Advice on co-parenting
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Thread Starter
Join Date: Jun 2019
Posts: 276
Advice on co-parenting
Hi All,
I am struggling with how to ease into co-parenting with my EXAW.
She is still presently using, and I saw this first hand this past weekend. Presently we have a verbal arrangement in which EXAW can visit daughter anytime provided there is supervision (from a 3rd party) or through myself. As my EXAW lives out of town it is hard for her to see her daughter. In fact she has only see her once in the last 30 days.
The reason for this arrangement is that the EXAW was drinking around my daughter and has put her into harms way...I got fed up with that and also told her to leave the family home. Which she did...and now is very angry about the situation (unfair etc...)
We have been under this arrangement since start of April 2019 but I can see that things are shifting for her because she seems to be becoming more desperate that her relationship with her daughter is souring. I actually don't want that to happen but I can see my daughter growing distant from her mom and a lot of that has to do with my daughter not ever feeling like her mom has adequately made up for her disappearing acts, missed birthday, driving her drunk etc.... In fact now, my daughter does not want overnight visits with her mom unless I supervise them...which is dangerous for me as there is still a spark between EXAW and myself.
I am feeling so guilty for this...Like I have to mend this relationship...that her using still makes me wonder if this is just another manipulation...
She is in a 12 week OP treatment program but still using...
Advice
I am struggling with how to ease into co-parenting with my EXAW.
She is still presently using, and I saw this first hand this past weekend. Presently we have a verbal arrangement in which EXAW can visit daughter anytime provided there is supervision (from a 3rd party) or through myself. As my EXAW lives out of town it is hard for her to see her daughter. In fact she has only see her once in the last 30 days.
The reason for this arrangement is that the EXAW was drinking around my daughter and has put her into harms way...I got fed up with that and also told her to leave the family home. Which she did...and now is very angry about the situation (unfair etc...)
We have been under this arrangement since start of April 2019 but I can see that things are shifting for her because she seems to be becoming more desperate that her relationship with her daughter is souring. I actually don't want that to happen but I can see my daughter growing distant from her mom and a lot of that has to do with my daughter not ever feeling like her mom has adequately made up for her disappearing acts, missed birthday, driving her drunk etc.... In fact now, my daughter does not want overnight visits with her mom unless I supervise them...which is dangerous for me as there is still a spark between EXAW and myself.
I am feeling so guilty for this...Like I have to mend this relationship...that her using still makes me wonder if this is just another manipulation...
She is in a 12 week OP treatment program but still using...
Advice
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Join Date: Mar 2008
Location: Boston
Posts: 2,946
She is in a 12 week OP treatment program but still using...
UGH. Keep protecting your daughter! That's always the right thing to do. Whether AW is getting "desperate" because her relationship w/ DD(DearDaughter) is deteriorating is not your side of the street. She's an adult and knows what she has to do but if she's still using - forget about her doing what's right.
Talk honestly with your DD too, so she knows these boundaries are n place because of the seriousness of alcoholism. I wish I had had one sober sane adult in my life when I was that age to protect me! How the heck did I know what to do or what to think? I was just a kid! I needed someone to say: "It's OK to still love your Dad and it doesn't mean he doesn't love you, but this is alcoholism, and so we have to protect ourselves and not enable his addiction, and I'm here all the time for you and will answer your questions and help you with strong feelings about this!"
Always always always play for Team Sanity and watch out for cunning and baffling Team Alcohol trying to recruit you and DD!!
Peace,
B
UGH. Keep protecting your daughter! That's always the right thing to do. Whether AW is getting "desperate" because her relationship w/ DD(DearDaughter) is deteriorating is not your side of the street. She's an adult and knows what she has to do but if she's still using - forget about her doing what's right.
Talk honestly with your DD too, so she knows these boundaries are n place because of the seriousness of alcoholism. I wish I had had one sober sane adult in my life when I was that age to protect me! How the heck did I know what to do or what to think? I was just a kid! I needed someone to say: "It's OK to still love your Dad and it doesn't mean he doesn't love you, but this is alcoholism, and so we have to protect ourselves and not enable his addiction, and I'm here all the time for you and will answer your questions and help you with strong feelings about this!"
Always always always play for Team Sanity and watch out for cunning and baffling Team Alcohol trying to recruit you and DD!!
