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Personal Recovery & AA: dissonace and conflict vs. connection & community

Old 09-01-2011, 12:40 PM
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Personal Recovery & AA: dissonace and conflict vs. connection & community

Increasingly, the sin/confession/redemption paradigm of AA has been difficult to embrace, as it runs counter to my sense of the spiritual, of what we might call ‘God’. As time has gone on, when going to meetings, and as connections to individuals have grown closer, there is an increasing amount of cognitive and existential dissonance, such that it has become more and more of a conflict. On one hand there is the sense of community and physically being with others recovering; on the other hand, the dogma of the group canon (the big book), its revered spiritual leader/founder (father figure), and then the individuals who embrace them to varying degrees. Thus I have found that it is harder and harder to share my personal journey and my stories of hope and recovery without crossing certain group boundaries, and arousing conflict. For instance, last week, I shared that in addition to AA, and all of the wonderful people there, that my therapist had also been another very helpful pillar of support. After that, the next five people who shared all went on to have something or other negative to say about therapists and therapy in general, as if I had stepped out of an AA meeting and into a Scientology group. It was bizarre, as I meant no disrespect. It was instructive in how quickly the group reacted to reject the incursion of an idea that they clearly did not want to gain general credence among the members: it was as if an outside force had attacked, and they mobilized against it. It was a very striking example of group dynamics, and, to that extent, a learning experience.

I take a multi-faceted approach, and am wondering how 'close' to AA my relationship should be, in relation to my personal history, my fragile sense of self esteem, and other modes of seeking recovery...to what extent is limited participation helpful, and to what extent does it raise the question of being a threat to the group authority, and thus set up the dynamic of choosing to move towards greater inclusion by accepting the dogma, or greater exclusion by remaining independent?

I have followed a path that re-writes the steps in much different language, focusing on the positive, the creative and the nurturing...but perhaps it is best to follow on my own, though group contact is helpful. I often think to myself: perhaps I should start an alternative recovery group.

Or that almost any group of recovering people is beneficial, in ways, but that the greater the dogma, the lesser I feel comfortable and willing to participate. And there it is: this social aspect that nonetheless seems helpful.

Or perhaps I am just lonely, given my odd work hours, and limited social contact in general. The Tavern I used to go to and AA meeting serve similar funtions...the saying 'any port in a storm’ seems apt, here, and the storm is loneliness, and lack of meaningful human and group engagement. I need to find a way to expand the richness of my social life, in ways that do not involve drinking, and go beyond just meetings. I went to 3 last week, and felt a bit frantic, like that was all I was doing, and got a bit worried about a whole life, passing like that, work, commute, sleep, walk to meetings on the weekend, work, commute, wash, rinse, repeat. It left almost no time for writing, or even cooking or cleaning for that matter, given the long commute and work hours.

I think I need to look at life-balance issues, here, as this goes on, though in early sobriety the meetings have helped.

~

I have been pondering this notion of 'ego' I hear so often, vs. the definition of ego in the field of psychology, and mulling over that the actual goal is not to deflate the ego per se. In AA, ‘ego’ is often uttered as something that is bad, as opposed to it being a neutral, schematic term. In many cases people with low self esteems lack a well adjusted ego, and need to build a healthy ego (or sense of personality), that allows them to negotiate their inner desires while also functioning in society. For the mighty who have fallen, those who felt they could control whatever might come along, and held positions of relative power and as such informed Bill W. (himself a the well heeled financier) 'tearing down' the ego may work best. For many others, 'adjusting' the ego function seems a more apt approach, especially for minorities, the disenfranchised, and those with a fragile sense of self to begin with. I wonder if the model of sin/surrender/confession redemption is as apt for those who never felt they could control everything, who felt powerless instead of powerful, who felt humble as opposed to certain, who lived meagerly as opposed to well, who dealt with issues of low self esteem as opposed to ‘inflated’ egos.

