Problem drinker vs true alcoholic
Member
Join Date: Nov 2007
Posts: 1,697
If you are looking out for yourself - what did you do wrong?
I do know that I could never get sober for someone else. And like you said - being part of the 'program' and working a program are two different things. I don't know any AA's who go to meetings, are active, and have got to the point where they are just having a couple drinks now and again with friends.
AA is for those who desire to stop drinking - not those who wish to moderate...
Alcohlics are the best actors in the world - truly. Keep that in mind.
I do know that I could never get sober for someone else. And like you said - being part of the 'program' and working a program are two different things. I don't know any AA's who go to meetings, are active, and have got to the point where they are just having a couple drinks now and again with friends.
AA is for those who desire to stop drinking - not those who wish to moderate...
Alcohlics are the best actors in the world - truly. Keep that in mind.
Member
Join Date: Jun 2006
Location: UK
Posts: 1,415
Hi Chick!
there's a FRiends and Family forum here at SR -
http://www.soberrecovery.com/forums/...ly-alcoholics/
There's lots of very wise people there!
NandM, help me out here. Do you and others on the 12 step forum believe that a "vital psychic change necessary to bring about recovery", and a "spiritual experience" are the same thing? Or are they quite different? I know I have had a vital psychic change.
Is it just words? Or are they different things?
there's a FRiends and Family forum here at SR -
http://www.soberrecovery.com/forums/...ly-alcoholics/
There's lots of very wise people there!
NandM, help me out here. Do you and others on the 12 step forum believe that a "vital psychic change necessary to bring about recovery", and a "spiritual experience" are the same thing? Or are they quite different? I know I have had a vital psychic change.
Is it just words? Or are they different things?
Member
Join Date: Sep 2007
Location: Kalamazoo, MI
Posts: 8
This is an awesome thread. Thanks to everyone for contributing so far.
Anyone who has to make specific rules for themselves in order to moderate their own drinking....has got a serious problem. I'm not going to label them, but I would say that they have a problem. (is that a label? I guess it is. sorry!)
I wish I had some awesome advice for you NYC but I do not. I do know that most alcoholics actually CAN control their drinking, but not for any significant length of time. Sooner or later, they eventually lose control. That is why the disease is so cunning--because most any alcoholic can force themselves to stay in control of their drinking (in the short run). We can fool ourselves into thinking we've regained control.
I use to try and limit myself to a fifth of liquor a day. A fifth! And I would screw that up eventually. It's not the amount that matters....it's the fact that I am making a rule at all. That is the insanity. That is the alcoholic mind struggling to maintain control. "Normal" people don't have to set rules for themselves....they don't have to struggle to drink responsibly. They find it effortless.
Anyone who has to make specific rules for themselves in order to moderate their own drinking....has got a serious problem. I'm not going to label them, but I would say that they have a problem. (is that a label? I guess it is. sorry!)
I wish I had some awesome advice for you NYC but I do not. I do know that most alcoholics actually CAN control their drinking, but not for any significant length of time. Sooner or later, they eventually lose control. That is why the disease is so cunning--because most any alcoholic can force themselves to stay in control of their drinking (in the short run). We can fool ourselves into thinking we've regained control.
I use to try and limit myself to a fifth of liquor a day. A fifth! And I would screw that up eventually. It's not the amount that matters....it's the fact that I am making a rule at all. That is the insanity. That is the alcoholic mind struggling to maintain control. "Normal" people don't have to set rules for themselves....they don't have to struggle to drink responsibly. They find it effortless.
Life the gift of recovery!
Thread Starter
Join Date: Aug 2007
Location: Home is where the heart is
Posts: 7,061
Originally Posted by paulmh 
NandM, help me out here. Do you and others on the 12 step forum believe that a "vital psychic change necessary to bring about recovery", and a "spiritual experience" are the same thing? Or are they quite different? I know I have had a vital psychic change.
Is it just words? Or are they different things?
Is it just words? Or are they different things?
