Alex1776

I personally don't like using marijuana, it makes me a bit paranoid and that causes me to become thirsty for a drink. I will also tell you psychiatric drugs hurt me real bad, just read the warning label or type in the name of any so called "non addictive" psychiatric medication into a search engine along with the words "lawsuit" or "withdrawal" and you will find pages and pages of real scary stuff. It was scary for me and I don't believe marijuana is any more dangerous than Rx psychiatric medication.


1. Does marijuana maintenance work for anyone ?

2. Is there any scientific evidence out there proving medical marijuana use or marijuana maintenance helps or hurts people in recovery ?

or any other thoughts ?

Dee74

Hi Alex

I smoked pot daily for 30 years so I have a rather jaundiced view of it.

I certainly wouldn't recommend it to treat any kind of mental illness, or for anyone with any history of substance abuse. Honestly I think that would be a recipe for disaster.

I also find it odd that people decry pharmaceuticals but will happily buy weed from who knows where and grown and dipped in god knows what and declare that must be safer because it's 'natural'.

That being said, if you can go to your Dr, be honest and open about your substance abuse and your mental illness...and if the both of you decide that marijuana is still the best treatment for whatever is ailing you, well ok..your call.

But do involve a professional. Do the best for yourself - get an expert opinion.

There may be other avenues to treat whatever your problem is that you as a layman have no knowledge of.

Don't self medicate.

D

Lorax1981

If someone is smoking marijuana they are not in recovery in my opinion.
-Ted

dox

I'm not sure that I understand: Are we talking about switching to marijuana in order to stay off the booze? If that works for you, then what are you going to use when the weed becomes (and it will become) a problem? cocaine? heroin?

I'm not trying to be funny. Just trying to make a point. As someone who, from an early age, was addicted to cannabis and later switched to alcohol, I can attest that the problem was me -- not my drug of choice.

The symptom is addiction. Whether I choose alcohol, marijuana, food or any other substance I will still be an active addict until I learn to be free from substance addiction. I choose to work the 12 steps of AA. Others have chosen other paths to recovery. But, using (abusing?) marijuana? That's just trading one unhealthy addiction for another unhealthy addiction IMHO.

There is no easy answer, no quick fix, to my problem(s). Accepting that truth was the beginning of the journey.

Threshold

I am also wondering what the med mj would be used for. I think mj has valid medical uses, but which application is being spoken of here.

Alex1776

Marijuana is has only been medical for a few years now and I don't know of any "official" list of medical uses. I don't think the APA and big pharma are going to publish one any time soon.

Here is something I thought of, back in the heyday of "dual diagnosis" I was caught in that dragnet. My alcoholism, including acute and post acute withdrawals (insomnia and hypomania) were labeled as symptoms of bipolar. I was told I needed pills every day for the rest of my life cause of my "brain disease" that can't be tested for with any test known to medical science, instead a silly 10 minute behavioral check list sealed my fate. Don't even get me started.

Anyway I was given these mood pills that totally trashed my creativity and motivation 24/7, I really wasn't making the connection between the pills and the zombie like state. I blamed these effects on being sober. With the blame in the wrong place, I went out and got some marijuana hoping It would help me "feel" life again cause that medication I was on even made music sound dull. I was really craving alcohol and stimulants on these zombie pills but I was bent on being "sober" and decided to only "give in" to marijuana.

The marijuana seemed to give me back creative thoughts and made my music a bit enjoyable again but didn't help as much as I had hoped with the lack of motivation, just a tiny bit

What happened in the end was my Rx for what I call the "zombie pills" ran out and in less then a week I began to feel life again and figured out what my problem really was but the nightmare was just beginning cause those pills cause withdrawal reactions from hell including insomnia that drove me into a psychosis full of panic attacks. The hospital of course blames these withdrawal reactions on my "illness" and attempts to coerce more of the same pills on me after I was dumb enough to go there for "help", but that another story.

I just started this discussion cause I think now that marijuana is medical and I used it to try and overcome whats called anhedonia and had some success I think the stuff has some useful properties. Anhedonia is a common reason people relapse, I know that personally. I also know that withdrawal reactions from marijuana are not reported to be even close in severity to most of those psychiatric drugs.

Technically speaking marijuana is a psychiatric drug, I'm hoping this discussion stays scientific because the politics of Medical marijuana and addiction recovery could fill 100 pages. I guess that does have to be talked about also so why not ?

