legna

Not here in the friends and family section…but here, at this place in my life. When I first came to this forum I was rather disturbed by comments like, “I would never date an addict – in recovery or not.” Or the idea that if you are with an addict then you will have a lifetime of waiting for the shoe to drop and them pick up again. Or people spreading the idea that an addict in recovery who didn’t warn the person he is dating that he is an addict on their first date is trying to hide something…etc., etc. I’ve been thinking about it these last couple of months though and I can see your point.

What I can’t see is ‘why me’? Why did I turn out the way that I did? How did I find my way out when so few do? I’m a hope to die, low bottom drug addict. When I crawled into the program I was facing seventy years in prison, my 270 lb frame was down to 120 lbs. During detox my heart quit twice and I suffered permanent brain damage as a result and yet…

I’ve got over twenty-one years clean. In my local NA community there are only three people with more clean time than me and I don’t want what they have. I watch people come in and I watch them go out again. While there are things that can rock my world, my wife relapsing and facing life as a result was certainly one of those things, but overall, I’m the happiest person I know. While NA is based on a one day at a time philosophy, I’ve no doubt that I’ll never use again. The idea of changing my mood or thinking by external means holds no appeal to me. The obsession was lifted on day six and I’ve never fantasized or dreamt about using like so many of my peers. My life is and has been ridiculously normal since I got clean and cleaned up my side of the street.

I live in a nice neighborhood where little old ladies bake me sweets and I take out their trash. I volunteer, not to make amends to the community but because I like doing things for others. I pay my bills, respect my wife, and call my father each morning to tell him I love him. I don’t try to get over on anyone, and nothing I do on a daily basis is explained away as, ‘it’s just my addict thinking’.

I really do get what you folks are saying today. There are probably 500 people in NA in this area and I think I could come up with five that I would trust in my house. Why is it that so few get recovery and what did I do different. This isn’t a useless or idle question; I sponsor folks and really wish I could give them what I’ve gotten – but I can’t figure out what I did differently to end up here in this spot today. Honestly, this isn’t an attempt to be arrogant and lift myself up; I’d really love to know and haven’t been able to figure it out from this side. I know there are some double winners here and wondering if they (or anyone) might have some ideas.

lizwig

Thank you for this post legna. I hope someday my son can honestly face recovery. I think that is the difference. Many WANT what you have but are incapable of committing to what it takes to get there, as they say....some are fundamentally incapable of true honesty. Thanks for being such a great role model to the countless individuals (21 years in...I'm guessing there have been thousands!!!) who have been witness to your testimonies. You are a beacon to those who truly want it.

soberlicious

But here's the thing legna, not everyone who encounters you knows that you used to be addicted to drugs. Many may not know your history, or even care, they just know you are a cool guy.

How do we know how many people we encounter throughout our lives who are long recovered? If people are self recovered and don't attend meetings, others wouldn't necessarily know they are one of the ones that "made it out". I've learned that several people I am aquainted with ended a seriously destructive pattern in their lives a significant chunk of time ago.

We can't really know that "so few get recovery", can we? It may be more than we think. I'd like to think so.

Kindeyes

Legna
I am no different than an addict. I had (have) behaviors (and they still crop up from time to time) that are similar to the behavior of an active addict. I am codependent--it's a character defect that I have, I recognize, I accept, and I work on. I am not ashamed or embarrassed by who/what I am.....I just "am". I spent a great deal of time in a state of misery/martyrdom (a self imposed hell) and couldn't figure out WHY. I hit a bottom.....a breakdown of sorts...that made me want to "get better" come hell or high water. I went in pursuit of "recovery". I worked the program I wished my son would.....and it worked for me.

I read here on SR and go to meetings and I come across people day after day who choose to stay in a state of misery, martyrdom--the self imposed hell. And I wonder.....why do I feel so lucky? Just like you.

Why? Because I work hard on me. I'm not perfect--far from it--but I can see how screwed up I was. It works because I work it. People can want something but not want to work for it. Whether they are addicts or codependents or ordinary people.......it's like wanting to win the lottery but never buying lottery tickets. If a person doesn't do what they need to do for themselves to "get better" (or buy a lottery ticket...lol).....it simply won't happen.

You wanted it. You worked for it. You were ready. Lots of folks just aren't ready.....yet.

gentle hugs
ke

incitingsilence

There are no answers to those questions and never will be. It is what it is, life … yours. We all have pages to write, chapters to fill and it will only be when the ink runs dry that …

Paths to walk, choices to make, so many things to learn …

Somehow I do suspect there is more going on then we may realize, but that is a whole another conundrum.

We can’t possibly know all the stories, or relay them.

Could it be in the view … I like soberlicious would like to think there is more as well.

I look around and think how the hell are some that I know even still alive. I mean I am real grateful they are, but there are many others very much the same who have lost their lives. My husband is one of them I wonder about. He wonders too, how the hell is he still here.

Life is a grand mystery, no one should miss anything!

legna

Granted.

I understand what you are saying - well, at least I think I do. The trouble with me accepting that is that... look, a twelve step program is not the only method, and it may not be the best method, but it certainly is a method that has been around a while and has had a measure of success that statistically seems to be on par with other methods.

