Knowledge vs Wisdom
Laozi Old Man
Thread Starter
Join Date: May 2008
Location: Detroit, MI
Posts: 6,665
Knowledge vs Wisdom
I am fond of collecting definitions of the concept of Wisdom. While there are many different definitions of wisdom, the one most common is; “wisdom is applied knowledge”. By this standard, the Nazi’s would have been considered wise men because they were masters at applying cold, objective and brutal knowledge. But who in their right mind would call Nazi’s wise men? My personal favorite definition is; “wisdom is not so much about acquiring knowledge, as it is about shedding misconceptions”.
One of the major misconceptions in addiction recovery that I had to overcome was the idea that the same tools that enabled me to stop drinking were the same tools that would enable me to stay stopped. Stopping drinking is one thing, but staying stopped is a whole new ball game. Getting stopped requires applying knowledge. Staying stopped requires shedding misconceptions.
The psychological tricks and tips that helped me obtain abstinence are not at all the same principles that keep me in recovery today. The easy to grasp slogans and frightening war-stories that were so critical in my first few weeks of abstinence were excellent tools to get me to want to stop drinking, but were never strong enough to keep me in recovery for the long run.
Slogans such as; “one day at a time” were essential in the early days of my recovery. I doubt that I could have survived without them. In the beginning, it truly was a one-day at a time program for me. Sometimes it was a one-hour at a time or even a one-minute at a time program. However, at some stage of my recovery, I had to abandon these tricks & tips and move on to more powerful tools such as new ways of thinking and spiritual tools.
As an alcoholic I have many blind spots and my brain may even be damaged in areas used for intuitive thinking. I need to somehow circumvent these dysfunctional maladies.
In other words, just not drinking does not treat alcoholism. I had to face the fact that I was uncomfortable in my own skin before I started drinking and was once again uncomfortable in my own skin after I stopped. The only long-term solution to my problem was finding a new way “taking comfort” that did not involve some sort of substance such as a liquid spirits or pills.
Since I already knew that a liquid spirit had once worked for me, but started causing me more pain than gain, I began to look for another form of spiritual solution. Namely; spiritual principles. Specifically, principles aimed at finding me the peace of mind that would allow me to be comfortable in my own skin once again, without being anesthetized.
The slogans and war-stories that helped me stay motivated in my early days of abstinence did in fact give me the diligence and tenacity to overcome my urges to pick up a drink and temporarily overcome my feelings of anxiety, frustration, guilt and despair. The problem with using diligence and tenacity were that in the long run they were mentally exhausting.
Like the ancient Greek hero “Sisyphus”, I had to push a stone up-hill 24 hours a day 7 days a week. Something that I was able to do long enough to meet my short-term goals (passing a drug screening) but not something that I could live with for the rest of my life. What I needed was a way to be totally relieved of the temptation to drink. Not just something to help me temporarily resist the temptation. Resistance is a struggle and I knew that to struggle for the rest of my life was futile. Just choosing to drink, one arduous day at a time, was not my long-term solution. What I truly needed was a way of life that would weather all storms.
What I needed to stay stopped was a “one life at a time” strategy. Something far to difficult for me to grasp in my early days of recovery. What is the long-term solution? Serenity, the “Deluxe Edition” of sobriety. It includes sobriety, peace of mind, optimism and a starting point for meditation. Without serenity, sobriety may not be worth having. True sobriety rides on the coat-tails of serenity.
One of the major misconceptions in addiction recovery that I had to overcome was the idea that the same tools that enabled me to stop drinking were the same tools that would enable me to stay stopped. Stopping drinking is one thing, but staying stopped is a whole new ball game. Getting stopped requires applying knowledge. Staying stopped requires shedding misconceptions.
The psychological tricks and tips that helped me obtain abstinence are not at all the same principles that keep me in recovery today. The easy to grasp slogans and frightening war-stories that were so critical in my first few weeks of abstinence were excellent tools to get me to want to stop drinking, but were never strong enough to keep me in recovery for the long run.
Slogans such as; “one day at a time” were essential in the early days of my recovery. I doubt that I could have survived without them. In the beginning, it truly was a one-day at a time program for me. Sometimes it was a one-hour at a time or even a one-minute at a time program. However, at some stage of my recovery, I had to abandon these tricks & tips and move on to more powerful tools such as new ways of thinking and spiritual tools.
