, believe me.
-Sorry this is so long. I just have really huge trust issues with my husband, I guess.
I once felt similar about my husband (while he was actively using, but fooling me the whole time) when I was suspecting him of using (heroin) and he was denying it and I had no proof. I felt like I had to sneak around and go through his stuff, I had to check his phone when he wasn't looking, I would look in the trash to see what the heck it was that he just threw away. I was trying to find something, to prove that he was lying.
My husband is not living with me right now, because he finally got sick of my behavior and he just told me & I told him to leave so he is living with his mother.
I really should have just stepped back and just looked at everything, not these little picky things. I should have stepped back and said "Would he have pawned that to "help his friend with his rent payment" a year ago?" "Would he be getting this angry at me for asking a question a year ago?" I should have gotten around all the little things that were adding up and I should have just asked "Who is this man and is he the same as he was a year ago?"
The answer was that I didn't know this man and I didn't know the lies and tricks he was capable of and he was not the same as he used to be. Instead I went crazy. I went crazy and I followed him around and I, in turn, was lying to him about why I was in the laundry room so long (going through each and every one of his pockets, socks, anything, extremely thoroughly) I lied to him about suspecting him. I didn't want him to know that I was suspecting him and I wanted him to make a mistake, and I wanted to catch it. I was flipping insane, and I think I've gotten better. I still don't trust him and I can't believe a word he says, but I have been away from him for several months now and I have been relaxing, I think.
My problem is that I still love this man so much, and I want everything to go back to how it was before heroin, but I don't know that it ever can. It makes me extremely depressed when I think about it, but I'm dealing with it. He is still using, and I talk to him on the phone occasionally, I probably shouldn’t. If he were to all of sudden be 100% clean and over it, and if he were to come back home, I still don’t know what my behavior would be like. I just don’t have the trust in him.
I’m not sure n the contract idea, I don’t think it would work for me. It would just be a set up for me to go crazy making sure he is sticking to the contract, and a set up for him to come up with more elaborate lies.
What I am really saying is that he can’t hide it forever, you’ll know. Just don’t go crazy and spy on his phone, or sneak around in his pockets or decide follow him around making sure he isn’t screwing up. You’ll know when he screws up, and you might know that already, and you feel like you just need proof. Proof or not, if you know it’s there, then it’s there. Driving yourself crazy is not fun, believe me.
-Sorry this is so long. I just have really huge trust issues with my husband, I guess.
Member
Thread Starter
Join Date: Mar 2012
Posts: 180
Thank you, thank you, thank you to all of you. I have read all of your replies and I agree. Ella, much of what you said has hit home.
Like I said, I decided to block his calls, texts, etc. because I need to just focus on me right now. I made that choice after all the crazy behavior Sunday, to just sit and clear my head, to allow some of this anger to surface and let it go, and to just begin to think and write out some thoughts. All of your posts have helped tremendously.
The thing that I keep thinking so far after reading your posts and thinking about my situation is this.......what if he really were being serious and really didn't want to talk to this person for his stated reasons, would I still want to be with him? Why would I want to be with someone who chooses to do things or not do things that are clearly not helping to re build trust? Why would I want to be with someone when confronted with something that clearly is bothering me throw a temper tantrum, start yelling and call me names? High or sober, why does it matter?
It really doesn't matter. I don't need him in my face explaining (or lying) why he behaved that way. SOmeone mentioned i need to stop focusing on the phone, calls, etc and look at the big picture of his character. I agree completely. Completely. It's a hard thing to accept and realize. Like you have all said to me, I'm just focusing on me. I cannot control him. He's a big boy. He made choices. I can make my choices for not accepting the behavior as something I want to be treated with and move on. I know this. Will be easier said (typed) than done. But for now, I am doing what's best for me.
Thanks also for the help with the boundaries.
Like I said, I decided to block his calls, texts, etc. because I need to just focus on me right now. I made that choice after all the crazy behavior Sunday, to just sit and clear my head, to allow some of this anger to surface and let it go, and to just begin to think and write out some thoughts. All of your posts have helped tremendously.
