Thoughts on sobriety timeline and method
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Thoughts on sobriety timeline and method
Okay here goes...
I am in a committed relationship with an alcoholic. I am female, partner is male. I am not a drinker, only occasionally in social situations or if we are out and my partner hands me one.
I have known that he was an alcoholic and heavy weed user since we first met--in the beginning, when we first were going out, in retrospect I would not be embellishing if I called it psychosis...anger, paranoia, emotional swings, incoherence, mistaking me for other people, accusing me of being responsible for former people's actions, etc. I found out later through his own admission that he had recently gotten off harder drugs, and he basically said now was the time to go if it was too overwhelming.
Of course I stayed. My partner is wildly intelligent, a hard worker, multiple degrees, and is always upgrading. He is creative and innovative. However, because he is a 'high functioning' alcoholic, who has hit what he felt were his own personal 'rock bottoms' years ago, it would be more realistic to keep 'on the program'--unofficial, and I don't really like it, but basically no hard stuff in the house--he drinks bud lites just as fast as vodka, so we pick the lesser of evils. He has tapered down the pot substantially, got rid of the 'ritualistc' accessories, vape, grinder, etc, but still takes a couple of tokes along with the booze. Plus, with male peers at work, there is always someone 'worse off' with their substance of choice, who misses work, who is not a committed/faithful partner, so with the 'benchmark' set, he feels like he is doing okay.
We routinely have conversations about drinking, and now, 3 years in, he has characterized himself as an alcoholic. This week, after medication that forbade alcohol, he could only make it 3 days without turning to smoking pot.
Those 2 weeks, and the weekend after, where I was away for the weekend, lead to both damage and epiphany. He went on a bender out with his friends while I was gone, and had to pick me up from the bus station on the fourth day. He was quiet, wearing shades, so I figured it was just the usual hangover...then he was speeding and slurring. I yelled at him that I knew he was drunk, and it's so stupid but I was in such incredible shock and did not know how to process that moment so I let him drive home. When we got in, he got mad at me for leaving him alone--that my leaving for the weekend 'let' him get into trouble. This type of forced codependence has been reocurring--I leave and he drinks, or I stay and he either is elated by the company and diversion where we can monitor, or he absolutely hates it/me and the control.
So we waited out the night, and my partner sits me down for a discussion. He said that over the 2 weeks, and over the last 10 years, he has tried everything but a facility stay--AA meetings, full-blown bible retreats/churchgoings, counselling (though not addiction specialists), cold turkey, tapering, etc. The crux of what he was saying was that he couldn't deny that he needed the six-week stay, detox, supervision, 'sweating it out completely away' were his words.
The thing we both see is, due to family circumstances, and career circumstances (we are in a rural community), it would be at least a year before he finishes his next degree, and works full-time. We have looked at the numbers, and can afford a treatment centre if everything financial seems stable. His proposition is: get weekly addiction counselling in the next city over, with the promise to enter a rehab facility as soon as his schooling is complete. In the meantime, he needs to smoke pot in order to 'take the edge off'
My questions are: am I being manipulated? Does this sound positive or optimistic? How can I handle what I feel is swapping one addiction with another? I mean, we finally 'tapered down' both substances as best as we could, but 3 years ago, he was full tilt into whatever altered his consciousness, so I am worried that switching one out will just bring about the full-tilt behaviour. And, here is the ugly truth coming from me after all this time--I don't like the company of people who are stoned...I am pretty sharp, intellectual, and practical, so I am worried about how I cannot enjoy my partner's company. At least with the alcohol, sometimes there was remorse and I could feel needed. And regarding marijuana, I am a complete hypocrite--I am totally pro-legalization, I don't care about friends using it, I have used it socially--but the thought of my partner carrying on with what I associate with a terrible series of behaviours and consequences, some of which affected me directly, makes my anxiety overwhelming to the point where I feel sick.
To condense: can pot use, if one was a long-term addict (from 13, currently 35 years old) can they fight one addiction by using another substance? My fear is that he has always used both concurrently. Any thoughts in general?
Sorry that was so long-winded...it was really hard to get to the point of typing this.
I am in a committed relationship with an alcoholic. I am female, partner is male. I am not a drinker, only occasionally in social situations or if we are out and my partner hands me one.
