Is this the End?
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Join Date: Nov 2008
Location: CA
Posts: 51
Is this the End?
My mother has been a severe alcoholic since 2003. She has had numerous hospital stays over this period. She was diagnosed with liver failure since 2009. She is once more in the hospital and this time I really wonder if she's not going to come out. She has ascites so bad they have drained her abdomen five times. She has a catheter because she went three days without urination. Her skin and eyes have a yellow hue. She seems disoriented and sluggish. I've been asking her and family members there (I live several states away) how bad she is but I'm not getting any straight answers. So I guess my question is for those that have experienced this, does what I describe sound like the end is near? Should I fly up there immediately? I suppose my questioning and hesitation stems from her repeated hospital stays and she always bounced back, but I'm also fearful I might be in denial that I'm about to lose her. I have a young son that I can't leave behind (no childcare) which also is making me hesitate. I'm torn between waiting and seeing what happens and the thought that she may pass suddenly. Advice and personal experiences welcome; thank you.
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Join Date: Sep 2011
Posts: 1,437
I would call the hospital, as the daughter they would tell you what her condition is, and also ask for the doctor in charge of her case. Just tell them that you want the facts because you are confused by other's reports.
I know what you mean. My mom wasn't the alcoholic, but the enabler martyr to my father the alcoholic. She died on the day after Christmas after a lifetime of near death hospitalizations and hypochondria to the point that her favorite daughter didn't even believe her and blew her off on my mom's last phone call to her from her death bed. I'm not suggesting at all that your mom is doing this. Just that I know the feeling of will she rebound once again.
I know what you mean. My mom wasn't the alcoholic, but the enabler martyr to my father the alcoholic. She died on the day after Christmas after a lifetime of near death hospitalizations and hypochondria to the point that her favorite daughter didn't even believe her and blew her off on my mom's last phone call to her from her death bed. I'm not suggesting at all that your mom is doing this. Just that I know the feeling of will she rebound once again.
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Join Date: Sep 2008
Location: Back East
Posts: 704
I guess my question would be, how important is it to you, that you are with her when she dies? My sister kept flying back from the West Coast every time it looked like our Dad might kick off -- and then he wouldn't, and she'd go back, and then come back a few weeks later, etc.
When my Dad died, I was in the next state at a bowling tournament. I got a call in-between matches informing me that he had died. I mentioned this to my team captain, and he said, hey, if you want to go home, go! I said no, what's the point?
I had, however, had the foresight to bring my Dad's bowling balls to the event, and with my first ball of the next match, used one to put ten pins in the pit. It was the least I could do for the old guy.
So this is something you can only decide for yourself -- how important is it to be there? That's different for everyone.
T
When my Dad died, I was in the next state at a bowling tournament. I got a call in-between matches informing me that he had died. I mentioned this to my team captain, and he said, hey, if you want to go home, go! I said no, what's the point?
I had, however, had the foresight to bring my Dad's bowling balls to the event, and with my first ball of the next match, used one to put ten pins in the pit. It was the least I could do for the old guy.
So this is something you can only decide for yourself -- how important is it to be there? That's different for everyone.
T
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Join Date: Jun 2010
Location: UK
Posts: 2,937
What would you like to do if you could?
What would make you happy?
I say this as in my opinion its important for you to be able to handle this in a way that you can live with forever more.
You don't want to have any regrets yourself that you didn't do something or say something in her last days.
I'm thinking of you xx
What would make you happy?
I say this as in my opinion its important for you to be able to handle this in a way that you can live with forever more.
You don't want to have any regrets yourself that you didn't do something or say something in her last days.
I'm thinking of you xx
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Join Date: Sep 2014
Posts: 1,792
I too have concerns like these about my separated alcoholic mate, who I live quite a distance from now. I have periods where I dread some phone call that he is sick or worse. I also worry sometimes about who will care for our animals, since they are with him.
All we can really do ultimately is turn everything over to our Higher Power, and accept the things we cannot change.
All the best to you. You and your family are in our prayers.
All we can really do ultimately is turn everything over to our Higher Power, and accept the things we cannot change.
All the best to you. You and your family are in our prayers.
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Join Date: Nov 2008
Location: CA
Posts: 51
Thank you for the replies. A lot of sound advice and I appreciate the shared experiences. Touching on what some of you mentioned, there are two reasons I feel I should go up there but both are not necessarily for me. If she died before I was able to get up there I wouldn't really regret not being there. And I hope that doesn't sound heartless; I made my peace with her situation years ago. After each subsequent brush with death she has had, I felt like emotionally I had to accept that she'd die this way.