Since NA has been where I found, or was led, to my answer... it's reasonable to me that in a town with 500 recovering addicts or so I'd find one or two that have something I want. Instead I find myself listening to the grand dame with 26 years clean crying (literally) about the man she's been waiting on for thirteen years to leave his wife. Or the fellow with the most clean time of all the men in this area (25) who has thirteenth stepped every above average looking female who has walked into the rooms for the last quarter century.

And you know something about my history that most don't reading this...that I've spent 24 years as a professional poker player - going where the game is throughout these fifty states and abroad and going to meetings along the way. I mean, I've met literally tens of thousands of recovering addicts. Have I gotten time to really get to know them all? Of course not. On the other hand, I trust my intuition and while I've certainly met very cool people - some of who have what I want... the numbers are dismally small. I'm finding the road less travelled (through NA) becoming barren.

You work hard on you because...? You want it? Okay. But why do you want it? If I look honestly at the question directed at myself, it's because it's fulfilling, it's freedom and it's fun! I mean, even digging through manure would be fun if by doing so you would consistently unearth a $10,000 bill every time you did so. Serenity, freedom, joy... are worth more than money and I found them every time I dug - not the whole bag of serenity or joy perhaps, but another step down that road.

From day one I recognized what I got from working it - how could anyone not notice? How could they think, well I dug around in this pile of $#%& and found $12,000; dug around in that pile over there and uncovered $8500; dug over here and uncovered $10,200. I'd dig some more over there but heck, maybe this time there's nothing there so I guess I'll pass.

Again, I'm not pretending to be perfect...or even close to it...I just don't get it. Recovery is awesome, freedom is worth dying for...and yet so many chose to die - even after a taste at the unlimited buffet. I suppose there's a reason for it and I just don't get to know right now, but searching for it is part of how I work my program. I'm an analyzer...it makes me happy - even when I'm confused like now.

bigsombrero

"There are probably 500 people in NA in this area and I think I could come up with five that I would trust in my house."

With those odds, do you wonder why people here avoid dating addicts?

I am an addict and alcoholic, and quite frankly I am not sure I'd ever date an addict either. Would you? Can you imagine finally getting close enough with someone to trust them, only to see their deviant side lead you back into a joint relapse?

As for your question as to what you're doing differently - you tell me! I often feel I will never relapse and am a good catch, and it's important to keep believing in yourself as I do too. But from a co-dependent perspective, these folks have already been down that road. There are plenty of other options for ex-husbands and wives, and getting out of this circle is part of their journey. Those with sons/daughters, they can look at people like yourself and draw strength in seeing a success story.

As for what you are doing...keep it up. Sounds like it's working.

legna

Well I did, but I'm over that now.

My wife is an addict so yes, I would. She did relapse earlier this year and is back again and coming up on four months. I'm responding to this specifically because the idea that you've put forth, "...lead you back into a joint relapse" is a concept that I hear frequently, but I don't get. There is nothing left for me to learn from drugs, nothing that could happen that could make the idea of taking drugs seem like a good idea. It's like if my wife came down with cancer...I wouldn't try to get it myself too, you know? And yet your perspective about the chance of a joint relapse is pervasive. Why do I not see it that way? What is different in me and how did I get this way?

Will do...whatever it is.

Carlotta

Same with me, I am an alcoholic and a codependent in recovery. It took me many years to be where I am at today: being able to have healthy relationship with people and setting boundaries. I went through the pain of living with an abusive chronic relapser, I stayed sober but it was absolutely awful.
I am not willing to take the risk of getting involved romantically again with an addict/alcoholic even if he is sober, I have seen too many relapses, too many people with long term sobriety keep their character defects and act badly. Like they say: Once burned, twice shy.

allforcnm

I am glad that you made it past your addiction Legna. One thing I see clearly is that you have such a "thinking mind" and you may live one day at a time, but you also stay one step ahead thinking and figuring things out. ( i.e Fluffy) ( big plan to never use again and you meant it!) You are also in many ways what I would call fearless. You put yourself out there in regards to what you want, what you believe in. And I think you accept change graciously.

It must be hard to see people pass through the NA program, but you know there is really no way of knowing if some leave and find recovery elsewhere, or if they are really lost forever in addiction. If you have trouble looking at the many group you've been involved in, and thinking 'I want what they have.'.. isn't it possible others feel this way too, and so they don't stick around? I think there are countless people who have won over their addictions but how would we know? No one would have a clue looking at my husband that he ever struggled with an addiction. He doesn't do NA, doesn't mentor others, doesn't advertise it.

I pray one day we can look back and say "that was 21 years ago" !!
Thank you for being here Legna. Your a great inspiration.

soberlicious

Agreed. That was my point as well. I think the odds are higher than any of us can know. We can't measure just by looking at one demographic. There are millions of "unidentified" recovered folks.

Worth repeating! Not only that, but legna also has the ability to "bridge" the unnecessary gaps people often create between "program people" and "non program people". I think that's important, especially on an Internet forum where lots of people lurk. His message is a strong positive one.