Peace,
B
Member
Join Date: Oct 2013
Posts: 11,459
The choice is to keep using is what your Ex is prioritizing over her child.-I agree 100% with Bernadette as I also grew up in an alcoholic home.
Protect your daughter, and be honest with her about what's happening in an age-appropriate way, and don't feel bad about your Ex--right now her addiction is more important to her than family, and as terrible as that is, there is nothing you can do to make her choose differently until (and if) she gets ready to.
I suggest you get some legal advice, document the continued alcohol use, and get some more formal custody arrangements in place. Does her OP know she's still using?
I'm sorry for your situation, but your are doing the right thing for your child.
Protect your daughter, and be honest with her about what's happening in an age-appropriate way, and don't feel bad about your Ex--right now her addiction is more important to her than family, and as terrible as that is, there is nothing you can do to make her choose differently until (and if) she gets ready to.
I suggest you get some legal advice, document the continued alcohol use, and get some more formal custody arrangements in place. Does her OP know she's still using?
I'm sorry for your situation, but your are doing the right thing for your child.
Member
Join Date: Nov 2016
Posts: 8,709
It is not your responsibility to mend their relationship, as long as you aren't hindering it (speaking badly about her, discouraging a relationship). Not to say you are.
Your wife is a grown woman with a child. If distance is prohibiting her from spending as much time with her as she would like then it would seem she should move closer or make a bigger effort to get there.
You mention that this could just be manipulation, to what end? To work her way back in to the house/family? It could be, really hard to say but if that is your gut feeling on it, you are probably right?
Does your Daughter have counselling or attend Al-Ateen at all? If not I would suggest you get her involved in either as soon as possible. Alcoholism is a family problem and her resentments are not the only things she will be dealing with.
You supervising over-night visits, based on what you have said, sounds like a disaster in the making.
Your wife is a grown woman with a child. If distance is prohibiting her from spending as much time with her as she would like then it would seem she should move closer or make a bigger effort to get there.
You mention that this could just be manipulation, to what end? To work her way back in to the house/family? It could be, really hard to say but if that is your gut feeling on it, you are probably right?
Does your Daughter have counselling or attend Al-Ateen at all? If not I would suggest you get her involved in either as soon as possible. Alcoholism is a family problem and her resentments are not the only things she will be dealing with.
You supervising over-night visits, based on what you have said, sounds like a disaster in the making.
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Join Date: Nov 2016
Posts: 8,709
Originally Posted by woodlandlost 
B,
Great reply...I just want to feel validated for doing what I am doing. The AW makes my actions sound over the top...and I have guilt around that for sure.
Great reply...I just want to feel validated for doing what I am doing. The AW makes my actions sound over the top...and I have guilt around that for sure.
That is where team sanity steps in, as Bernadette so aptly called it.
If someone came up to you today and said you know, your Daughter's Aunt Betty is a using addict but gosh she would really like to spend some time with your Daughter, perhaps have overnight visits so they could see a movie etc.
In any sane world would that ever wash? No. Sure, what harm can it do to have my child around an addict!
Unfortunately you can get one foot (or in some cases both) on the insanity ship because you have also lived with it so long. Things that would be shocking to others get to be the norm. Someone passing out on the sofa or floor, staying up all hours of the night drinking. Unable to attend a function or celebration because they are too wasted or hung over. These are not "normal".
This is misplaced guilt. I suggest that you aren't coming between her and your Daughter, addiction is and we all know there is only one person that can fix that.
Community Greeter
Join Date: Aug 2011
Posts: 16,246
wll…...it seems that you are struggling with establishing certain boundaries around the relationship between you and your wife....(with the child in the middle)….
Perhaps some more focus on what are appropriate boundaries....the help of alanon and your therapist should be helpful with that....
Perhaps some more focus on what are appropriate boundaries....the help of alanon and your therapist should be helpful with that....
Community Greeter
Join Date: Aug 2011
Posts: 16,246
wll…..For what it is worth....there are several books written for children who have a parent who is an alcoholic....For the child to read or for an adult to guide them through the book....
The following are just 3 examples...but, there are many more...