I feel bad for her; she's lost almost everything and very soon that may include her life. I don't want her to die alone and scared; I guess I worry she may if I'm not there. But really, we've not had a relationship for almost 6 years; only recently even speaking on the phone. If I went up there I'd be doing it for her, not me. Is it selfish if I denied her seeing me when this might be the end? And I hate that I feel this way, but if I were to go up there and she recovers once more, part of me would be frustrated. I've prepared myself for this for years and I'd really just like it to be over finally. I feel pretty horrible for admitting that, but that's the place I'm at.
I feel bad for her; she's lost almost everything and very soon that may include her life. I don't want her to die alone and scared; I guess I worry she may if I'm not there. But really, we've not had a relationship for almost 6 years; only recently even speaking on the phone. If I went up there I'd be doing it for her, not me. Is it selfish if I denied her seeing me when this might be the end? And I hate that I feel this way, but if I were to go up there and she recovers once more, part of me would be frustrated. I've prepared myself for this for years and I'd really just like it to be over finally. I feel pretty horrible for admitting that, but that's the place I'm at.
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Join Date: Mar 2014
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My parents, my grandparents, and my stepfather all died. I didn't say "goodbye" officially to any of them. I don't think there is any way to know if "this is it" or not. As far as I know none of them were alcoholic deaths, but death is death. The ones who drank died lots younger than the ones who didn't, regardless.
Ultimately, we all die alone. I made my peace with all of my relatives when they were alive except my father, who died when I was very young. If you can do that, it helps. She made her choice to die this way, and she'll likely be heavily medicated anyway if she is in the end stage for real this time.
I had some guilt when my family died, but there is no way to know when it's the time - even when there is protracted illness and hospitalization. A little guilt is human - and part of death. None of us have perfect relationships with our families, and especially ones who self-destruct. It's almost like a suicide. ((Hugs))
Ultimately, we all die alone. I made my peace with all of my relatives when they were alive except my father, who died when I was very young. If you can do that, it helps. She made her choice to die this way, and she'll likely be heavily medicated anyway if she is in the end stage for real this time.
I had some guilt when my family died, but there is no way to know when it's the time - even when there is protracted illness and hospitalization. A little guilt is human - and part of death. None of us have perfect relationships with our families, and especially ones who self-destruct. It's almost like a suicide. ((Hugs))
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Join Date: Jun 2010
Location: UK
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I don't think you are horrible for your thoughts at all.
Of course you don't want this for her. Thats because she's your mum and you love her.
Maybe its worth considering that alcoholism is a disease. Like cancer or dementia. She is dying from a disease. Many of us will die from a disease.
She won't be alone if she dies in hospital honey.
Nurses and medical staff are human. They love and care like we do. They can be shoulders to cry on and have hands that can be held.
When my beloved auntie died, I just wanted to write her a letter.
To say thanks for the christmas's, the birthdays. the love. her friendship.
I did.
My cousin's put the letter in her coffin when she died.
Thats what I wanted and I was lucky. I got it. I had time to do that.
I think you answered a lot of your own questions with your post.
People don't talk about it and I think we should more, but if there is a chance we can prepare and have a 'good' death, then thats better.
Better for your mum and for you.
I really am thinking of you and wish you the best xx
Of course you don't want this for her. Thats because she's your mum and you love her.
Maybe its worth considering that alcoholism is a disease. Like cancer or dementia. She is dying from a disease. Many of us will die from a disease.
She won't be alone if she dies in hospital honey.
Nurses and medical staff are human. They love and care like we do. They can be shoulders to cry on and have hands that can be held.
When my beloved auntie died, I just wanted to write her a letter.
To say thanks for the christmas's, the birthdays. the love. her friendship.
I did.
My cousin's put the letter in her coffin when she died.
Thats what I wanted and I was lucky. I got it. I had time to do that.
I think you answered a lot of your own questions with your post.
People don't talk about it and I think we should more, but if there is a chance we can prepare and have a 'good' death, then thats better.
Better for your mum and for you.
I really am thinking of you and wish you the best xx
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Join Date: Jun 2011
Location: The Deep South
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I think you should do what you are comfortable doing. I attended my mother in the ICU two months before we turned off the machine and let her go. It was rough, I'll admit. She took a handful of pills, threw up and it went into her lungs and she died from ARDS. Well, she died from the injection actually, but ARDS would have shut down all her organs one by one naturally. She was in an induced coma to give her some sort of relief or comfort from it.
