desypete

its true i dont have much to do with councilors at all
i once went to see a psychiatrist when i was 18 looking for a cure that would take away my aggression when i drank as i was a loony when drunk and could cause trouble and end up facing jail etc

but the next day when sober i either wouldn't know what i did or know what i did and be full or fear shame and remorse it was a nightmare world for me as i only wanted to enjoy life like my mates did

so i went to see an expert who filled me full of pills and was trying out all sorts of different methods on me

he never once mentioned aa

i could of saved myself a lot of pain in life and a lot of hurt to others if only he could of directed me to the place that could help me

whilst in aa i have never been in jail or before the courts ever as i dont do anything wrong that would warrent police action
thats how my life would of been had i got the right treatment for me at such an early age

so no i dont hold them up for much as far as alcoholism goes

if you have other problems that booze then there might be a place for them but even then i have lost my child i still dont use a councilor my sponsor has helped me through it all and still does

aa is useless for me to cope with losing my child but then its not set up for losing kids its there for alcoholics and alcoholism

the fact i never picked up a drink again over my pain is testament that it works for that problem ie not picking up a drink

but i never forget just how wrong that psychiatrist was when i was just a kid

hopeful4

AA is a wonderful thing. You learn so much and your sponsor is there to encourage you to stay on the right track, and to understand what you are going through.

It has always blown my mind when someone says they would lie to a counselor. You pay a counselor and come on your own accord, why would you dream of lying to that person? If you go to the right one, one who is trained in dealing with addicts, they will point you in the right direction.

It's not a one person fit all situation I don't think. Certain types of mental illness require certain types of help. Not all people are qualified to give that help.

Good luck to you. I am so glad you have received the help you needed in AA, however there are issues that AA cannot treat.

jdooner

I went through two Psychiatrists and one Psychologist before I found someone who is the right fit for me. I would not have been able ot make the progress I have without him.

Pete, it does not have to be an either or. My therapist has helped keep me in AA. If it were not for him, I would have been long gone.

Given your background and the loss of your son, it might help to see someone that specializes in both addiction and grief. It has been my experience that psychologists or therapists can work better for someone looking to deal through psychoanalysis vs through medication. A Psychiatrist, at least in the US will focus more on medication and limited psychoanalysis in conjunction with the medication treatment.

If your open, you might see some benefits. What you have dealt with is quite traumatic and I don't try to understand what you have experienced. But the number of times you refer to it in your posts suggests someone helping you work through that process in addition to your work in AA might be of help.

Good luck!

jaynie04

My therapist worked at Hazelden for 15 or so years, my prescribing psychiatrist worked at Silver Hill for over a decade. I would wager that they have seen every trick in the book when it comes to addicts and alcoholics. In fact, if there was anything that annoyed me it was the fact that I believe to some degree specialists in this field assume you are probably not telling the whole picture at times.

There are a lot of recovering allies/addicts who are trained counselors. Almost every therapist at my rehab was in recovery themselves.

Making a broad pronouncement based on a singular experience is a fairly weak argument. You might have lied to a counselor, I am sure there are a lot of sponsees who lie to their sponsors… Am I to draw the conclusion that all sponsors are gullible? Absolutely not. Neither will I draw the conclusion that all sponsees lie.

There was an article in the Washington Post this am about the rise of suicides among youths since the heavy broadcasting of the potential for suicides induced by antidepressants began. Probably too soon to make a solid case. What if young people have died because they did not seek treatment that might have saved them?

However, preventing people from getting the medical treatment they need because you make it an either/or equation is a damaging stance in my opinion. I think you will continue to see integration within recovery going forward, and I believe that is a plus. I don't believe taking the position that one must be a purist in any particular doctrine helps anyone, in fact I think it actually may dissuade people from finding support outside of the medical community.

We all come to the table with a different history. Our struggles to get sober are as complex and multilayered as we are, there are a lot of moving parts. Culture, age, socio-economic status, education level, family history, individual physiology, trauma…the list is too long to even put down on paper.

I believe good will should prevail among all of us in recovery. We are already a stigmatized group within society. To cause further fracture within this group by attempting to aggrandize one modality while diminishing others is senseless and self-defeating. Recovery, like any part of society, will always be a fluid genre. Our biggest challenge as a group should be focusing on how to best integrate the findings most likely to help us.

20 years ago we wouldn't have been having this international conversation about recovery. That right there is a perfect example of how incorporating different or new ideas can move us all forward. People can actually come here and get advice about how to handle situations in AA, instead of saying "I am scared to ask the group, I am never going back". That is a win/win.

And seeking medical treatment and getting help for physical issues that improve quality of life is a win/win too.

desypete

there is a long time member in aa who lost his daughter and not long after lost his wife
the drs have filled him up with so many pills he just isnt the same man i once knew
he is in a home now as he can not look after himself and they bring him out to a meeting once a week
its such a shame to see him in that mess but it shown me how i dont want to be or end up

i go to a group were parents are all together to talk over there loss of there kids
its a monthly meetings and i am giving it a try
but i also have this new way of living were i have to accept each day and somtimes each minute of the day that i dont have my son around anymore

i have to reject feeling sorry for myself so i have to be hard on me it doesnt mean i am not walking around in pain but when i can get out there and do something for someone else i just forget about my own pain

its going to take time for me i know that its the same for us all when problems come along in life and there is no way we can fix them nor can we blame ourselves for the problem as we didnt bring it about

there are no answers but this one
tough luck get on with it

i dont know if a councilor could help me or not to be honest but one things is for sure if my methods i use today still dont work for me in time then i might get fed up with the pain and go and see one

but so far i am on year 2 and i am back out there living again or trying to and thats a long way from staying at home and in bed daily just trying to sleep my life away

i am back at work now 4 shifts a week and the rest of my time i go to aa meetings and help new comers etc
but lately i am at odds with many members over the god issue and its making me want to give up going to aa
thats why i am here looking for other methods that i might be able to use instead of aa
what i need is an aa that doesnt use the word god but uses instead a high power or love or sprituality that doesnt involve praying or anything to do with a god of the church

ScottFromWI

I think this sentence pretty much sums up your entire thread here, which is becoming pretty hard to understand to be honest.

