luvflowers

Hello all! I am a little better today than yesterday and thanks to all the wonderful support that this forum has presented to me. You have no idea how having access to this outlet is unreplaceable. Thanks again and again.

I know enabling is a complex concept. There must be levels of enabling. I would just like somewhat of a gauge as to when to limit the enabling. I get it, in the past, I did try to help my son by cleaning up his mess, covering for him, blah, blah, the list could go on. These are nonemergent things that I could quickly put an abrupt end to. The more important question is, what about keeping an eye on him while in his intoxicated state that could land him in the hospital, get into an accident, fall get a concussion, and the list goes on, that could be emergent? I can not babysit him and prevent these measures. It's not physically possible. I live about 25 miles from him. Most of the time I don't know when he is drinking, but sometimes I do. That is what scares me the MOST, OR if something should happen to my grandbabies as a result of his addiction and inability to make a coherent decision. Where and how do you draw the line?

I hope this question makes sense. Any insight on this would be greatly appreciated. Thank you in advance.

sage1969

This is hard and heartbreaking; I've teens, two of whom have / are struggling with addictions. From a practical standpoint, unless your son is a minor or you've legal guardianship over him or his children, your legal liabilities are more limited, unless he's driving your vehicle or they live on your property or your have a fiduciary responsibility (where you would be legally responsible for his behavior). Otherwise, as hard as it is, you can't monitor what is going on, whether he lives 25 or 2500 miles away. He is an adult and makes his own decisions.

Another poster shared this quite recently, and one sentence stands put to me: "I feed my addiction enough ... please don't help me."

The Battle Isn't Yours To Fight
You can't make me clean though I know it is what you want for me to be, but until I want it. I won't be. You can't love me clean because until I learn to love myself. I won't be. I know you must wonder how can I learn to love myself when I am caught up in a lifestyle of self-hatred and self destruction.

I can learn from my own experience. I can learn from the things that happen to me along the path of my own mistakes. I can learn by being allowed to suffer the consequences of my own choices. Life has a funny way of teaching us the lessons we need learn.

I know it devastates you to watch me hurting myself. I know you want to jump in and save me. This helps ease your pain, but I don't think you understand just how damaging it is to me.

You see although I look and sound like your loved one. Me, the person is locked away deep down inside my being. What you see before you is a addict ruled and reigned by my addiction.

The main focus of a addict is to feed the addiction. Every effort you put forth in the name of "helping" me, the person ... falls prey to the addict giving more power to the addiction to shackel down the person in me a little more each time.

I feed my addiction enough ... please don't help me.

The only way for the person in me to get free is to be free. Free to fall in order to find the strength to get back up and fight back to break free.

How can or will I ever be able to get clean.

The same way I gave myself over to my addiction is the same way I can give myself over to my recovery. BY MYSELF

By allowing me to reach rock bottom you move over and allow me to find the my own way back. It is in the fight to break free that I will find myself. It is in the fight that I learn to love myself. The more I learn to love myself the more I will do to better myself.

I am aware that when I use I am playing russian roulette with my life. I know this, but that is a chance we take when we use. The addict in me is willing to take that chance in the name of getting high.
Rock bottom is but a circumstance away. I can't get in if you are blocking the entrance ...

Please for the sake of the person in me, move out of the way and let me fall as far down as I have to in order to reach the bottom. Pray for me that when I do hit that is not with the impact that leaves me for dead (I know that is your greatest fear), but if it comes to that, be sure to tell my story so that others might learn and live.

Nytepassion
Recovering Addict

trailmix

I'm a bit confused. You know logically, that you have zero control over him (sober or drinking), the incidents you mention are out of your control as you are not on site.

What kind of enabling do you mean? Or are these just worries?

RunningScared

I'm not one that can post long paragraphs. My son can sink or swim on his own. Not my problem.

Seren

I wish I had some sort of magic thing you could do for your son or magic conversation you could have that would make this all better--that would make him stop being so self-destructive. But I can't because there are none. His decisions and actions as far as alcohol is concerned are as out of your control in the same way that say his decision would be to sell everything he owns and move to Alaska and start crab hauling for a living. (And apologies, I'm not trying to be flippant.)

It is the hardest 'letting go' a parent can do. To realize that the precious child you've nurtured and protected is now (although still just as beloved) wholly other than you. You can't build a bubble around your adult alcoholic child no matter how much every instinct tells you to. I think what can help is getting support for yourself--here, and in real life as well. Whether that is counseling or Al-Anon, or some other way to share with and learn from people who understand.