As an alcoholic I have many blind spots and my brain may even be damaged in areas used for intuitive thinking. I need to somehow circumvent these dysfunctional maladies.
In other words, just not drinking does not treat alcoholism. I had to face the fact that I was uncomfortable in my own skin before I started drinking and was once again uncomfortable in my own skin after I stopped. The only long-term solution to my problem was finding a new way “taking comfort” that did not involve some sort of substance such as a liquid spirits or pills.
Since I already knew that a liquid spirit had once worked for me, but started causing me more pain than gain, I began to look for another form of spiritual solution. Namely; spiritual principles. Specifically, principles aimed at finding me the peace of mind that would allow me to be comfortable in my own skin once again, without being anesthetized.
The slogans and war-stories that helped me stay motivated in my early days of abstinence did in fact give me the diligence and tenacity to overcome my urges to pick up a drink and temporarily overcome my feelings of anxiety, frustration, guilt and despair. The problem with using diligence and tenacity were that in the long run they were mentally exhausting.
Like the ancient Greek hero “Sisyphus”, I had to push a stone up-hill 24 hours a day 7 days a week. Something that I was able to do long enough to meet my short-term goals (passing a drug screening) but not something that I could live with for the rest of my life. What I needed was a way to be totally relieved of the temptation to drink. Not just something to help me temporarily resist the temptation. Resistance is a struggle and I knew that to struggle for the rest of my life was futile. Just choosing to drink, one arduous day at a time, was not my long-term solution. What I truly needed was a way of life that would weather all storms.
What I needed to stay stopped was a “one life at a time” strategy. Something far to difficult for me to grasp in my early days of recovery. What is the long-term solution? Serenity, the “Deluxe Edition” of sobriety. It includes sobriety, peace of mind, optimism and a starting point for meditation. Without serenity, sobriety may not be worth having. True sobriety rides on the coat-tails of serenity.
Member
Join Date: May 2008
Location: Whoville (with Horton)
Posts: 121
Thank you very much for this post. I have not yet stopped drinking, as I am awaiting a few different things to go through the health system so I have medical intervention of my withdrawals while I detox. However I have spent the last month or so with a real thirst for knowledge. I have researched the phychology of addiction - I have googled possible complications of detox, I have spent time chatting to different people on here and searched high and low for answers to ways to avoid relapse. So I have a whole lot of knowledge now, but I think I now understand from your post that all that comes to nothing after I get through the detox, then I have to rely on wisdom, discernment and support from others.
Perhaps an interesting concept to ponder would be that knowledge comes from your head wheras wisdom comes from your soul.
Perhaps an interesting concept to ponder would be that knowledge comes from your head wheras wisdom comes from your soul.
Seriously Fun!
Join Date: Mar 2008
Location: California coast
Posts: 415
I see it as getting through the physical addiction. Where I am coming out of a fog. I can't really "think" to much. Everything is about how I physically feel. Tired mostly. And then I feel like I start to wake up and deal with all these thoughts and feelings I have not been able to handle before.
I wanted to Feel calm and comfortable.
So then comes the emotional rollercoaster. I'm full of anxiety, shame, fear, embarrassment, anger, and I say things I wish I hadn't.
I needed to feel calm and comfortable.
Then I start to think. I start using the ideas I have heard before, but had forgotten while drinking and drugging. Mostly I need to hear that I am loved, and cared about even though I just **cked everything up in my life, and those close to me. I would start to listen to words of hope, and understanding.
I started to feel calm and comfortable.
And then all of the sudden the sky started to look clear and blue again. I could see happiness in other people's faces. And then I was able to laugh. I could smell food. I could smell soap. I could smell the coffee.
Then the little gems of wisdom started to really make sense. I really need to "keep it simple". I can go OCD on so many things. Overthink, and obsess on something. And that causes me anxiety and fear.
I needed to feel calm and comfortable again, and fast.
So I had to "Let it go..."
And because my memory is so short...I can handle listening to the words of wisdom over and over again, and it sounds new.
So how do I keep finding words of wisdom?
I read a lot of recovery material. On line, AA, Grapevine, Chicken Soup for the soup books, Daily meditation books, and going to meetings and quietly listening to personal stories of recovery. I spend 15 minutes to 2 hours a day on my recovery depending on how bad I need it. I have made it a daily ritual. Even if I don't want to. I do it. (I certainly spend hours, days, and weeks on getting loaded...that's for sure.) I replace it now with positive things. And when I'm out in nature...I breath deeply, and I look all around me, and admire how beautiful the world is to me.
