drainedwife

I am a bit confused about whether this "disease" is exactly that and when the addict really has choices that they have control over.

My ah brings drugs into the house when i tell him not too...That is his choice right? he has control over "Where" he uses, doesnt he?

Also, is the craving so strong that it controls everything else in their lives?
How come some addicts are functioning and others arent?

They had a choice the first time they decided to use...I can understand at 19, 20 years old...the experimenting that goes on with kids...but how is it at age 35, 40, 45, 50...that people who should be wise enough and know the risks....turn to drugs??? Do they still think they are invinsible at that age, as kids do?

"when the addict hits his bottom, he will then usually make a CHOICE to turn his life around" We hav all heard this before...it is a disease that they have no control over....or do they??

hope213

they make a bad chioce when they first use at any age. it is a choice when they first get started, later it developes into a disease.it is all up to them to turn it around.pretty much like going to the dr.& getting medication for any other disease. this is how i feel.if it is left to "grow" it does not get any better.

teke

i agree that addiction is a desease of the mind. what that means to me is that i have an addictive personality. i can easily get addicted to most anything or anyone.

i choose to use drugs at a later age, but at the time, i did not understand that i did have an addictive nature and i did not understand drug abuse. strange but true. i believe that i made the choice to use in the first place , but in the end, i feel as if i had opened the door to being controlled by my addictive nature that was set in motion by my doc.

i believe that at first most addicts look functional, but as the desease progresses, the functional part go out the window. some take longer than others.

the urge to use is very very strong, and it will take a do or die kind of determination to fight that urge and a lot of addicts have to get to that place before they are so miserable that they are willing to do whatever it takes to get clean and stay clean. addiction is a very hard habit to kick and it does take help, but it will take for the addict himself to realize that his life is out of control and they he needs help and a commitment to stick to the help. jmho still praying for ya

parentrecovers

i believe it is a disease - not curable, but controlable. blessings, k

daisylady

My AH who is rehab right now said to me the other day- "I know that addiction is a disease but I need to accept some responsibllity for my actions, I chose to use cocaine for the first time, and now I have to work the steps to recover from the disease" I agree with him.

I think the disease hits addicts when they are not looking, it is sneaky and before you know it, you are addicted. It seems like addicts think they are controlling the drugs while using with friends, recreationally and socially. However, the drugs are controlling them, before they know it, THEY are going to the dealers house to score, not just getting it or sharing it with their "friends"... This all makes sense to me and it is how I deal with it.

Prayers to you and your family.

Cupicake

I think from a scientific standpoint the chemical workings of the mind that causes the cravings is a disease because once that "gate" is opened by drug use, if you have an addictive personality, that gate can never really close again but the part of the addict that gives into the "calling of the cravings" is where the choice plays a part. You could give into it or deny it. To deny it is where the hard work comes in. It's almost like having that piece of chocolate cake or whatever dessert or denying yourself the dessert. You don't really need it but your mind and body says it's calling your name.

faith123

From my experience with my addict, he learned to control some of his actions with me. He learned what he had to do if I continued to let him live with me, and what things I wouldn't tolerate. After he left me destitute, without food or money for gas a few times, I raised so much cain about that, that he made sure he never left me like that again. It didn't stop him from leaving and going off on his binges, but he did have enough brain left to know he wouldn't be coming back home many more times to me, if he left me like that. Dont' get me wrong, I was brainwashed to put up with all the things he did. My point is, he still had some reasoning ability left. He made some choices. Like the last one he made. He thought I was going to get a big sum of money. He made sure he stayed around till I found out I wasn't getting it. The minute we got home without the money, was the minute he left. I haven't seen him since. He also had enough sense to know what kinds of things he could steal from me and get away with for a while before I discovered them missing. He didn't steal the TV, or the stereo, or the keyboard. It was always something little, like my grandma's gold wedding ring, or the fishing rods, or the tools that I didn't use very often. That took some thinking. He wasn't totally out of control. He knew how to protect his interests. He also knows he has to drive safely to keep from being arrested. They're not stupid. They are some of the smartest, most manipulative people I have ever come in contact with. They are thinking and making choices every minute of the day, planning how they will get their next hit.

cinderellawkids

I think thats why its a mental disease.
Think of all the people who know they are going to get UAed and if positive go to jail. None of them want to go to jail, but they still do the drug. I remember AH would convince himself its okay to use because being in ajil meant he was at home miserable, but whereever you go there you are, and happiness still never came

BigSis

Bio/Psycho/Social disease... that is how my kids' rehab described it.