Dee74

If you're basing your dislike of pharmaceuticals on one experience, I think you need to get real.

Unless your marijuana is prescribed it's not medicinal, Alex.
I 'self medicated' for years - but really...I was just getting high.

Anhedonia is a common problem for long term substance abusers who become sober. I had it too.

The best way to treat that is not to bombard it with other drugs but to let your brain recover...that takes a few months...be patient.

D

Alex1776

I don't bash all of them, one in particular I found rather interesting back in the day, its called Lysergic acid diethylamide, also known as lysergide its a semisynthetic drug of the ergoline family, well known for its psychological effects which can include altered thinking processes, closed and open eye visuals, synesthesia, an altered sense of time and spiritual experiences...

I give it 5 stars.

On the other hand you have things like "clonazepam" a lousy anxiety reducer compared to others in its class that usually causes its users to have panic attacks if they ever try to stop taking it.

Zero stars here.

Then you have things like brain disabling "Abilify" an anti-psychotic seen on millions of fraudulent T.V advertisements that trick unsuspecting viewers into thinking its an anti depressant by saying the word "anti-depressant" about 2 dozen times during the fraudulent T.V advertisements played every 20 minutes on some channels. Side effects may include :

Fever, stiff muscles, confusion, sweating, fast or uneven heartbeats; jerky muscle movements you cannot control; sudden numbness or weakness, headache, confusion, or problems with vision, speech, or balance;fever, chills, body aches, flu symptoms, sores in your mouth and throat; increased thirst or urination, loss of appetite, fruity breath odor, drowsiness, dry skin, nausea, and vomiting; seizure (convulsions);

• thoughts of hurting yourself;
  
• feeling like you might pass out;
  
• jaundice (yellowing of your skin or eyes); or
  
• urinating less than usual or not at all.
  
• choking or trouble swallowing;
  
• dizziness, drowsiness, or weakness;
  
• constipation, mild stomach upset;
  
• headache, anxiety;
  
• sleep problems (insomnia); or
  
• weight gain.

and of course death as well.


I give it half a star for at least proving that the pharmaceutical industry has absolutely no soul whatsoever. Further proof of this can be found by typing in the Name "Abilify" and view the new selling sickness ad campaign targeting children and youth.

Does your child act like a child ? Ask your doctor about brain disabling "Abilify".

Then we have "Paxil" also known by the trade names Aropax, Pexeva, Seroxat and Sereupin.

If you are one of the lucky ones that doesn't loose 100% of your sexual desires on this stuff and have a child, guess what ? Paxil causes birth defects !

1 star just for being so evil !

Alex1776

I know that now !!!! It took being a human pharmacy and some real bad results to finally figure that out.

dardanella

Alex, not to be a downer but I
would love to start a new thread, a real discussion about anhedonia. I've heard it can last for months....how about 30 months? People who are really experiencing long term anhedonia are typically not logging in to forums because we are apathetic zombies who tried all the herbal, nutrition and 'just wait it out' suggestions years ago. Some people seem to recover in months. This is great for them and I wish I could actually 'feel' happy for them but anhedonia has robbed me of any emotion at all. I cried once several months back and it felt so good to feel anything. I can fake it. I know how a normal person would react to good news so for a few minutes i can smile and say "I'm so excited." I do this for the benefit of the people I love. I'm not depressed, I'm nothing and so tired of it. Just the damn truth. (Oh, and I miss LSD too)

dardanella

As for Marijuana, I live in a state where it is legal for medical and recreational use. I have had a prescription for around three years. I cannot smoke it, it freaks me out. I have been clean from opiates for about three years but of course I'm living with extreme back pain again. Concentrated cannabis oil does alleviate the acute pain so I can get some sleep. I take them a couple times a month to break the pain cycle along with ibuprofen and applying ice. If anybody here thinks I'm not 'clean' I'm on the wrong forum.

NYCDoglvr

Smoking grass makes you high. You can't be sober if you're high from anything, including grass.

Alex1776

I agree , but I do like making long threads by stirring things up .

dardanella

I do this so i don't take opiates for the excruciating pain i deal with every day. I do this twice a month so i don't take muscle relaxers or pain pills of any kind. I don't endorse it but if you think I'm getting "loaded" you are misinformed. I hope you don't drink coffee or eat sugar. Otherwise you are not 'clean' either.

dardanella

Alex 1776 and NYCDoglvr I was responding to the OP's question.
"Does marijuana maintenance work for anyone ?"
Was that a rhetorical question? I was just trying to contribute an honest answer.

