help with boundaries/email
I Love Who I Am
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Join Date: Sep 2009
Location: Midwest
Posts: 3,210
help with boundaries/email
This is to AH. He's at work. He told me this last night and I chose to not engage. But I have to say something.
Last night you said you and your dad might get a six pack to drink while taking the kids around trick or treating? That's not going to happen. There is no drinking around the kids, remember? You guys can go do that after if you want.
Last night you said you and your dad might get a six pack to drink while taking the kids around trick or treating? That's not going to happen. There is no drinking around the kids, remember? You guys can go do that after if you want.
I Love Who I Am
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Join Date: Sep 2009
Location: Midwest
Posts: 3,210
I'm so freaking furious. I can't even tell you. The last time the kids were with their AH and his dad, they went out, left my boys with the 14 year old cousin who ignored them the entire time, and came back so drunk my AH couldn't walk and had to be carried!
He called me the next day saying, 'just so you know, I got really drunk last night and youngest son was crying."
that was the beginning of the end. The kids were TOTALLY freaked out. When I laid down the law and said no more drinking around the kids, he got drunk anyway and screamed at them that they needed to "man up!" that he CHOOSES to live his life this way and they need to accept it.
Oh my god I hate him so much today. He's already told the kids that grandpa is coming to take them trick or treating with him. I am staying here at the house to hand out candy and AH was suppose to take the kids around the neighborhood.
He called me the next day saying, 'just so you know, I got really drunk last night and youngest son was crying."
that was the beginning of the end. The kids were TOTALLY freaked out. When I laid down the law and said no more drinking around the kids, he got drunk anyway and screamed at them that they needed to "man up!" that he CHOOSES to live his life this way and they need to accept it.
Oh my god I hate him so much today. He's already told the kids that grandpa is coming to take them trick or treating with him. I am staying here at the house to hand out candy and AH was suppose to take the kids around the neighborhood.
I Love Who I Am
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Join Date: Sep 2009
Location: Midwest
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Ok here's my newest version
You said you would be bringing a six pack over for your dad and you to drink? No you're not. do you ever remember how you traumatized your kids when you were at your dads condo? Or how you yelled at them to "man up" when they were upset with your drinking? I remember. And so do they.
There is no drinking around the kids AH! Especially you and your dad together! I dont' give a rats ass what you think of me, I will keep the kids safe.
No beer or no trick or treating with kids. Period.
You said you would be bringing a six pack over for your dad and you to drink? No you're not. do you ever remember how you traumatized your kids when you were at your dads condo? Or how you yelled at them to "man up" when they were upset with your drinking? I remember. And so do they.
There is no drinking around the kids AH! Especially you and your dad together! I dont' give a rats ass what you think of me, I will keep the kids safe.
No beer or no trick or treating with kids. Period.
Member
Join Date: Nov 2007
Posts: 1,294
Or... no alcohol on the premises.
If it's there, it will be consumed, right? If it's consumed, who's gonna consume it? Moot questions, right?
When I feel turbulence about a reply or boundary, I force myself to try to make it in ten words or less, because that cuts straight to the point and doesn't leave too many words for controlling phrases or revenge language, etc. It's only enough words to state the bare facts.
CLMI
If it's there, it will be consumed, right? If it's consumed, who's gonna consume it? Moot questions, right?
When I feel turbulence about a reply or boundary, I force myself to try to make it in ten words or less, because that cuts straight to the point and doesn't leave too many words for controlling phrases or revenge language, etc. It's only enough words to state the bare facts.
CLMI
Member
Join Date: Oct 2009
Location: Missouri
Posts: 673
(((Transform))) - May I suggest detachment, too. You're angry at the disease and the insanity of suggesting such a thing. As so many wonderful people have suggested to me...
BREATHE
Peace IN
Fear and anger OUT
Distract yourself
You'll come back without anger and sane and able to deal with taking care of YOU and your children.
(((Transform)))
BREATHE
Peace IN
Fear and anger OUT
Distract yourself
You'll come back without anger and sane and able to deal with taking care of YOU and your children.
(((Transform)))
I Love Who I Am
Thread Starter
Join Date: Sep 2009
Location: Midwest
Posts: 3,210
This makes me sick by the way. I hate him and his father both today and hope I can keep it together. I won't make this mistake in the future.
I sent him a text that said.
there is no drinking around the kids. this isn't going to change. ever.
So of course he texted me right back
Wow, nice delivery. Good morning to you.
But I'm not answering. Won't work. I finally do not care what he thinks of me and do not want him back. Thank GOD!!!!