It literally made me nauseous and ill every time I went in to see her. One of the hardest things I've ever done in my life. I guess it would be way harder had she been my child. Still, I hyperventilated multiple times and was self-medicating with alcohol throughout.
I had cut off contact with her eight months prior and she took the pills after I responded to one of her many phone calls via email, explaining to her that I needed space. She apparently couldn't handle it and took the pills. I'll have to live with it for the rest of my life.
I know she didn't do it to punish me. She told me herself only a year before not to ever blame myself if anything happened to her. She'd been wanting to die for a very long time. Multiple drug overdoses throughout her life. So, I try and hold onto that knowledge in order to forgive and have some comfort or relief from the guilt.
Do what you feel you can do. I hope you can find some peace in knowing what to do and how to handle it. You're in my thoughts.
It literally made me nauseous and ill every time I went in to see her. One of the hardest things I've ever done in my life. I guess it would be way harder had she been my child. Still, I hyperventilated multiple times and was self-medicating with alcohol throughout.
I had cut off contact with her eight months prior and she took the pills after I responded to one of her many phone calls via email, explaining to her that I needed space. She apparently couldn't handle it and took the pills. I'll have to live with it for the rest of my life.
I know she didn't do it to punish me. She told me herself only a year before not to ever blame myself if anything happened to her. She'd been wanting to die for a very long time. Multiple drug overdoses throughout her life. So, I try and hold onto that knowledge in order to forgive and have some comfort or relief from the guilt.
Do what you feel you can do. I hope you can find some peace in knowing what to do and how to handle it. You're in my thoughts.
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Join Date: Nov 2010
Location: Washington, DC
Posts: 456
There was a two year period were my alcohlic father appeared to be on death's door. He was in a nursing home four hours away. I would often drive up for my last visit and was then relieved when he pulled through.
Right before he passed I already had a visit scheduled. A nursed called me to tell me that he wasn't doing well and I was able to tell her that I was heading up in the morning.
When I finally got there he was heavily medicated on morphine and in an awful mood. He barely acknowledged me and just kept asking for everyone to leave him the h$ll alone. The way he was acting, yelling, and cursing brought up old childhood memories. I was literally frozen at the foot of his bed like a scared little girl. I was able to say goodbye in my own way, but it was far from a movie moment. Not sure what I was expecting.
I drove back home and did get a call the following night that he indeed had passed away. Even after two years of thinking that he was going to die the news came as a shock. I was sad, but also truly relieved this time because he was no longer suffering and I didn't have to worry about him anymore.
I was also filled with deep, deep, sadness that I was never doing to have the father that I always wanted. I continue to work on trying to appreciated th father that I got.
Anyway, I am so so sorry that you and your mother are going through this difficult time.
With my limited experience with death, I think it falls into the category of things we can't control. Even doctors and nurses can't predict when it will happen. It's sort of like birth.
Thanks for letting me share my story.
Take Care,
db
Right before he passed I already had a visit scheduled. A nursed called me to tell me that he wasn't doing well and I was able to tell her that I was heading up in the morning.
When I finally got there he was heavily medicated on morphine and in an awful mood. He barely acknowledged me and just kept asking for everyone to leave him the h$ll alone. The way he was acting, yelling, and cursing brought up old childhood memories. I was literally frozen at the foot of his bed like a scared little girl. I was able to say goodbye in my own way, but it was far from a movie moment. Not sure what I was expecting.
I drove back home and did get a call the following night that he indeed had passed away. Even after two years of thinking that he was going to die the news came as a shock. I was sad, but also truly relieved this time because he was no longer suffering and I didn't have to worry about him anymore.
I was also filled with deep, deep, sadness that I was never doing to have the father that I always wanted. I continue to work on trying to appreciated th father that I got.
Anyway, I am so so sorry that you and your mother are going through this difficult time.
With my limited experience with death, I think it falls into the category of things we can't control. Even doctors and nurses can't predict when it will happen. It's sort of like birth.
Thanks for letting me share my story.
Take Care,
db
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Join Date: Sep 2008
Location: Back East
Posts: 704
You don't want to have any regrets yourself that you didn't do something or say something in her last days.
