communication
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Join Date: Aug 2011
Posts: 16,246
"That anyone, the addict, the boys, the other family members should think that you should just walk away and leave it all to someone that is just going to squander it and lose it to the bank anyways, is beyond ridiculous. I know that, you know that, anyone who isn't allowing themselves to be manipulated and all wrapped up in his B.S. knows that." (quotes from smallbutmighty).
Amaranth----I think think this is true.
Stand up for yourself. When dealing with someone like this. you will not get any stars in heaven for trying to be a "nice guy".
If you don't put your own welfare first, nobody else is going to.
Amaranth----I think think this is true.
Stand up for yourself. When dealing with someone like this. you will not get any stars in heaven for trying to be a "nice guy".
If you don't put your own welfare first, nobody else is going to.
Member
Join Date: Oct 2013
Posts: 11,431
There will be nothing left if you wait two years. He will run it into the ground, not pay taxes so a lien will be filed if not already, and the value will plummet.
Meanwhile, the kids will have really had good opportunity to fully develop their own own alcohol and drug problems living with him as example.
Don’t you see this? Letting him go own will send it all circling down the drain.
Please go to court and save yourself here.
Meanwhile, the kids will have really had good opportunity to fully develop their own own alcohol and drug problems living with him as example.
Don’t you see this? Letting him go own will send it all circling down the drain.
Please go to court and save yourself here.
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Thread Starter
Join Date: Sep 2018
Posts: 436
Thank you all so much for your kind support. You have no idea how much it helps. Its sure been a rollercoaster day. My mother in law answered my apology text and thanked me for being open wow! that was unexpected. She sent a very nice message. Then my son messaged and apologised for the way he spoke to me earlier. lovely message. Then a whole barrage of veiled suicide threats from my husband, "you're pushing me over the edge, I can't cope, the pressure is too much" etc. I answered with "No emotional blackmail please. go to bed, you're having a comedown" he says he's not having a comedown. "whatever, I saw you last night. You're having a comedown. things will look brighter in the morning"
wow i'm exhausted. I'm happy I didn't fall for the manipulation. I was worried for a short while that he might actually be suicidal but since I have read so much about this kind of behaviour on this forum I didn't bite. Half an hour later the next message was "can you still pick up that thing for the job tomorrow" yes
I phoned my counseller and had an emergency session. She did a visualisation with me and I fell asleep. oops. But I am calm now and will go to bed soon. It's so hard to navigagte these very emotionally charged days. My counseller is teaching me how to reel myself in when I get so uncalm and reactive. I'm focusing now on staying calm till wednesday. I'm handing it over to my higher power.
Thank you all for being there
wow i'm exhausted. I'm happy I didn't fall for the manipulation. I was worried for a short while that he might actually be suicidal but since I have read so much about this kind of behaviour on this forum I didn't bite. Half an hour later the next message was "can you still pick up that thing for the job tomorrow" yes
I phoned my counseller and had an emergency session. She did a visualisation with me and I fell asleep. oops. But I am calm now and will go to bed soon. It's so hard to navigagte these very emotionally charged days. My counseller is teaching me how to reel myself in when I get so uncalm and reactive. I'm focusing now on staying calm till wednesday. I'm handing it over to my higher power.
Thank you all for being there
Member
Join Date: Nov 2016
Posts: 8,639
I'm glad some of that finished up better Amaranth. When we are feeling particularily anxious or sad or when things (like the conversations) are not as we would like them to be and are unsettling and make us feel unsettled, we need to know that more will be revealed and that these things tend to resolve themselves.
It's not easy being disliked for something, especially when you feel you have done nothing wrong, like with your Son. It's particularly hurtful, I think, because you expect them to KNOW you and know you wouldn't purposefully hurt them. I totally get that. In fact you haven't done anything wrong there but perhaps you should always keep in mind the environment your children are in and that they tend to be self centered at that age.
What you are doing, by hopefully forcing the sale of the house is standing your ground. Might that cause a whole bunch of "unsettledness" absolutely, but you will get through it.
As much as an ex or STBex, to our minds, is being very unreasonable and spouting negatives and poisoning the mind(s) of our children, it is still their parent and while an equal say may not seem justified to us, that doesn't mean it doesn't to them.
