I have no idea what else to do but type here
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Join Date: Feb 2010
Posts: 524
I have no idea what else to do but type here
I feel so far removed from a normal life. I know I am in the worst part of this (I think) I know it will get better but I feel so f*d up right now.
I got a call from the realtor yesterday and he said this particular place was available. When did I want to move - immediately or in 10 days? I thought I would throw up.
I was thinking August 1st, August 30th something a little less panicky. But I stressed to him how I need to get out and he really went working on this for me so I feel responsible to oblige.
I called my mother and said "what do I do?" she said go. She is willing to pay my rent for a while so I can get a grip. I said, but Mom I had the divorce papers written up as sell split and go - Now I am going before sell/split? She said well, you have the opportunity, it's only going to get worse, or not change at all, this could take forever, it could be a year or two before that house sells and he's not going to jump on the projects.
I told him and he took it as a betrayal. I just got done telling him we would sell.split and go (its not like he was cooperative if you have been following my saga). And the next day(s) I tell him I out. He wants to know how I plan on supporting two households. I didn't have an answer. Yes he works full time and gets some overtime
He got quacky but he is now in a more weepy state. He is asking me what he is supposed to do (almost in a pathetic sad way) - he has no means, no resources, I just got done in the last few days assuring him I wasn't going to screw him (while he went on and on that i was going to screw him)
We spent the next hour or so communicating. Then I spent the next whatever counseling him. You are going to be ok, it will be ok, you will thank me for this someday. Why don't you do this - why don't you do that - your parents will help you -
Then it became all about him. Things never work out for him. he fails at everything. He is more suicidal every day, he's picturing the walls covered in red as they drag his body out. When this is all over he's going to sit with a bottle of jack. its always been the wrong timing for him. Do I think he likes being like this he asks...I have no idea what it's like for him. He has no idea how to handle his emotions because he has drowned them in alcohol for 20 years he says.
THIS is what always sucked me back in - I was always the reasonable positive good attitude do what you have to do, person and he was always the victim of life.
I suggested different things for him and none of them were good ideas. He has nothing but he won't walk away from the house. He doesn't want to live with his parents, but he won't cash in his 401k. He was just looking at a foreclosure property and thinks he can get it for 14K after the house sells (? - no chance) - but he has no time to fix the house. But he won't walk away from the house. But me - I just "cut and run" that has always been my style he said.
I think it is very rude and wrong of me to have decided to sell.split.go and now I leave. When I went away for the weekend the family told me -call realtor guy and get out - so I did and now here i sit wondering if I'm evil and if I am falling away from my moral code.
he said I am sticking him with everything. He's going to be "stuck" doing everything. He can't think for himself and I found myself thinking for him last night.
I have been so detached from him - not engaging - putting my shield up, doing what I have to do, almost felt empowered. Last night I feel like I entered a very dangerous emotional trap with him. It was like old times. Sitting on the couch listening to him cry the blues and me trying to help him. My god for a second I thought to myself "just stay with me until you find a place" HOW RIDICULOUS.
I'm doing everything and getting blamed for everything. I'm trying to do right while being accused of doing wrong. and this isn't even the horrible marriage - this is the horrible divorce!
Confused.
I got a call from the realtor yesterday and he said this particular place was available. When did I want to move - immediately or in 10 days? I thought I would throw up.
I was thinking August 1st, August 30th something a little less panicky. But I stressed to him how I need to get out and he really went working on this for me so I feel responsible to oblige.
I called my mother and said "what do I do?" she said go. She is willing to pay my rent for a while so I can get a grip. I said, but Mom I had the divorce papers written up as sell split and go - Now I am going before sell/split? She said well, you have the opportunity, it's only going to get worse, or not change at all, this could take forever, it could be a year or two before that house sells and he's not going to jump on the projects.