Member
Join Date: Feb 2008
Posts: 902
sugErspun - I feel like I did something wrong because if he's not really an alcoholic, then I could have just given up the love of my life without trying to give him the chance to figure it out. Sounds dumb, but this is my thought process right now. He said he has all this support, so if I'm wrong, doesn't that make me crazy or something like that? Then again, lie after lie, which have been much worse than I posted, kind of makes me think something is wrong. All I know now is that it's a difficult place to be.
I understand that he has to get better for himself. I guess I have watched too much intervention TV or something. I thought he was giving up drinking because he wanted to. I also thought that if the people in his life were important enough he would work to make that change. I just don't understand why he would admit to the problem, then say that although he is an alcoholic, he is different now and can control it.
Pulmh - Thanks for the link! I see what they have to say. I'm already going to meetings, so I guess I'm headed in the right direction.
Skinnyninja - Thank you! Someone else (who has a drink maybe one every six months) told me the same thing. I guess it just helps to hear from someone in recovery.
I am sorry for intruding on your post. Thank you again!
I understand that he has to get better for himself. I guess I have watched too much intervention TV or something. I thought he was giving up drinking because he wanted to. I also thought that if the people in his life were important enough he would work to make that change. I just don't understand why he would admit to the problem, then say that although he is an alcoholic, he is different now and can control it.
Pulmh - Thanks for the link! I see what they have to say. I'm already going to meetings, so I guess I'm headed in the right direction.
Skinnyninja - Thank you! Someone else (who has a drink maybe one every six months) told me the same thing. I guess it just helps to hear from someone in recovery.
I am sorry for intruding on your post. Thank you again!
Life the gift of recovery!
Thread Starter
Join Date: Aug 2007
Location: Home is where the heart is
Posts: 7,061
Originally Posted by NYC_Chick
sugErspun - I feel like I did something wrong because if he's not really an alcoholic, then I could have just given up the love of my life without trying to give him the chance to figure it out. Sounds dumb, but this is my thought process right now. He said he has all this support, so if I'm wrong, doesn't that make me crazy or something like that? Then again, lie after lie, which have been much worse than I posted, kind of makes me think something is wrong. All I know now is that it's a difficult place to be.
I understand that he has to get better for himself. I guess I have watched too much intervention TV or something. I thought he was giving up drinking because he wanted to. I also thought that if the people in his life were important enough he would work to make that change. I just don't understand why he would admit to the problem, then say that although he is an alcoholic, he is different now and can control it.
Pulmh - Thanks for the link! I see what they have to say. I'm already going to meetings, so I guess I'm headed in the right direction.
Skinnyninja - Thank you! Someone else (who has a drink maybe one every six months) told me the same thing. I guess it just helps to hear from someone in recovery.
I am sorry for intruding on your post. Thank you again!
I understand that he has to get better for himself. I guess I have watched too much intervention TV or something. I thought he was giving up drinking because he wanted to. I also thought that if the people in his life were important enough he would work to make that change. I just don't understand why he would admit to the problem, then say that although he is an alcoholic, he is different now and can control it.
Pulmh - Thanks for the link! I see what they have to say. I'm already going to meetings, so I guess I'm headed in the right direction.
Skinnyninja - Thank you! Someone else (who has a drink maybe one every six months) told me the same thing. I guess it just helps to hear from someone in recovery.
I am sorry for intruding on your post. Thank you again!
I did not want your question to get lost in this thread. You might check there as you will probably find more responses there.
Life the gift of recovery!
Thread Starter
Join Date: Aug 2007
Location: Home is where the heart is
Posts: 7,061
Original posting for this thread.
Originally Posted by nandm
Some recent threads started me thinking about the various ways people see the program of AA. Some people have the thought that going to meetings will keep them sober, some feel that being active in service work will keep them sober, some feel that working with a sponsor and going to meetings is what it takes, while others feel working the steps is the key.
Because of the differing ways that people stay sober while claiming to utilize the program of AA, I became curious as to why some require the complete application of the program to stay sober while others can do a half hearted program and even at times ridicule the program of AA and still stay sober.