This will all work out, perhaps even differently than you imagine (which is why maybe it's not a good idea to imagine!).
Do you notice how the fact that your MIL and Son were upset with you sent you plummeting emotionally? We won't always be liked for our decisions, even by those close to us. Sometimes with some of them, there is no resolution in sight. That's terribly sad, especially in the case of children, but it no doubt happens more than we know. I have experience with this. That doesn't make you a bad person.
The transition from teen to adult can be a tough one. It's not easy to have someone as the center of your world looking out for themselves. That transition sometimes doesn't work that well, it happens. What I do know is that you can't negotiate that back with the house, it will be what it will be, regardless. As I mentioned a while ago, everyone there is looking out for themselves, it's important that you take care of yourself too. You are important and I hope you know that.
It's not easy being disliked for something, especially when you feel you have done nothing wrong, like with your Son. It's particularly hurtful, I think, because you expect them to KNOW you and know you wouldn't purposefully hurt them. I totally get that. In fact you haven't done anything wrong there but perhaps you should always keep in mind the environment your children are in and that they tend to be self centered at that age.
What you are doing, by hopefully forcing the sale of the house is standing your ground. Might that cause a whole bunch of "unsettledness" absolutely, but you will get through it.
As much as an ex or STBex, to our minds, is being very unreasonable and spouting negatives and poisoning the mind(s) of our children, it is still their parent and while an equal say may not seem justified to us, that doesn't mean it doesn't to them.
This will all work out, perhaps even differently than you imagine (which is why maybe it's not a good idea to imagine!).
Do you notice how the fact that your MIL and Son were upset with you sent you plummeting emotionally? We won't always be liked for our decisions, even by those close to us. Sometimes with some of them, there is no resolution in sight. That's terribly sad, especially in the case of children, but it no doubt happens more than we know. I have experience with this. That doesn't make you a bad person.
The transition from teen to adult can be a tough one. It's not easy to have someone as the center of your world looking out for themselves. That transition sometimes doesn't work that well, it happens. What I do know is that you can't negotiate that back with the house, it will be what it will be, regardless. As I mentioned a while ago, everyone there is looking out for themselves, it's important that you take care of yourself too. You are important and I hope you know that.
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Thread Starter
Join Date: Sep 2018
Posts: 436
no court tomorrow. I applied for a 30 day extension. i can hear you all groaning "why Amaranth!! why do you want to drag it out for another month????" It will be a september date because the courts shut in august. I did it because by september the kids will be 18 and so the custody thing will be irrelevant. My lawyer thought it was a good idea. I have all my papers in order. I will not attend any more sit downs with husband. I will not make any other offer. The ball is in his court. If he decides to come to an agreement he can communicate it by email. If he decides to keep contesting, I'm ready. The mediator is done.
The kids came to see me yesterday - a surprise visit. It was lovely.
The kids came to see me yesterday - a surprise visit. It was lovely.
Member
Join Date: Nov 2016
Posts: 8,639
Actually, that makes perfect sense. I think that was a really wise move. This leaves room, at court, for focus on the issues - not that the kids aren't important, of course, but for a matter of weeks, why even worry about custody issues.
I'm glad the kids came to visit! Aside from the mediator thing being a huge annoyance because of your stbxAH, it may have a silver lining in that your kids did get to see your side a bit more, that can't be a bad thing.
You sound really focused yourself A - you will be fine.
I'm glad the kids came to visit! Aside from the mediator thing being a huge annoyance because of your stbxAH, it may have a silver lining in that your kids did get to see your side a bit more, that can't be a bad thing.
You sound really focused yourself A - you will be fine.
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Thread Starter
Join Date: Sep 2018
Posts: 436
Feeling very annoyed with myself today. I have managed to hold my boundary since the phone call to my mother in law. No contact with my husband extending to not talking about him. A mutual friend told me last week his mother told him all about our conversation and he is very very angry with me. Fine. I didn't talk to the kids about it but I'm waiting for their anger again. No doubt he will have ranted to them about it.
today I saw the landlady of his new girlfriend. She started to complain about them. I said I have loads more than him to talk about but then I was suddenly hooked and she told me all sorts of things that I really don't need to know.
I feel kind of dirty. He's getting himself into more mess. It's a small town, I can see the situation is far from ideal but now I know it is very messy. I don't need to know and I don't know why I got into that conversation. I don't know why I listened to all the sordid details.