I told him and he took it as a betrayal. I just got done telling him we would sell.split and go (its not like he was cooperative if you have been following my saga). And the next day(s) I tell him I out. He wants to know how I plan on supporting two households. I didn't have an answer. Yes he works full time and gets some overtime
He got quacky but he is now in a more weepy state. He is asking me what he is supposed to do (almost in a pathetic sad way) - he has no means, no resources, I just got done in the last few days assuring him I wasn't going to screw him (while he went on and on that i was going to screw him)
We spent the next hour or so communicating. Then I spent the next whatever counseling him. You are going to be ok, it will be ok, you will thank me for this someday. Why don't you do this - why don't you do that - your parents will help you -
Then it became all about him. Things never work out for him. he fails at everything. He is more suicidal every day, he's picturing the walls covered in red as they drag his body out. When this is all over he's going to sit with a bottle of jack. its always been the wrong timing for him. Do I think he likes being like this he asks...I have no idea what it's like for him. He has no idea how to handle his emotions because he has drowned them in alcohol for 20 years he says.
THIS is what always sucked me back in - I was always the reasonable positive good attitude do what you have to do, person and he was always the victim of life.
I suggested different things for him and none of them were good ideas. He has nothing but he won't walk away from the house. He doesn't want to live with his parents, but he won't cash in his 401k. He was just looking at a foreclosure property and thinks he can get it for 14K after the house sells (? - no chance) - but he has no time to fix the house. But he won't walk away from the house. But me - I just "cut and run" that has always been my style he said.
I think it is very rude and wrong of me to have decided to sell.split.go and now I leave. When I went away for the weekend the family told me -call realtor guy and get out - so I did and now here i sit wondering if I'm evil and if I am falling away from my moral code.
he said I am sticking him with everything. He's going to be "stuck" doing everything. He can't think for himself and I found myself thinking for him last night.
I have been so detached from him - not engaging - putting my shield up, doing what I have to do, almost felt empowered. Last night I feel like I entered a very dangerous emotional trap with him. It was like old times. Sitting on the couch listening to him cry the blues and me trying to help him. My god for a second I thought to myself "just stay with me until you find a place" HOW RIDICULOUS.
I'm doing everything and getting blamed for everything. I'm trying to do right while being accused of doing wrong. and this isn't even the horrible marriage - this is the horrible divorce!
Confused.
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Join Date: May 2014
Location: Philly burbs, NJ
Posts: 99
One of the great things about this forum is how reading other people's sagas can help put your own in perspective. In turn, other people can help you get a grip on things, if you can see the truth in what they're saying.
When I read your story, it's completely clear to me that you're making the right decisions (to leave) and that he's just quacking his head off while you try and solve all his problems for him. So what if you just told him you'd stay until the house was sold and now you're changing your mind? Circumstances changed-- a place to move into came up quickly. How many times has he changed his mind on YOU or not done what he said?
You said he has a job-- so why is he whining about not having any resources?
Your story helps me see my own more clearly too--because I do the same thing you do, worry about the RAH instead of about myself. We do this because we're codependents and the cycle of long ingrained behavior is really hard to break.
Stop worrying about him and his feelings and his crying and his turning the tables on you to make it all sound like it's your fault. Put yourself and your kids first, he will have to take care of himself. Or not.
I'm trying to do the same.
When I read your story, it's completely clear to me that you're making the right decisions (to leave) and that he's just quacking his head off while you try and solve all his problems for him. So what if you just told him you'd stay until the house was sold and now you're changing your mind? Circumstances changed-- a place to move into came up quickly. How many times has he changed his mind on YOU or not done what he said?
You said he has a job-- so why is he whining about not having any resources?
Your story helps me see my own more clearly too--because I do the same thing you do, worry about the RAH instead of about myself. We do this because we're codependents and the cycle of long ingrained behavior is really hard to break.
Stop worrying about him and his feelings and his crying and his turning the tables on you to make it all sound like it's your fault. Put yourself and your kids first, he will have to take care of himself. Or not.
I'm trying to do the same.
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Join Date: Aug 2011
Posts: 16,246
meggem....if "I'm doing everything and getting blamed for everything".....how is this falling away from your moral code?? Personally, I don't think it is.
Did you DELIBERATELY lie to him with intent to deceive and bring harm to him????? It looks to me like you have bent over backwards in sympathy and accomodation to him.
Did you impulsively, one day, say: I think I will get a divorce with the sole purpose and fun of hurting him. I dont' think so!!!!!
This is real life....and reality sometimes interferes with our well laid plans! Whether we like it or not...and survival dictates that we have to change our plans, sometimes, to accomodate REALITY.
Have you ever heard that "The best laid plans of mice and men will often go astray".?