~

In psychology, the ego is essentially the functioning ‘self’, negotiating between the pleasure seeking, primal desires of the child-like Id, and the demands of the parental, moral, socially learned super-ego. Thus, the goal is have to have an ego that balances these competing polarities. Much of the notion of the ego being 'bad' has always baffled me...it is a neutral term, in all actuality, and not simply a balloon to be deflated; it has more of a qualitative aspect as much of or perhaps more so than a quantitative aspect, of being big or small. And so, considering this, I have mulled over what things are holding me back, what aspects of personality I would like to change, and what things about me that are good, that I need to nurture and develop.

This has made me see that what many call a 'defect' of personality is a somewhat loaded term, and one that bristles with complexities. It reminds me in aspects of the notion of original sin, an idea I have always rejected, as if we were all born not being OK.

~

Later, in the field of Transactional Analysis, Erik Berne would use the terms Child, Parent and Adult to more or less replace the earlier paradigm of Id, Ego, and Super-Ego, in which he proposes that our thoughts and actions are directed out of these parts of ourselves: the impulsive, fun-loving, creative, curious child; the rational adult; and the restrictive, judging but also nurturing parent. In AA, I often see the new-comer in the role of the naughty child, and the older members in the role of parent, with the discussion being carried on in a generally, but not always, pragmatic adult level. But the social dynamics are certainly curious, as is the victim/rescuer/enabler paradigm.

So all of this has made me see that what many call a 'defect' of personality is a somewhat loaded term, and one that bristles with complexities. It has a very negative connotation, and reminds me in aspects of the notion of original sin, an idea I have always rejected, as if we were all born not being OK.

I still have no intention of drinking, and have been exploring my self and my prior motivations with great rigor...it is mainly that I lack an avenue to share all this that at times seems frustrating. I have explored starting an independent recovery group, open to different modalities, and have even looked into using rooms at the local Unitarian Church, who seemed to like my ideas, and have also contacted the person who started The Spiral Steps, in as exploratory capacity, to see what steps might lead to this becoming a reality.

Well, thought I would share this; I am certain many brows will be raised, but if I am to be true to myself, to my inner spirit and its connection to the universal, to the light within me, my Holy Ghost, if you will, then this is what needed to be said.
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Old 09-01-2011, 01:03 PM
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Intellectualizing got me drunk. Why not just work your AA program?
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Old 09-01-2011, 01:07 PM
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HP - What you have been doing over these last few months seems to have been working for you. My home group doesn't look down on getting outside help and I don't think most do.

I know for me, therapy was a big part of my recovery.

You have to do whatever works for you.

Don't worry about what others think of you.
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Old 09-01-2011, 01:20 PM
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Originally Posted by HuskyPup View Post
For instance, last week, I shared that in addition to AA, and all of the wonderful people there, that my therapist had also been another very helpful pillar of support. After that, the next five people who shared all went on to have something or other negative to say about therapists and therapy in general, as if I had stepped out of an AA meeting and into a Scientology group. It was bizarre, as I meant no disrespect. It was instructive in how quickly the group reacted to reject the incursion of an idea that they clearly did not want to gain general credence among the members: it was as if an outside force had attacked, and they mobilized against it. It was a very striking example of group dynamics, and, to that extent, a learning experience.
A common approach to sidestep the "no cross-talk" rule. Not unusual, and as you've seen, quite effective. That is, unless someone like me happens to be present to share after the fifth person. I never could resist whenever something like this occurred. :-)
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Old 09-01-2011, 01:20 PM
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Good for you, Huskypup, good for you. If there is one thing I have learned in the years since I quit drinking, it is that this thing that some people call "recovery" is actually just life. Each of us must live our lives the way we see fit, and there is nothing wrong with examining a particular philosophy to see if it suits us, or with judging group dynamics to decide whether we want to be part of a particular group.

Great work.
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Old 09-01-2011, 01:23 PM
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Originally Posted by HuskyPup View Post

I take a multi-faceted approach, and am wondering how 'close' to AA my relationship should be...
Same here. I study far more philosophy, religion and spiritual subject matter than most AA members and find that most old-timers are not open to any of it.