My hypothesis on this is that today's rooms of AA are not just filled with true alcoholics but a large percentage of problem drinkers (those who have not crossed the line into the hopelessness of the inability to live with or without alcohol). Although I feel that problem drinkers do need help and do not feel they should not be welcomed into AA, I do feel that the message of AA can be distorted when one fails to recognize the difference between the alcoholic and the problem drinker. A problem drinker has not lost all ability to stop under their own power whereas the alcoholic has. When a problem drinker carries his message often times it can mean that the true alcoholic may be led to delay trying the spiritual solution that AA offers but rather they are tempted to try those things that may work for the problem drinker, such as just going to meetings, but not working the steps, only working the steps they feel comfortable with, or only working the steps once and then deciding they are done.
My hypothesis was formed through my own experience, observations (both in the rooms of AA and on this board) as well as studying the Big Book, as well as outside literature. Below are some passages from the Big Book that I feel back up my thoughts.
Big Book Page 44:2-3
This is the basic premise of the Alcoholics Anonymous program. If we have reached the point where human aid is of no avail we have nowhere to turn but to a spiritual solution to our problem. AA is not a self help program. If we were able to help ourselves we would not need AA. From this passage it appears that for those who are truly alcoholic; unable to control their drinking, unable to quit entirely when they honestly want to; the solution has to be a spiritual one. If someone can quit drinking without a spiritual solution then they probably are not an alcoholic of this type. Although an alcoholic may have at one time been a problem drinker, the key difference remains that the alcoholic is unable to quit drinking by his/her own power and is beyond human aid. A problem drinker who has not crossed the line into alcoholism may be able to stop drinking by hanging out with other sober people, by avoiding alcohol, or by determination. The danger comes in when people blur the lines between the problem drinker and the alcoholic. A problem drinker that claims to be an alcoholic who comes into AA and states, "I don't work the steps yet, I am sober" can hinder the true alcoholic in their recovery as it can lead them to once again into the insanity of white knuckling it and then feeling the program failed them because they wind up drinking again.
Big Book Page 44:5-6
Tangible assistance from a Power greater than ourselves seems unavailable to those of us who are without hope. This help seems out of our reach and only available to monks, priests, and gurus. Faced with alcoholic destruction we become willing to attempt to access this Power that the authors declare has solved their problem. For the true alcoholic this is often a matter of life and death. The problem drinker may find it inconcievable or even ridiculous that they need to choose between destruction or a spiritual solution. For they have only glimpsed what true alcoholic destruction is. The true alcoholic has lived the destruction and knows the desperation that comes with it. For them the thought that there might be a solution is an answer to a prayer, even if it means considering a spiritual solution.
Big Book Page 44:9-10
To be a true alcoholic means that to recover we have to abandon our old ways of thinking and methods of dealing with life. Many of us hold tightly to the idea that our lives based on self can be successful if only we try hard enough. We resist, sometimes for years, beginning to build our lives on a spiritual foundation. This is not necessarily true for the problem drinker
Many of us try for years to avoid the spiritual solution hoping that mere fellowship with sober people will help us recover. Sooner or later we realize that our lives run on selfwill are unsuccessful and we begin to seek a solution. Some of us unfortunately return to our old solution and begin once again to drink. Others of us discover a true solution in the spritually based way of life suggested in the Big Book.
Alcoholism destroyes all things worthwhile in our lives leaving only feelings of worthlessness, hopelessness, and guilt. Association with sober people in AA can not bring about a personality change sufficient to overcome alcoholism. The power capable of restoring meaning and purpose to our lives can be found only by adopting a spiritual way of life. The problem drinker might be able to stay sober through these things but the true alcoholic can not.
Big Book Page 44:14
I can not think of a truer statement than this one. I tried the self help route and for me all it did was provide me more proof that I am an true alcolic, I passed the problem drinker stage early in my drinking, and I have to have a spiritual solution for me to recover.
I am not posting this thread to start a religious discussion so please lets keep on track with this and stay away from the topic of "AA is it religious" as it has nothing to do with this thread.
