Failing at NO contact
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Thread Starter
Join Date: Jan 2013
Posts: 1,920
Failing at NO contact
So I got loose from my alcoholic gf. She will not call for a while and randomly text how alone she is and tells me we cannot be together. I will call and she sounds very angry and she sounds different than I have ever heard her sound before. It sounds evil. So I am thinking of just blocking the number. I am only five months sober and I feel so mad at myself. Any advice for committing to no contact? I know I don't love her but I think I have been dependent on her to make me feel better about myself. I'm also going through a difficult health problem and I feel very close to relapse. A friend in AA told me this person wants to drag me down. Advice?
A work in progress
Join Date: Jul 2010
Location: South Jersey
Posts: 16,633
I think "no contact" sounds like a very, very good idea. Don't expect her to cooperate--if she were the cooperative type you wouldn't be in this position.
Oh, sorry, you asked for advice on how to achieve that. Block her number, block her emails/texts. If something gets through do NOT respond. If, in spite of all of that, she persists, then call your family court or the domestic violence hotline or local women's shelter (I know you're a guy but they can help with something concerning DV) and find out if you can get a protective order to prohibit her from contacting you. I know that sounds extreme but if she doesn't respect your efforts to be left alone, that might be an excellent option.
Oh, sorry, you asked for advice on how to achieve that. Block her number, block her emails/texts. If something gets through do NOT respond. If, in spite of all of that, she persists, then call your family court or the domestic violence hotline or local women's shelter (I know you're a guy but they can help with something concerning DV) and find out if you can get a protective order to prohibit her from contacting you. I know that sounds extreme but if she doesn't respect your efforts to be left alone, that might be an excellent option.
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Join Date: Jan 2015
Location: West Coast
Posts: 774
awe... I wish I could give you advice! All I know is that when those texts or calls or emails are coming in... or they aren't, each of those moments is a chance to think it through and just NOT react.
It does sound like you really need to focus on yourself though. Take care of yourself, give her the reigns to do so for herself, and whether or not she gets help, YOU will be okay.
It does sound like you really need to focus on yourself though. Take care of yourself, give her the reigns to do so for herself, and whether or not she gets help, YOU will be okay.
Member
Join Date: May 2013
Location: east coast
Posts: 1,332
Hi,
Congrats on the sobriety. I remember that time well. Kind of a let down. The humdrum boringness of life has settled in and it kind of feels like " this is it?". You will get through it. Go to more meetings or read, read, read here. It's a bump.
I am sorry about the health problem. I can understand well. I have a precancerous condition that I have to get checked periodically forever and sometimes it's just depressing.
Now, no contact. That's a hard one. I went no contact with my mother last summer. Hardest thing I ever did. My mind started obsessing, I thought of calling her everyday. It consumed me for a good month. I constantly fought myself. But, it slowly got better and now I almost never think of her. It was in the beginning the most emotionally difficult thing I ever did. But I don't have a single regret.
Good luck in whatever you choose. And keep sharing
Congrats on the sobriety. I remember that time well. Kind of a let down. The humdrum boringness of life has settled in and it kind of feels like " this is it?". You will get through it. Go to more meetings or read, read, read here. It's a bump.
I am sorry about the health problem. I can understand well. I have a precancerous condition that I have to get checked periodically forever and sometimes it's just depressing.
Now, no contact. That's a hard one. I went no contact with my mother last summer. Hardest thing I ever did. My mind started obsessing, I thought of calling her everyday. It consumed me for a good month. I constantly fought myself. But, it slowly got better and now I almost never think of her. It was in the beginning the most emotionally difficult thing I ever did. But I don't have a single regret.
Good luck in whatever you choose. And keep sharing
Member
Thread Starter
Join Date: Jan 2013
Posts: 1,920
Thank you. I just feel like a void. I lost my identity in this relationship and I never had a voice. It's like I was taken hostage. I'm so mad at myself for being weak and not believing that I deserve so much more. Yet when I talk with them all I get is criticism and how I messed everything up by not being there and not caring. It makes me feel insane and like I am a bad person.
Member
Join Date: Nov 2014
Posts: 190
Sending you lots of support! I do have to say, congrats on staying committed to your sobriety! I know how important that must be.
Ask yourself what you need for you. How can you get that? What supports do you have available to you? What kind of self care can you do in spite of this difficult situation. Maybe identifying something as self care can be a step towards finding yourself again?
Hugs!
Ask yourself what you need for you. How can you get that? What supports do you have available to you? What kind of self care can you do in spite of this difficult situation. Maybe identifying something as self care can be a step towards finding yourself again?
Hugs!
