NewbieJ

My AH (I suspect he is A, as he says himself "one is one too many and one more is never enough) has begun to drink more, and will admit to being depressed because he doesn't have certain things in life - a house, children. We don't have children because I'm afraid to at this point, due to his abuse, which is now emotional as well as verbal, and sometimes physical.

That's the background. Anyhow, now he is completely pushing me away or shutting me out. He doesn't touch me, hold me, hug me, kiss me, smile at me, rub my arm, do anything. MAYBE if I'm say, rubbing his sore knee, he'll stroke my back. But other than that there is no affection. And barely any attention - he rarely talks to me unless he needs something, or if I ask a question. He spends most of his time doing solitary hobbies or watching television. At night after work, he goes straight for his wine that he just bought on the way home, everyday.

I am attending al-anon but am feeling incredibly unloved. On our anniversary (third wedding, 14th year together) last week, as well as during other fights resulting from small seemingly "nothing" things that set him off, that he wants a divorce, he hates me, he hates his life, he hates everything about his life. He stopped wearing his wedding ring (which ironically is engraved, "All can be lost but us" after he lost his first one in a river).

Just wondering if anyone else has gone through this. I am trying to remain loving, someone just told me "God cannot exist in hate." The god of my understanding, my higher power, is love, and I am trying to remind myself of this, and reach out and be loving even when he is shunning me.

dollydo

He is in the throws of addiction...his first love is alcohol and he may possibly be on another substance.

I will assume that you have your own deal breakers...mine is abuse...verbal is unacceptable..physical is a flat out deal breaker. To me, addiction and physical abuse are two entirely different issues, yes, alcohol & drugs can intensify the need to abuse, however, neither are the cause. Is his father or mother an abuser?

IMHO, love does not conquer all, especially when addiction is involved. If that were the case, none of us would be here.

Read all the stickies at the top of this forum and those on the Family & Friends of Substance Abusers, also take the time to read Codependent No More...great starting point on your path to recovery from codependency.

NewbieJ

Yes, his father was an alcoholic and addict who was also abusive, according to AH's mother. His father, however, left when he was very young, or his mom did, I'm not sure of the story. Anyhow, his dad was in and out of the picture until he was about 12? Probably earlier, but that's what I recall. So as far as him being around the abuse, or him himself being abused, I'm not sure. Either way, there is strong genetics for his possible alcoholism - his father & his 2 paternal uncles as well as his grandfather were alcoholics.

Anyhow. No, there is no excuse for abuse. For me, the verbal things are worse for some reason.

I was just curious if the "shutting out" or ignoring/not being affectionate is an issue. There is no sex unless I initiate.

gerryP

So, as long as he shows you affection it's okay with you that he emotionally, verbally and physically abuses you?

marie1960

Oh Newbie, I am sorry to hear what you are living.

I have to agree with everyone, Abuse is a dealbreaker.

You are in a toxic situation. This is not a relationship. And this certainly is not love.

Alcoholism is a progressive disease, in time the situation will only get worse.

Time to make yourself the # 1 priority of your life.

We are hear for you. Please keep reading and posting.

velma929

My husband became an expert at shutting me out. The last two or three years of our marriage, I opted not to speak until spoken to. Even when I did reply, I learned to say something non-committal, as even agreeing with him could start a fight. AH didn't notice, or if he did, didn't care. So yes, I have experienced this.

Wish I'd had the stones to call it quits while I was still young. Trying to get a date at my age is near-impossible. We were together for twenty-five years, and the last eight really kinda sucked.

Count me as puzzled as to why you'd initiate sex with a drunk. Never did a thing for me.

NewbieJ

Ouch, everyone - well first off let me say I meant to type "Wondering if this is an issue that is common with some of you." Let's not judge the woman who's already dealt with the abuse and is just curious about something.

Anvilhead - I'm not wondering what I can "get" from the man that makes it okay. I merely asked a question if "shutting out" was common. There are plenty of people here who are at the moment, still staying with their AH despite other issues they may mention - infidelity, horrible or absent parenting. And I must say I don't see anyone jumping on them quite as you did to me.