I have to limit my terminology to that which is in the Big Book. Even quoting from the 12&12 gets me negative feedback in some meetings. The best rule I find useful is:

"When in Rome, do as the Roman's do".
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Old 09-01-2011, 01:29 PM
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Originally Posted by onlythetruth View Post
If there is one thing I have learned in the years since I quit drinking, it is that this thing that some people call "recovery" is actually just life.
Bingo.
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Old 09-01-2011, 01:32 PM
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Originally Posted by sugarbear1 View Post
Intellectualizing got me drunk. Why not just work your AA program?
Was this meant to be supportive? Because it sounds awfully disrespectful and dismissive to me. I for one think that Huskypup is doing a great job of thinking things through and figuring out what will work for him.
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Old 09-01-2011, 01:39 PM
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Originally Posted by Boleo View Post
I have to limit my terminology to that which is in the Big Book. Even quoting from the 12&12 gets me negative feedback in some meetings.
Wow, that is really unfortunate, Boleo. I went to some mighty dogmatic meetings during my years in AA, but I never ran across a problem quoting from the 12&12. Guess I was lucky.
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Old 09-01-2011, 01:43 PM
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I guess I just really don't care about negative feedback.
I share from my experience.
No one has to like it. It's just the truth.
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Old 09-01-2011, 02:39 PM
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If I go to AA to find negetive people and ideas....I sure can. I can hear all sorts of complaints

If I go to AA to share my positive expereinces...I always go away feeling good about the meeting...
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Old 09-01-2011, 02:57 PM
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Thank you for your post! You are a very good writer and it was nice to see some of my own thoughts so concisely expressed. Especially regarding the loneliness and odd work hours and addiction being seen as a defect issues...

The idea of an alternative group is interesting too!
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Old 09-01-2011, 03:13 PM
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Huskypup...can I get an AMEN??? and I'm not even religious LOL I agree wholehartedly with your post. You cited many of the reason I drifted away from AA early on, with no ill effects on my sobriety (in fact quite the contrary). I could not reconcile my feelings about the way group members seemed to shut down others when they shared. It didn't bother me when they did it to me because...well, I don't base my self esteem on what others think of me. Spent too many years doing that and lost myself in the process. I found some valuable things in AA, but also a great deal of things that were either not valuable or were impeding my growth. When I put it on a scale...well, it was clear I needed to move on to something more valuable for me at that point in my recovery.

The dissonance you are describing is very real...and enduring it for long periods can be very dangerous to one's well being. You should NOT have to compromise beliefs in order to fit into a group. Group dysfunction is alive and well and has been throughout history. Dissonance is there for a reason...it is telling you something very important. Consider listening...

Lastly...Intellectualizing can get you drunk? wow...I don't even know what to say...um, I am an educator and if there is only one thing I hope to pass along to the young people I teach it is that knowledge is power. period. The "stuck" can become "unstuck" with knowledge. Just a little P.S. - drinking alcohol can get you drunk and that's all that can get you drunk.
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Old 09-01-2011, 03:17 PM
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Originally Posted by onlythetruth
it is that this thing that some people call "recovery" is actually just life.
OTT, this is one of the most profound things I've heard lately...
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Old 09-01-2011, 03:47 PM
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Originally Posted by onlythetruth
it is that this thing that some people call "recovery" is actually just life.
Yes sir reee.

I wish I only had a thinking problem. Alas not so, it was my drunken behavior that got me...to use the AA vernacular..into many a tight fixes.
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Old 09-01-2011, 03:49 PM
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Hi HuskyPup... I hope you find the group of people and the support you crave.

If you are looking for support for your alternative program of recovery at AA, it won't happen. Not because your ideas have no merit, or that they don't like you... Not at all. The fellowship of AA supports the program of AA. I am not at all surprised that you have encountered some cognitive dissonance, although I would hope that you were not treated too badly... We, in this diverse recovery community must show each other some respect, even if we disagree about each other's method.