Member
Join Date: May 2013
Location: east coast
Posts: 1,332
You are not a bad person. You suffer from alcoholism. Many extraordinary people in this world have suffered from it as well. But, you are getting better and working hard at righting the wrongs. Don't let people make you feel bad. Ever.
A work in progress
Join Date: Jul 2010
Location: South Jersey
Posts: 16,633
If you ask me, SHE'S the one who's messed up. She had a pretty long period of sobriety when she decided to get involved with you. Nobody's got all their marbles yet when they are newly sober. She was in a better position to know better. BUT what's done is done. I hope you don't allow this the mess with your sobriety. Do you run into each other at meetings, or can you find different ones to avoid her there? Have you let others in the Fellowship know you need some extra support right now?
One thing--I wouldn't necessarily assume this person "wants to drag you down," but by holding onto you (and, yes, treating you like a hostage), she is having that effect. So it really doesn't matter whether she intends/wants to or not. For your own sake you have to let go, and pry her clutches from you.
One thing--I wouldn't necessarily assume this person "wants to drag you down," but by holding onto you (and, yes, treating you like a hostage), she is having that effect. So it really doesn't matter whether she intends/wants to or not. For your own sake you have to let go, and pry her clutches from you.
A work in progress
Join Date: Jul 2010
Location: South Jersey
Posts: 16,633
Look, if the problem were you, she wouldn't "turn into a different person." She'd just break up with you. That's what normal people do when a relationship isn't working out for them. There is NOTHING wrong with breaking up--it happens all the time. You start dating someone, for some reason it isn't working, and you break up. It doesn't mean you're "not good enough." It means there is something in HER makeup that you can't fill, any more than alcohol could fill it.
Ever read in the Big Book, or hear at meetings, about the "hole in the soul" that people try to fill with alcohol (before they discover their Higher Power can fill that hole)? Some people try to fill that hole with relationships. And that doesn't work because two people in a relationship should not be filling deficiencies in each other, they should be companions who enjoy and treasure each other.
So she needs to look for something besides YOU (or any other person) to heal that. You can't do it for her, and it isn't because you are inadequate. Whatever she says.
Ever read in the Big Book, or hear at meetings, about the "hole in the soul" that people try to fill with alcohol (before they discover their Higher Power can fill that hole)? Some people try to fill that hole with relationships. And that doesn't work because two people in a relationship should not be filling deficiencies in each other, they should be companions who enjoy and treasure each other.
So she needs to look for something besides YOU (or any other person) to heal that. You can't do it for her, and it isn't because you are inadequate. Whatever she says.
Member
Join Date: Jan 2015
Location: West Coast
Posts: 774
No Acheleus, you ARE good enough. It is up to us to define to others what we are worth. Failing at helping someone else isn't a failing because we have no control over them. Help is out there if she wants it. Why does it have to come from you? Let the myriads of organizations and professionals do that work with her.
I hope I am reading your posts right and not doling out unneeded advice here...
I hope I am reading your posts right and not doling out unneeded advice here...
Behold the power of NO
Join Date: Jan 2013
Location: WA
Posts: 7,764
Originally Posted by Acheleus 
She has just turned into a different person it is very scary. It's also sad and it makes me feel guilty like I am not good enough.
I think I had given you the link when you first broke up and we recommended no contact but here we go
https://play.google.com/store/apps/d....blocker&hl=en
and it is completely free
Member
Thread Starter
Join Date: Jan 2013
Posts: 1,920
Self care initiative and steps to get away from toxic badness: reading poetry in bed tonight and I haven't done that in so long. I had no common interests with my ex. I'm also talking to a friend I made from class who is a writer and loves literature. I'm going to get my life back and enjoy my freedom. Watching a hockey game. I haven't done that in so long! I'm so glad to be free!!
Member
Join Date: Oct 2013
Posts: 11,448
A terrific poem to start the day:
Peter Quince at the Clavier
I
Just as my fingers on these keys
Make music, so the self-same sounds
On my spirit make a music, too.
Music is feeling, then, not sound;
And thus it is that what I feel,
Here in this room, desiring you,
Thinking of your blue-shadowed silk,
Is music. It is like the strain
Waked in the elders by Susanna;
Of a green evening, clear and warm,
She bathed in her still garden, while
The red-eyed elders, watching, felt
The basses of their beings throb
In witching chords, and their thin blood
Pulse pizzicati of Hosanna.
II
In the green water, clear and warm,
Susanna lay.
She searched
The touch of springs,
And found
Concealed imaginings.
She sighed,
For so much melody.
Upon the bank, she stood
In the cool
Of spent emotions.