I *rarely* initiate sex which is why we do not have it. My curiosity is if "shutting out" was part of the emotional abuse, if someone had the same experience - you know, to feel like I am not alone in this, which is why these forums exist. I have to say I'm extremely disappointed with the response I got here. Thanks for the "support" - some of you could have said things a little differently.

NewbieJ

We all have different experiences. I sometimes thought if we had more sex, it would help. As all of us know, not only do we sometimes attempt to control the drinking, we also may try other desperate measures to "help". What I was trying to highlight was HIS disinterest in sex, not the fact that I sometimes initiate. But thank you everyone! Geez.

LifeRecovery

NewbieJ-

I read the responses as an attempt to look at the forest but getting blocked by a tree.

Not my point though. I lived with a loved one with some emotional abuse and some instability, but the physical behavior never turned on me directly.

Intimacy was a huge challenge. I think he felt so bad about himself that this was just one more thing he could not handle. When separating though he threw this one in my face. I got to the point about three years into the marriage where I resented being the one who did it all, pay the bills, cook the food, work full time and initiate intimacy. As a result I decided to stop. It was not a good sign for the relationship.

HOwever the thought of being intimate with someone I cannot completely trust is really challenging also. May I ask can you trust him enough right now to be intimate?

NewbieJ

Thanks LifeRecovery. I think it is interesting that physical abuse shocks so many people, as in, that is usually the last straw, when so many of us put up with emotional/verbal for far too long. I know for a while I explained the physical stuff away by rationalizing that he wasn't really "hitting" me.

In my current experience, AH is the one who earns all the money, and we recently moved to a new state for his new job. However, I do everything else - everything. The trust issue is huge with me...I do not believe he is cheating simply because he is always home (I'm not quite sure if that's what you mean by trust) when he's not at work. But who knows really.

The intimacy/affection issue really affects me because I am incredibly far from our previous home and it makes me feel even more alone. It wasn't until about three weeks ago that his behavior really changed, and I started wondering if he had a drinking problem. So all of this is VERY new to me. He had previously been in counseling for his "rage" problem as well as taking meds, which he abruptly stopped during our recent difficulties. Anyhow, just some background.

But as you mention, he does "throw it in my face" occasionally, such as "You don't have sex with me." My favorite line was "When was the last time you performed the duties of a wife?" That made me sick to my stomach. And he said it with a self-righteous smirk. Honestly, even after all the abuse - that was the thing that turned on my lightbulb. As in - you need to start getting things ready to leave.

LifeRecovery

By trust I meant I could not trust him to be sober, to treat me respectfully, to not yell and scream when things did not go his way etc. How could I trust him with my physical body when I could not trust him with my emotional wellbeing? For me the emotional berating and abuse made it challenging to consider intimacy. That is what I meant by the trees (intimacy) and the forest of all of the other mistreatment, and how I read the other posts.

I did stay after an affair (that was a different type of breaking of trust), but honestly a lot was already gone before that. I thought we were working it out and I found out he was back in touch with her. After the first affair I finally got into Al-anon, after the second I was done. I said I wanted a divorce, and though challenging I have not seriously considered going back.

I am worth more than being a whipping post or a way for him to work those things out in his life that are not going well. I know you are too.

I choose not to have kids because I could not trust the idea of him with them....it took me a long time to realize I was worth as much as fictional kids down the road where.

marie1960

Newbie,

Following and reading this thread, I am not reading any negative judgement directed at you.

What I am reading in each post, is a real concern for you, your well being and safety. We are all here to support you.

If your sister, mother, or best friend, were living your current life, what would you advise them to do?

Abuse is a very serious situation. Statistics have proven violence only escalates. Please seek help. Keep yourself out of harm's way.

I would take this as a sign, view it as a gift, and when he's not paying attention, grab the car keys, slip out the door, drive off into the sunset, never to return.

NewbieJ

I see - at the moment, no, I do not trust him in that way. After reading one of the sticky's entitled "From the abuser's point of view", I recognized a lot of what is really going on. It's another form of control - he gives in when he knows I've been craving some form of affection, only to push me away after and for the next few weeks.