I am interested in hearing other's thoughts on the thread topic. The topic of this thread is problem drinker vs true alcoholic and how it applies to the program of AA.
Because of the differing ways that people stay sober while claiming to utilize the program of AA, I became curious as to why some require the complete application of the program to stay sober while others can do a half hearted program and even at times ridicule the program of AA and still stay sober.
My hypothesis on this is that today's rooms of AA are not just filled with true alcoholics but a large percentage of problem drinkers (those who have not crossed the line into the hopelessness of the inability to live with or without alcohol). Although I feel that problem drinkers do need help and do not feel they should not be welcomed into AA, I do feel that the message of AA can be distorted when one fails to recognize the difference between the alcoholic and the problem drinker. A problem drinker has not lost all ability to stop under their own power whereas the alcoholic has. When a problem drinker carries his message often times it can mean that the true alcoholic may be led to delay trying the spiritual solution that AA offers but rather they are tempted to try those things that may work for the problem drinker, such as just going to meetings, but not working the steps, only working the steps they feel comfortable with, or only working the steps once and then deciding they are done.
My hypothesis was formed through my own experience, observations (both in the rooms of AA and on this board) as well as studying the Big Book, as well as outside literature. Below are some passages from the Big Book that I feel back up my thoughts.
Big Book Page 44:2-3
This is the basic premise of the Alcoholics Anonymous program. If we have reached the point where human aid is of no avail we have nowhere to turn but to a spiritual solution to our problem. AA is not a self help program. If we were able to help ourselves we would not need AA. From this passage it appears that for those who are truly alcoholic; unable to control their drinking, unable to quit entirely when they honestly want to; the solution has to be a spiritual one. If someone can quit drinking without a spiritual solution then they probably are not an alcoholic of this type. Although an alcoholic may have at one time been a problem drinker, the key difference remains that the alcoholic is unable to quit drinking by his/her own power and is beyond human aid. A problem drinker who has not crossed the line into alcoholism may be able to stop drinking by hanging out with other sober people, by avoiding alcohol, or by determination. The danger comes in when people blur the lines between the problem drinker and the alcoholic. A problem drinker that claims to be an alcoholic who comes into AA and states, "I don't work the steps yet, I am sober" can hinder the true alcoholic in their recovery as it can lead them to once again into the insanity of white knuckling it and then feeling the program failed them because they wind up drinking again.
Big Book Page 44:5-6
Tangible assistance from a Power greater than ourselves seems unavailable to those of us who are without hope. This help seems out of our reach and only available to monks, priests, and gurus. Faced with alcoholic destruction we become willing to attempt to access this Power that the authors declare has solved their problem. For the true alcoholic this is often a matter of life and death. The problem drinker may find it inconcievable or even ridiculous that they need to choose between destruction or a spiritual solution. For they have only glimpsed what true alcoholic destruction is. The true alcoholic has lived the destruction and knows the desperation that comes with it. For them the thought that there might be a solution is an answer to a prayer, even if it means considering a spiritual solution.
Big Book Page 44:9-10
To be a true alcoholic means that to recover we have to abandon our old ways of thinking and methods of dealing with life. Many of us hold tightly to the idea that our lives based on self can be successful if only we try hard enough. We resist, sometimes for years, beginning to build our lives on a spiritual foundation. This is not necessarily true for the problem drinker
Many of us try for years to avoid the spiritual solution hoping that mere fellowship with sober people will help us recover. Sooner or later we realize that our lives run on selfwill are unsuccessful and we begin to seek a solution. Some of us unfortunately return to our old solution and begin once again to drink. Others of us discover a true solution in the spritually based way of life suggested in the Big Book.
Alcoholism destroyes all things worthwhile in our lives leaving only feelings of worthlessness, hopelessness, and guilt. Association with sober people in AA can not bring about a personality change sufficient to overcome alcoholism. The power capable of restoring meaning and purpose to our lives can be found only by adopting a spiritual way of life. The problem drinker might be able to stay sober through these things but the true alcoholic can not.