I have known that he was an alcoholic and heavy weed user since we first met--in the beginning, when we first were going out, in retrospect I would not be embellishing if I called it psychosis...anger, paranoia, emotional swings, incoherence, mistaking me for other people, accusing me of being responsible for former people's actions, etc. I found out later through his own admission that he had recently gotten off harder drugs, and he basically said now was the time to go if it was too overwhelming.
Of course I stayed. My partner is wildly intelligent, a hard worker, multiple degrees, and is always upgrading. He is creative and innovative. However, because he is a 'high functioning' alcoholic, who has hit what he felt were his own personal 'rock bottoms' years ago, it would be more realistic to keep 'on the program'--unofficial, and I don't really like it, but basically no hard stuff in the house--he drinks bud lites just as fast as vodka, so we pick the lesser of evils. He has tapered down the pot substantially, got rid of the 'ritualistc' accessories, vape, grinder, etc, but still takes a couple of tokes along with the booze. Plus, with male peers at work, there is always someone 'worse off' with their substance of choice, who misses work, who is not a committed/faithful partner, so with the 'benchmark' set, he feels like he is doing okay.
We routinely have conversations about drinking, and now, 3 years in, he has characterized himself as an alcoholic. This week, after medication that forbade alcohol, he could only make it 3 days without turning to smoking pot.
Those 2 weeks, and the weekend after, where I was away for the weekend, lead to both damage and epiphany. He went on a bender out with his friends while I was gone, and had to pick me up from the bus station on the fourth day. He was quiet, wearing shades, so I figured it was just the usual hangover...then he was speeding and slurring. I yelled at him that I knew he was drunk, and it's so stupid but I was in such incredible shock and did not know how to process that moment so I let him drive home. When we got in, he got mad at me for leaving him alone--that my leaving for the weekend 'let' him get into trouble. This type of forced codependence has been reocurring--I leave and he drinks, or I stay and he either is elated by the company and diversion where we can monitor, or he absolutely hates it/me and the control.
So we waited out the night, and my partner sits me down for a discussion. He said that over the 2 weeks, and over the last 10 years, he has tried everything but a facility stay--AA meetings, full-blown bible retreats/churchgoings, counselling (though not addiction specialists), cold turkey, tapering, etc. The crux of what he was saying was that he couldn't deny that he needed the six-week stay, detox, supervision, 'sweating it out completely away' were his words.
The thing we both see is, due to family circumstances, and career circumstances (we are in a rural community), it would be at least a year before he finishes his next degree, and works full-time. We have looked at the numbers, and can afford a treatment centre if everything financial seems stable. His proposition is: get weekly addiction counselling in the next city over, with the promise to enter a rehab facility as soon as his schooling is complete. In the meantime, he needs to smoke pot in order to 'take the edge off'
My questions are: am I being manipulated? Does this sound positive or optimistic? How can I handle what I feel is swapping one addiction with another? I mean, we finally 'tapered down' both substances as best as we could, but 3 years ago, he was full tilt into whatever altered his consciousness, so I am worried that switching one out will just bring about the full-tilt behaviour. And, here is the ugly truth coming from me after all this time--I don't like the company of people who are stoned...I am pretty sharp, intellectual, and practical, so I am worried about how I cannot enjoy my partner's company. At least with the alcohol, sometimes there was remorse and I could feel needed. And regarding marijuana, I am a complete hypocrite--I am totally pro-legalization, I don't care about friends using it, I have used it socially--but the thought of my partner carrying on with what I associate with a terrible series of behaviours and consequences, some of which affected me directly, makes my anxiety overwhelming to the point where I feel sick.
To condense: can pot use, if one was a long-term addict (from 13, currently 35 years old) can they fight one addiction by using another substance? My fear is that he has always used both concurrently. Any thoughts in general?
Sorry that was so long-winded...it was really hard to get to the point of typing this.
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Hi! Welcome to the forum. As a former alcoholic myself I must say this whole situation is a big manipulation. Your partner is an alcoholic and pothead. The only solution is complete abstinence from both. Anything less is baloney. Needing to take the edge off is just an excuse to not deal with life on life's terms.
