seek

The addict/alcoholic needs to take 100% responsibility for their lives - not rely on others to bolster them. I am sick of everything being about them and catering to them. It's really not all about them.

They cause destruction to themselves AND others - it's just too much to expect others to drop everything 24/7 and do x, y & z to save them.

Step up to the plate of your own life.

HoneyBadger1

As difficult as it is to accept, there is no "right" or "wrong" answer for everyone. We all have to do what is right for each of us. Reading other people's experiences and the outcomes of those experiences will help. Reading books will help. Understanding yourself will help even more. But at the end of the day, the only one who knows what is right for you is YOU. I can assure you that everyone here only wants to help, and you are free to ignore whatever you do not feel applies to you. And as time goes on, what you are willing to accept and what you will not accept may change drastically! When you feel you have tried everything, and you are empty and hopeless, you may very well decide that this is not the life you signed up for and find the strength to once again live your life for you. Or maybe, just maybe, your loved one will have found recovery. But the best thing you can do for you is put all your focus and energy into what you can do to help yourself. It is the greatest gift you can give yourself and your loved ones. Become strong and know who you are and what you want and that you are just as worthy of the attention you have been giving others and could now instead be giving yourself. Love yourself as much (or ideally, more) than you have loved your addict. And then you may just find a true gift - peace.

Strength to all,
HB

Leftover

This information presented by Gamaur is exactly what I DID NOT need to hear. After 20 years of supporting an alcoholic drug addicted son, I was dead tired. I had supported, encouraged, smiled, lifted, understood, provided, loved, given, listened, counseled, saved, treated and blew enough air into his balloon to take him to the moon and back. AND GUESS WHAT........he continued to get sicker and sicker and so did I. Where does one draw the line when enabling. Reading what Garmaur proposes only makes me feel guilty for not hanging in there. I can tell his addiction has clouded his judgment about what to expect from loved ones. When I realized that I could not change my son's relationship with drugs, I began to change my relationship with him. I'm healthy now and, sadly, he is still sick.

CodeJob

Leftover, you are wise. You should hang out here more often!

http://www.soberrecovery.com/forums/...-heroin-2.html

Leftover

Well CodeJob, thanks for the link to Garmaur's addictive rants. As late as yesterday he was admitting to being on an opiate high. It scares me the harm that can be done to the naive who are suffering here and looking for Hope to hold on to. Listening and taking advice from an active addict is not healthy. I hope everyone on this thread will take a moment to read your above noted post and realize who is spewing advice.

FindingMe2

I completely agree! I have seen the same on F&F alcoholic side. Personally, it makes my stomach turn. Thanks for sharing!!

Needabreak

Glad you caught that, Codejob, especially since a poster on this forum yesterday was using Gamaur's words to put the rest of us down.

I agree that this type of stuff is harmful to newbies here, especially the insinuation that needing space from an addict and defining healthy borders is a selfish thing or a sign of failure and that the addict should always come first. They did it to me when I first joined the site a couple years ago. I was in DEEP pain at the time, and it did not help at all to hear that I was being selfish.

alterity

Jessica, a brand newbie herself, wasn't putting anyone down nor was there any program bashing in her thread. She was asking sincere questions, trying to make sense out of inconsistencies, and clearly is seeking to help and not to disengage from her A fiance. The fact is that al-/nar-anon "helps" very few addicts in loved ones' lives and this is borne out in the research.

I think that there may be an impression out there that al-/nar-anon helps addicts or may be a program for people to help them when that is not what it is for. For example, I have seen articles written from a 12 Step perspective that have titles such as "how to help the addict in your life" but the suggestions really help the loved one. They should have titles such as "how to cope with the addict in your life."

Five years ago, like Jessica, I thought I would find the kind of advice here that would help me help my As. I did not. These days, with my B acutely psychotic, hospitalized, and mentally incompetent, I have received some encouraging words that show concern for B and an understanding that someone has to do for him what he clearly cannot do for himself. Jessica's situation is clearly very, very, very unlike mine; hence, she received a different response that she felt was indifferent.

I can relate to her disappointment and confusion as I was in her shoes years ago. I think loved ones have to get to a certain level of desperation and need for detachment to appreciate what al-/nar-anon has to offer, which is a lot and very valuable.

Gamaur

I said I wouldn't post in this thread any further, but seeing as things are getting a little personal with references to my personal life, drug use and credibility, I have to say something.

The fact the diatribe has continued after I've made a clear concession and genuine, heartfelt apology for the various miscommunications of ideas, is very upsetting. I misunderstood the purpose of this sub-forum and came at it from the wrong angle, it's as simple as that.

Having my posts marginalised as 'addictive rants' is a gross misrepresentation, and you know it. If someone can honestly read through everything I've written on these forums and think I've just been 'ranting', and lack any credibility of opinion, then I'd like to here your reasons.

I know the OP triggered some painful emotions in many people here, and I empathise with you completely; the OP is a work-in-progress and was tailored to a different kind of support forum, and needs far more elaboration to distinguish itself from Johann Hari's article/TED talk. As soon as I realised the extent of the error I immediately took full accountability for it.

The fact people have continued their hostility, as though the OP were posted by a misguided authority, suggests it's become something of an emotional outlet. Because there's absolutely nothing rational about continuing to attack a post by someone who admitted he was wrong, who literally stated they've attempted suicide in the past year. Also, the posting of my personal addiction thread, where I have only recently opened up about some extreme challenges I've been facing recently, as a means to discredit me even further, is bordering on sadistic.

And for the record, I was on an opiate high a month ago, in the midst of an extreme crisis, which was elevated by a painful tooth abscess I had. My active addiction is marijuana, and the term 'using' is an indication of being in a period where I will get it when am able to; it does not mean I am constantly high. It's complicated - all drug addiction is - so I would really appreciate it if it weren't branded around as some kind of tool to discredit me.

Not meaning to control the conversation or anything, but I have to protect myself a little here. It's an emotionally charged topic and everyone has the right to rant their feelings, I just wish people would read everything posted after the OP before they did.

Dee74

If I may make a personal observation: there's nothing in that thread that discredits the OP.

I'm closing this down so that the relevant Forum Mod can take a look.

D