The thing that I keep thinking so far after reading your posts and thinking about my situation is this.......what if he really were being serious and really didn't want to talk to this person for his stated reasons, would I still want to be with him? Why would I want to be with someone who chooses to do things or not do things that are clearly not helping to re build trust? Why would I want to be with someone when confronted with something that clearly is bothering me throw a temper tantrum, start yelling and call me names? High or sober, why does it matter?
It really doesn't matter. I don't need him in my face explaining (or lying) why he behaved that way. SOmeone mentioned i need to stop focusing on the phone, calls, etc and look at the big picture of his character. I agree completely. Completely. It's a hard thing to accept and realize. Like you have all said to me, I'm just focusing on me. I cannot control him. He's a big boy. He made choices. I can make my choices for not accepting the behavior as something I want to be treated with and move on. I know this. Will be easier said (typed) than done. But for now, I am doing what's best for me.
Thanks also for the help with the boundaries.
Member
Join Date: Aug 2012
Posts: 165
i know this is an old post...but one thing i have learned in therapy is that what you do in the dark will come to light...eventually. for me, i learned about my husband's cheating and drug usage after not knowing about it for a long time. eventually it all came out. but there were red flags...he was not transparent. and i think transparency is a must in any healthy marital relationship.
and i wouldnt believe a word anyone tells you about transparency being a bad thing in any way. when trust is broken, it is a must. any marriage counselor will tell you that...especially when there is cheating or a severe betrayal of trust. "those who have nothing to hide, hide nothing." transparency in a marriage to rebuild trust means COMPLETE access to phone records, email, voicemail, computers....whatever it takes to make YOU feel safe. yes, it is a violation of privacy, and it is uncomfortable for the person who had done wrong...but it is a requirement to build trust back in the relationship. and if your man is not willing...freely giving up access to all of his communications, then that is a red flag....period. no one wants to have someone checking up on them forever, i get that...but it is the only way to rebuild the trust back.
girl, don't go believing that something is wrong with you for making that a requirement...especially for someone on drugs.
forget about that violation of privacy....please. if you want to rebuild trust, then his ass should do it. and if he cant accept that, then he can get the hell out of the house. him preaching some moral reason or whatever about not being transparent is crap...see that crap for what it is.
i wish i would let my cheating, drug addict husband come back home and bitch to me about his privacy. please. he can stay gone with that ****.
you are doing right.
and i wouldnt believe a word anyone tells you about transparency being a bad thing in any way. when trust is broken, it is a must. any marriage counselor will tell you that...especially when there is cheating or a severe betrayal of trust. "those who have nothing to hide, hide nothing." transparency in a marriage to rebuild trust means COMPLETE access to phone records, email, voicemail, computers....whatever it takes to make YOU feel safe. yes, it is a violation of privacy, and it is uncomfortable for the person who had done wrong...but it is a requirement to build trust back in the relationship. and if your man is not willing...freely giving up access to all of his communications, then that is a red flag....period. no one wants to have someone checking up on them forever, i get that...but it is the only way to rebuild the trust back.
girl, don't go believing that something is wrong with you for making that a requirement...especially for someone on drugs.
forget about that violation of privacy....please. if you want to rebuild trust, then his ass should do it. and if he cant accept that, then he can get the hell out of the house. him preaching some moral reason or whatever about not being transparent is crap...see that crap for what it is.
i wish i would let my cheating, drug addict husband come back home and bitch to me about his privacy. please. he can stay gone with that ****.
you are doing right.
Member
Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 493
Originally Posted by madisonblake
Anvilhead - apparently I was incorrect in thinking that people who will disagree with you will do it in a constructive manner.
I call it protecting myself and my family....not having nothing better to do.
I call it protecting myself and my family....not having nothing better to do.
Member
Join Date: Jan 2009
Posts: 864
Posted by Miller and i wouldnt believe a word anyone tells you about transparency being a bad thing in any way. when trust is broken, it is a must. any marriage counselor will tell you that...especially when there is cheating or a severe betrayal of trust. to rebuild trust means COMPLETE access to phone records, email, voicemail, computers....whatever it takes to make YOU feel safe. yes, it is a violation of privacy, and it is uncomfortable for the person who had done wrong...but it is a requirement to build trust back in the relationship. and if your man is not willing...freely giving up access to all of his communications, then that is a red flag …
I don’t agree at all and I don’t think this is healthy for the one implementing it.