You "helping him" to control his consumption, monitoring his intake, switching from vodka to beer is just an elaborate way of keeping you hooked as his enabler and allowing him to have his cake and eat it too. It isn't your fault that he goes on benders when you are out of town. It is his fault. He is an alcoholic. No one is forcing him to drink. Why bother going to alcohol counseling while he is still drinking and or smoking. Total waste of time. If he truly wants to get sober and stay sober he needs to do whatever it takes. He can take a leave of absence from school and from work. People make those choices everyday. Becoming sober is one of the hardest things I ever did. It required complete dedication to not just not drinking but to reevaluating my life, my relationships, taking responsibility for my actions and addiction, and basically changing everything. Anything less and quitting would have been pointless.
You "helping him" to control his consumption, monitoring his intake, switching from vodka to beer is just an elaborate way of keeping you hooked as his enabler and allowing him to have his cake and eat it too. It isn't your fault that he goes on benders when you are out of town. It is his fault. He is an alcoholic. No one is forcing him to drink. Why bother going to alcohol counseling while he is still drinking and or smoking. Total waste of time. If he truly wants to get sober and stay sober he needs to do whatever it takes. He can take a leave of absence from school and from work. People make those choices everyday. Becoming sober is one of the hardest things I ever did. It required complete dedication to not just not drinking but to reevaluating my life, my relationships, taking responsibility for my actions and addiction, and basically changing everything. Anything less and quitting would have been pointless.
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"we finally 'tapered down' both substances as best as we could,"
This sentence fragment struck me ... when you say "we", you mean his drinking/smoking, right? The thing is, it's not your drinking/smoking, so anything you did to help him cut down is something he didn't do for himself. Which as I understand it is critical for someone who wants to beat an addiction. When I quit cigarettes, it wasn't because someone else hid them from me, or rationed them out to me, it was because I knew I had to.
Sorry, I think while he has a good point about the money and time needed to get the help he needs, if he really wants to quit, he'll find a way regardless.
This sentence fragment struck me ... when you say "we", you mean his drinking/smoking, right? The thing is, it's not your drinking/smoking, so anything you did to help him cut down is something he didn't do for himself. Which as I understand it is critical for someone who wants to beat an addiction. When I quit cigarettes, it wasn't because someone else hid them from me, or rationed them out to me, it was because I knew I had to.
Sorry, I think while he has a good point about the money and time needed to get the help he needs, if he really wants to quit, he'll find a way regardless.
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As an alcoholic my gut tells me "his proposition" is just an attempt to satisfy you so he can continue using. He may have tried almost everything but nothing is going to work if he doesn't want to stop.
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Getting sober isn't a "group effort"--it's something the addict has to do on his/her own, for his/her own reasons. I've been around alcoholism and recovery for over 30 years (first husband just celebrated 31 years sober, second husband went back to drinking after a near-death experience, and I'm sober over seven years), and I can tell you that all he is doing is stalling. He's talking a "plan," not engaging in action.
Who is financially supporting him during these "constant upgrades" to his education? He may seem to be "functioning" right now, but things are rapidly falling apart. He could have killed both of you, or some other innocent person, driving drunk. He gets arrested, loses his license for months/years, who will drive him around?
There are free recovery programs--Salvation Army has a pretty successful one, from what I understand. Sobriety takes complete focus and dedication. It's not like a hobby you'll pursue when you have the time and money for it.
Have you been to Al-Anon? I think it would be very helpful for you to get your focus off him and onto how this is affecting YOU.
Who is financially supporting him during these "constant upgrades" to his education? He may seem to be "functioning" right now, but things are rapidly falling apart. He could have killed both of you, or some other innocent person, driving drunk. He gets arrested, loses his license for months/years, who will drive him around?
There are free recovery programs--Salvation Army has a pretty successful one, from what I understand. Sobriety takes complete focus and dedication. It's not like a hobby you'll pursue when you have the time and money for it.
Have you been to Al-Anon? I think it would be very helpful for you to get your focus off him and onto how this is affecting YOU.
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On the other hand. If he is an alcoholic/pot addict, which to me he sounds like he isn't denying that at all, then to just stop cold turkey puts their bodies into withdrawals. Their ability to function in all aspects of life are pretty greatly diminished during this time. Just needing enough to keep them at bay "take the edge off", is his way of trying to keep on going with his work, life etc. until he can get into treatment.
He isn't asking you to let him keep on drinking/smoking. He knows he has a problem. He has tried multiple times, and openly wants to try again.
