intention

I was at a strong recovery meeting today, plenty of talk about the 12 Steps being the solution.

Then a newcomer shares and says she is so sorry to hear all our sad stories but she is feeling really optimisic, although she thinks that may change and she may end up like us (being sad) ????

This is not the first time I have experienced this so I am mindful when sharing about difficulties to talk about them in the context of solving them with the program, as others are who share the solution.

But whether the message is heard is another matter.

Mark75

Maybe the newcomer is not always ready to hear the message. Perhaps there is an expectation that just by attending a meeting, that they will be recovered, the world will know peace and ponies will come down from the sky.

Recovery, good recovery, is a journey of self examination, humility, leveling of pride and amends. Happy Joyous and Free are feelings that come after a lot of work. It is, I think, overwhelming for some.

True joy and inner peace is not being all happy and fun. It is the reward of a difficult journey. Keeping it means giving it away, service... If that message is not delivered along with the promises, the newcomer will be done a disservice. IMO.

Or maybe, the newcomer that says that doesn't yet know hopelessness and desperation?

Well, hmm, I hope my post isn't too much of a downer. I am struggling myself lately, a little... But I always remain hopeful and I have faith... because of the program of AA.

Mark

Norther

I hope not to offend anyone, but I do wonder if enough attention and awareness is devoted to newcomers in AA. I have seen newcomers hanging uncomfortably around the periphery while all the regulars at a meeting spend all their time talking to one another before the meeting. At times, because of this sort of thing, newcomers are never greeted at all. (It may be that they want to go unnoticed, but I think it is irresponsible to assume so.) Wouldn't greeting newcomers be part of twelfth-step work? I go up and say hi to them, but I think it might be better if someone with more sobriety than I stepped up.

See tradition five.

Mark75

Norther... IDK, At my home group I have been confused at times... those with the longest sobriety don't always seem to reach out as much as I would want... but it gives me a chance to go up and offer the hand AA... sometimes I wonder if that's the point... to allow me that privilege... ???

No, I think perhaps someone still pretty new in the rooms has a lot to offer when greeting a brand new member.

Mark

Tommyh

could just be a pink cloud episode,who knows?
give her a couple more months and I hope she still is that happy

Brucel

Thanks for the post,
We have a designated greeter that welcomes the newcomer. If someone goes more into the mess than the message someone usually finds some humor in it and comments. Were just people, and for me I never personally saved anyone with my message, though I might have bored them close to death. It was the message of hope intertwined with personal calamity that got my attention. God Bless

intention

I think you make some very good points. In this particular case the newcomer was out of a 3rd detox but this time was "different" but for no particular reason.

In her mind I guess going from being hopelessly drunk to sober and clear headed is recovery. When she hears the stories of those who have recovered from suicide attempts, prision, being sectioned under the mental health act, she doesn't hear the recovered, only the sad story of the past.

As you say it is overwhelming. It's a lot to take in when you have only had a few days sober.

Sorry to hear you are struggling just at the moment.....your post didn't seem like a downer to me at all. Thanks for your thoughts, I found them helpful.

intention

Ok I am guilty here. I only get to a couple of day meetings and most of the meetings are in the evening, so I very often see "new" people at the meetings I go to, only to find out that they have been around for years and they just have the day off work and decide to go to a meeting. Sometimes I am reluctant to talk to them - fear of making a fool out of myself...awkwardness meeting new people - I know, it's something I am working on.

I don't think anyone greeted this woman but she did walk in just as the meeting was started. I am glad she shared and we were able to approach her after and give her some literature, numbers and we did have a good 5 minute conversation. Hopefully she will come back and hear more of the message.

I agree with Mark, I think that someone like you does have something to give to the newcomer in greeting them too.

DayTrader

My first instinct is to wonder just how good a meeting it really was.

I've sat at tables with people with 7 ppl with 2 - 15 years and one new guy. I then listened to them all TELL the newcomer their stupid war-story ONE MORE TIME, heard them talk about all the trouble booze causes, and finish with "but I'm glad I'm here in AA." Then.....after the meeting...... I've heard those same AA regulars talk about what a great table it was for that new guy. Guess who's missing the boat? It's NOT the new man/woman.

We deal in ATTRACTION. What's attractive about a ridiculous recounting of one idiot drunk's past......mine included? Nothing. Newcomers don't even know the steps let alone understand them. They're sitting there scared as hell, wondering if they're really an alcoholic, wondering if things really ARE that bad, wondering if they'll ever be able to have fun in life EVER again, hearing all these crazy words they don't understand (alcoholic, sponsor, work the steps, powerless over alcohol, life's unmanageable, etc), and they're full of doubt that they're in the right place.

Did anyone ask that newcomer if they knew what an alcoholic was? Did anyone explain what alcoholISM is and then explain the 3-fold disease? Did anyone talk to them about what God has done in their life and how WONDERFUL life can be once you surrender and start relying upon God to do for you what you couldn't do for yourself? Did everyone who spoke TALK AT the new person? Did all the "regulars" decide they were suddenly junior therapists and wax poetic about things they "knew" about life rather than from the Big Book? How many people went up to that newcomer after the meeting, gave him/her their number, got the newcomer's number and has called the newcomer since the meeting to say hi and see how they are doing? How many people offered to be a temporary sponsor to help that newcomer understand the program and work them through the steps?