I am not sure I find it a red flag either and there is no way in hell in addiction or out of it I would give total access to prove myself. Either I am trusted or I am not, that simple. I won’t prove anything I will be just me and show by actions the truth. It is not on me who believes it or not….oh think that one out.
I remember years ago saying to someone who was just so angry at the lies … what would you do with the truth, anything different? Hell don’t you know the truth already, why not believe it ? Would it change if he walked and said hey I was just out, hit the corner copped and shot up and now I am gonna go and nod off ok, love yah…. Hey I was out hitting the ole crack pipe, some chic was there, we had random sex and wow I am sorry but she was there, you weren’t…
Let me tell you something, in the sickness there would be far too many who rationalize the above and say I don’t trust and yet never walk out the door. They might not admit it, but then again what the addicts do is really not our problem nor our business, what we take and rationalize and blame on the drug, and make excuses for in terms of how they behave, in terms of justifying our own behavior now that is what we need to focus on.
I think I would rather … although it was most annoying in every way … have the one who wanted to be trusted again do the work. I would want them to prove they were trustworthy by their actions, not by some unhealthy contract or by me running every aspect of their life and being in their email, their phone records…that to me is insane.
My husband drove me nuts with accountability. He drove me nuts with details. It is amazing the sicker we are the more we need to control and know everything. As we get healthy, accept that they are addicts, accept that their actions are all on them, and not the drug they choose to use well we don’t need to have their answers are own become much more important.
He would go the store come home with receipts and I didn’t ask for this, if he went to the bank … oh the bank is interesting in Camden anyway, you can cop on your way out…he would call, say the money is in move it…He would randomly need to share things he did, lies he told. And he knew cause I am huge on it being about looking at the lies you tell yourself that was my focus for me and something I did ask him to look at for himself ….. One day I said, really no more and then learned another valuable lesson… he wasn’t totally doing this to prove anything to me, but to heal in is own right. He felt he needed to be accountable, he felt he needed to share…and it was part of the amends he needed to make. Oh wtf this wasn’t all about me … lmao.
And to go one further if anyone said to me I need your phone records, your emails, to have open access to everything you do on the net, need you to check in when you leave the house because I don’t trust you I would say there is the door, don’t let it hit you in the ass on the way out. And I say this from the addict/codependent and recovery side of the fence. I say this as an open book, ask a question I will answer with the truth, whether you like my answer or not…another issue we anticipate the answer before we ask the questions, we ask questions we already have the answers for…most insane I find. But then I was so comfortably at home in the sickness.
I have no reason to prove I am trustworthy, I do that by action each day. I have no reason to have my husband prove he is, he does that by his actions each day …I also have cheating, hitting as a point of no return, hit me, cheat on me…last thing I would be worried about was him proving he would be trusted again because there would be no need, the relationship would be over. Which begs the question why … why use a contract, why the need for full access when the damage was already done? Why salvage a relationship were cheating was evident? Is there a point of return, can there be, will one ever trust again, can you live without it ever being an issue in the back of your mind? I know I couldn’t, maybe some can and if they do I would think there would have to be a clean slate, it would have to be for there to be any healthiness in the relationship…
Active addiction looks its part all the time, using doesn‘t always need to be around for this… recovery looks way different and it does on both sides of the fence.
Member
Join Date: Feb 2008
Location: Chicago area
Posts: 4,269
I am another who does not buy into this as it relates to adults. If I can't trust, there is nothing worth saving. Staying emeshed in someone else's business sustains and protects my codependency, the disease of my ego.
Attempting to control leads to mutual resentment and does not work.
Attempting to control leads to mutual resentment and does not work.
Member
Join Date: Aug 2012
Posts: 165
transparency is a must....i dont care what anyone says about that. but that is me. goes both ways....you can see my ****....i can see your ****. no secrets...especially when you are restablishing trust in a relationship.
both should be an open book. those who have nothing to hide, hide nothing.
not negotiable for me....hell NO!
like i said before..."i wish i would have a cheating or drug addict spouse tell me i couldnt look in his phone because of his privacy." that is a load of crap!
please.
girl...do you. if you want transparency to feel safe...then ask for it. he should be willing to do everything it takes to make you feel safe. any good marriage counselor will tell you that once trust has been broken.