Anyhow. From the get go, a couple years ago when kids were first "brought up" (during an argument) I thought...it sounds like he wants kids more than he wants ME. It was just this strange, odd thing that he desperately wanted something that he had never really discussed, and he wanted them NOW, and meanwhile he didn't seem to much care for the person who would "give" them to him. It's taken me this long to realize that for whatever reason, I am not worth much to him - not in a healthy way.

Marie1960 - I do believe that I am planning just what you describe. It's what brought me to this site, to al-anon. Because I feel that is the only healthy option at this point, I know I need something to provide the healthy growth and strength to help me during the process.

NewbieJ

Also - as far as violence escalating, it has. However because of what I've learned at al-anon, I do not think I am being naive when I say that there will not be any more violence. Most of the violence and raging took place when I tried to "get through" to him, when I tried to talk to him, desperate to understand what was going on. Or when he would try to leave, I would want him to stay. It was then that he would lash out.

Now, I simply leave him alone. There's just no utility in rationalizing.

Windmills

Your last post sounds like you're holding the blame for something that wasn't your fault. Nothing you ever say or do can MAKE someone abusive to you. That blame isnt yours to carry and saying you won't do it any more isn't giving the problem.
In my situation, I stopped confronting him. Soon enough my existence was a reason to abuse me. The dinner was too small? He'd throw it at the wall. I didn't open the door fast enough? He'd scream, shout and push me round. I was walking too slow? He'd pull my hair. You get the idea.

SoaringSpirits

oops, double post

SoaringSpirits

You just described the last 2-3 years of my marriage with my AH before I hit bottom and we separated. It was devastating.

Shunning and stonewalling are emotional ABUSE.

I suggest you read this article on the "Four Horsemen of Marriage." It's the four marriage killers. Stonewalling is one of them. Men tend to stonewall the most. It's deadly to a marriage. All four were alive in my marriage, and reading this was a huge eye opener.

Hugs to you, and know you are not alone.[/QUOTE]

marie1960

"A woman's strength can be compared to a tea bag, you never know how strong it will be until you put it in hot water," (Eleanor Roosevelt, I think said this)

Windmills, just want to send you a big hug, your post is an absolute eye opener.

Krys

Before I met my current abf I was with a guy for 6 years that was not an addict in any sort of way...he was anti drug go figure! However he was verbally and emotionally abusive. The silent treatment, the blame game, twisting every word I said (even facts...the shy is blue "no it's not it's grey!"), and in the end he would push past me and "accidentally" bump into my shoulder or push me. It was going to escalate and like you I had moved with him to another state far away from everyone I knew who could help. One day I found myself thinking "If only he would really hit me, then there would be a bruise and maybe someone would believe me when I tell them he is not a good guy. Then maybe when we fought about it he couldn't deny what he said or did anymore...I would have proof." The second I finished that thought I realized what a mess I had become and I packed up and left. Never looked back. Add alcohol into the mix and things would have been terrifying. You are living with a verbally, emotionally and physically abusive man who is an alcoholic. I am afraid for your safety and well being. If you won't leave now please start planning your escape.

NewbieJ

My apologies, I wasn't clear. In our situation, he hasn't ever come at me without us being in an argument (even though that argument stemmed from nothing - typically that he seemed to be in a bad mood completely out of nowhere). So, going by something I learned in al-anon, I'm not going to argue with him when he's drunk, or ask him "What's wrong?" Surely there are alcoholic abusers that attack without "provocation", however right now for us that isn't happening. Not to say it couldn't happen down the road, but for him, he's typically a boiling pot under the surface, and it just takes something to open the lid and have it come spilling over. Whether it's traffic, me asking what's wrong because I notice he's quiet on the phone, something will set him off so he can unload. Or perhaps he looks for those things.

In NO WAY did I mean to sound as if I am accepting blame for his behavior - I am simply trying to avoid it for the time being in any way I know how.

Though I do look back and get angry at myself for not calling the police when I know I should have, I also know that had I done so, I would not be where I am right now in al-anon, I wouldn't have had my moment of clarity. At the points in time in which he did the things he did, I had no reasoning for it. And though "unacceptable behavior is unacceptable", knowing what is going on with him has helped me take the blame off of myself and put it where it belongs. Because even though it isn't right, most of us know that the abused takes on the pain of the abuser, and we begin to believe the things they tell us, and we begin to believe it is our fault.