Freedom1990

Just for some clarification on my part, not only am I a recovering addict/alcoholic, but I was married to an active alcoholic/addict, and I have two ADs. Believe me, there are days I wish I didn't have the life experience from all of those angles, but it is what it is and I do share my experiences in more than one place here on SR.

Oh, and I'm proud to be clean/sober since August 5, 1990.

yeahgr8

IMHO I think it's good to have a mix of different views from both alchies/addicts, codeps and people that have been affected by the previous, even in the same thread.

This is a Friends and Family of Alcoholics area of the forum i thought and, as far as i understood, was more for the people affected by alcoholism and addiction not for the actual addicts and alcoholics themselves. As such i would expect some quite frank discussions about the A's and A's, some not being too happy about the fact that they have had to deal with partner's/family member's problems.

I think Formerdoormat has every right to express the views in the post she made in this thread without getting a kicking and, quite honestly, as a recovering alcoholic i don't think she is far wrong. There are a lot of us that stop drinking and remain dry drunks by not changing anything else in their life!

I think Ago is right to not let his great sober progress be belittled as it isn't ******* easy at all, as he saw it, too but I think he should just throw his toys out of the pram on this one but not leave the site for good.

So there!

Omega Man

My wife and I dealt with her father and his active alcoholism for the first 4 yrs we we're together. He's now been sober for 8 yrs with the help of AA to the great joy of the family.
Now I'm seeing both sides of the fence as I'm an admitted alcoholic and working a program of recovery thru AA.

Did I miss something in the rules that as an alcoholic I should stick to the newcomers or alcoholism forums?

PS - LOST SUE, I'm really sorry your original post seems to have been sidetracked; please stick around. As you can see, alcoholism causes a lot of damage to all involved.

yeahgr8

Hmmm got me there, i'm going back to alchies section

lost sue

I will be here for quiet a while. Thank you. I found out today that he is looking into AA. He has been active on the online AA for the days that he has not been drinking. I won't stop doing what I am doing for myself. I know I can't. I don't want to go through the heartache of this not working for him but I do have to be real about it. Thank you all for your posts. I know I need to know that it might and might not work.
Sue

ICant

Former Doormat, I enjoy reading your posts and some of them have made me cry. I understand why you write the above but I feel if you had truly detached you would not have been crushed every time he failed. My husband's drinking is not about me and the big revelation is that his sober behaviour is not about me either. I don't mind former alcoholics posting here because it offers insight into other people's lives and backgrounds. And I think if we all had a zen bubble around us we can tolerate differences of opinion.

As you know Lost Sue, my husband stopped getting drunk as a result of me announcing I was leaving him. Even if he is just buying time, I am still grateful. For every day that he doesn't get drunk, myself and my children gain another day of peace. How can that be a bad thing? As long as I don't wrap myself up in what he is doing, and keep the focus on myself, I stay healthy. If/when he gets drunk again, I will leave. In the meantime, I have been examining my own life from childhood and teen years, journalling, attending al-anon, reading SR. The journey has been awful and wonderful. I don't know where you are in your recovery but I have been in recovery for 3 and a half years and I have only recently reached a point where I don't define success by my ability to stay married.

Tally

3 days is good, 3 days is a start. My bf has been sober since 23rd February 08, just over 10 months now and he had a "day 3" too, infact all recovering/sober alcoholics have had a day 3.

Obviously you need to work on detaching still, look after yourself and put yourself first and carry on with your plans so that if he does relapse you're still on your road.

I walked around on egg shells for the first few weeks of my bf's soberiety worrying about saying the wrong thing or doing the wrong thing or doing anything that might make him drink...then I remembered I can't make him drink just as much as I can't make him not drink and I had to remind myself to detach and get on with things for myself.

If he's never tried to stop before and this isn't the hundreth time he's quit then you have every right to feel hopeful, sometimes it does work out and if it doesn't then you know what you have to do. Good luck to you both.

FormerDoormat

I detached, but his alcoholic behaviors continued, despite therapy, despite three stints at rehab, despite daily AA meetings. I felt I was short changing myself by trying to live a life with him. He got to own his alcoholism and all the behaviors that went along with it and I got to own my freedom.

Detachment while attempting to co-habitate with an alcoholic comes with a price. One that I was not willing to pay. The only way I could be free of his downward spiral was to end my relationship. As you know he drank himself to death shortly thereafter. I don't recommend that anyone follow in my path.

If you want to know what it looks like, what it feels like to watch an end-stage alcoholic, search for this thread:

His Name IS Richard and He IS an Alcoholic

If you want to know what it feels like to watch someone you love trade their life for their next drink, read this thread:

His Name WAS Richard and He WAS an Alcoholic

both of which were written by me.

My feelings on this topic are mine, they are real, and they are valid. As always, I share them from the bottom of my heart.

Barbara52

I have to admit lately that the focus in the F&F forums seems to have gone over more predominantly to the perspective of the As and RAs who hang out in here.

Although I often find their perspective informative and helpful, this is supposed to be for those of us who are not the A or RA is it not? I have been struggling as to whether this is the forum for me any more since the focus seems to have changed over the past few months especially.

Morning Glory

My experience is a little different. I was with an alcoholic that I loved with all my heart. I broke contact with him for 5 years and then we became best friends for the remainder of his 15 years on this earth. I wouldn't trade that friendship for anything even though he was active in his alcoholism. He was my best friend.