I think I'm feeling shame. He had a good reputation in this town for many years. He has many talents. He has destroyed his own family and has now taken up with a woman with young children and looks like he's on course to destroy that family too. She's been with her partner for 20 years.
He seems to know no limits. Roll on September, divorce and hope for a happy, joyous new start for me.
today I saw the landlady of his new girlfriend. She started to complain about them. I said I have loads more than him to talk about but then I was suddenly hooked and she told me all sorts of things that I really don't need to know.
I feel kind of dirty. He's getting himself into more mess. It's a small town, I can see the situation is far from ideal but now I know it is very messy. I don't need to know and I don't know why I got into that conversation. I don't know why I listened to all the sordid details.
I think I'm feeling shame. He had a good reputation in this town for many years. He has many talents. He has destroyed his own family and has now taken up with a woman with young children and looks like he's on course to destroy that family too. She's been with her partner for 20 years.
He seems to know no limits. Roll on September, divorce and hope for a happy, joyous new start for me.
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Thread Starter
Join Date: Sep 2018
Posts: 436
Yes, that's what I'm wondering. Why do I feel shame? Why do I feel so bad about his behaviour? I know I am a separate person and his actions say nothing about who I am.
What I can't work out is ...... Why does it affect my serenity?
What I can't work out is ...... Why does it affect my serenity?
Community Greeter
Join Date: Aug 2011
Posts: 16,246
Amaranth------I suspect that it comes from the kinds of "self talk" that you do to yourself. Self talk is the about the kind of beliefs that one has internalized to such a degree that they happen at a, mostly, subconsciious level. We all do some kinds of our own self talk----. Often, they are beliefs about ourselves that we have internalized and have lived with from a very early age.
If we become conscious of what these automatic messages to ourselves are---then there are ways to changes the self-destructive ones.
There are lots of books written about this subject of self talk.
If we become conscious of what these automatic messages to ourselves are---then there are ways to changes the self-destructive ones.
There are lots of books written about this subject of self talk.
Member
Join Date: Nov 2016
Posts: 8,639
Yes, you are used to having his actions reflect on you, or perceived them to be, well no longer!
Also, divorce is just a piece of paper, just like marriage is, it's the thoughts and feelings that go behind it that matter, true? It's time to separate yourself from his actions, you no longer have a horse in that race (thankfully!), you have no say in anything he says or does.
You know, maybe writing out all his transgressions would help? He is not the guy with the great reputation anymore. He is probably the guy with the reputation of the town drunk, again, no reflection on you. It's too bad that he came to this but he did it of his own volition, he had support, you, the children, his meddling Mother and did he grab that support? No he destroyed it.
Those are his choices and that is who he is now. Perhaps instead of thinking of him as he was, really look at who he is now, it may change your perspective on negotiating anything to do with the house and him housing your children. In fact the house now becomes just another weapon for him to destroy things.
Also, divorce is just a piece of paper, just like marriage is, it's the thoughts and feelings that go behind it that matter, true? It's time to separate yourself from his actions, you no longer have a horse in that race (thankfully!), you have no say in anything he says or does.
You know, maybe writing out all his transgressions would help? He is not the guy with the great reputation anymore. He is probably the guy with the reputation of the town drunk, again, no reflection on you. It's too bad that he came to this but he did it of his own volition, he had support, you, the children, his meddling Mother and did he grab that support? No he destroyed it.
Those are his choices and that is who he is now. Perhaps instead of thinking of him as he was, really look at who he is now, it may change your perspective on negotiating anything to do with the house and him housing your children. In fact the house now becomes just another weapon for him to destroy things.
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Join Date: Jan 2016
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“Yes, that's what I'm wondering. Why do I feel shame? Why do I feel so bad about his behaviour? I know I am a separate person and his actions say nothing about who I am.
What I can't work out is ...... Why does it affect my serenity?”
Because codependency is primarily about taking responsibility for how others behave...so if they fail, we have failed. I was trained for a very, very long time that it was up to me what my qualifiers did, said and felt. That if I just did everything right they would be happy and healthy.
It’s an enormously difficult lesson to unlearn...but his choices are his.
Roll on, September!