Has he ever heard that?......if not...maybe someone needs to clue him in.
This is a divorce....and, in a divorce, it is extremely rare that everyone gets everything to go as smoothly as they want.
meggem, he is playing his usual role of dependent victim. He wants what he wants....and, frankly, we all do.....BUT alcoholism and a toxic relationship has created the present situation....and, this is the consequence.
He is probably going to kick and wiggle and cry and try to manipulate you by pushing every button that he can to get you to abort this whole thing.
I've gotta say that your mother sounds like a voice of reason, here---and, you know that she has your welfare at heart. meggem...as I have had to do...you need to begin growing a thick rhino skin...to protect yourself from the machinations and crying tantrums of grown toddlers.
This stuff is hard. But, there comes a point when you have got to do what you have got to do.
You WILL get through this.......
dandylion
Did you DELIBERATELY lie to him with intent to deceive and bring harm to him????? It looks to me like you have bent over backwards in sympathy and accomodation to him.
Did you impulsively, one day, say: I think I will get a divorce with the sole purpose and fun of hurting him. I dont' think so!!!!!
This is real life....and reality sometimes interferes with our well laid plans! Whether we like it or not...and survival dictates that we have to change our plans, sometimes, to accomodate REALITY.
Have you ever heard that "The best laid plans of mice and men will often go astray".?
Has he ever heard that?......if not...maybe someone needs to clue him in.
This is a divorce....and, in a divorce, it is extremely rare that everyone gets everything to go as smoothly as they want.
meggem, he is playing his usual role of dependent victim. He wants what he wants....and, frankly, we all do.....BUT alcoholism and a toxic relationship has created the present situation....and, this is the consequence.
He is probably going to kick and wiggle and cry and try to manipulate you by pushing every button that he can to get you to abort this whole thing.
I've gotta say that your mother sounds like a voice of reason, here---and, you know that she has your welfare at heart. meggem...as I have had to do...you need to begin growing a thick rhino skin...to protect yourself from the machinations and crying tantrums of grown toddlers.
This stuff is hard. But, there comes a point when you have got to do what you have got to do.
You WILL get through this.......
dandylion
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Join Date: Sep 2012
Location: atlanta, ga
Posts: 3,581
Yeah lots of quacking.
I think you need to talk to your attorney on how to proceed. You need to sit down and look at your finances. Before you make a move be sure you know what you are getting yourself into or out of.
Normally I would just say get the hell out and screw him - however, you need to be apprised of the divorce laws in your state regarding property. Sometimes if someone leaves the other person can file for abandonment. I have no idea if that is applicable to your situation.
The only point your STBXAH that is valid is "how are we going to afford two households"? How are you? is your name on the mortgage of this property? Can you pay the mortgage yourself if so? Because I believe the STBX is going to do whatever he can to make things difficult for you and might go to the extreme in cutting off monies to you (apparently he already has). He is not going to fix up the house - its not happening. He does not want this divorce so you might as well reconcile that and do it and get it on the market.
Most states are equitable distribution so that 401k that he won't cash in - well half of it belongs to you. May be better that he not touch it for now until you guys figure out a settlement.
I think it would be miserable to live with someone I was divorcing I can't think of anything I would rather not do. I agree with your parents that you should move out yet I must say again please run all this by your attorney first. Divorces are financially tough be sure to do what you can to protect yourself.
I think you need to talk to your attorney on how to proceed. You need to sit down and look at your finances. Before you make a move be sure you know what you are getting yourself into or out of.
Normally I would just say get the hell out and screw him - however, you need to be apprised of the divorce laws in your state regarding property. Sometimes if someone leaves the other person can file for abandonment. I have no idea if that is applicable to your situation.
The only point your STBXAH that is valid is "how are we going to afford two households"? How are you? is your name on the mortgage of this property? Can you pay the mortgage yourself if so? Because I believe the STBX is going to do whatever he can to make things difficult for you and might go to the extreme in cutting off monies to you (apparently he already has). He is not going to fix up the house - its not happening. He does not want this divorce so you might as well reconcile that and do it and get it on the market.
Most states are equitable distribution so that 401k that he won't cash in - well half of it belongs to you. May be better that he not touch it for now until you guys figure out a settlement.