It has a biological base... it is genetic and inherited. If you never awaken the disease, perhaps you will NEVER become an addict. But did you know that the Tylenol I gave to my kids in the 80's contained alcohol? Too late... it was awake (as an aside, I had to call poison control on my now-addicted daughter at age 2 for drinking an entire bottle of Tylenol that she climbed her dresser to reach).

Psychological - I have met lots and lots of addicts and alcoholic in my meetings. Even sober, alcoholics have some common personality traits. In a room of alcholics and alanons... you can almost "guess" the program of origin. Perhaps some personality traits (that "all about me" and "more more more!" stuff) are inherited, too? Wouldn't surprise me.

Social.... most of us know about the pressure to use, the availability of drugs/alcohol, the acceptance of using as a societal norm. If you are diabetic, you also experience this. Food and drugs are part and parcel of our culture.

Nope. I don't believe it is a choice... not like a "normie" gets to choose.

I heard someone tell me one day - "I eat for fuel, I really don't understand those who diet".

That comment struck me as foreign as the comment "I am a social drinker, I don't understand why someone can't have only 2 drinks".

And in some social circles, "I am a social smoker, I don't understand why you have to be high all week long."


When I try to take my experience as an addict and apply it to an "earthperson", it sounds silly.

To me, it sounds just as silly when an "earthperson" tries to take their experience and apply it to an addict.

It just doesn't fit.

I don't know if this helps, but it helped me to get my head around why the addicts I love behave to differently from me.

HKAngel24

I truly believe that drug addiction is pretty misunderstood in society- or more specifically by most people. I am a recoverying anorectic and have always been faced with ignorant individuals who demand, "why can't you just eat?!" I am even positive that many people also view eating disorders as choices that one makes, but they too have a biological and genetic base to them as well as there being certain personailities that are more prone to develop unhealthy relationships with food. By the way-BigSis- great comment.
I have always found that in order for me to progress in MY recovery I have to view food as fuel in my mind. It helps put my struggle in perspective.

I am even at fault at stomping my feet with regards to the whole "Addiction is a disease" business. I KNOW it is a disease and I do accept this, but I also believe that there are many addicts who will use the disease piece in order to escape taking personal responsibility for their life and using. Even I think I sometimes encourage my own denial by playing up the disease aspect of addiction because for whatever reason it is less painful.

I struggle with understanding the disease model and applying it accurately to my situation with my abf. I just want to thank everyone who posted such awesome metaphors that helped relay the essence of the choice versus addiction question.

cinderellawkids

Heather that is a really good point. Im a recovering anorexic myself and it was not as simple as not eating that was just the outlying symptom of the disease.

marle

As far as being a functional addict, I believe it all depends on the drug and the means of delivery. A person snorting coke may take longer to lose everything than someone who smokes crack. Taking opiates orally does not addict someone as quickly as snorting. With my daughter, when she was buying her own drugs, she had to work, so her use was limited to what she could afford. When she took up with her abf, he bought all her drugs. So all she needs to do is be high, she does not have to work or try to get money for drugs. She went downhill really fast. As far as a choice, she did have all the knowledge to make a choice to use the first time. After that, I don't think it was a choice. I know that my daughter would not have chosen to lose everything that she once loved if she had a choice. So initially maybe, but not in the end. Hugs, Marle

Sunflower

check out the posts on the Friends and Family of Alcoholics Forum titled ''choice''---I started it and it has turned into a huge debate albiet off the topic alot...It seems drug addiction familes and friends are much more open minded that the ones in the forum I am in--so nice to read your replies here--as I believe it is a disease

tropikgal2

I think it is part disease and part conscious choice. Like cancer is a disease that no one chooses "I think I would like to have cancer!", they just get it wothout choosing to. On the other hand, a person choses to use drugs. If they relapse, especially like in the case of my RAH after many many years of cleanliness, they CHOSE to use. It's not like he just walked underneath a heroin tree by accident and a syringe fell off and embedded itself in his arm. He had to consciously seek out the drug, the utensils to use it, and find a place to do so.
I think that the word disease is over used. The reason the AMA utilizes the term is because with addictive drugs like meth and coke (in any form), or any of the opioids, it changes the brain to want, in fact need ,in order to function. Hence the term disease because the brain becomes diseased. I think that some people are more inclined to abuse drugs, but ANYONE can become addicted, especially where opiates are concerned because of the similarity to the bodies' own chemicals. But that's another biological discussion I will save for another day.