While normally I have little sympathy for the "excuses" and gas-lighting etc., sometimes I feel the need to remember, that this is a disease that they can't often get out of, without serious help. I don't think he wants to live like this. So he is trying to make the best of it he can under the current circumstances.
He isn't asking you to let him keep on drinking/smoking. He knows he has a problem. He has tried multiple times, and openly wants to try again.
While normally I have little sympathy for the "excuses" and gas-lighting etc., sometimes I feel the need to remember, that this is a disease that they can't often get out of, without serious help. I don't think he wants to live like this. So he is trying to make the best of it he can under the current circumstances.
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Originally Posted by Hangnbyathread 
On the other hand. If he is an alcoholic/pot addict, which to me he sounds like he isn't denying that at all, then to just stop cold turkey puts their bodies into withdrawals. Their ability to function in all aspects of life are pretty greatly diminished during this time. Just needing enough to keep them at bay "take the edge off", is his way of trying to keep on going with his work, life etc. until he can get into treatment.
He isn't asking you to let him keep on drinking/smoking. He knows he has a problem. He has tried multiple times, and openly wants to try again.
While normally I have little sympathy for the "excuses" and gas-lighting etc., sometimes I feel the need to remember, that this is a disease that they can't often get out of, without serious help. I don't think he wants to live like this. So he is trying to make the best of it he can under the current circumstances.
He isn't asking you to let him keep on drinking/smoking. He knows he has a problem. He has tried multiple times, and openly wants to try again.
While normally I have little sympathy for the "excuses" and gas-lighting etc., sometimes I feel the need to remember, that this is a disease that they can't often get out of, without serious help. I don't think he wants to live like this. So he is trying to make the best of it he can under the current circumstances.
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Originally Posted by happybeingme
You "helping him" to control his consumption, monitoring his intake, switching from vodka to beer is just an elaborate way of keeping you hooked as his enabler and allowing him to have his cake and eat it too. It isn't your fault that he goes on benders when you are out of town. It is his fault. He is an alcoholic. No one is forcing him to drink. Why bother going to alcohol counseling while he is still drinking and or smoking. Total waste of time. If he truly wants to get sober and stay sober he needs to do whatever it takes. He can take a leave of absence from school and from work. .
The leave of absence is honestly a sticky point...being a rural community, and being reimbursed for his current program, I don't disagree with him in putting off the timeline. Many times I have stated that I felt manipulated, and if he truly felt that he was trying to 'think out loud' as a means of processing his addiction, that he should see a therapist. It seems that we are now at that point, which is why I am cautiously optimistic.
The 'we' language that another poster pointed out--I knew I was going to catch it for that; I even thought about changing it, but left it in because that is how it worked.
The difference that I am struggling with is that my partner has honestly tried everything out there in terms of sobriety--has felt that he truly thought 'I am doing this for me' rather than in the throes of a new relationship, finding religion, etc...only to find a reason to drink/smoke pot/cigarettes in a couple days. He himself also used the quitting smoking analogy in terms of recognizing the problems but having to come to the conclusion by himself.
Another poster who brought up financials--that reflects the 'high functioning' curse...there is always someone worse off, my partner is a very hard worker, we both save...every month he tallies his statement for what he has wasted on alcohol.
The difference is, between in the past where I have known in the moment I was being manipulated, or looked back at what were subtle ways of having me be complicit in his drinking...he has never outright made a statement that honest, while coming to the conclusion of how he needs a treatment centre, that everything else did not work for him. In the past, whenever he discussed a desire for sobriety, it was ambiguous--'one day...' He has the usual fears--missing out, what no alcohol or drugs really means, has withdrawn from his group of friends who only ever encouraged the party lifestyle, is incredibly active and athletic...to get to this point after so much trial and error, following a very real risk in the vehicle, sabotaging his own success, without framing it around MY discussion, but his reflection and initiative...this is why I wonder if I can believe him this time.
Thank you guys for any/all of your thoughts.
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Welcome to SR! I'm in agreement with the others - this is quacking at it's finest, truly. Yes, you are definitely being manipulated. People get sober every single day under less than ideal circumstances - there is never a GOOD time to do it, except for Today. Today always works. It's up to him to make it a priority & seek solutions. As one of my favorite sayings goes; he doesn't have a problem so much as a solution he doesn't like.