She felt, among the leaves,
The dew
Of old devotions.
She walked upon the grass,
Still quavering.
The winds were like her maids,
On timid feet,
Fetching her woven scarves,
Yet wavering.
A breath upon her hand
Muted the night.
She turned —
A cymbal crashed,
And roaring horns.
III
Soon, with a noise like tambourines,
Came her attendant Byzantines.
They wondered why Susanna cried
Against the elders by her side;
And as they whispered, the refrain
Was like a willow swept by rain.
Anon, their lamps' uplifted flame
Revealed Susanna and her shame.
And then, the simpering Byzantines
Fled, with a noise like tambourines.
IV
Beauty is momentary in the mind —
The fitful tracing of a portal;
But in the flesh it is immortal.
The body dies; the body's beauty lives.
So evenings die, in their green going,
A wave, interminably flowing.
So gardens die, their meek breath scenting
The cowl of winter, done repenting.
So maidens die, to the auroral
Celebration of a maiden's choral.
Susanna's music touched the bawdy strings
Of those white elders; but, escaping,
Left only Death's ironic scraping.
Now, in its immortality, it plays
On the clear viol of her memory,
And makes a constant sacrament of praise.
--Wallace Stevens
Peter Quince at the Clavier
I
Just as my fingers on these keys
Make music, so the self-same sounds
On my spirit make a music, too.
Music is feeling, then, not sound;
And thus it is that what I feel,
Here in this room, desiring you,
Thinking of your blue-shadowed silk,
Is music. It is like the strain
Waked in the elders by Susanna;
Of a green evening, clear and warm,
She bathed in her still garden, while
The red-eyed elders, watching, felt
The basses of their beings throb
In witching chords, and their thin blood
Pulse pizzicati of Hosanna.
II
In the green water, clear and warm,
Susanna lay.
She searched
The touch of springs,
And found
Concealed imaginings.
She sighed,
For so much melody.
Upon the bank, she stood
In the cool
Of spent emotions.
She felt, among the leaves,
The dew
Of old devotions.
She walked upon the grass,
Still quavering.
The winds were like her maids,
On timid feet,
Fetching her woven scarves,
Yet wavering.
A breath upon her hand
Muted the night.
She turned —
A cymbal crashed,
And roaring horns.
III
Soon, with a noise like tambourines,
Came her attendant Byzantines.
They wondered why Susanna cried
Against the elders by her side;
And as they whispered, the refrain
Was like a willow swept by rain.
Anon, their lamps' uplifted flame
Revealed Susanna and her shame.
And then, the simpering Byzantines
Fled, with a noise like tambourines.
IV
Beauty is momentary in the mind —
The fitful tracing of a portal;
But in the flesh it is immortal.
The body dies; the body's beauty lives.
So evenings die, in their green going,
A wave, interminably flowing.
So gardens die, their meek breath scenting
The cowl of winter, done repenting.
So maidens die, to the auroral
Celebration of a maiden's choral.
Susanna's music touched the bawdy strings
Of those white elders; but, escaping,
Left only Death's ironic scraping.
Now, in its immortality, it plays
On the clear viol of her memory,
And makes a constant sacrament of praise.
--Wallace Stevens
Member
Thread Starter
Join Date: Jan 2013
Posts: 1,920
That is a wonderful poem. Idea of order at key west is one of my favorites. Got a text about distancing ourselves and then a phone call. Ignored both. Going to go ahead and block. I'm not sure why these attempts at contact keep happening. I'm tired, sad and ready to move on.
Member
Join Date: Feb 2015
Location: Seattle, WA
Posts: 254
It sounds like you have all the right ideas about the plan, it's the execution you need a more solid picture of? I absolutely second what everyone else had said, so I won't repeat it. I'll just re-post something I found on the good ol' internet that has helped me in times of doubt about what NC means (I went NC with my mother last year.)
How can we keep ourselves and our loved ones safe from our abusive parents, siblings, or other relatives? After we have tried rebuking, confronting, reasoning, pleading, and setting limits for years- only to find that nothing works with abusers- what choice is left? And after we disown our abusers, or THEY disown US for setting limits on their behavior, how can we stay safe from their drama, schemes, manipulations, and attempts to draw us back in?
If you have not yet gone No Contact- or have only just recently done so- then some of these measures will no doubt seem extreme to you at this point in time. Your estranged family might not have tried yet to get to you and re-establish their control over your life using these tactics, but eventually they will start. And then, not only will you see the logic in putting up impermeable walls, but you will be prepared to do so and not be caught off-guard.