My bet...... it wasn't such a good meeting after all. That's my experience anyway.

I'm not trying bust anyone's balls and I'm absolutely NOT accusing you or your meeting of being crumby. I've been part of that crap I described above myself. I've been just as much at fault as anyone. Selfishness and self-centeredness, is the root of my problems too.

Far too often our OWN false egos don't want to admit we're doing a poor job of carrying THE message to a newcomer - Find God / Help Others.


/.rantover.\

Pagekeeper

I would feel great after coming off the withdrawls of a hard binge. Life was new. Colors were brighter. I felt giddy and hopeful for a few weeks, sometimes as long as a month or two. I suppose this is what is referred to as the pink cloud.

Then BAM. I was restless, irritable, and discontent. Couldn't stand having a sober mind. Those pink clouds had shorter and shorter durations until the last time I came to AA and had NO pink cloud to speak of. Not even a for a day. I was a nervous, easily startled, frightened mess of a desperate wreck. For me, that is the state I had to be in in order to hear the message. If I had felt any better, emotionally or physically, it would've went through one ear and out the other. Our book says much of the same--"Most alcoholics have to be pretty badly mangled before they really commence to solve their problems.”

This was true in my case.

DayTrader

I'd argue that what we're calling a "Pink Cloud" is quite simply feeling God working inside of you and doing for you what you can't do for yourself. Pink Cloud.....!?!?!??? That's how GOD feels.

.....or, we can go back to managing our own lives (poorly) and avoid that awesome feeling of God for good.

BP44

I was at a meeting the other night and before the meeting I was talking to a guy who is about 60 days sober. I had noticed him get up and leave before the meeting really got started the night before. I asked him what happened and he said, " I started getting agitated because the guy was taking too long to read " How It Works". He then said, " I just wish once people would talk about the great things that have happened in their life since they got sober. JUST ONCE DAMMIT". Now, had I been on my A game I would have responded, " You know, that's what we talked about last night, it's a shame you left early" But the reality is that all I could think about was this.....What in the Hell is this guy hearing? Because this all we talk about. We share in our group about lives being transformed. Our meetings are literature based and solution oriented. And then I had to remember that I could only hear when I could hear, and I could only see when I could see. Not every newcomer is ready for hope. And not every newcomer will hear hope, even when that is all that's being shared.

Taking5

I am out of town on business and hit a meeting last Sunday. A guy there identified himself as being at his first AA meeting ever (they actually ask this question at the beginning of the meeting). He had been in jail for 4 months - and the evidently don't have AA meetings in jail in this town.

I also identified myself as an out of town visitor when that question was asked. Several drunkalogs later, the meeting came to a close. Immediately afterward several people came up to me and started asking about AA in Mobile AL, etc. and I changed focus asking "Isn't someone going to give the new guy a big book?". I was then asked if I would like to give him one and I responded that as I might not ever be at that meeting again that maybe a regular should present it to him.

They did get him a BB, but I was appalled that at a meeting of 50 people no one put the newcomer first. In this meeting I have severe doubts that the newcomer would ever get the message, JMHO.

shaun00

i agree.........but then its also worth remembering the "still suffering" may not be just the newcomer.......it may be the one with a few years strung together...

Peter

New comers are quicker to identify with the troubles they hear at a meeting.

They do not yet understand the language of recovery or how recovery works in our lives.

I believe that is why we often hear newcomers lamenting that all they hear at a meeting are people talking about their problems.

If there is a newcomer in the room I try to remember my first meeting and share from that perspective. Spouting recovery slogans will probably not mean much to a newcomer.

navysteve

And some say there is no such thing as a "bad meeting". That is terrible. There was a great article in the Grapevine a few years ago about who is saving a seat for the newcomer? It showed on the cover a bunch of seats with keys on them (that is how many save a seat for themselves). The cool thing is, that simple actions like the one you described have the power to change a whole group for the better.

Pagekeeper

Each person has a place in a meeting, just like each person has a place in God's world. Some may carry the message of the 12 steps in an insightful manner that is attractive not just to the new person, but to the one who has years. From reading Intention's posts here on SR, if she's even half as articulate at meetings, then she is helping the newcomer by carrying the solution.

Others may not be as articulate, but they may be the one to approach the newcomer. Still another may reach someone with a war story--when I first came in that is all I could identify with. A woman shared that she hid her vodka bottles and I could relate to that because I hid mine too! It got me thinking maybe I wasn't that different from these people.

For me, these days I go to a meeting, share my experience, carry the message as best as I can, and if I develop a resentment over how a meeting is run or toward an individual in that meeting or something that was said, I write it down in that first column and take it all the way to 4th column.

intention

Yes, that is exactly how it was.


Good points to make, thanks. I have to remember that it is God's will as to who actually hears the message.

intention

I must admit that I am not sure I would have been brave (if that is the right word) enough to stand up and make that suggestion that Dgillz did about the book and the newcomer, in a meeting that I didn't usually go to.

Maybe that group has changed now, just by the actions of one person. That's something for me to think about.

Chops

When people used recovery or sobriety in gradeable terms you freaked me out as a newcomer.... you still do 2 years later. "Good sobriety, quality sobriety", all is in the eye of beholder. Its an impossible concept to grasp since any single person can reset the bar. Thus it confuses me to this day.

Sober = Sober

How about starting at staying away from a drink of booze for one day?