Big Book Page 44:14
I can not think of a truer statement than this one. I tried the self help route and for me all it did was provide me more proof that I am an true alcolic, I passed the problem drinker stage early in my drinking, and I have to have a spiritual solution for me to recover.
I am not posting this thread to start a religious discussion so please lets keep on track with this and stay away from the topic of "AA is it religious" as it has nothing to do with this thread.
I am interested in hearing other's thoughts on the thread topic. The topic of this thread is problem drinker vs true alcoholic and how it applies to the program of AA.
Awaiting Email Confirmation
Join Date: Jan 2006
Posts: 120
Just wanted to say that I did appreciate this topic, and it was one I had been thinking about at the time it was posted: i.e., am I a true alcoholic? and if not, maybe I should be quiet at AA meetings (though I find them helpful) for the reasons mentioned in the OP.
I do continue to lurk here at SR, and find the discussions useful, even the contentious ones
Wherever my course takes me, I wish all you fine people the best!
I do continue to lurk here at SR, and find the discussions useful, even the contentious ones
Wherever my course takes me, I wish all you fine people the best!
Life the gift of recovery!
Thread Starter
Join Date: Aug 2007
Location: Home is where the heart is
Posts: 7,061
Originally Posted by kevin 311
i.e., am I a true alcoholic? and if not, maybe I should be quiet at AA meetings (though I find them helpful) for the reasons mentioned in the OP.
I do continue to lurk here at SR, and find the discussions useful, even the contentious ones
I do continue to lurk here at SR, and find the discussions useful, even the contentious ones
I did not mean for my post to come across as though I do not feel there is room in AA for problem drinkers. In fact I think that they can get a lot of use from AA. I as an alcoholic have learned a lot from those that have been able to find AA before they crossed the line from problem drinker into true alcoholism. Please do not feel that you should not speak in an AA meeting. Your experience, strength, and hope is just as important as anyone else's there. You never know whether or not what you share may be the key to someone finding sobriety and saving their life or not. I personally have enjoyed your posts and do hope that you continue to do so. I am sure if you were in a meeting with me and shared I would also be able to find something useful from your share.
Thank you for being here.
Judith
Psalm 118:24
Join Date: Nov 2004
Location: ILLINOIS
Posts: 15,203
Originally Posted by kevin 311
Just wanted to say that I did appreciate this topic, and it was one I had been thinking about at the time it was posted: i.e., am I a true alcoholic? and if not, maybe I should be quiet at AA meetings (though I find them helpful) for the reasons mentioned in the OP.
I do continue to lurk here at SR, and find the discussions useful, even the contentious ones
Wherever my course takes me, I wish all you fine people the best!
I do continue to lurk here at SR, and find the discussions useful, even the contentious ones
Wherever my course takes me, I wish all you fine people the best!
Tradition 3
only requirement is a desire to stop drinking.
Forward we go...side by side-Rest In Peace
Join Date: Jun 2002
Location: Serene In Dixie
Posts: 36,740
Originally Posted by FightingIrish
Gosh, I never knew I had so much control over other people's drinking. I feel so powerful now.
because you must be jesting.
If you are serious...Step 1 is calling your name.
FI and Kevin
Glad you are here with us!
Forward we go...side by side-Rest In Peace
Join Date: Jun 2002
Location: Serene In Dixie
Posts: 36,740
Some post have been off base
due to personal attacks.
Some post did have quotes from the
BB without the disclaimer needed to use them.
Please see the top sticky here for
how to post within our new guidelines.
This thread has been trimmed for those reasons.
Thanks Everyone.
due to personal attacks.
Some post did have quotes from the
BB without the disclaimer needed to use them.
Please see the top sticky here for
how to post within our new guidelines.
This thread has been trimmed for those reasons.
Thanks Everyone.
Member
Join Date: Jan 2008
Location: Denver, CO
Posts: 5
Now I am confused, I am only 25, but I have done damage to myself with booze, and I have quit for 3 months at one time, and my whole family is alcoholics...and I do damage to my relationships when drinking, and people in my life think I have a problem! So AA is not for me???? My dad was a functioning alcoholic, he worked three jobs but had to drink, and this thread makes me think that I have no place in AA, which is where I wanted to go. I have been drinking since 12, and can drink bottles at a time. I thought AA was for anyone with a drinking problem. Now I feel I have no help.