As always, what I write is my own opinion based on my personal experiences with abusers and their targets, and not intended to substitute for counseling with a qualified professional. I urge you to seek counseling with your pastor or a licensed therapist who specializes in the field of abuse before making any decisions regarding your individual situation.
So, what exactly does it mean to “cut ties” with reprobate, sociopathic abusers?:
TWENTY-ONE RULES OF NO CONTACT
1. No talking to them no matter what happens and no matter what you hear.
2. No letting them talk to you, No listening to anything they say, No "hearing them out."
3. No letting them into your house and No going to their house. If it is possible to move, then move, get a P.O. box, and don't let them know when or where you're going.
4. No phone calls and No returning voicemail messages. Change your number to unlisted and unpublished, and do not give it to anyone you can't trust not to give it to your abuser. Never pick up the phone. Use Caller ID or let your machine pick up.
5. No sending or responding to e-mails. Block their e-mails, IMs, and ability to see when you are online.
6. No meetings to "talk things over" or "work things out."
7. No cards or letters, and No responding to cards or letters. No birthday cards. No Christmas cards. No Mother's Day or Father's Day cards.
8. No giving gifts and No accepting gifts. If a gift is sent to you, No acknowledging it and No responding.
9. No exceptions for holidays, birthdays, or anniversaries.
10. No returning gifts, cards, or letters. To an abuser, that is a response. He will interpret it to mean that you are still emotionally connected to him, you still care, and if he keeps trying, he can wear you down. Just ignore all communications.
11. No visits, including hospital visits.
12. No letting them near your kids. If they're too toxic for you to be around, then they're too toxic for your children to be around. Monitor your children's e-mails and cell phones, changing e-mail accounts and phone numbers if necessary. Warn your children to stay away from them, and to run and tell a teacher if they show up at their school. Notify your children's school to call you and the police.
13. No public pleasantries. If you run into them in a public place, ignore them, turn your back, and walk away. If they approach you, say in a loud voice, "Leave me alone!" and "Do not talk to me." If they persist or you believe you are being stalked, call the police. Get a paper trail started. Make a police report and get a case number so that in the future you can file charges for stalking, aggravated harassment, and any other crimes that the police or your lawyer can think of.
14. No discussing them with anybody who has contact with them.
15. No speaking at all to anyone who might be pumping you for information or spying on you, and reporting back to them. Cut off anyone who is not loyal to you.
16. No listening to any news about them. If you are absolutely dying of curiosity, listen, but do not show any undue interest, do not get baited into responding, and do not reveal any information about yourself in return.
17. No giving other people information about you or your family that they could carry back to your abuser.
18. No invitations to your big events and No responding to invitations they send you.
19. No responding to news that they are getting married, having a baby, getting a new job, retiring, moving, taking a trip, sick, dying, or dead.
20. No big announcements and No telling them anything about your life- No letting them know you're getting married, moving, or having a baby. No letting them know when your children get married, where they live, work, or go to school, or when your grandkids are born.
21. Print out e-mails, tape voicemail messages, and keep all cards, letters, and other communications in a file for future harassment or stalking charges, but do not respond.
No Contact means NO Contact. Nothing! Nada, Zilch, Zip, Zero. As if your ex-abusers were total strangers who also happen to be dangerous, psychopathic stalkers. Which they pretty much are. So why would you not protect yourself and your family from them?
Narcissists do not understand limits, maintaining a comfortable distance, taking it slow, or being cordial while still keeping someone at arm’s length. They only deal in extremes, and must be totally enmeshed with you, with no boundaries or restrictions. It’s all or nothing with them. Because of this, it’s important to accept that it is not possible to have “limited” or “occasional” contact- for instance, only when there is a big event like a wedding or a funeral. This only sends a mixed message to your abuser, who will interpret any willingness at all on your part to communicate with him as a sign that all is forgiven, you’ve gotten over your little snit, and everything can now go back to normal, without him ever having to apologize or stop abusing you.
No Contact is The End. You have already wasted your entire life trying everything possible to have a nice peaceful relationship, and nothing worked. That is why you’ve reached this crossroads. There is nothing left to try. It's over. It's time to put a period on it, walk away, and never look back. Time to finally live your life. Time to do what you must to protect yourself and your loved ones from evil people who would do you harm. If you break No Contact, you will only be sucked back in. If you keep No Contact, you will live your life in peace, freedom, and safety. And after it's all over, I leave it up to you whether you go to the funeral or not. If you have moved on with your life and left the past in the past, then you won't feel the need to.
If you have not yet gone No Contact- or have only just recently done so- then some of these measures will no doubt seem extreme to you at this point in time. Your estranged family might not have tried yet to get to you and re-establish their control over your life using these tactics, but eventually they will start. And then, not only will you see the logic in putting up impermeable walls, but you will be prepared to do so and not be caught off-guard.