I sent him a text that said.
there is no drinking around the kids. this isn't going to change. ever.
So of course he texted me right back
Wow, nice delivery. Good morning to you.
But I'm not answering. Won't work. I finally do not care what he thinks of me and do not want him back. Thank GOD!!!!
Member
Join Date: Jul 2009
Location: Tucson, AZ
Posts: 77
What about:
I don't feel comfortable with alcohol being consumed by the resposible adults in charge of the kids. It is not safe or emotionally healthy for them. I will not allow them to be in harms way. They will not be going anywhere with anyone who is drinking or plans to.
That is to the point but not putting him on the defensive. This gives him to opportunity to make his own choice without you telling him what he can't do.
I don't feel comfortable with alcohol being consumed by the resposible adults in charge of the kids. It is not safe or emotionally healthy for them. I will not allow them to be in harms way. They will not be going anywhere with anyone who is drinking or plans to.
That is to the point but not putting him on the defensive. This gives him to opportunity to make his own choice without you telling him what he can't do.
Member
Join Date: Aug 2009
Posts: 390
Why can't he stay home and give out candy and you take the kids? The kids' safety is the most important at this point.
How about, you drink with those children trick or treating the cops will be involved. It is ILLEGAL!!! You have that on your side.
Who's party is this anyway? This is the kids' night. I'm so sorry you have to deal with such ridiculous insanity on what should be a nice family night.
How about, you drink with those children trick or treating the cops will be involved. It is ILLEGAL!!! You have that on your side.
Who's party is this anyway? This is the kids' night. I'm so sorry you have to deal with such ridiculous insanity on what should be a nice family night.
I Love Who I Am
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Join Date: Sep 2009
Location: Midwest
Posts: 3,210
Thank you for your suggestion sapphire but I have some questions:
Is there anything I can do to create a clear boundary about drinking that will not put him on the defensive?
Also, I'm not telling him what to do. I'm restating the boundary directly. Again, I can sugar coat this as much as anyone but it won't matter.
Today I reached a deeper level of horror when I recall AH's drinking, how it affects the kids and how I am also responsible, in part, by caring more about my sick relationship with him than their well being.
If I have to, I'll file for divorce, take the financial hit and start the process for full custody. I've been told my my first ex husband ( recovering addict of 26 years who runs groups at jail for a local treatment center) that there is no judge in our county who will allow unsupervised visitation with an active alcoholic.
I'll keep doing research to make sure as much as possible of that claim. But for now, I"m not going to tip toe around anymore.
He can, and will, get defensive. That wasn't my objective. Keeping his drinking away from my already traumatized kids is.
That is to the point but not putting him on the defensive.
Also, I'm not telling him what to do. I'm restating the boundary directly. Again, I can sugar coat this as much as anyone but it won't matter.
Today I reached a deeper level of horror when I recall AH's drinking, how it affects the kids and how I am also responsible, in part, by caring more about my sick relationship with him than their well being.
If I have to, I'll file for divorce, take the financial hit and start the process for full custody. I've been told my my first ex husband ( recovering addict of 26 years who runs groups at jail for a local treatment center) that there is no judge in our county who will allow unsupervised visitation with an active alcoholic.
I'll keep doing research to make sure as much as possible of that claim. But for now, I"m not going to tip toe around anymore.
He can, and will, get defensive. That wasn't my objective. Keeping his drinking away from my already traumatized kids is.
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Join Date: Jan 2009
Posts: 1,888
I think what you wrote to him was spot on.
Stating that boundary is on behalf of your children and there is no room for apology or further explanation. He will continue to stick his toe over the line to see if you're keeping watch over it. Expect it.
You'll have to state the boundary and restate it over and over for even a fraction of it to sink in. Keep your cool and just say or write it the same way again and again. Even the most midless of creatures can adapt to change. He will figure it out eventually.
His response back to you making you out to be somehow deranged this morning, is just a knee jerk reaction from an active alcoholic. Ignore it.
You're right that anything having to do with booze no matter what the context is going to raise his feathers. When your life is lived in defense of something you become passionate for the cause, right? My Xfriend has gotten into foster caring for shelter cats to keep them from being put down due to shelter overcrowding. She is very passionate about the cause. If you were to mention anything, and I mean anything, involving a cat (even your own) she will jump all over you about how it is cared for, if you vaccinate, is it neutered or spayed on and on and on. When I lived with my XABF I could not even say the word beer in any context without him clenching his teeth.
There are no threats or ultimatums in boundaries, only statements of fact. 1 + 2 = 3 Same result every time. AH + Booze = No kids. Simple, direct, and undeniable.
