Brain damage from alcohol
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Join Date: Sep 2003
Location: Raleigh, NC
Posts: 9
Brain damage from alcohol
I need to talk with someone that has an alcoholic with "wet brain" or the medical term is Korsakoff syndrome. I feel like I am going through this alone. It is a nightmare.
My ex who is the father on my 2 boys does not remember the last 6 years and thinks we are still married. He has been in an institution since Dec 2006.
Please post if you have any experience with this.
My ex who is the father on my 2 boys does not remember the last 6 years and thinks we are still married. He has been in an institution since Dec 2006.
Please post if you have any experience with this.
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Join Date: Dec 2004
Posts: 3,672
I believe the correct term is Wernicke-Korsakoff syndrome. I don't know much about it except that it's a brain disorder caused by a lack of vitamin B (thiamen). Apparently, alcohol abuse robs an addict's body of or blocks the absorption of vitamin B. I know when my boyfriend went through rehab, his doctors put him on a regime of thiamen for several months.
Wernicke-Korsakoff syndrome is non-reversible and progressive and is generally a sign of end-stage alcoholism. I learned about this syndrome when I was doing internet research on the term "end-stage alcoholism."
Wernicke-Korsakoff syndrome is non-reversible and progressive and is generally a sign of end-stage alcoholism. I learned about this syndrome when I was doing internet research on the term "end-stage alcoholism."
cunning. baffling. powerful.
Join Date: Feb 2007
Location: NY
Posts: 183
Wernicke-Korsakoff Syndrome is actually a pair of syndromes: Wernicke's encephalopathy and Korsakoff psychosis that always appear together. Thus the term Wernicke-Korsakoff is used to describe them.
They are the end result of chronic Thiamine (Vitamin B1) deficiency.
Thiamine deficiency is seen in approximately one fourth of chronic alcoholics admitted to emergency rooms in the US as well as in patients who have had gastric bypass surgery or other gastric disturbances (cancer, gastritis, persistant vomiting...) and in developing countries; it is a symptom of malnourishment. Thiamine is required for normal nerve function in the peripheral nervous system and it's chief targets are the peripheral nerves, heart, and finally the brain (in that order).
Before Wernicke-Korsakoff's signs are seen, 2 other syndromes preceed it. The first signs of serious Thiamine deficiency are "peripheral polyneuropathies" - damage to the nerves of the feet and hands. They become paralyzed and insensitive to sensory stimulation like pain, heat, and touch. The ankle or wrist will "drop" limply because the nerves do not communicate with the muscles.
This can be reversed with Thiamine supplementation. The nerves themselves aren't damaged, only the myelin (like wire insulation) which can be replaced with proper nutrition.
If the Thiamine deficiency continues, there will be cardiovascular problems. The heart will become enlarged and weak, failing to pump enough blood so that eventually peripheral edema (swelling) develops. This too can be reversed with proper nutritional supplementation. (This should not be confused with "cardiomyopathy" - a degenerative heart disease common in alcoholics. Cardiomyopathy is caused solely be the toxic effects of ethanol on the heart rather than any nutritional deficiency.)
Finally, if the deficiency continues for long enough, Wernicke-Korsakoff syndrome will appear. In the West this syndrome is primarily associated with alcoholics due to both the fact that chronic alcoholics have poor nutrition and the process is accelerated by the toxic effects of too much alcohol. Very occasionally Wernicke-Korsakoff will develop by itself, but it is usually accompanied by cardiac problems and polyneuropathies.
The symptoms of Wernicke's encephalopathy are ophthalmoplegia (eye paralysis), nystagmus, ataxia of the gait (clumsy walking), and a derangement of mental function (listlessness and disorientation). Korsakoff's psychosis takes the form of retrograde amnesia (past memory recall impairment) as well as the inability to acquire new information, and confabulation (lying). Neither one occurs separately - they are sucessive stages of a single nervous system disease. The symptoms come from a degeneration of specific areas of the brain: the optic chiasm (where the optic nerves join), the mammilary bodies (part of the thalamus), and the cerebellum (the part of the brain that controls balance and coordination).
Once the degeneration has reached this point: Wernicke encephalopathy is reversible with Thiamine supplementation. Korsakoff's syndrome, however, is non-reversible
Hopefully this has increased your understanding of Wernicke-Korsakoff syndrome. Though Thiamine deficiency in alcoholics is a common finding, Wernicke-Korsakoff is the result of long term deficiency and generally there are many many signs before it affects the brain.
I'm not sure what to say about your ex, because it is possible that he is suffering from something else that is affecting his brain. Has he actually been diagnosed with Wernicke-Korsakoff syndrome?
~SK
They are the end result of chronic Thiamine (Vitamin B1) deficiency.
Thiamine deficiency is seen in approximately one fourth of chronic alcoholics admitted to emergency rooms in the US as well as in patients who have had gastric bypass surgery or other gastric disturbances (cancer, gastritis, persistant vomiting...) and in developing countries; it is a symptom of malnourishment. Thiamine is required for normal nerve function in the peripheral nervous system and it's chief targets are the peripheral nerves, heart, and finally the brain (in that order).
