Please help me support my friend. I don't understand.
Member
Join Date: Aug 2015
Location: Western US
Posts: 9,010
Hey Corrado, there are many scientists (both atheists and believers) who have used the 12 step model to recover whether from codependency or addiction. You may indeed have to interpret the "Higher Power" part differently.
The power greater than yourself could be . . . your friend's unique quality as a living being who has the right to choose her own path. It could be the force of nature that runs through us all.
My dad is a scientist and he never really could apply critical thinking to anything outside of the physical world. I never understood that. I hope you can assimilate information about addiction/codependency and figure out what works and doesn't work. Unfortunately, doing the right thing with an alcoholic requires more than an intellectual understanding; it necessitates excruciatingly painful moral/ethical decisions and actions. Many simply can not do it. This may be no fault of their own; every situation is a complex tangle of different personalities, resources, disabilities, abilities, needs, strengths . . . . etc . . . .you get the point.
The stickies are a real mishmash of community wisdom so it might take some clicking and reading to find information that fits you.
The power greater than yourself could be . . . your friend's unique quality as a living being who has the right to choose her own path. It could be the force of nature that runs through us all.
My dad is a scientist and he never really could apply critical thinking to anything outside of the physical world. I never understood that. I hope you can assimilate information about addiction/codependency and figure out what works and doesn't work. Unfortunately, doing the right thing with an alcoholic requires more than an intellectual understanding; it necessitates excruciatingly painful moral/ethical decisions and actions. Many simply can not do it. This may be no fault of their own; every situation is a complex tangle of different personalities, resources, disabilities, abilities, needs, strengths . . . . etc . . . .you get the point.
The stickies are a real mishmash of community wisdom so it might take some clicking and reading to find information that fits you.
Member
Join Date: Aug 2016
Posts: 1,144
There's forces other then us in control. If it's not a higher power than it could be the magnetic forces in the world. Take what you like and discard the rest as long as you're making progress. Don't worry about getting hung up on some components of 12 steps.
A work in progress
Join Date: Jul 2010
Location: South Jersey
Posts: 16,633
Wow. Reading your posts, corrodo, frankly creeps me out a little. Caring, and wanting to help, are normal. Your tone of desperation sounds more like obsession than love. You said you had thick skin and to give it to you straight--well, that's what I'm hearing.
Your friend isn't teetering on the brink of death. True, the sleeping pills are some cause for concern, but she's still adjusting to living sober. Many newly sober alcoholics have sleep problems (even without energy drinks), and it looks like she is trying to balance out how she feels at any given time. Alcoholics aren't known for their patience with letting things like bursts of energy or sleep happen naturally--they want what they want when they want it.
I get it. I'm eight years sober, and to this day I have to constantly have something to sip on. I don't like energy drinks (too sweet for my taste), but I drank tons of coffee and iced tea. When it started bothering me (making me feel jumpy), I switched to half-caf. I still drink coffee all day, every day (or iced tea), and I go right up till bedtime, myself. I read in bed for a while and fall asleep without a problem. I finally gave up cigarettes in favor of vaping, but I do that constantly, too.
But know what? I am a darned sight healthier than I was when I was drinking. THAT would have killed me.
You have expressed your concern. Now it's time to back off. Because you're not asking how to "care" for your friend, you are asking how to CONTROL her--if you could, you would force her (in what you consider to be a loving way) to live the way YOU think she should live. She has a right to self-determination, though, which includes deciding what she is going to put in her body. And whether she puts snow tires on her car. And whether she takes her vitamins, goes for her annual mammogram, etc.
All of your care and concern may become a moot point, too, if you drive her away from you. If you were MY friend, I'd be rethinking the relationship. I'd feel smothered.
I'm being blunt here, because you asked for blunt. I think you honestly do care very much for your friend, but she has the right to live as she wants to.
Your friend isn't teetering on the brink of death. True, the sleeping pills are some cause for concern, but she's still adjusting to living sober. Many newly sober alcoholics have sleep problems (even without energy drinks), and it looks like she is trying to balance out how she feels at any given time. Alcoholics aren't known for their patience with letting things like bursts of energy or sleep happen naturally--they want what they want when they want it.
I get it. I'm eight years sober, and to this day I have to constantly have something to sip on. I don't like energy drinks (too sweet for my taste), but I drank tons of coffee and iced tea. When it started bothering me (making me feel jumpy), I switched to half-caf. I still drink coffee all day, every day (or iced tea), and I go right up till bedtime, myself. I read in bed for a while and fall asleep without a problem. I finally gave up cigarettes in favor of vaping, but I do that constantly, too.
But know what? I am a darned sight healthier than I was when I was drinking. THAT would have killed me.
You have expressed your concern. Now it's time to back off. Because you're not asking how to "care" for your friend, you are asking how to CONTROL her--if you could, you would force her (in what you consider to be a loving way) to live the way YOU think she should live. She has a right to self-determination, though, which includes deciding what she is going to put in her body. And whether she puts snow tires on her car. And whether she takes her vitamins, goes for her annual mammogram, etc.
All of your care and concern may become a moot point, too, if you drive her away from you. If you were MY friend, I'd be rethinking the relationship. I'd feel smothered.
I'm being blunt here, because you asked for blunt. I think you honestly do care very much for your friend, but she has the right to live as she wants to.
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