My son is an alcoholic and I will have no contact with him when he is active in his alcoholism because his personality changes so much that he becomes dangerous. I do enjoy it when he is sober and cherish our relationship during those times.

My daughter has been sober or 13 years and she did it on her own with no program. She just realized one day that she needed to be a better mother and that was enough for her.

I had to leave one relationship with an active addict and never have contact again due to his mental illness.

I have been single for a long time now and I'm very content that way and choose to stay single.

Each person is an individual and each situation is unique. I try to look at my motives when making decisions about my life. Am I acting from guilt, fear, or comfort? Can I get some different perspectives from those on the outside that aren't overwhelmed by my emotions in my current situation? I have no crystal ball and can't see the future so I make decisions based on my today and do what I can live with. I am the only person that has to live with the consequences of my decisions.

GiveLove

Thanks, Sue.

Sending you hugs and prayers that you can keep your quest for happiness on track, no matter what choices your husband decides to make.

:ghug

DesertEyes

um.... not really. This forum is for those who's lives have been affected by the addiction of a loved one. We follow the 12 step principles as closely as we can, and that means that we only care that you are in _pain_ as a result of somebody else's drinking.

We do not exclude people who are recovering from drug/alcohol addiction, food addiction, nicotine addiction, or any such. We _do_ ask that posts be respectful of _everybody_, regardless of the status of their loved one, or whether they wish to stay or leave.

If a poster's life has _not_ been affected by a loved one's addiction, that is when we ask them to go hang out in the "cafe".

Mike

Barbara52

I didn't ask for anyone to be excluded. I said I found the comments of As and RAs informative and helpful. But....

If I have to start being careful that I do not offend the As who come in here (and the anger/hurt/etc. that results from being involved with an A often means speaking in a manner that is not polite to and about As), it will mean I (and I assume others) will not be able to be as open and inquiring as we need tobe to work on our issues as the F&F of As. I seems to me that the focus has been shifting more toward the As/RAs and away from is F&F of As.

But by no means did I say anyone should be excluded.

embraced2000

altho i love hearing the perspective of the a or the ra, and how they acted during their addiction, and have learned alot regarding the questions i always wondered about, i do find their responses to the friends and families of alcoholics off the radar at times.

i guess we come from different approaches. it seems that the a forum doesn't really like having us respond to their posts....it triggers them or something. some truly appreciate it, while others just bristle. especially the ones that are still asking why didn't so and so help me? or being upset about being kicked out.

such is the world, i reckon. jmho

lost sue

I have been so lucky to have help from everyone on this forum. I myself being a person who really didn't know anything a couple weeks ago feel like I have so much information to work with I have months of reading and lots of meetings to go to. I think going to alanon and having that safe time is a relief for me. I have not had any negative posts that have been hurtful to me. Some gave me the hard truth and I am glad for that. If I go to the page for A's I am sure they will give me even harder truth. I am glad everyone is free to come to all forums and I am glad for chat with everyone. Of course I have only been on chat 2 times and not for long, I have found the most caring and understanding people that truly can relate with me no matter which side of the fence they are on. Thank you all again for being such a great support to someone who is still lost and finding her way!!!

GiveLove

:ghug3 sue!

ToughChoices

I am very grateful for the wide variety of experiences and opinions that speak here.

Occasionally a post will irritate me or rub me the wrong way, but most/all of those posts have taught me something very important - have brought to light issues that I wasn't aware of before.

I'm glad that many recovering addicts/alcoholics post here.
I'm glad that strong, independent men and women who've left their alcoholic partners post here.
I'm glad that anxious, loving mothers and fathers post here.
I'm glad that hurting young people, full of fears and hopes for life with their alcoholic partners post here.
I'm glad that those who've found peace and recovery with their alcoholics post here.

This forum shows the multitude of possibilities that exist - the many different ways that things can work out. There is hope and despair, disappointment and growth. All of these messages are important to me.

Thank you to everyone, and best of luck to you, lostsue.
This a great place to recover.

-TC

Barbara52

See Ago reaction to FD's comment as to how easy insult is taken. It happens from all POVs all too easily especially since the printed word means there is no way to judge to "tone" of a comment.


For me there is difference between seeking out or even receiving other POVs and a feeling (self imposed of course) of suppression of my comments because an A or RA may take offense to my at times very much anti alcoholic feelings and comments.

First off I don't know that many view the A in their life as "the enemy" but even if true, for me this place began as a very needed place of safety from the POV of the A in my life, where I heard the experience of others sharing my journey of recovery which is not the same as the journey of an As journey of recovery. What I needed most was not the POV of the A but of others who know what its like from the POV of the F&F of As. Learning to take my focus off of trying to understand my xAH was what led to my biggest strides in recovery. I don't need to understand what its like for the A to work on myself. In fact concentrating on the A would have been counter productive.

When I need info on alcoholism from the POV of an A I know where to go to get it.

Tarheel

B52,

(Regarding what Anvilhead said - "IF we each speak from a place of our OWN experience strength and hope, i fail to see how that would be considered insulting.... ")



This is what FD said. She was not speaking about her own experience. She was making a blanket statement about alcoholics and people who choose to spend their lives with them. That's a monumental difference.

I don't think anyone would have felt insulted if FD had spoken only for herself.

As I pointed out, my experience is very different from hers. However, in no way do I believe that my experience determines what hers will or should be.

TH

prodigal

Thank you, thank you, thank you.