Sometimes I do forget that this one little gem exists, but this post helped me tremendously in my early days on SR. The title drew me in, but it wasn't what I was expecting.
10 Ways Family Members Can Help a Loved One with a Drug or Alcohol Problem

Jw92

Hi luvflowers, I'm glad your feeling a little bit better today. I agree with trailmix, I think you are confusing enabling with worrying? I'm not sure, but you might find this read about enabling useful:

https://www.soberrecovery.com/forums...alcoholic.html (There are many ways to enable an alcoholic)

There are plenty of other reads under that classical reading tab that you may also find helpful or just interesting x

luvflowers

Sage1969....this heartwrenching and gutwrenching. This is SO so so so sad to read. I hate this road. I pray every day and I sometimes don't get why people have to suffer so. I do get it, unfortunately, hard lessons are learned for some but what about the ones that don't get to pick themselves up from rock bottom. Thank you for sharing, this is very hard for me.

luvflowers

Thank you Trailmix...I really don't know how to explain what I am trying to ask. Thank you for replying.

luvflowers

Seren you are so very sweet. This forum is so blessed to have someone like you reading and responding in a way that is both frank and empathetic (I am guessing but hopefully you have never had to deal with this). I so appreciate you and your contribution to my hurt and boy does it hurt and concern. I only thought that life was tough at times, this takes the cake. My daughter had issues when in her late teens and early 20's and that was the bumpiest road I thought I would ever be on. Detention, multiple times, and wow just thinking about those days is tough. I made her accountable for her actions, instead of trying to save her with a smack on the hand, which was her saving grace, and hard for me. She is absolutely great now. My son, on the other hand, after years and years of schooling seemingly with the best head on him, is now more worrisome than my daughter ever was because at least I had a hand somewhat in insisting that she be accountable. She was also in my household. My son is a grown adult and it is completely out of my hands. Thank you so much again for your kind words, and for trying to open my eyes, they are open just not seeing as they should at times.

luvflowers

Thank you Jw92 very much.

trailmix

I just want to say when I said "just" worries, in no way did I mean to downgrade the worry! I just meant instead of.

What I see? What I have seen, is that there is nothing you can do about it really. Your worry is wasted emotion and wasted time. You can let go of a person with love. That doesn't mean you are giving up on them or have no hope for them, just that you are respectfully allowing them to make their own choices in life.

Enabling an alcoholic is, generally, considered doing something for someone that they can do themselves. Like calling in to their work for them when they are "sick". Giving them money, providing things (phone, car, accommodation, material things) that they are fully able to obtain themselves.

It's hard and it happens with children that are not addicts as well. It's never easy to tell your child no, regardless of their age, but it's not doing them a favour. How can they fly if you cut their wings. Addiction just adds another layer to that.

It is a true sign of codependency when you feel that if you lose control of this situation it will spiral out of control. But it's a false control, not real at all.

Worrying helps your Son not at all and it is probably making you very unhappy? Relinquishing that faux control hurts no one.

luvflowers

Trailmix, in no way, did I take what you said as a downgrade. I just have really had a time with this over the last few days and my mind doesn't compute like it should during these periods of exacerbation. I know what I SHOULD do and handle my thoughts but when it's your child makes it even more challenging and painful. One day at a time for me. I just try and stay physically active while trying to get out more to take my mind off the situation at hand. Thank you and everyone for all your time and devotion to helping those in emotional pain during their very troubled times,

Seren

I'm really sorry to read all you have been through as a family. I'm happy that your daughter is doing well now! Addiction is truly a family disease that affects generations as it has with my family.

I think it's always a good idea to encourage people we love to seek recovery. It's just a soul-crushing roller coaster to continue to pin our hopes on every crumb of hope thrown our way only to be devastated when some other alcohol-fueled crisis happens.

My late husband would still talk to his son even when the conversation was alcoholic nonsense. He felt it was important to maintain that connection. My stepson can be a champion at manipulation, and he saved the worst of it for my stepdaughter (his sister). In order to get money from my husband, my stepson would always have some emergency or other (getting kicked out of his apartment, wrecking his truck, landing in jail, etc.).

We learned to never just give him cash because it would go straight to alcohol or drugs. We took time to consider what we would do, if anything. For example, if he needed money for rent, we would send the check straight to the landlord. But if we felt that it was not the right thing because it was shielding him from the consequences of his drinking, then we would do nothing. He has spent many weeks in jail. He has lost a truck and a car. He was found a few years ago unconscious at the bottom of some steps (outdoors) and was taken to the hospital as a John Doe. He has damaged his brain and currently lives in a nursing home several hours drive from me.

Detaching from his chaotic life is the only way my dear late husband and I could have found any peace. And detaching, or letting go, didn't mean we didn't care (although that is what we were accused of by his son). It's just the realization that we had no control over his choices. I thought you might enjoy this. It has helped me and many other members.

seekingcalm

Thank you for sharing Seren...wonderful article...and at the end where it says, the addict has to feel the natural consequences, rather than the the family feeling all of the negative consequences...very powerful!

trailmix

Yes, we can know what we should do, but not want to do it. Your answer is to distance yourself from the situation (keeping an eye on the children only, to see they are well taken care of). That's really it.