My sister kept coming back (from 3,000 miles away) because each time, she felt that, "This might be the last chance I have to see Dad." She seemed to have this Norman Rockwell vision of what the end would be like, if only it could be arranged perfectly -- somehow, the three of us would be together, and would all be reconciled in my Dad's final moments on this Earth, and all would be fine. Or, if he didn't expire, she'd fly home, and then fly back in a few weeks, when there would be another "possible last chance to see him," and so on.
As it turned out, my Dad didn't die alone -- he had 24-hour nursing care at home, and he was attended by... a very attentive home care nurse. When I came home a few hours later, she met me at the door and told me about it, explaining that he died peacefully, although it took a minute, etc. -- when you have a pacemaker, it detects that the heart has stopped, then gives it a jolt to try to restart it, and it keeps trying a certain number of times before it gives up and concedes that the patient has, in fact, died, and other details that I didn't really need to know.
Sister wasn't there, as it turned out -- and... well, what did it matter? My Dad wasn't really able to communicated much during his last few months (he may have had a stroke or something, we never found out for sure), and whatever thoughts he might have had at the end were his own. I wasn't there, but if I had been, I wouldn't have had anything much to say -- that's how we were, his last year or so. Do I feel that it mattered? No, not really.
It's an individual thing....
T
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Join Date: Nov 2008
Location: CA
Posts: 51
Thank you again for all the replies. The experiences you have shared have given me a lot to think about. Not closer to a decision yet, although I guess leaning more in one direction. I took the advice some of you shared and called the hospital to speak with her doctor. I had to leave a message, but I'm hoping the doctor will call me back today, if not tomorrow. I feel like it's important I make a well informed decision.
I talked to my mom briefly today and she sounded like she was fading. Maybe she is on meds or it's part of her condition, but she honestly sounded horrible. It pulled at my heartstrings and really made me miss her.
I talked to my mom briefly today and she sounded like she was fading. Maybe she is on meds or it's part of her condition, but she honestly sounded horrible. It pulled at my heartstrings and really made me miss her.
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Join Date: Nov 2008
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Short update: She has been released from the hospital. She told me she is meeting with her doctor in a few days to discuss end of life options. So I guess things are clearer now. I don't really know how much time she has left, but probably not much. Thank you again for all the support.
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Join Date: Aug 2012
Location: Florida
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I'm sorry to hear this news, but at least now you know. Don't feel guilty for any of your feelings. You're with a group that understands the complex relationships we have as ACoA. I won't be around whenever my AM does pass. I have no desire to be part of that circus or attend her memorial service (she wants to be cremated). I won't be able to make it through all of the eulogies and hearing people tell me how wonderful she was and how I was so lucky to have her as a mother (I've heard that enough while she's still alive, thanks). The thought of it makes me nauseous. Sometimes we've simply had enough and dealing with the situation from a distance is best. Only you can know what's right for you.
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I hope you are doing well, NOLAGIRL.
I buried my AM about a year and a half ago, and I was the only one with her when she died.
She had dementia for the last year of her life, which was kind of nice because she was actually much better to deal with than the preceding 55 years of my life.
My brother, who is estranged and my sister who took care of her during her last years, declined to be there while she went through the dying process, and I certainly don't blame them.
I didn't like my mother (she was a self-absorbed beast, to be gentle in my diction), and I only loved her in a remote and extremely detached kind of way - not much, if the truth be known.
We gave her a graveside burial with no eulogy.
My sister and I both did more than she deserved and I do not suffer from pangs of guilt for not doing more. I don't miss her a bit.
In 50 years of drinking, she never once picked up a white chip.
I hope you are doing well with your situation and I hope this helps (at least a little).
This is my first post on this forum.
I buried my AM about a year and a half ago, and I was the only one with her when she died.
She had dementia for the last year of her life, which was kind of nice because she was actually much better to deal with than the preceding 55 years of my life.
My brother, who is estranged and my sister who took care of her during her last years, declined to be there while she went through the dying process, and I certainly don't blame them.
I didn't like my mother (she was a self-absorbed beast, to be gentle in my diction), and I only loved her in a remote and extremely detached kind of way - not much, if the truth be known.
We gave her a graveside burial with no eulogy.
My sister and I both did more than she deserved and I do not suffer from pangs of guilt for not doing more. I don't miss her a bit.
In 50 years of drinking, she never once picked up a white chip.
I hope you are doing well with your situation and I hope this helps (at least a little).
This is my first post on this forum.
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