If you haven't been around here long, definitely take some time to read through the sticky threads at the top of the forum..... there is SO much amazing info there!
One quick thought on this:
We have every right, on our side of the fence, to choose to NOT engage & not play into any kind of "forced codie" dynamic. I didn't always understand that & justified my reactions to his actions but in reality I almost ALWAYS have the option to drop the rope & act independently (short of situations involving abuse).
If you haven't been around here long, definitely take some time to read through the sticky threads at the top of the forum..... there is SO much amazing info there!
One quick thought on this:
This type of forced codependence has been reocurring
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How do you KNOW he has "honestly tried"? If he was stalling and manipulating, then AA or anything else isn't going to magically get him sober. If, indeed, he is truly READY to get sober, then AA might have a whole different impact.
The other thing is, there is no easy or painless way to get sober. Alcoholics drink because it DOES something for them. Learning other ways to live--happily sober--is an absolute requirement for lasting sobriety. And that involves going through an uncomfortable process, whether you're inpatient, outpatient, AA, or whatever.
The other thing is, there is no easy or painless way to get sober. Alcoholics drink because it DOES something for them. Learning other ways to live--happily sober--is an absolute requirement for lasting sobriety. And that involves going through an uncomfortable process, whether you're inpatient, outpatient, AA, or whatever.
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Originally Posted by spegs
The difference is, between in the past where I have known in the moment I was being manipulated, or looked back at what were subtle ways of having me be complicit in his drinking...he has never outright made a statement that honest, while coming to the conclusion of how he needs a treatment centre, that everything else did not work for him. In the past, whenever he discussed a desire for sobriety, it was ambiguous--'one day...' He has the usual fears--missing out, what no alcohol or drugs really means, has withdrawn from his group of friends who only ever encouraged the party lifestyle, is incredibly active and athletic...to get to this point after so much trial and error, following a very real risk in the vehicle, sabotaging his own success, without framing it around MY discussion, but his reflection and initiative...this is why I wonder if I can believe him this time.
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Originally Posted by LexieCat
How do you KNOW he has "honestly tried"? If he was stalling and manipulating, then AA or anything else isn't going to magically get him sober. If, indeed, he is truly READY to get sober, then AA might have a whole different impact.
The 'tapering' issue--I even frame it to others as "I know it sounds crazy but this made a difference..." As he would drink fireball just as fast as lite beer, it was the difference between anger and passing out, and keeping relative awareness. I do recognize my role in that, but as I said, I was grasping at anything that would reduce the potential for harm.
Again, my point with him is if there is a recognition and awareness that really and truly when his program is complete, and we are down to just a puff here and there, with a commitment to weekly therapy, maybe the responsibility and recognition piece would fall into place? An addictions therapist could work on that, plus goal-setting.
Like I said, I am so torn in wanting to believe him, and feeling like this is another way of getting me to comply--but this has also been the most candid and concrete that he has ever been.
Thank you for your responses. They are really mirroring my own thoughts.
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http://www.soberrecovery.com/forums/...ed-denial.html
Please read this and see if you spot your addiction. Best of luck to you.
I hope you decide to treat yourself and your life to a real companion,
you deserve no less.
Please read this and see if you spot your addiction. Best of luck to you.
I hope you decide to treat yourself and your life to a real companion,
you deserve no less.
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Did he work the AA program, or was he counting on going to meetings and distracting himself to keep him sober? Was he smoking pot to "take the edge off" during that time?
My own theory, having known hundreds of alcoholics in various stages of drinking or recovery, is that "moments of clarity"--where you realize what needs to happen and have a willingness to do what it takes--have a pretty short shelf-life. What typically happens is if you don't act on it IMMEDIATELY, the window tends to close and it could be months or years (if ever) before that window opens again.
All he is doing is projecting a plan for sometime in the indeterminate future. That's something alcoholics do ALL THE TIME. It's right up there with, "I really should lose these 25 pounds, I'll make that my New Year's resolution--for next year."
He's not scared for his life--if he were, he'd be doing something NOW. Personally, I wouldn't pin any hopes on it.
My own theory, having known hundreds of alcoholics in various stages of drinking or recovery, is that "moments of clarity"--where you realize what needs to happen and have a willingness to do what it takes--have a pretty short shelf-life. What typically happens is if you don't act on it IMMEDIATELY, the window tends to close and it could be months or years (if ever) before that window opens again.