1. "I Can Be Me: A Helping Book for Children of Alcoholic Parents"...by Ed.D. Diane S. O'Connor ( for age 4-12)
2. "Mommy's Disease"...by Carolyn Hanna O'Connor
3, "An Elephant in the Living Room" (The Children's Book) ...by Jill M. Hastings
You can find all of them on amazon.com...most at reduced prices if used copy, and some are free on kindle....
****Sorry,if you are already familiar...but, I post these because other parents may be looking for materials to help/talk to their kids.....
The following are just 3 examples...but, there are many more...
1. "I Can Be Me: A Helping Book for Children of Alcoholic Parents"...by Ed.D. Diane S. O'Connor ( for age 4-12)
2. "Mommy's Disease"...by Carolyn Hanna O'Connor
3, "An Elephant in the Living Room" (The Children's Book) ...by Jill M. Hastings
You can find all of them on amazon.com...most at reduced prices if used copy, and some are free on kindle....
****Sorry,if you are already familiar...but, I post these because other parents may be looking for materials to help/talk to their kids.....
Member
Join Date: Jun 2014
Location: Englewood
Posts: 76
Interesting! What’s the youngest you think that a kiddo could attend? My little guy is 9 and I’ve been talking to him about our upcoming changes and he wants to go to an alanon meeting. I am hesitant because I don’t want the content to get too heavy for him.
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Join Date: Aug 2011
Posts: 16,246
Thursdays....I have heard that, sometimes, they have taken kids as young as 8...but, I can't verify that....
I have, also, heard that there are some "Alakid" meetings in some places....for the younger kids....
I don't have kids, anymore....but, I am pretty sure that some others will be along who can better inform you.....
I have, also, heard that there are some "Alakid" meetings in some places....for the younger kids....
I don't have kids, anymore....but, I am pretty sure that some others will be along who can better inform you.....
Member
Join Date: May 2018
Posts: 296
Originally Posted by woodlandlost
Hi All,
I am struggling with how to ease into co-parenting with my EXAW.
She is still presently using, and I saw this first hand this past weekend. Presently we have a verbal arrangement in which EXAW can visit daughter anytime provided there is supervision (from a 3rd party) or through myself. As my EXAW lives out of town it is hard for her to see her daughter. In fact she has only see her once in the last 30 days.
The reason for this arrangement is that the EXAW was drinking around my daughter and has put her into harms way...I got fed up with that and also told her to leave the family home. Which she did...and now is very angry about the situation (unfair etc...)
We have been under this arrangement since start of April 2019 but I can see that things are shifting for her because she seems to be becoming more desperate that her relationship with her daughter is souring. I actually don't want that to happen but I can see my daughter growing distant from her mom and a lot of that has to do with my daughter not ever feeling like her mom has adequately made up for her disappearing acts, missed birthday, driving her drunk etc.... In fact now, my daughter does not want overnight visits with her mom unless I supervise them...which is dangerous for me as there is still a spark between EXAW and myself.
I am feeling so guilty for this...Like I have to mend this relationship...that her using still makes me wonder if this is just another manipulation...
She is in a 12 week OP treatment program but still using...
Advice
I am struggling with how to ease into co-parenting with my EXAW.
She is still presently using, and I saw this first hand this past weekend. Presently we have a verbal arrangement in which EXAW can visit daughter anytime provided there is supervision (from a 3rd party) or through myself. As my EXAW lives out of town it is hard for her to see her daughter. In fact she has only see her once in the last 30 days.
The reason for this arrangement is that the EXAW was drinking around my daughter and has put her into harms way...I got fed up with that and also told her to leave the family home. Which she did...and now is very angry about the situation (unfair etc...)
We have been under this arrangement since start of April 2019 but I can see that things are shifting for her because she seems to be becoming more desperate that her relationship with her daughter is souring. I actually don't want that to happen but I can see my daughter growing distant from her mom and a lot of that has to do with my daughter not ever feeling like her mom has adequately made up for her disappearing acts, missed birthday, driving her drunk etc.... In fact now, my daughter does not want overnight visits with her mom unless I supervise them...which is dangerous for me as there is still a spark between EXAW and myself.
I am feeling so guilty for this...Like I have to mend this relationship...that her using still makes me wonder if this is just another manipulation...
She is in a 12 week OP treatment program but still using...