Now, while your out at breakfast or getting ready for festivities tonite, consider your plan for the evening. If you suspect there is going to be a problem. Put that "Take One Please" sign on your candy bowl, set it outside and take your kids around the neighborhood. No one is going to fault you for keeping your children safe. Go out early so you and the kids can be back to hand out what's left in person.
I bet they would rather remember that they spent Halloween with you having fun then watching their Dad fall drunk into a ditch while they were left to walk home in the dark alone.
Just my thoughts.
Hang in their Mama, you're doing just fine!!! Happy Halloween!!!
Alice
Stating that boundary is on behalf of your children and there is no room for apology or further explanation. He will continue to stick his toe over the line to see if you're keeping watch over it. Expect it.
You'll have to state the boundary and restate it over and over for even a fraction of it to sink in. Keep your cool and just say or write it the same way again and again. Even the most midless of creatures can adapt to change. He will figure it out eventually.
His response back to you making you out to be somehow deranged this morning, is just a knee jerk reaction from an active alcoholic. Ignore it.
You're right that anything having to do with booze no matter what the context is going to raise his feathers. When your life is lived in defense of something you become passionate for the cause, right? My Xfriend has gotten into foster caring for shelter cats to keep them from being put down due to shelter overcrowding. She is very passionate about the cause. If you were to mention anything, and I mean anything, involving a cat (even your own) she will jump all over you about how it is cared for, if you vaccinate, is it neutered or spayed on and on and on. When I lived with my XABF I could not even say the word beer in any context without him clenching his teeth.
There are no threats or ultimatums in boundaries, only statements of fact. 1 + 2 = 3 Same result every time. AH + Booze = No kids. Simple, direct, and undeniable.
Now, while your out at breakfast or getting ready for festivities tonite, consider your plan for the evening. If you suspect there is going to be a problem. Put that "Take One Please" sign on your candy bowl, set it outside and take your kids around the neighborhood. No one is going to fault you for keeping your children safe. Go out early so you and the kids can be back to hand out what's left in person.
I bet they would rather remember that they spent Halloween with you having fun then watching their Dad fall drunk into a ditch while they were left to walk home in the dark alone.
Just my thoughts.
Hang in their Mama, you're doing just fine!!! Happy Halloween!!!
Alice
I Love Who I Am
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Join Date: Sep 2009
Location: Midwest
Posts: 3,210
Thank you Alice! 
I am home again, AH has called several times, all cheery and positive. He's coming over in a half hour to carve pumpkins and start helping youngest son get dressed.
The kids are geeked. I"m just going to focus on them, on having fun with them. I don't think he'll bring beer over, but if he does, I won't be surprised and will file for divorce on Monday.
I ain't messin with that man no more.
In fact, I just ran into our old neighbor when we were out. She was horrified that AH and I have seperated again, that he wouldn't stop drinking and stay away from his affair partner, but her husband laughed. "is he stupid? you wrote about him bailing on your family in the New York Times Magazine (2004 the first time we were separated). Now he has an affair? That guy has no healthy fear for his life."
I loved that. I reminded me of who I really am. Not a sniveling, sorry, scared little b****
I am home again, AH has called several times, all cheery and positive. He's coming over in a half hour to carve pumpkins and start helping youngest son get dressed.
The kids are geeked. I"m just going to focus on them, on having fun with them. I don't think he'll bring beer over, but if he does, I won't be surprised and will file for divorce on Monday.
I ain't messin with that man no more.
In fact, I just ran into our old neighbor when we were out. She was horrified that AH and I have seperated again, that he wouldn't stop drinking and stay away from his affair partner, but her husband laughed. "is he stupid? you wrote about him bailing on your family in the New York Times Magazine (2004 the first time we were separated). Now he has an affair? That guy has no healthy fear for his life."
I loved that. I reminded me of who I really am. Not a sniveling, sorry, scared little b****
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Originally Posted by transformyself 
Is there anything I can do to create a clear boundary about drinking that will not put him on the defensive?
Remember, this boundary is YOURS. How he reacts to it is up to him. Can you detach from his reaction?
I Love Who I Am
Thread Starter
Join Date: Sep 2009
Location: Midwest
Posts: 3,210
Can you detach from his reaction?
Detach from his reaction.
Ok. Let's review.
- State boundaries clearly, without discussion.
- Detach from his reaction.
- Do not run him over with the car.
- Get back to my happy, prosperous, alcoholic-free life ASAP.
thanks everyone!
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