To repeat, I don't smoke weed. I use it occasionally as prescribed for temporary relief of extreme pain.

As I said I have been clean from opiates for nearly three years. I have never been to a 12 step meeting, i did it alone, after an 8 year addiction that almost killed me several times. After that accomplishment, I began eating organic, whole food, limiting sugar and salt intake and quit my beloved coffee habit. I don't even watch t.v anymore, (feels like an addiction to me). I don't smoke cigarettes or play computer games. I am barely able to walk more than 1/2 mile without unbearable pain. I am not addicted to cannabis concentrate. You are totally entitled to your opinion and for some forum members I'm sure any deviation from total abstinence is unacceptable. I did mention that I'm not endorsing it to others. I'm just going for total honesty here as I thought you were asking.

Threshold

I think it would be a great idea to start a thread on anhedonia, it is VERY common, a common reason people abuse substances in the first place and a common issue that leads to relapse.

Threshold

I never smoked pot. Apparently it has a vast variety of effects on moods, feelings, etc...like nearly any psycho active drug.

I don't know anyone who is on med MJ for mood issues. I have a friend who lost her appetite as the result of being under anethesia and has an Rx for it for that reason. She has the pills. I know people who have Rx for pain management.

It would seem from what some people who've used it have told me, that it could have a valid role as a psych drug, but I'm no dr, never used and don't know anything about it's effects and whether or not it's appropriate for that use.

I do believe that it's best to give life straight up a real shot before we does ourselves with anything new. My self medication experiments turned out bad for me.

My current approach is to see if I can address the cause of why I feel too much of somethings and not enough of others and see if I can get to the root of things.

Carlotta

Marijuana is legal in my state and most people I know smoke.
I was never a heavy pot smoker but chose to quit doing it when I quit drinking. I don't want to substitute one drug for another and I can't afford to be baked all day long (too much going on plus I pack up the pounds).
Marijuana can be an excellent thing for people going through chemio who are nauseous with no appetite and also for people who live in chronic pain as long as they are not addicts.
I have an addictive personality so I chose to stay away from mind altering substances since I don t trust myself to do things in moderation.

Alex1776

I think the definition of sobriety and recovery 2 different things.

Sobriety is being "sober" , Recovery is getting better.

I have a friend (with major OCD) that just took a "white chip" again this week at A.A and he was totally devastated by the experience. While most just judged him and everyone else was giving him advice to stay "sober" based on 12 step teachings my advice was If your program of recovery includes going out and getting drunk every 60-90 days like you have been doing, so what, you don't have to prove anything to these people.

I have seen people die after the guilt and shame induced by this day / time count status ranking system causes them to stay out after they "go out" and do a little using. I know this friend of mine drinks harder when he does go out to cover these guilt shame feelings. Where in that "big book" does it say anything about mandatory taking of "time chips" ????? WTF !

Sorry about the rant. but grrrr !

Im glad the marijuana works for you. I know its alot less damaging to the body than "sober approved" pain relievers such as Cymbalta that have inspired 100s of angry web pages and a few high profile class action lawsuits cause so many 1000s of people have been hurt by it.

legna

I'd like to weigh in on this discussion. I know literally hundreds of people around recovery circles who try to figure out a way to smoke marijuana to get high while claiming it is for medicinal purposes. I know one who takes marijuana that I consider sober and in recovery.

He's a friend who has excruciating chronic pain. I've sat up with his wife while we listened to him cry in his sleep. I've flipped his mattress and changed his sheets in the middle of the night because it is soaked through with his sweat. He stayed clean. I attended physical therapy sessions and doctor visits with him as he declined any pain pills again and again. His HMO doctor finally suggested that he try marijuana. She couldn't prescribe it herself (because she worked for Kaiser) but suggested he go to a doctor who could. He declined again. Two months later, my wife and I, his wife and his sponsor - all of us in the program, sat down with him and talked about a very controlled attempt. He acquiesced. He said he could make it through the day but he decided he would take a small amount before bed - but not smoked because it seemed too 'drug culturie' <-- not a word I know. He buys butter at a medicinal marijuana store, has a cup of tea and a slice of buttered bread before bed...and he sleeps. No crying out, no night sweats...he gets six solid uninterrupted hours before it wears off. Been this way for a year and a half. One slice of buttered bread just before bed.

I don't believe that I can be convinced that he is not sober and in recovery.