That's how I do it, and I'm sticking to it. And most of all I try to not take myself too seriously...for that always gets me in troubled water.
And I LOVE feeling calm and comfortable.
I wanted to Feel calm and comfortable.
So then comes the emotional rollercoaster. I'm full of anxiety, shame, fear, embarrassment, anger, and I say things I wish I hadn't.
I needed to feel calm and comfortable.
Then I start to think. I start using the ideas I have heard before, but had forgotten while drinking and drugging. Mostly I need to hear that I am loved, and cared about even though I just **cked everything up in my life, and those close to me. I would start to listen to words of hope, and understanding.
I started to feel calm and comfortable.
And then all of the sudden the sky started to look clear and blue again. I could see happiness in other people's faces. And then I was able to laugh. I could smell food. I could smell soap. I could smell the coffee.
Then the little gems of wisdom started to really make sense. I really need to "keep it simple". I can go OCD on so many things. Overthink, and obsess on something. And that causes me anxiety and fear.
I needed to feel calm and comfortable again, and fast.
So I had to "Let it go..."
And because my memory is so short...I can handle listening to the words of wisdom over and over again, and it sounds new.
So how do I keep finding words of wisdom?
I read a lot of recovery material. On line, AA, Grapevine, Chicken Soup for the soup books, Daily meditation books, and going to meetings and quietly listening to personal stories of recovery. I spend 15 minutes to 2 hours a day on my recovery depending on how bad I need it. I have made it a daily ritual. Even if I don't want to. I do it. (I certainly spend hours, days, and weeks on getting loaded...that's for sure.) I replace it now with positive things. And when I'm out in nature...I breath deeply, and I look all around me, and admire how beautiful the world is to me.
That's how I do it, and I'm sticking to it. And most of all I try to not take myself too seriously...for that always gets me in troubled water.
And I LOVE feeling calm and comfortable.
Member
Join Date: Jul 2008
Location: MN
Posts: 36
Originally Posted by Boleo 
I am fond of collecting definitions of the concept of Wisdom. While there are many different definitions of wisdom, the one most common is; “wisdom is applied knowledge”. By this standard, the Nazi’s would have been considered wise men because they were masters at applying cold, objective and brutal knowledge. But who in their right mind would call Nazi’s wise men? My personal favorite definition is; “wisdom is not so much about acquiring knowledge, as it is about shedding misconceptions”.
One of the major misconceptions in addiction recovery that I had to overcome was the idea that the same tools that enabled me to stop drinking were the same tools that would enable me to stay stopped. Stopping drinking is one thing, but staying stopped is a whole new ball game. Getting stopped requires applying knowledge. Staying stopped requires shedding misconceptions.
The psychological tricks and tips that helped me obtain abstinence are not at all the same principles that keep me in recovery today. The easy to grasp slogans and frightening war-stories that were so critical in my first few weeks of abstinence were excellent tools to get me to want to stop drinking, but were never strong enough to keep me in recovery for the long run.
Slogans such as; “one day at a time” were essential in the early days of my recovery. I doubt that I could have survived without them. In the beginning, it truly was a one-day at a time program for me. Sometimes it was a one-hour at a time or even a one-minute at a time program. However, at some stage of my recovery, I had to abandon these tricks & tips and move on to more powerful tools such as new ways of thinking and spiritual tools.
As an alcoholic I have many blind spots and my brain may even be damaged in areas used for intuitive thinking. I need to somehow circumvent these dysfunctional maladies.
In other words, just not drinking does not treat alcoholism. I had to face the fact that I was uncomfortable in my own skin before I started drinking and was once again uncomfortable in my own skin after I stopped. The only long-term solution to my problem was finding a new way “taking comfort” that did not involve some sort of substance such as a liquid spirits or pills.
Since I already knew that a liquid spirit had once worked for me, but started causing me more pain than gain, I began to look for another form of spiritual solution. Namely; spiritual principles. Specifically, principles aimed at finding me the peace of mind that would allow me to be comfortable in my own skin once again, without being anesthetized.
The slogans and war-stories that helped me stay motivated in my early days of abstinence did in fact give me the diligence and tenacity to overcome my urges to pick up a drink and temporarily overcome my feelings of anxiety, frustration, guilt and despair. The problem with using diligence and tenacity were that in the long run they were mentally exhausting.