Try not to take it personally... Overanalyzing and intellectualizing the negative responses you get from people who have recovered from a hopeless state of mind using the steps when you propose to them another way... Well, it could put you in a state of mind where a drink starts to look appealing... And no one wants you to go back out.

If you are not happy in AA and cannot be true to yourself by doing as they do... Then good for you for recognizing it... and get out there and start your own meeting... I am sure you are not the only one who feels the way you do.

Get a room at the Unitarian Church and a coffee pot and start that meeting! I wish you nothing but success.
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Old 09-01-2011, 05:04 PM
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What types of meeting do you go to? I personally do not like open discussion meetings, where people might share about the fishing trip they went on over the weekend or what their kids are doing in school.

I like BB study or 12 step meetings, they tend to have less drama and are more focused on the program. JMHO.
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Old 09-01-2011, 06:29 PM
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HuskyPup,
Maybe AA isn't for you. There are plenty of approaches to recovery. If you feel drawn to begin a new meeting or an alternative recovery group, by all means follow your heart. I am surprised that group members were antagonistic and negative when you mentioned working with a therapist. I know lots of folks in AA who have benefited from therapy, anti-depressant medication, addiction counselors, group therapy, etc. The next time someone in AA dismisses therapy, you might consider quoting the Big Book:

"But this does not mean that we disregard human health measures. God has abundantly supplied this world with fine doctors, psychologists, and practitioners of various kinds. Do not hesitate to take your health problems to such persons. Most of them give freely of themselves, that their fellows may enjoy sound minds and bodies. Try to remember that though God has wrought miracles among us, we should never belittle a good doctor or psychiatrist. Their services are often indispensible in treating a newcomer and in following his case afterward." p. 133 Big Book of AA, 1st Ed.

Also, you might try some different AA meetings. Each has its own "personality" so to speak. If you live in a larger metropolitan area, there are likely meetings that draw different groups -- men, women, gay-friendly, agnostic, beginners, etc. And Carol makes an excellent point. The more I focus on the negative, the negative increases. The more I focus on the positive, the positive increases. All the best.
Susan
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Old 09-01-2011, 09:13 PM
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HuskyPup,

Mark75 and susanlauren gave you the best advice, IMO. If you can't stand up to the Big Book thumpers without flinching, and you can't do what Boleo suggested ("when in rome, do as the romans do"), your best bet is to find something that suits you better. Unless you can actually get with the program, so to speak, my guess is that the "cognitive and existential dissonance" that you describe is only going to grow over time.

If you do your homework, you'll learn that AA has a long history in the area where you are at. The Oxford Groups were active there, and Sam Shoemaker, whom Bill Wilson got the original six step program from, was born there. I know of one AA group in the area that is still in operation after 53 years. You simply aren't going to find any meetings where they do not put emphasis on the 12 Step program, or what some in the 12-Step forum here call "middle of the road" AA. At best, you'll end up in one of the two "agnostics" groups in the state, where people drive for an hour or more to get to, but where they also use the steps.

Starting a new recovery program from scratch might be a tall order, but it should be relatively easy for you to start a LifeRing Secular Recovery group in the area, or a SMART Recovery group. Perhaps others with similar inclinations to yours might benefit if you do.
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Old 09-01-2011, 09:42 PM
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I have the good fortune of being in meetings where many of the AA members contradict the pure AA message. I believe its call the infusion of 'rehab speech'. Such groups do exist. Yes these groups violate just about every precept of AA. Talk like the; 'first drink causes powerlessness', 'don't drink no matter what', meeting makers make it' and so on.

I know I am involved with people that forgo the primary message of AA to accommodate the 'outside fringe' of people, like myself, that seek fellowship in a sober life style. I have been included for better or worse in registered open AA meetings.

If you happen to find like minded members of AA, as I have, then you will know the benefit of group membership. Groups of people that invoke positive change among its members is a powerful thing.

I say find like minded peeps. Be involved with them and forget - pass over that you find disturbing.
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