All he is doing is projecting a plan for sometime in the indeterminate future. That's something alcoholics do ALL THE TIME. It's right up there with, "I really should lose these 25 pounds, I'll make that my New Year's resolution--for next year."
He's not scared for his life--if he were, he'd be doing something NOW. Personally, I wouldn't pin any hopes on it.
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I think sometimes, being "wildly intelligent" can be even more of a hindrance to working a recovery program and having it stick. In whatever program or course of therapy you and he choose (and I'm definitely recommending that you start work on your own recovery from co-dependence, forced or not) one of the key pieces to understand and really embrace is surrendering to the idea that you don't really have any kind of control over this disease. You aren't smarter than it. You can't logic your way out of it. His actions and manipulations don't come from any "better" place than anyone else simply because he is higher functioning or has multiple degrees. And you especially will need to let go of the idea that you have any kind of control over him or his program too!
This was so hard for me to accept. I have always prided myself on my intelligence and being able to figure out a way out of any problem. I have always taken control of my life and trusted in myself and my own logic over anything else. Self-help and therapy never really worked for me in the past because I could completely see what the problem was, what the steps were to fix it, but felt like, since I knew what was going on "behind the curtain" or I knew what made it tick, I couldn't fully embrace the program because I couldn't just blindly follow the path like other people could. Wow, that makes me sound like a pompous a$$!
It took getting to my own personal rock-bottom and really, truly surrendering to the concept that I am not smarter than this disease. I am not in control. I can't logic my way through. It doesn't matter if I am "smarter" than anyone else because we are all walking our own paths, and everyone's path is just as valuable as anyone else's. My need for control and need to be "right" has been as much of a problem for me as my partner's addictions have been for her.
I hope that when he is ready, your partner will be able to embrace this truth as well!
This was so hard for me to accept. I have always prided myself on my intelligence and being able to figure out a way out of any problem. I have always taken control of my life and trusted in myself and my own logic over anything else. Self-help and therapy never really worked for me in the past because I could completely see what the problem was, what the steps were to fix it, but felt like, since I knew what was going on "behind the curtain" or I knew what made it tick, I couldn't fully embrace the program because I couldn't just blindly follow the path like other people could. Wow, that makes me sound like a pompous a$$!
It took getting to my own personal rock-bottom and really, truly surrendering to the concept that I am not smarter than this disease. I am not in control. I can't logic my way through. It doesn't matter if I am "smarter" than anyone else because we are all walking our own paths, and everyone's path is just as valuable as anyone else's. My need for control and need to be "right" has been as much of a problem for me as my partner's addictions have been for her.
I hope that when he is ready, your partner will be able to embrace this truth as well!
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Spegs... I too have a high functioning, very smart "intelllectual" type of A. So I understand all the reasoning that goes on. It was 6 months from the first mention of in patient rehab, until he finally left for treatment. I bring thus ip, because getting a bed in a facility is a whole other process, at least in his case it was. I dont know where you live, but where I am, it was a very lengthy and stressful process, dealing with insurance and who would take him and who wouldn't and how much would be covered, etc. I am wondering
if you could gage his commitment by getting the process started early? I have read of people reserving beds in treatment centers up to a month in advance. Just an idea, but if he is serious, he might be willing to get the ball rolling, and have a date set and the bed lined up.
if you could gage his commitment by getting the process started early? I have read of people reserving beds in treatment centers up to a month in advance. Just an idea, but if he is serious, he might be willing to get the ball rolling, and have a date set and the bed lined up.
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Originally Posted by findingme26
I think sometimes, being "wildly intelligent" can be even more of a hindrance to working a recovery program and having it stick. In whatever program or course of therapy you and he choose (and I'm definitely recommending that you start work on your own recovery from co-dependence, forced or not) one of the key pieces to understand and really embrace is surrendering to the idea that you don't really have any kind of control over this disease. You aren't smarter than it. You can't logic your way out of it. His actions and manipulations don't come from any "better" place than anyone else simply because he is higher functioning or has multiple degrees. And you especially will need to let go of the idea that you have any kind of control over him or his program too!