It's perfectly acceptable to call a therapist and just have an initial appointment. You can specify that you prefer to have no drugs prescribed, and all you have to do is talk. You'll never know if it can help you if you don't try it.

desypete

the thread started out as me trying to understand if i had bi polar or was it just my isms that i treat myself that has a new name for it called by polar ?

as the mood swings and horribale behaviour fit me or used to fit me like a t

since working on me my moods swings have vanished along with my anger and wanting to hit out in frustration when i dont get my own way etc

it has since drifted on into a councilor v aa way of life type of argument

i can not change my experience with the professionals and thats all i can base it on
like i can not convince someone who prayed to god and got saved that they were just lucky
they dont think about all the other people who prayed and didnt get saved as sadly those people dont have a voice anymore to argue

the medical profession are much needed for people who are chronic dependent on booze, same as in house treatment centres who can control withdrawal symtons ( so long as its free of course and not a profit making scam)

anyway like i have said i can only base things on my own personal experience like we all do
god saves some and not others ? drs save some and not others aa saves some and not others
there doesnt seem to a single thing out there that can save all

ScottFromWI

That doesn't have to be an argument -many people do both. To me it sounds like you have questions that a therapist might be able to help you answer.

I think all people are saying is that you shouldn't discount potential solutions based on experience in the past. There are good therapists and bad ones, just as there are good and bad AA sponsors, good and bad medical doctors, good and bad ministers, etc.

biminiblue

Anger at God is a central theme in your problem, desy.

Do you think an angry God took your son away from you to hurt you in some way? My Higher Power is not about anger or revenge or pain and suffering or shame or guilt.

My Higher Power is a comforter in hard times. A better Way in sorrow. A lifting of burdens.

I have lost all of my family. Every single one of them died. I am now alone in the world if I choose to be. I don't blame God, people die on this planet. Sometimes little children die of heart attacks. I don't pretend to understand the Why of the Universe.

I just try to live with what Is.

We may or may not get answers. I don't think the why is even important. Your son would not want you to live in agony due to his death. If you could commune with him now, do you think he would accept that it was his time? Do you think your son might say to you, "Dad, it's okay. I'm fine. Please live your life." ?

I had to get to the place where I believed my family is looking down on me and cheering me on, not looking down at me in sadness for their deaths. Their time came. So will mine. I am tasked with living life as well as I possibly can for however much time I have left. I don't want to disappoint them by wallowing in my sorrow. That's no life.

Soberpotamus

Hey, I think you're right. I don't think there's a single thing that can save all. And that's ok Find what makes your life a little easier and more enjoyable to live.

Desy... it's ok to be angry that there is no God to save you. And it's ok to seek help from a psychologist if you think it might help you. You don't have to label yourself or be diagnosed to benefit.

I hope you find some peace.

Dee74

If you want to know if you're bipolar only a qualified physician can adequately answer that question Desypete.

D

desypete

i am not angry at a god as i dont believe in one
i can get angry sitting in an aa meeting hearing all the wonderful shares from people who have been saved from drinking by this so called god

but like i have always said we never hear from the people who prayed to be saved and didnt get saved
so i am sorry but this god thing is just brainwashed fairy tales in my eyes

i deal in real life as i have to live in this real world

what on earth could a counclior do for me over losing my son ?
do you honestly think someone who has read a book or got a certificate could help me or even begin to understand what its like to watch a little boy die who begged to live ?

i get angry when i picture my son in that way and its going to take time and time only to help me plus my sponsor and friends who already have helped me in more ways than one

would a councilor give me thousands of pounds to help me pay for a headstone for my son ?

my sponsor did along with a few other members of aa

without the real love and care i have been given by some in aa there is no doubt in my mind i would of been found hanging from a rope

so please if you want to take my inventory like i can take yours then look at the facts and not wash them away because they dont fit in with what you believe in thanks

Dee74

I think there are trained grief counsellors who could help you very much desypete...
but if you're not open to that option that's your choice.

I think if you are bipolar speaking with a Dr could help you very much too - but again thats your call.

You made a few statements you got taken to task for, but noone is trying to beat you up here - I think everyone is trying to help.
D

desypete

sorry for sounding off and being ungrateful for the suggestions of help

thanks for the suggestions i will take them on board but for me i honestly believe i am doing ok at the moment

i am working and providing for my other kids on my own
i am getting out and about a lot more and learning to live out in the world again
of course i am still hurt and when i get hurt it shows up as anger but i soon do some deep breathing and then think over what i have just done and if i need to make an amend
i will never be perfect but on the whole i have come a long way

thanks for the suggestions and once again sorry for my anger