That is part of the HARD WORD the liar has to do to earn trust back.
do you.
this topic is closed for me...but girl, just do you...do what you need to feel safe. him willing to be an open book is the first step in trying to establish that trust with you...and whatever else YOU need.
i wish i would let somebody play me like that again. please.
both should be an open book. those who have nothing to hide, hide nothing.
not negotiable for me....hell NO!
like i said before..."i wish i would have a cheating or drug addict spouse tell me i couldnt look in his phone because of his privacy." that is a load of crap!
please.
girl...do you. if you want transparency to feel safe...then ask for it. he should be willing to do everything it takes to make you feel safe. any good marriage counselor will tell you that once trust has been broken.
That is part of the HARD WORD the liar has to do to earn trust back.
do you.
this topic is closed for me...but girl, just do you...do what you need to feel safe. him willing to be an open book is the first step in trying to establish that trust with you...and whatever else YOU need.
i wish i would let somebody play me like that again. please.
Nature Girl
Join Date: Mar 2002
Location: By The Lake
Posts: 60,328
I also agree that if there is no trust, there is no relationship.
I will not demean another by snooping into their affairs, nor will I allow others to demean me by snooping into mine.
Trust is there or it isn't and if it isn't, all the contracts in the world won't make it so.
Lies and cheating would be a deal breaker for me, but if I chose to give a second chance it would have to be with forgiveness on my part and impeccable behaviour on theirs. Nothing more, nothing less.
That said, there is no "right" answer to this issue. We each have to decide what works for us....or what doesn't.
Hugs
I will not demean another by snooping into their affairs, nor will I allow others to demean me by snooping into mine.
Trust is there or it isn't and if it isn't, all the contracts in the world won't make it so.
Lies and cheating would be a deal breaker for me, but if I chose to give a second chance it would have to be with forgiveness on my part and impeccable behaviour on theirs. Nothing more, nothing less.
That said, there is no "right" answer to this issue. We each have to decide what works for us....or what doesn't.
Hugs
Member
Thread Starter
Join Date: Mar 2012
Posts: 180
Wow you really did bring up a blast in the not so distant past for me. Miller, I have to still agree with you and with me and what I felt at that time. I haven't spoken to my ex in months. The way I finally broke things off for good........well, I got into his phone records and found that every single time I thought something was weird, well it was. Every single argument started over someething stupid, well guess who the first person was he called when he left here? His drug dealer. Enough was enough. It was the end for me FINALLY after two years of the worse relationship I have ever been in.
Did I play my part? yes. But do I feel bad for myself for snooping and finding his call records? NO. Absolutely not. Have I learned a lesson? Yes. Will I ever let an addict into my life? NO WAY! Will I let someone I don't trust into my life again? No. Will I ever stoop to snooping? NO. But again, do I feel like I should regret the snooping? No way. This person was so good at the con, so good at the lying, so good at pretending, that I would have continued to second guess what I was feeling. The proof for me gave me the strength to say enough is enough and bye bye addict.
My life is finally back to calm, back to normal. Do I still get angry? Sure, but I'm in a much better place. My only regret is not the snooping, it's the not leaving sooner. But then again, when I start to feel regret, I have to remind myself this all happened for a reason and I had to go through that hell the last few rounds of make ups/break ups to know that there's no chance I would ever trust this person again and nor would I ever want to try.
Did I play my part? yes. But do I feel bad for myself for snooping and finding his call records? NO. Absolutely not. Have I learned a lesson? Yes. Will I ever let an addict into my life? NO WAY! Will I let someone I don't trust into my life again? No. Will I ever stoop to snooping? NO. But again, do I feel like I should regret the snooping? No way. This person was so good at the con, so good at the lying, so good at pretending, that I would have continued to second guess what I was feeling. The proof for me gave me the strength to say enough is enough and bye bye addict.
My life is finally back to calm, back to normal. Do I still get angry? Sure, but I'm in a much better place. My only regret is not the snooping, it's the not leaving sooner. But then again, when I start to feel regret, I have to remind myself this all happened for a reason and I had to go through that hell the last few rounds of make ups/break ups to know that there's no chance I would ever trust this person again and nor would I ever want to try.
Currently Active Users Viewing this Thread: 1 (0 members and 1 guests)