This was so hard for me to accept. I have always prided myself on my intelligence and being able to figure out a way out of any problem. I have always taken control of my life and trusted in myself and my own logic over anything else. Self-help and therapy never really worked for me in the past because I could completely see what the problem was, what the steps were to fix it, but felt like, since I knew what was going on "behind the curtain" or I knew what made it tick, I couldn't fully embrace the program because I couldn't just blindly follow the path like other people could. Wow, that makes me sound like a pompous a$$!
It took getting to my own personal rock-bottom and really, truly surrendering to the concept that I am not smarter than this disease. I am not in control. I can't logic my way through. It doesn't matter if I am "smarter" than anyone else because we are all walking our own paths, and everyone's path is just as valuable as anyone else's. My need for control and need to be "right" has been as much of a problem for me as my partner's addictions have been for her.
I hope that when he is ready, your partner will be able to embrace this truth as well!
This was so hard for me to accept. I have always prided myself on my intelligence and being able to figure out a way out of any problem. I have always taken control of my life and trusted in myself and my own logic over anything else. Self-help and therapy never really worked for me in the past because I could completely see what the problem was, what the steps were to fix it, but felt like, since I knew what was going on "behind the curtain" or I knew what made it tick, I couldn't fully embrace the program because I couldn't just blindly follow the path like other people could. Wow, that makes me sound like a pompous a$$!
It took getting to my own personal rock-bottom and really, truly surrendering to the concept that I am not smarter than this disease. I am not in control. I can't logic my way through. It doesn't matter if I am "smarter" than anyone else because we are all walking our own paths, and everyone's path is just as valuable as anyone else's. My need for control and need to be "right" has been as much of a problem for me as my partner's addictions have been for her.
I hope that when he is ready, your partner will be able to embrace this truth as well!
I do know I need to address my own role in this, but always thought it would be in conjunction with treatment.
The prior poster mentioning AA meetings while distracting...yes that was exactly what it was. "white knuckling" it in a way.
The codependence thread...it's kind of the same thing, right--read and understand all the literature, wince as you recognize yourself, but then try to think around the problem when you want the solution you hope to see.
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Originally Posted by findingme26
I think sometimes, being "wildly intelligent" can be even more of a hindrance to working a recovery program and having it stick.
) but essentially they are finding that some people are literally hardwired to be more resistant to spirituality which, they propose, is at least to some degree, a necessary part of a healthy recovery & keeping ongoing sobriety. They discussed it much the same we do here - doesn't matter if you connect to nature, religion, a cardboard cutout of a lizard. It's the ability to defer to something, to some degree, outside of yourself & your own intelligence & life experiences.
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Yup, I always thought AA was FANTASTIC--for other people. Even as I saw myself slipping ever further into the bottle, I had this sort of belief in my own intellectual superiority--that I was simply smart enough to pull the plug before I got to "addiction"--and even if I crossed the line, well, it would just be a matter of deciding I wouldn't do it any more--after all, I'm a smart person!
It doesn't work that way. I often hear it said nobody's too dumb to "get" the AA program, but it's certainly possible to be too smart to.
It doesn't work that way. I often hear it said nobody's too dumb to "get" the AA program, but it's certainly possible to be too smart to.
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Join Date: Dec 2015
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Originally Posted by spegs
Jeez...I can't tell if you're talking about me or him, that was all so dead-on.
I do know I need to address my own role in this, but always thought it would be in conjunction with treatment.
The codependence thread...it's kind of the same thing, right--read and understand all the literature, wince as you recognize yourself, but then try to think around the problem when you want the solution you hope to see.
I do know I need to address my own role in this, but always thought it would be in conjunction with treatment.
The codependence thread...it's kind of the same thing, right--read and understand all the literature, wince as you recognize yourself, but then try to think around the problem when you want the solution you hope to see.
I'm not the one with the addiction in my relationship, but it was eye opening to see that my struggles with control and co-dependence were just as much a sickness for me as her addictions are for her. I've been going to Al-Anon, posting here, and reading as much as I can on co-dependence. I don't feel like I'm generally co-dependent in other aspects of my life, but I definitely am where my partner is concerned. And even if I wouldn't classify my issues as full co-dependence all the time, control over myself and others is a huge problem area for me.
I still struggle with the "higher power" aspect of Al-Anon (which speaker was that, FireSprite? That is such a true issue for me!) but just realizing that there are truths and paths outside myself and my own experiences and maybe I'm not always the authority on the best way to handle something, has been a major shift for me.
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