As always, what I write is my own opinion based on my personal experiences with abusers and their targets, and not intended to substitute for counseling with a qualified professional. I urge you to seek counseling with your pastor or a licensed therapist who specializes in the field of abuse before making any decisions regarding your individual situation.
So, what exactly does it mean to “cut ties” with reprobate, sociopathic abusers?:
TWENTY-ONE RULES OF NO CONTACT
1. No talking to them no matter what happens and no matter what you hear.
2. No letting them talk to you, No listening to anything they say, No "hearing them out."
3. No letting them into your house and No going to their house. If it is possible to move, then move, get a P.O. box, and don't let them know when or where you're going.
4. No phone calls and No returning voicemail messages. Change your number to unlisted and unpublished, and do not give it to anyone you can't trust not to give it to your abuser. Never pick up the phone. Use Caller ID or let your machine pick up.
5. No sending or responding to e-mails. Block their e-mails, IMs, and ability to see when you are online.
6. No meetings to "talk things over" or "work things out."
7. No cards or letters, and No responding to cards or letters. No birthday cards. No Christmas cards. No Mother's Day or Father's Day cards.
8. No giving gifts and No accepting gifts. If a gift is sent to you, No acknowledging it and No responding.
9. No exceptions for holidays, birthdays, or anniversaries.
10. No returning gifts, cards, or letters. To an abuser, that is a response. He will interpret it to mean that you are still emotionally connected to him, you still care, and if he keeps trying, he can wear you down. Just ignore all communications.
11. No visits, including hospital visits.
12. No letting them near your kids. If they're too toxic for you to be around, then they're too toxic for your children to be around. Monitor your children's e-mails and cell phones, changing e-mail accounts and phone numbers if necessary. Warn your children to stay away from them, and to run and tell a teacher if they show up at their school. Notify your children's school to call you and the police.
13. No public pleasantries. If you run into them in a public place, ignore them, turn your back, and walk away. If they approach you, say in a loud voice, "Leave me alone!" and "Do not talk to me." If they persist or you believe you are being stalked, call the police. Get a paper trail started. Make a police report and get a case number so that in the future you can file charges for stalking, aggravated harassment, and any other crimes that the police or your lawyer can think of.
14. No discussing them with anybody who has contact with them.
15. No speaking at all to anyone who might be pumping you for information or spying on you, and reporting back to them. Cut off anyone who is not loyal to you.
16. No listening to any news about them. If you are absolutely dying of curiosity, listen, but do not show any undue interest, do not get baited into responding, and do not reveal any information about yourself in return.
17. No giving other people information about you or your family that they could carry back to your abuser.
18. No invitations to your big events and No responding to invitations they send you.
19. No responding to news that they are getting married, having a baby, getting a new job, retiring, moving, taking a trip, sick, dying, or dead.
20. No big announcements and No telling them anything about your life- No letting them know you're getting married, moving, or having a baby. No letting them know when your children get married, where they live, work, or go to school, or when your grandkids are born.
21. Print out e-mails, tape voicemail messages, and keep all cards, letters, and other communications in a file for future harassment or stalking charges, but do not respond.
No Contact means NO Contact. Nothing! Nada, Zilch, Zip, Zero. As if your ex-abusers were total strangers who also happen to be dangerous, psychopathic stalkers. Which they pretty much are. So why would you not protect yourself and your family from them?
Narcissists do not understand limits, maintaining a comfortable distance, taking it slow, or being cordial while still keeping someone at arm’s length. They only deal in extremes, and must be totally enmeshed with you, with no boundaries or restrictions. It’s all or nothing with them. Because of this, it’s important to accept that it is not possible to have “limited” or “occasional” contact- for instance, only when there is a big event like a wedding or a funeral. This only sends a mixed message to your abuser, who will interpret any willingness at all on your part to communicate with him as a sign that all is forgiven, you’ve gotten over your little snit, and everything can now go back to normal, without him ever having to apologize or stop abusing you.
No Contact is The End. You have already wasted your entire life trying everything possible to have a nice peaceful relationship, and nothing worked. That is why you’ve reached this crossroads. There is nothing left to try. It's over. It's time to put a period on it, walk away, and never look back. Time to finally live your life. Time to do what you must to protect yourself and your loved ones from evil people who would do you harm. If you break No Contact, you will only be sucked back in. If you keep No Contact, you will live your life in peace, freedom, and safety. And after it's all over, I leave it up to you whether you go to the funeral or not. If you have moved on with your life and left the past in the past, then you won't feel the need to.
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