I think it would be miserable to live with someone I was divorcing I can't think of anything I would rather not do. I agree with your parents that you should move out yet I must say again please run all this by your attorney first. Divorces are financially tough be sure to do what you can to protect yourself.
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Join Date: Sep 2013
Location: Mid-Atlantic
Posts: 551
Meggem, I've been following your story and I wanted to let you know that I think that you're brave, insightful, sensitive, honorable, and kind . . . but it's irrelevant what I think . . . it's what you think of yourself. You KNOW who you are, and you don't need anybody (me, your AH) to characterize you.
Your AH's quacking is coming from a place of fear. He has been running the show up until now, and he's not responding well to the very appropriate boundaries that you've set. It probably hasn't seemed real to him, but now that it does, he's pulling out all stops, vacillating from pathetic to anger. More than anything, he's going to paint himself as the wronged party, the victim, and he's going to frame you as the villain. There's not one bit of self-awareness regarding his role in bringing you both to this place.
Let's be real. This situation is not easy for you, but you are doing it. Unlike him, you aren't waxing on about how you've been victimized, you aren't receiving constant reassurance, nobody is solving your problems . . why should HE get that?
It's not your job to make his life good. He is a grown man, working full time, and fully capable of making his own plan/following it. As for the house, he has NOT done his part--he hasn't been making the repairs and he hasn't been civil to you (to be honest, he has been downright verbally abusive, especially on your birthday).
Breathe. Don't respond or react. Move into your new place and allow yourself to manage this journey without his toxic voice in your ear, preying on your self-doubt (he knows your fears, knows your hot buttons, and will continue to capitalize on them).
You know that your decisions have come from a very honorable place. He will never be willing to see that because he wanted the status quo. Time to be as sensitive to your own needs as you have been to his.
You're doing super well. Best of luck to you.
Your AH's quacking is coming from a place of fear. He has been running the show up until now, and he's not responding well to the very appropriate boundaries that you've set. It probably hasn't seemed real to him, but now that it does, he's pulling out all stops, vacillating from pathetic to anger. More than anything, he's going to paint himself as the wronged party, the victim, and he's going to frame you as the villain. There's not one bit of self-awareness regarding his role in bringing you both to this place.
Let's be real. This situation is not easy for you, but you are doing it. Unlike him, you aren't waxing on about how you've been victimized, you aren't receiving constant reassurance, nobody is solving your problems . . why should HE get that?
It's not your job to make his life good. He is a grown man, working full time, and fully capable of making his own plan/following it. As for the house, he has NOT done his part--he hasn't been making the repairs and he hasn't been civil to you (to be honest, he has been downright verbally abusive, especially on your birthday).
Breathe. Don't respond or react. Move into your new place and allow yourself to manage this journey without his toxic voice in your ear, preying on your self-doubt (he knows your fears, knows your hot buttons, and will continue to capitalize on them).
You know that your decisions have come from a very honorable place. He will never be willing to see that because he wanted the status quo. Time to be as sensitive to your own needs as you have been to his.
You're doing super well. Best of luck to you.
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Join Date: Aug 2011
Posts: 16,246
YES......what Bullfrog just said. This is the time to navigate with your brain. Lokk where your heart has gotten you.......
I'm not trying to dis the heart.......but, there is a time and place for everything...and this is definitely brain time.......
(as opposed to Hammer Time, of course)...LOL...
dandylion
I'm not trying to dis the heart.......but, there is a time and place for everything...and this is definitely brain time.......
(as opposed to Hammer Time, of course)...LOL...
dandylion
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Join Date: Aug 2012
Location: Chicago
Posts: 5,450
Sometimes it is ONLY with space and separation that we find the perspective to see our situation for what it really is, and to discover what is really important to us. And sometimes we have to force that space and separation before we feel ready, because there is opportunity and we feel overwhelmed by current circumstances.
It's your responsibility to take care of you. It's his responsibility to take care of him. You're allowed to change your mind, change your plans, and to acknowledge that what was right for you yesterday isn't right for you today. It's never going to FEEL great while you are living smack dab in the middle of so much emotion and drama.
It's your responsibility to take care of you. It's his responsibility to take care of him. You're allowed to change your mind, change your plans, and to acknowledge that what was right for you yesterday isn't right for you today. It's never going to FEEL great while you are living smack dab in the middle of so much emotion and drama.