What I can't work out is ...... Why does it affect my serenity?”
Because codependency is primarily about taking responsibility for how others behave...so if they fail, we have failed. I was trained for a very, very long time that it was up to me what my qualifiers did, said and felt. That if I just did everything right they would be happy and healthy.
It’s an enormously difficult lesson to unlearn...but his choices are his.
Roll on, September!
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Thread Starter
Join Date: Sep 2018
Posts: 436
the 30 day extension is up. couldn't get hold of my lawyer so I went to see the judge myself. They are waiting for the agreement that we are going to present for our amicable divorce....... that is not going to happen
Last weekend the kids turned 18. we had a lovely afternoon do with some of their friends and the parents. It was like a big extended family, we've all known each other for years and watched the kids growing up together. couldn't have wished for a better day and couldn't have felt more proud seeing my boys become men!!
their father was there all day. the kids went for a night out, the parents stayed on. I spoke with my husband for several hours when the kids left. we still have such a strong bond and we talked deeply about many things that we needed to talk about years ago. At last I think I got that communication that I have been craving for so long. It was surreal but kind of healing. He was drunk and I did knowingly break my boundary of never enagaging with him when he is drunk.
He is in a terribly dark place. He spoke a lot about death, committing suicide and then said he had thought a lot about killing me...
we got onto the divorce and he became very aggressive. He said he would burn the house down before he sells it. I started to feel a little bit unsafe and went home.
It's not OK to say those things to me. It's not OK to talk that way. I have spoken to the lawyer now and asked that the divorce get going asap. I told him what my husband said, he suggests I report it to the police. I'm not going to do that just yet. I have an appointment with the psychologist later this week. I will ask if there is any process that I can start so that he will enter the mental health department. I asked the lawyer to put it in the notes for the judge. The last thing I want is to be awarded occupancy of the house!!
My husband is now toxic. He has poisoned himself for so long with drugs and alcohol he has disappeared. He is a mess and potentially a danger to himself and to me. He has no idea what he is saying or doing when he is drunk. There is nothing I can do for him.
I have tried so hard to help him and now I know there is nothing I can do, I feel a sense of relief. The kids are 18, there is no custody battle. I feel like I am almost at the end of very long and very painful story. What happens to my husband now is not my business. I am done.
Last weekend the kids turned 18. we had a lovely afternoon do with some of their friends and the parents. It was like a big extended family, we've all known each other for years and watched the kids growing up together. couldn't have wished for a better day and couldn't have felt more proud seeing my boys become men!!
their father was there all day. the kids went for a night out, the parents stayed on. I spoke with my husband for several hours when the kids left. we still have such a strong bond and we talked deeply about many things that we needed to talk about years ago. At last I think I got that communication that I have been craving for so long. It was surreal but kind of healing. He was drunk and I did knowingly break my boundary of never enagaging with him when he is drunk.
He is in a terribly dark place. He spoke a lot about death, committing suicide and then said he had thought a lot about killing me...
we got onto the divorce and he became very aggressive. He said he would burn the house down before he sells it. I started to feel a little bit unsafe and went home.
It's not OK to say those things to me. It's not OK to talk that way. I have spoken to the lawyer now and asked that the divorce get going asap. I told him what my husband said, he suggests I report it to the police. I'm not going to do that just yet. I have an appointment with the psychologist later this week. I will ask if there is any process that I can start so that he will enter the mental health department. I asked the lawyer to put it in the notes for the judge. The last thing I want is to be awarded occupancy of the house!!
My husband is now toxic. He has poisoned himself for so long with drugs and alcohol he has disappeared. He is a mess and potentially a danger to himself and to me. He has no idea what he is saying or doing when he is drunk. There is nothing I can do for him.
I have tried so hard to help him and now I know there is nothing I can do, I feel a sense of relief. The kids are 18, there is no custody battle. I feel like I am almost at the end of very long and very painful story. What happens to my husband now is not my business. I am done.
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Join Date: Nov 2016
Posts: 8,639
You are absolutely right, he is far far away from sanity and there is probably, no going back, without a lot of work which he is unwilling to do.
As for the birthday, that's great that it was such a success for them and your stbx didn't ruin it (for them).
As for the birthday, that's great that it was such a success for them and your stbx didn't ruin it (for them).
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