Like the ancient Greek hero “Sisyphus”, I had to push a stone up-hill 24 hours a day 7 days a week. Something that I was able to do long enough to meet my short-term goals (passing a drug screening) but not something that I could live with for the rest of my life. What I needed was a way to be totally relieved of the temptation to drink. Not just something to help me temporarily resist the temptation. Resistance is a struggle and I knew that to struggle for the rest of my life was futile. Just choosing to drink, one arduous day at a time, was not my long-term solution. What I truly needed was a way of life that would weather all storms.
What I needed to stay stopped was a “one life at a time” strategy. Something far to difficult for me to grasp in my early days of recovery. What is the long-term solution? Serenity, the “Deluxe Edition” of sobriety. It includes sobriety, peace of mind, optimism and a starting point for meditation. Without serenity, sobriety may not be worth having. True sobriety rides on the coat-tails of serenity.
One of the major misconceptions in addiction recovery that I had to overcome was the idea that the same tools that enabled me to stop drinking were the same tools that would enable me to stay stopped. Stopping drinking is one thing, but staying stopped is a whole new ball game. Getting stopped requires applying knowledge. Staying stopped requires shedding misconceptions.
The psychological tricks and tips that helped me obtain abstinence are not at all the same principles that keep me in recovery today. The easy to grasp slogans and frightening war-stories that were so critical in my first few weeks of abstinence were excellent tools to get me to want to stop drinking, but were never strong enough to keep me in recovery for the long run.
Slogans such as; “one day at a time” were essential in the early days of my recovery. I doubt that I could have survived without them. In the beginning, it truly was a one-day at a time program for me. Sometimes it was a one-hour at a time or even a one-minute at a time program. However, at some stage of my recovery, I had to abandon these tricks & tips and move on to more powerful tools such as new ways of thinking and spiritual tools.
As an alcoholic I have many blind spots and my brain may even be damaged in areas used for intuitive thinking. I need to somehow circumvent these dysfunctional maladies.
In other words, just not drinking does not treat alcoholism. I had to face the fact that I was uncomfortable in my own skin before I started drinking and was once again uncomfortable in my own skin after I stopped. The only long-term solution to my problem was finding a new way “taking comfort” that did not involve some sort of substance such as a liquid spirits or pills.
Since I already knew that a liquid spirit had once worked for me, but started causing me more pain than gain, I began to look for another form of spiritual solution. Namely; spiritual principles. Specifically, principles aimed at finding me the peace of mind that would allow me to be comfortable in my own skin once again, without being anesthetized.
The slogans and war-stories that helped me stay motivated in my early days of abstinence did in fact give me the diligence and tenacity to overcome my urges to pick up a drink and temporarily overcome my feelings of anxiety, frustration, guilt and despair. The problem with using diligence and tenacity were that in the long run they were mentally exhausting.
Like the ancient Greek hero “Sisyphus”, I had to push a stone up-hill 24 hours a day 7 days a week. Something that I was able to do long enough to meet my short-term goals (passing a drug screening) but not something that I could live with for the rest of my life. What I needed was a way to be totally relieved of the temptation to drink. Not just something to help me temporarily resist the temptation. Resistance is a struggle and I knew that to struggle for the rest of my life was futile. Just choosing to drink, one arduous day at a time, was not my long-term solution. What I truly needed was a way of life that would weather all storms.
What I needed to stay stopped was a “one life at a time” strategy. Something far to difficult for me to grasp in my early days of recovery. What is the long-term solution? Serenity, the “Deluxe Edition” of sobriety. It includes sobriety, peace of mind, optimism and a starting point for meditation. Without serenity, sobriety may not be worth having. True sobriety rides on the coat-tails of serenity.
*****
Now as for the second part of your post...
I have what I referr to as "The Emotional Tool Box." And the house you're building is the right to control your own destiny."
Quitting and staying Clean is like a hammer... A very simple tool..
But you can't just build a house with a hammer... Eventually you have to turn a screw... Eventually you have to do some wiring... Eventually you have to put in a light bulb...
And to do that, you have to constantly keep building new emotional tools...
But it doesn't end there... Because these tools have to come from somewhere... And in the great spiritual Metropolis that is our life, there are many things... Unfortunately none of them seem to be hardware stores...
So the greatest skill of them all isn't just how to use all these tools... It's also a focus on learning how to build any tool, from the heap of parts that just keeps rolling around in your mind.
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