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Join Date: Jul 2010
Posts: 13,497
meggem,
If he is not wanting to cash in his 401K, then he is thinking of the future.
He will be ok.
just do what you need to do, and let him worry about his self... I believe it will be easier for him, since he has the 401 to fall back on if neccessary.
some of us have had to do that. I needed to borrow on mine to fix my truck... he can use his too, so do not feel like you have to help him!
If he is not wanting to cash in his 401K, then he is thinking of the future.
He will be ok.
just do what you need to do, and let him worry about his self... I believe it will be easier for him, since he has the 401 to fall back on if neccessary.
some of us have had to do that. I needed to borrow on mine to fix my truck... he can use his too, so do not feel like you have to help him!
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Join Date: Oct 2013
Posts: 11,434
You can't keep living with this, nor should your children.
I think running it by a lawyer is wise, and then get your family and a moving truck and make it happen.
He has put himself in this position, not you.
As others have said, it is getting real and he doesn't like that there are consequences to his addiction. But there are.
As an addict myself I knew this, but didn't want to see it
until it got real for me too. Then I changed.
Maybe he will too, but not as long as he doesn't have to if you keep being responsible for everything.
Let it, and his quacking go.
Grow the rhino skin, and get on with your life and maybe he will start taking charge of his own.
I think running it by a lawyer is wise, and then get your family and a moving truck and make it happen.
He has put himself in this position, not you.
As others have said, it is getting real and he doesn't like that there are consequences to his addiction. But there are.
As an addict myself I knew this, but didn't want to see it
until it got real for me too. Then I changed.
Maybe he will too, but not as long as he doesn't have to if you keep being responsible for everything.
Let it, and his quacking go.
Grow the rhino skin, and get on with your life and maybe he will start taking charge of his own.
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Join Date: Oct 2009
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My xah was furious cos we agreed a sell, split go but I couldn't do it in the end. I had to have some space from him. We are not even at sell stage and I cannot stand being in the same room as him so I asked him to leave given I a m the carer for our disabled sons. He refused saying I'd gone back on our agreement. He got really, really angry. I pointed out he'd gone back on his no booze agreement too. Upshot is he's going, with bad grace and much quaking about how awful it will be, he's no money, job or friends, he's cut back, why can't I see he's changed blah, blah, blah. but he is going. I think he's looking forward to it now cos he's moving in with like minded people who will not question what he drinks.
I needed to escape for my own sanity. Opened ended when/if we sell was destroying me. It's too hard. I needed to heal and move on, not be trapped in the situation cos HE can't grow up and face his own problems. I'd go pronto and don't look back xx
I needed to escape for my own sanity. Opened ended when/if we sell was destroying me. It's too hard. I needed to heal and move on, not be trapped in the situation cos HE can't grow up and face his own problems. I'd go pronto and don't look back xx
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Join Date: Apr 2013
Posts: 494
He is asking me what he is supposed to do (almost in a pathetic sad way)
P.S. He is likely going to blame you for everything no matter WHAT you do. In my experience.
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Join Date: Jun 2008
Posts: 478
oh miss meggem - I soooo feel for you. As you well know I haven't been through this, however what I can tell you is that this past November things really came to a head in our house. The holidays were very awkward, and by the time January came I had my ducks in a row to leave. He tried to call my bluff as I'd done before, but this time was different. I had a place to go. I had submitted my application and was ready to move into the new place in about two weeks. He flipped. (We're not married, but common law applies in our state and the mortgage is ONLY in his name) He can't afford it on his own. He begged and pleaded, all the promises of change. All the same things I heard before. But I had so much fear, about whether I was doing the right thing, was it really that bad, how much worse would I feel.. just everything, the confusion.. I thought I would puke.
You know what I did, I cancelled the application, told the lady I wouldn't be moving after all. Promised him I'd give it a month and re-evaluate. I lost every last bit of momentum I had. Here we are 6 months later and guess what? Surprise, surprise, not a damn thing has changed, we're still having the same problems, same arguments and we're both still living the same routine. The only thing that's different is.. I'm not allowed to bring up what happened in Nov, because that's just drudging up the past and apparently had no basis to the argument now.