Member
Join Date: Sep 2004
Location: seattle
Posts: 468
welcome, lingerie life.
you are a member of AA when you say you are. Yes, we can help you. I suggest getting to some face to face meetings and introducing yourself as a newcomer, at the begining of the meeting. You will be given phone numbers of those willing to help you. Call them. You will be given suggestions, such as get and read a bigbook. Follow the suggestions, and look for similarities not the differences. AA isnt as rigid as some people portray.
We can help.
If you are willing to be completely honest about your drinking, and willing to do some work to stay sober, you'll be just fine.
you are a member of AA when you say you are. Yes, we can help you. I suggest getting to some face to face meetings and introducing yourself as a newcomer, at the begining of the meeting. You will be given phone numbers of those willing to help you. Call them. You will be given suggestions, such as get and read a bigbook. Follow the suggestions, and look for similarities not the differences. AA isnt as rigid as some people portray.
We can help.
If you are willing to be completely honest about your drinking, and willing to do some work to stay sober, you'll be just fine.
Forward we go...side by side-Rest In Peace
Join Date: Jun 2002
Location: Serene In Dixie
Posts: 36,740
Hi Lingerielife.....Welcome!
Certainly AA is for you and it's an awesome adventure!
Congratulations on seeking a sober healthy future.
Face to face meetings are nothing like these
discussion of AA. You will find hope and help
and you too can recover.
Forward we go ...side by side
Certainly AA is for you and it's an awesome adventure!
Congratulations on seeking a sober healthy future.
Face to face meetings are nothing like these
discussion of AA. You will find hope and help
and you too can recover.
Forward we go ...side by side
Life the gift of recovery!
Thread Starter
Join Date: Aug 2007
Location: Home is where the heart is
Posts: 7,061
Originally Posted by Lingerielife
Now I am confused, I am only 25, but I have done damage to myself with booze, and I have quit for 3 months at one time, and my whole family is alcoholics...and I do damage to my relationships when drinking, and people in my life think I have a problem! So AA is not for me???? My dad was a functioning alcoholic, he worked three jobs but had to drink, and this thread makes me think that I have no place in AA, which is where I wanted to go. I have been drinking since 12, and can drink bottles at a time. I thought AA was for anyone with a drinking problem. Now I feel I have no help.
Kevin,
I did not mean for my post to come across as though I do not feel there is room in AA for problem drinkers. In fact I think that they can get a lot of use from AA. I as an alcoholic have learned a lot from those that have been able to find AA before they crossed the line from problem drinker into true alcoholism. Please do not feel that you should not speak in an AA meeting. Your experience, strength, and hope is just as important as anyone else's there. You never know whether or not what you share may be the key to someone finding sobriety and saving their life or not. I personally have enjoyed your posts and do hope that you continue to do so. I am sure if you were in a meeting with me and shared I would also be able to find something useful from your share.
Thank you for being here.
I did not mean for my post to come across as though I do not feel there is room in AA for problem drinkers. In fact I think that they can get a lot of use from AA. I as an alcoholic have learned a lot from those that have been able to find AA before they crossed the line from problem drinker into true alcoholism. Please do not feel that you should not speak in an AA meeting. Your experience, strength, and hope is just as important as anyone else's there. You never know whether or not what you share may be the key to someone finding sobriety and saving their life or not. I personally have enjoyed your posts and do hope that you continue to do so. I am sure if you were in a meeting with me and shared I would also be able to find something useful from your share.
Thank you for being here.
Member
Join Date: Sep 2007
Location: Omak WA
Posts: 1,049
Alcohol Abuser vs Alcoholic...
Hi Everyone,
I have experience in all of these topics. I am married again to my first husband and he abused alcohol all the 14 years we were married the first time. I drank right along with him.