cinderellawkids

My mom mentioned an interesting thought the other day. We were discussing AH and she said, I cant imagine the amount of vitamins and supplemeents he's ahve to take to repair the damage substance have done to his body. It is so true. A night out for anyone of us if we got drunk would deplete many vitamins our body needs, different for each of us, but a person that does it all the time is way out of wack chemically due to depletion of supplements iour bodies need to function

drainedwife

well my ah was clean for years. he started smoking pot with his friends in jr. high...then in either high school or college he started "partying with his friends and using coke. I believe he stopped or did it very infrequently when i started dating him, because i had no idea. during the first 9 years of our marriage, i did find coke in his possession maybe twice. so he was still "partying", but it must have been very infrequent because i had no idea it was going on. i did catch him drinking in his car by himself a few times, and that alarmed me. Then maybe 4 or 5 years ago it started. he said he had back pain..maybe he did, maybe he didnt. but he went seeking a dr. to prescribe him pain meds. when they would prescribe him things like skelaxin, he didnt fill the prescription. He also ordrered drugs on the internet. I know he was taking vicidin, hydocodone and eventually found a dr. who prescribed oxycontin. at some point he began snorting it. there were times that he tried to detox himself on his own, only to go back to it. finally, i found a dr. wo put him on suboxone,and he is still on it now over a year later, but he also switched his addiction to cocaine. He has also tried ADHD meds recently as well. He is very depressed and it could very wel be partly due to the loss of dopamine from the oxycontin abuse. He beleives he is not addicted to the coke because "he knows what its like to be addicted, and this is not it". he knew he was addicted to the oxycontin..the cocaine is different because he says he doesnt crave it...if that were true, then why cant he stop when i tell him it is a dealbreaker in our marriage. I guess that is all part of the disease. He actually believes this..he doesnt get that he just "switched addictions. " the oxycontin, i believe really did him in..before that he wasnt a heavy user...or else i would have known about it...
anyway, i just wanted to share my addicts story, and maybe someone who has been there before can shed some light on the addiction process because sometimes, I actually start beliving him when he says it is different than when he was addicted to oxycontin. He also tells himself that everyone will get addicted to oxycontin, since that is the nature of an oppiate. which is true,,,but if he didnt have the "disease" he wouldnt have started using coke..is that correct? also, he wouldnt have started snorted the oxycontin if he didnt have the disease. a normal person prescribed oxy for pain wouldnt go buy it on the street also after not getting "enough" from the dr. Am i correct in this thinking????
thanks for your help everyone!

drainedwife

did the disease just progress very slowly in his case???
just wondering after re-reading my post...thanks again for your help everyone!

Blackrose2756

What kind of helped me with the disease concept was that my ex & his half-sister had never seen each other for 16 years. She didn't even know he existed. But she was so much like him....it was scary. And I mean that in regards to her using drugs & alcohol. I think a choice is made in the beginning & then somewhere the choice ends. And it does progress....sometimes slowly...sometimes quickly.......I've also heard that an addict will not go back to where they were when they got clean if they relapse...they will pick up where they would have been had they never gotten clean. I also see it in the mental sense. My addict uses this as his way to deal with life. Anything that hurts him or he can't handle...he drinks, he drugs, etc. But I've also seen the mental damage he has caused himself. When he walked back into my life in 1997, he was clean/sober & was mentally doing well. He had worked through a lot of his issues. Once he relapsed & every relapse thereafter, he got worse. Until the last relapse he was evaluated by a shrink & I was told that he needed inpatient treatment for mental issues besides his drinking & drugging. He was no longer able to control what he did. And was considered dangerous. And I guess, that is the scary part, a person can destroy themselves with drugs & booze & sometimes never recover.

Lynne

fluffyflea

It is a disease which is very treatable. It is a physical, mental and spiritual disease. Because it is called a "disease" doesn't automatically put it in the class of having no choice. There are all kinds of choices the alcoholic /addict can make if they choose to in order to deal with this illness.

Earthworm