That my dear.. was the one of the worst mistakes I ever made. I had it, the way out. I caved, and now I'm still miserable fighting the same fight. It's hard, but I believe in you. I think you can do this. You are not responsible for taking care of him anymore.. and never should have been in the first place. Many other have very eloquently explained that in better ways than I can. But I for one.. can't wait to hear your stories of the peace in your new home, how you did something fun with the kids and no one was there to bring the mood down. To see you grow and enjoy all the beautiful things life has to offer, and tell even through the words on a computer screen that you're wearing a big beautiful smile on your face.
Hugs!!!
You know what I did, I cancelled the application, told the lady I wouldn't be moving after all. Promised him I'd give it a month and re-evaluate. I lost every last bit of momentum I had. Here we are 6 months later and guess what? Surprise, surprise, not a damn thing has changed, we're still having the same problems, same arguments and we're both still living the same routine. The only thing that's different is.. I'm not allowed to bring up what happened in Nov, because that's just drudging up the past and apparently had no basis to the argument now.
That my dear.. was the one of the worst mistakes I ever made. I had it, the way out. I caved, and now I'm still miserable fighting the same fight. It's hard, but I believe in you. I think you can do this. You are not responsible for taking care of him anymore.. and never should have been in the first place. Many other have very eloquently explained that in better ways than I can. But I for one.. can't wait to hear your stories of the peace in your new home, how you did something fun with the kids and no one was there to bring the mood down. To see you grow and enjoy all the beautiful things life has to offer, and tell even through the words on a computer screen that you're wearing a big beautiful smile on your face.
Hugs!!!
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Join Date: May 2010
Location: USA
Posts: 13,560
Honey, this is what they do in the beginning. It's all manipulation to make you feel just as you do. Why are you putting him first AGAIN?? Why are you having this sort of communication with him?
Say what you have to say and move on. The more you listen to his BS the more BS he is going to dish out to try to manipulate you.
Move out. The house will sell when it sells. Yes, he is going to have to man up. He is not a child, let him figure himself out.
Be strong, you can do this!
Say what you have to say and move on. The more you listen to his BS the more BS he is going to dish out to try to manipulate you.
Move out. The house will sell when it sells. Yes, he is going to have to man up. He is not a child, let him figure himself out.
Be strong, you can do this!
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Join Date: Jul 2006
Location: sitting down and facing front
Posts: 170
Boo bloody hoo to him. What he's saying to you is he's tried absolutely nothing to save the relationship, and now he doesn't know what to do (paraphrased from one of my favourite Simpsons quotes). Sounds like the sell, split, go (if I'm interpreting that correctly) was an excuse for him to drag his feet on step one so that two and three never get to happen.
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Thread Starter
Join Date: Feb 2010
Posts: 524
Deep Breath... Ok....You guys are great. Here is my takeway.
1. Suck it up.
2. Don't miss out on your chance to get out - just go.
3. Let him take care of himself.
4. Check with the lawyer
5. Chances are I might never feel "ready"
6. Follow my brain.
7. Things changed, oh well.
Ok, I am filling out the application this afternoon. I left a message with the lawyer and I'm staying the course.
I don't think I would be this far without you guys. Honestly.
1. Suck it up.
2. Don't miss out on your chance to get out - just go.
3. Let him take care of himself.
4. Check with the lawyer
5. Chances are I might never feel "ready"
6. Follow my brain.
7. Things changed, oh well.
Ok, I am filling out the application this afternoon. I left a message with the lawyer and I'm staying the course.
I don't think I would be this far without you guys. Honestly.
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Join Date: May 2014
Location: Philly burbs, NJ
Posts: 99
I read this somewhere else, but I think it applies here too. We're like birds locked in a cage. Sometimes the door opens, and it's our chance to get out. But we have to be brave enough to fly out of the cage, because the door will shut eventually and may never open again.
I'm struggling with this right now, too; my RAH has moved out and I'll need to decide within the next year whether or not it will be permanent. After44 years, it's not easy to leave the cage. I had a chance 7 years ago and I blew it, and I don't want to miss the open door this time.
I'm struggling with this right now, too; my RAH has moved out and I'll need to decide within the next year whether or not it will be permanent. After44 years, it's not easy to leave the cage. I had a chance 7 years ago and I blew it, and I don't want to miss the open door this time.
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