In later years I passed the invisible line and knew I was an alcoholic & did go to treatment but only stayed sober one year here and there...especially when pregnant.
Then I had a 14 year relapse and ended up getting sober the last time at age 48 and that was 19 years ago. :ghug2
My husband was sober nine years and started drinking again...alcohol abuse..
decided he wanted me back after I was sober a few years so stopped drinking again and never has drank again. :bounce
I am still sober and we re-married after we were both retired from our careers.
The last year of my drinking I did control or what they refer to as maintenance drinking...I was on a limited budget so drank a six pack or 1/2 a fifth of vodka a night...I had no choice...I was at a place where I needed the alcohol at a certain time every day or I would start into withdrawals & if I worked overtime & had to go to the store I couldn't even write a check cuz I would be shaking so much.
I did choose the AA Program but had counseling at the Alcohol Program & group therapy there too. At the same time I got counseling from another counselor for my depression.
My whole first year of sobriety was spent getting counseling and attending AA Meetings at least once a day & sometimes a noon meeting here & there.
I worked half time and the rest was spent on staying sober and improving myself esteem as best I could by working the AA Program.
Each of us has different needs and that also is why they have open & closed AA Meetings so those not sure are welcome anytime to the open meetings & also spouses are welcome to come.
The closed meetings are for those who are serious about getting sober...some still relapse but still want to get sober but don't always make it.
kelsh
I have experience in all of these topics. I am married again to my first husband and he abused alcohol all the 14 years we were married the first time. I drank right along with him.
In later years I passed the invisible line and knew I was an alcoholic & did go to treatment but only stayed sober one year here and there...especially when pregnant.
Then I had a 14 year relapse and ended up getting sober the last time at age 48 and that was 19 years ago. :ghug2
My husband was sober nine years and started drinking again...alcohol abuse..
decided he wanted me back after I was sober a few years so stopped drinking again and never has drank again. :bounce
I am still sober and we re-married after we were both retired from our careers.
The last year of my drinking I did control or what they refer to as maintenance drinking...I was on a limited budget so drank a six pack or 1/2 a fifth of vodka a night...I had no choice...I was at a place where I needed the alcohol at a certain time every day or I would start into withdrawals & if I worked overtime & had to go to the store I couldn't even write a check cuz I would be shaking so much.
I did choose the AA Program but had counseling at the Alcohol Program & group therapy there too. At the same time I got counseling from another counselor for my depression.
My whole first year of sobriety was spent getting counseling and attending AA Meetings at least once a day & sometimes a noon meeting here & there.
I worked half time and the rest was spent on staying sober and improving myself esteem as best I could by working the AA Program.
Each of us has different needs and that also is why they have open & closed AA Meetings so those not sure are welcome anytime to the open meetings & also spouses are welcome to come.
The closed meetings are for those who are serious about getting sober...some still relapse but still want to get sober but don't always make it.
kelsh
Member
Join Date: Sep 2007
Posts: 1,876
Once the line into full blown alcohlism has occurred the ability to stop drinking by one's own power is GONE.
Where is this line??? Who determines how bad it has to get before one crosses the line??
If one has the ability to get sober without the steps they never crossed that line? That is absolutely false.
It is also an insult to all those who have gotten sober without the steps and there are many good people here at SR who have decided that aa is not for them and THEY ARE SOBER. Maybe they really weren't alcoholics afterall....
aa is suppose to be a place for anyone who has a desire to stop drinking, but the truth is unless one parrots the aa ideologies they will always be outsiders...putting "real" alcoholics at risk...
Can't have it both ways.
Where is this line??? Who determines how bad it has to get before one crosses the line??
If one has the ability to get sober without the steps they never crossed that line? That is absolutely false.
It is also an insult to all those who have gotten sober without the steps and there are many good people here at SR who have decided that aa is not for them and THEY ARE SOBER. Maybe they really weren't alcoholics afterall....
aa is suppose to be a place for anyone who has a desire to stop drinking, but the truth is unless one parrots the aa ideologies they will always be outsiders...putting "real" alcoholics at risk...
Can't have it both ways.
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