I know you already know this. So it's a question with an answer you already have, you just don't like the answer (if that sounds harsh in any way, absolutely not intended that way).

It's entirely possible you could create a rift between you and your Son by backing off and saying "no" to requests. That's scary, fear inducing.

I think it's helpful to keep busy when we are trying to get through something that will heal (like leaving an alcoholic spouse or a broken leg!), but if you don't face this (and yes, it hurts and it's hard) you will be worried for years and years.

Coddling our children, addicts or not, harms them. Maybe if you think of it that way, that letting go of the rope isn't hurting him, it's hurting him to hold on so tight (and also dragging you along).

luvflowers

Seren thank you as always for responding. It's always endearing to hear someone else's personal journey, not that I mean endearing that it happened. I really have no one to share this with. So it's this forum where I have sought most of the information and advice. I did restart Al-Anon last week. I had briefly started during covid when everything was by zoom. That was very impersonal for me, but I did appreciate it though, don't get me wrong. I haven't really gotten the flow of al-anon yet. I get that no one talks about their issues but shares some experiences which is helpful and I do get it, people don't want to hear everyone's personal day-to-day dealings. Just general helpful info. One of the hardest feats in this whole thing is where to draw the line in steering my son. I know you suggested giving him the AA phone number. Which I have not done yet, as he would think that I have lost my mind, because he says he has no problem. My situation is that he is very self-sufficient, and needs no money, no car, and nothing in that respect from me. He is teetering on something happening though, he can't keep up on the road he's on. This past weekend he drank the whole weekend and the wife took the children and stayed with her mother. So I do think she is doing it partly for the safety of the babies and using them to her advantage by saying he can't see them. So when they are at odds like this, I can not see the babies either. She has constantly bashed me for being an uncaring mother by not telling my son to stop drinking and acting like a child. She CLEARLY has no understanding of alcoholism. I am a retired NICU nurse and really have no business diagnosing my daughter-in-law (even my dad was bipolar and my daughter had issues in her teens and early 20's so I am very well-read in the MSDS and its content. I know this makes me no authority though but she has huge control, manipulation and low self-esteem issues. She has tried to make me feel so bad, and in part blames me for some of his drinking, because I am not stopping him or whatever she thinks I should be doing. So frustrating.

I am sorry that you ever had to deal with any of this yourself. You clearly can empathize with me. I just sit and shake my head as to why these things have to happen. I wish sometimes wish they could criminalize alcohol, but I am guessing these ones would find something else to abuse possibly. It's so sad.

Thank you again for your support!

velma929

One of the hardest feats in this whole thing is where to draw the line in steering my son.

Honestly, I think you're dreaming to think you have any control at all at this point.

She CLEARLY has no understanding of alcoholism.
She may not, but SHE AND THE BABIES CLEARLY are closer and more affected by his addiction than you are. They live with him.

...So when they are at odds like this, I can not see the babies either.
Your disdain for her is clear. I'd be giving you a wide berth, too. Demonizing her when she has control of the babies seems to not be working in your favor. Yes, she escapes to her mother's. I think that's wise. When the two of them are apart, they're not saying anything to one another to make the situation worse.

She probably wonders why you held your daughter's feet to the fire and coddled your baby boy by covering for him. You don't have to explain, (to us anyway). What's done is done.

She's your daughter-in-law, the woman your son chose for his babies' mother. Some people make better friends than enemies. But, you can blame her if you want. It just isn't getting you anywhere you want to go, or your son, either.

luvflowers

Thank you Velma929 for your insight. I am always open to others and whatever input may help me grow. I CLEARLY want what is best for the babies and the family, foremost the babies, they are innocent/helpless in all this. I want my son well also but I know its his path to choose. my messages may appear self-centered and poor ole me. Not my intent, I am hurting and sometimes my verbalization reflects that. I am here to gather information with positive growth from all this. Thank you again.

velma929

I didn't mean, at all, that you sounded self-centered. My intent was to maybe point to the idea that a woman with two small children and a husband who was an addict was in need of compassion, not hostility.

Seren

You're right. Your DIL probably does not have an understanding of addiction. I hope that she can begin to learn more, as it makes this chaos a bit more bearable.

I don't know her at all, but I suspect that what she does understand is that her life feels completely out-of-control, she is scared for herself and her babies, and she is running to the only place that feels secure for her--her own mother. She wants to control him or have someone else control him so that life will feel calm to her again. You and your DIL have two things in common: you want to 'make' your son stop drinking; and you both love an alcoholic.