needuall

I know some addicts can hide their excessive drinking or drug habits to some degree if they want to.
I think usually their extreme selfishness is
obvious eventhough they do not realize it. They seem to think it is ok.
Selfish mind set is the biggest clue for me- a very (too) unselfishness person will accept and adjust to this. I am interested if you agree, disagree or anything else to add.
A good thing though is I believe alcoholics do not like and are not attracted to healthy people...sounds good to me!

velma929

I think alcoholics like normies pretty well - as long as the normies are able to pay the bills. The selfishness - I was thinking about just today. It can be weird and peculiar.

AH's aunt (his mother's sister) had passed away. We were preparing to leave for the funeral, and he came to me with some stones. (Yes, actual rocks.) And he told me he was going to tell his cousins about how he collected these rocks when he had been on an outing with his own mother, and how he was thinking about her, and how much he missed her. As best I can remember, his mother had died ten years before.

I was taken aback. I finally managed to explain that what he was planning was inappropriate. His own mom had died, there had been a proper funeral, his cousins had been there to share his grief and comfort him, and now it was his turn to comfort them, not ask for sympathy around his loss a second time. We had to go over this for a few minutes - he just wasn't getting it.

LovelyKaya33333

I agree with Velma... I think alcoholics LOVE normies.... I think that they are very attracted to someone being responsible ( especially in a romantic relationship) cause it hides their drinking... if a partner who is not an alcoholic can keep **** together in life, the drinking goes un noticed often....

I do think alcoholics that are active in their drinking are just about the most selfish people on the planet. They will do anything to "feel good about themselves" lie, deflect, blame, yell....drink with their kids in the car, not be accountable to anyone or anything... They don't have that natural voice of "This is hurting someone else" they just do what they want and most of the time at all costs. I think the battle is when attempting to get sober they finally start to remember or see how they have been and what they have lost usually that a mountain of shame builds and they finally say screw it and drink again........ This is why in my opinion some type of program or therapy is a must when getting sober... This is just from my opinion...... and what I have seen

PeacefulWater12

I think alcoholics can be attracted to all sorts of people.

However healthy people will not tolerate alcoholic behaviours. Once a healthy person with good self esteem and boundaries sees the actions and attitude of an alcoholic, they will end the relationship.

Whereas a person who has their own issues such as growing up in an alcoholic home, will maybe not see all the behaviours and even if they do, to them is is "normal" as it is what they grew up around. It is familiar.

So for us as codependents, the very best thing we can do is work on ourselves. For us to learn healthy outlooks, us work a recovery program.

To respond to your question about strongest trait in addiction, I think lack of responsibility and always needing to blame everything on someone else is a huge red flag.

Thank you for raising this discussion.

Leopol

Hi needuall,
So for me, I was ever exposed to alcoholism until I was 26 and it was the selfishness of individuals that laid the first brick for me to start connecting the dots.

It ook me about a good 1,5 year- 2 years to figure it out but one of the evenings I realised there was alcoholism in my ex's family was when we were on a family holiday and my ex's uncle was continuously saying he loved his wife so much and kept drinking straight whiskey, she complained he snored too much when he drank and became very touchy touchy that she didn't like so she slept in a different bed. This was about a two week straight bender he was going on while we were on vacation. night after night the same story. I asked my ex then, don't you think its weird he's saying he loves her while drinking but she is clearly stating that she wants him to not drink so much, so if he loved her why won't he just not drink and be with her instead?

I was very naive haha JEEZ. but I figured it out eventually so yay me. And selfishness is definitely what I look for.

needuall

Thank you all for your responses. Maybe alcoholics who are active seek out enablers who will put up with their craziness and cover up for them- which just allows the disease to progress taking down both addicts and their enablers. Maybe if alcoholic is in true recovery that person wants a healthier/ non enabler because if not, he knows he will get sicker and die.
Enablers and alcoholics both need to change for themselves regardless of anything for a better life- that includes awareness. All of you are so helpful with all your thoughts and experiences!

trailmix

I've never been an enabler (it just isn't in my nature lol) - but I hear what you are saying.

I think it's dangerous to lump all alcoholics in to a group. They are people just like you and me. Some people like outgoing people who like to travel the world and are very independent, some like more of a stay at home person that cooks (I'm talking male and female here).

Alcoholics are no different except they would probably, one would imagine, prefer to have someone around who accepts their drinking. I don't see that as enabling - I see that as accepting people for who they are.

Leopol

I've been trying to find the right words to explain and understand what was happening in my experience and my brain was still trying to make sense of all the different actors that contribute to the dysfunction of such a system. Thank you for clearly and simply writing this out. My brain immediately calmed down while reading this.

duckduckgoose

In my experience, the selfishness is DEFINITELY a big sign. As my qualifier’s alcoholism progressed, he got more and more selfish (even about things not directly related to alcohol/drinking). It was like he felt the world should revolve around him.

PeacefulWater12

Hello DuckDuckGoose

I noticed this is your first post so wanted to say hello and welcome.

I hope you find comfort and help by joining us.

thequest

This. It absolutely takes enabling for an alcoholic or addict to continue and not hit a bottom when they should. They're codependent emotionally and physically ie the favors, rides, money etc. I've seen that relationship play out too many times.

That being said alcoholics and addicts are extremely selfish which also makes them dangerous. To obtain their gratification they become good actors & liars to cover up their habit and eventually manipulators to get favors. Some expand into grifting. Throw in THEIR priority and focus on their next high the narrow focus and misplaced priorty opens the door to a whole bunch of other crap.

nez

This was not the case with me when I was actively drinking. I grew up in an alcohol free family, but where enabling ran rampant. It used to drive me crazy, so when I left home, I tried to steer clear of people with enabling personalities.

It's really rare in life that a situation is as black and white as we tend to paint it.