Advice
You are the only responsible parent your daughter has. An untreated alcoholic is always a risk. I can say this as a solo mum with 2 preschoolers who spend 3 nights with their alcoholic dad... No supervision. It's god awful. My dad was also an alcoholic and it was his inconsistent behaviour that screwed us up. I'm sorry but you're feeling guilty for the woman you still love. You are now your daughter's only parent. Her needs come first. Sorry for being brutal. It took me 5 months of therapy with trauma councillors to let go of feeling guilty for doing the RIGHT thing.
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Join Date: May 2010
Location: USA
Posts: 13,560
I have a DD who is just a little older than yours. She has been through this for quite some time. The best investment I ever made was counseling (with the right counselor) for my children. It gave them a safe place to vent.
Thing is, as they get older, she will recognize a couple of things. One, that you are fighting to do everything you can do to protect her. So keep doing that. Two, that her mother is an alcoholic and there is nothing she can do about that.
She needs to understand the three C's. The she did not cause it, she cannot control it, and she cannot cure it. That addiction to an addict is the same as them needing to breathe. It's not a choice between she and the booze (that's a hard one that my DD still struggles with), and that she is loved no matter what.
She is old enough to receive education on addiction. If you have a Celebrate Recovery around you, many of them have a teen program called the Landing. It's an amazing program and I highly recommend it.
As far as what you can do. Educate yourself about the judges and court in your area as family court has a wide discretion and they all handle alcohol addiction in different ways. Talk to attorneys who understand addiction and are familiar with your judges.
Sending you a big hug.
Thing is, as they get older, she will recognize a couple of things. One, that you are fighting to do everything you can do to protect her. So keep doing that. Two, that her mother is an alcoholic and there is nothing she can do about that.
She needs to understand the three C's. The she did not cause it, she cannot control it, and she cannot cure it. That addiction to an addict is the same as them needing to breathe. It's not a choice between she and the booze (that's a hard one that my DD still struggles with), and that she is loved no matter what.
She is old enough to receive education on addiction. If you have a Celebrate Recovery around you, many of them have a teen program called the Landing. It's an amazing program and I highly recommend it.
As far as what you can do. Educate yourself about the judges and court in your area as family court has a wide discretion and they all handle alcohol addiction in different ways. Talk to attorneys who understand addiction and are familiar with your judges.
Sending you a big hug.
Member
Join Date: Mar 2008
Location: Boston
Posts: 2,946
12 is usually old enough for AlAteen, at least the meetings I've been around, but check your local area:
https://al-anon.org/for-members/grou...urces/alateen/
Peace,
B.
https://al-anon.org/for-members/grou...urces/alateen/
Peace,
B.
Member
Join Date: Mar 2017
Posts: 1,618
I noted that there's "still a spark" between you and the ex-wife. Good for you for noticing this and being self-aware. Also, this is one more HUGE reason to maintain you and your daughter's distance from the ex-wife, and/or outsource supervision to third parties. Kids that age are starting to become super-aware of "sparks", and very impressionable in ways that will shape their own future sparkiness. You don't want your daughter to form her expectations of what it means to be attracted to someone based on her observations of an alcoholic.
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Thread Starter
Join Date: Jun 2019
Posts: 276
WOW. Everyone who responded, THANK YOU
)
I took my daughter to a program called, Bounce Back, which was put on by a substance abuse service designed for kids 11-13 that have parents with addiction. It was a 3 day intensive course and she learned a lot. She has also been doing weekly art therapy sessions where she is able to talk about her mom and learn techniques to deal with the ups and downs. We don't have Al-Ateen where I live (on an small island community), we do have Al-Anon though.
)I took my daughter to a program called, Bounce Back, which was put on by a substance abuse service designed for kids 11-13 that have parents with addiction. It was a 3 day intensive course and she learned a lot. She has also been doing weekly art therapy sessions where she is able to talk about her mom and learn techniques to deal with the ups and downs. We don't have Al-Ateen where I live (on an small island community), we do have Al-Anon though.
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Join Date: Sep 2017
Location: Southern US
Posts: 510
Woodlandlost, that's great. That weekly art therapy sounds like something my daughter would like. Art has been a huge source of therapy for her. I looked on the Alateen site, and it says that when there is no Alateen meeting available, they are more than welcome to attend Alanon. There was also a link for an online Alateen chat group: https://al-anon.org/newcomers/teen-c...-chat-meeting/
Just thought I'd pass that along.
Just thought I'd pass that along.
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