Before Wernicke-Korsakoff's signs are seen, 2 other syndromes preceed it. The first signs of serious Thiamine deficiency are "peripheral polyneuropathies" - damage to the nerves of the feet and hands. They become paralyzed and insensitive to sensory stimulation like pain, heat, and touch. The ankle or wrist will "drop" limply because the nerves do not communicate with the muscles.
This can be reversed with Thiamine supplementation. The nerves themselves aren't damaged, only the myelin (like wire insulation) which can be replaced with proper nutrition.
If the Thiamine deficiency continues, there will be cardiovascular problems. The heart will become enlarged and weak, failing to pump enough blood so that eventually peripheral edema (swelling) develops. This too can be reversed with proper nutritional supplementation. (This should not be confused with "cardiomyopathy" - a degenerative heart disease common in alcoholics. Cardiomyopathy is caused solely be the toxic effects of ethanol on the heart rather than any nutritional deficiency.)
Finally, if the deficiency continues for long enough, Wernicke-Korsakoff syndrome will appear. In the West this syndrome is primarily associated with alcoholics due to both the fact that chronic alcoholics have poor nutrition and the process is accelerated by the toxic effects of too much alcohol. Very occasionally Wernicke-Korsakoff will develop by itself, but it is usually accompanied by cardiac problems and polyneuropathies.
The symptoms of Wernicke's encephalopathy are ophthalmoplegia (eye paralysis), nystagmus, ataxia of the gait (clumsy walking), and a derangement of mental function (listlessness and disorientation). Korsakoff's psychosis takes the form of retrograde amnesia (past memory recall impairment) as well as the inability to acquire new information, and confabulation (lying). Neither one occurs separately - they are sucessive stages of a single nervous system disease. The symptoms come from a degeneration of specific areas of the brain: the optic chiasm (where the optic nerves join), the mammilary bodies (part of the thalamus), and the cerebellum (the part of the brain that controls balance and coordination).
Once the degeneration has reached this point: Wernicke encephalopathy is reversible with Thiamine supplementation. Korsakoff's syndrome, however, is non-reversible
Hopefully this has increased your understanding of Wernicke-Korsakoff syndrome. Though Thiamine deficiency in alcoholics is a common finding, Wernicke-Korsakoff is the result of long term deficiency and generally there are many many signs before it affects the brain.
I'm not sure what to say about your ex, because it is possible that he is suffering from something else that is affecting his brain. Has he actually been diagnosed with Wernicke-Korsakoff syndrome?
~SK
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Join Date: Sep 2003
Location: Raleigh, NC
Posts: 9
12 years ago
I'm reading my post from 12 years ago. Yes my AH did have Wernicke-Korsakoff or wet brain. He has long term memory but no short term memory. He now lives in a group home since this happened in 2006. Very sad that at 42 years of age he cannot take care of himself as he has no executive function. He is now 54. I have never met anyone in all my years of Alanon that had an alcoholic with this disability. Would like to hear from someone else if there is anyone out there.
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Join Date: Jan 2017
Posts: 774
Hi Purplesky. When I was in rehab there was a woman who was in for pill addiction. She said her father has this condition. He has been hospitalised for years, much like your ex, though he is a lot older (in his 70s I think.)
I will ask around in my AA group and see if anyone has any more info.
I will ask around in my AA group and see if anyone has any more info.
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Join Date: Oct 2017
Location: uk
Posts: 2,428
Originally Posted by purplesky 
I'm reading my post from 12 years ago. Yes my AH did have Wernicke-Korsakoff or wet brain. He has long term memory but no short term memory. He now lives in a group home since this happened in 2006. Very sad that at 42 years of age he cannot take care of himself as he has no executive function. He is now 54. I have never met anyone in all my years of Alanon that had an alcoholic with this disability. Would like to hear from someone else if there is anyone out there.
When I worked in a nursing home many years ago, there was a lady with this disease. All the other residents were very elderly in the home. This lady stood out as she was so much younger.
In her 40's I would think. She had a very strong, slim, reasonably fit body. She was empty though, her mind was gone. I was told alcohol had destroyed the functionality of her mind. She needed full personal care, could do nothing for herself. Need to be guided.
She was an empty shell. She did as asked by the nursing staff. Followed instructions, I feel without really knowing what was going on. Was very quiet and gentle.
The most shocking part to me was that I was told she had been in the home for about ten years already and could easily live right through to old age, due to her strong, healthy body.
This contrasted with many of the other very elderly residents with failing, old bodies but sharp, alert minds.
Recalling this has brought tears to my eyes. It was so terribly sad.
I recall in her room she had an oil painting of a fabulous young woman. I had just thought it was a general painting. Someone then mentioned it was of picture of this lady in her youth.
Hope this post helps and is maybe of comfort to you. Sending you understanding and empathy.
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Join Date: May 2010
Posts: 1,254
It was mentioned that this could also lead to cardiovascular and eye problems. The alcoholic here has developed/experienced cardiovascular, swelling and eye issues among other things yet claims the b vitamins in those sports drinks are enough. I was always heard modified water soluble vitamins don't have the same effect has the more natural slowing absorbing ones.
He started experiencing these issues at least 30 years ahead of schedule when it comes to family history. Don't even want to get into his convenient memory.
He started experiencing these issues at least 30 years ahead of schedule when it comes to family history. Don't even want to get into his convenient memory.
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