suboxone withdrawl advice
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Thread Starter
Join Date: Aug 2013
Posts: 6
suboxone withdrawl advice
im down to 3mg and am wondering how bad its going to be when I jump, will I be able to work? how long does withdrawl last? my doctoe gave me trazadone for sleep and clonidine which she says will help, what can I expect? any advice will be appreciated
Member
Join Date: Feb 2012
Posts: 4,966
Yeah I think it depends on how much you jump from. If it's 3 mgs. I assume you will feel pretty crappy for awhile. I've read a lot a From this forum as well as the suboxone talk zone forum and what I've learned is the the lower you can taper to...and I'm talking .25 and lower....even alternating days for at least a couple weeks or more the better the outcome....the less the withdrawal symptoms. That is my plan. But I do think there are certain symptoms you will be stuck with regardless and those seem to be insomnia, low energy and anxiety.
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Join Date: Feb 2015
Location: southeast mitten
Posts: 21
Tapering seems to be the least painful from what I've heard. Although if you are like myself, I don't have the self control to taper, so I jumped at a ridiculous 24mgs. I'm now 53 days clean and even now I have a hard time sleeping a good full nights rest. My acute withdrawal lasted around two weeks, then it got more bearable. I have some symptoms, i.e.cold sweats on occasion even still now. Remember that we are healing now and it's going to take some time. Best of luck to you.
Member
Join Date: May 2014
Posts: 21
I am also needing advice.
My bf is losing his job end of May. He will not have the money for the medicine. What should he do now to prepare his mind/body for the detox??? PLEASE HELP..... Do you recommend any over the counter meds to help? B12 for energy, something for vomitting, diarhea im sure.... but what else should he expect???
I even thought about consultation with a pharmacist.
My bf is losing his job end of May. He will not have the money for the medicine. What should he do now to prepare his mind/body for the detox??? PLEASE HELP..... Do you recommend any over the counter meds to help? B12 for energy, something for vomitting, diarhea im sure.... but what else should he expect???
I even thought about consultation with a pharmacist.
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Join Date: Feb 2014
Location: Western NY
Posts: 1,209
LeeLee - I see that your request for help was posted a couple weeks ago, but I just saw it now. Hopefully you are still active on the site and will get some additional feedback. I can offer some general thoughts, but I don't have personal experience with long-term sub use.
First of all, can he talk to his doctor about some sort of tapering? Even if he only has a script for the rest of the month it would at least give him something to work with. If he has insurance that covers the visit or at least the script then it might help to squeeze that extra visit in. I think this is by far the most important part to figure out. If he can work out a tapering plan with his doctor (even an aggressive taper with what he has) it will probably provide a greater benefit than everything else on my list combined. Jumping off of a high dose of subs is going to be brutal regardless of any of this other stuff. If he can't do that for some reason then you might try checking taper schedules posted online. There are plenty of examples posted on this forum if you dig through the past threads.
Immodium AD can really help with stomach issues during withdrawal. It is an opi, but it doesn't cross the BBB (blood-brain barrier) for all practical purposes. So it can bind to the opi receptors in the gut, which curbs stomach issues during withdrawal.
As far as OTC meds go, I think the general OTC meds you would take for the flu are about the best you can do. Tylenol for leg pain, benadryl for sleep, etc.
The thing is that the withdrawal is going to suck no matter what you take as far as vitamins / OTC meds. I think it is natural to try to find some other drug to make withdrawal easy, but the only thing that really helps opi withdrawal is additional opis. Subs / methadone help folks coming off short-term opis (oxy, heroin, etc.), but that obviously isn't going to help in your situation. My point is that no matter what he does it will be a rough ride that is going to really test his inner strength. It wasn't until I really accepted the fact that I was going to have to endure some temporary hell that I was able to do it.
On your list of symptoms you have left off the two worse ones in my opinion. Lack of sleep is an awful part of the withdrawal. Again, I haven't come off of subs, but if you read the stories here you will see this is almost a universal issue for folks that did come off of them. When coming off of a short-acting opi I would typically get 3 - 4 hours of sleep total over the first 4 days. By day 5 I was able to finally go to sleep on my own, and I got 5 hours. I was actually lucky compared to some folks who aren't able to sleep at all for the first several days. It was only the first night that I wasn't able to sleep at all, and the following night I was able to sleep for an hour. The night after that I got 2 hours, and I would start taking 'micronaps' during the day. With those I would dose off for 5 minutes or so after closing my eyes. The sub withdrawal tends to be longer, and a lot of the guys on here were operating on low sleep <4 hours per night for quite a while. In some of the severe cases they were on no sleep for several days. You may start running into hallucinations and things like that when you start talking about zero hours of sleep for longer than a few days. One of my old junkie friends didn't sleep for a whole week, and he wash pushing the limits of sanity. The 8th day he slept, but when he got up he couldn't tell if he was asleep and dreaming that he was awake or if he was really awake. I am not a doctor, but I can't imagine that kind of insomnia is good for you.
The second major symptom that I found terrible was the RLS. That would make it impossible to get comfortable in bed. Every time I would get into a new position I would get a sensation that I had to move my legs. It is difficult to explain if you haven't experienced it before, but laying still becomes unbearably difficult. A mild case involves twitching slightly, and a more severe case involves literally kicking the bed. That restlessness can also move to your arms, and you end up flopping around the bed back and forth.
For the insomnia / RLS I found hot baths to be helpful. In fact, a hot bath was more helpful than OTC or prescription meds for the insomnia. Epsom salts can help with the bath because they will keep your skin from pruning if you are in for a long time. I found the RLS to only be unbearable when I was trying to force myself to sleep. If I couldn't get to sleep within say 10 minutes I got back up again. If he can force himself to exercise that will help work off some of that nervous energy. Of course, you feel like **** and are extremely fatigued during it. Exercise is the last thing you feel like doing, but it helps once you get started.
If you talk to a pharmacist I would take some time to pick out a specific one to ask. I know particular pharmacists that are outstanding at their professional, and honestly know more than a lot of doctors about medications. However, a lot of the pharmacists will get sheepish if you ask them, and won't have a clue. They will probably think you are the junkie, because everyone says that they are helping a friend / boyfriend / etc. with withdrawal rather than saying they are going through it. If you find a good one they might be able to give you some solid guidance. I don't see how it could hurt except for the fact about them possibly thinking you are the junkie.
As far as preparing your mind / body for it, I think you can do the same things you would normally do for good health. If he isn't currently exercising that would be something he could start doing. Exercise does help a lot, and if he is in better shape heading into it the more exercise he should be able to do. I am not sure what someone could do to prepare their mind for it other than to accept the fact that it is going to be a tough process, but they are going to do it come hell or high water. It did help me to remind myself that I never have to go through it ever again. Once it is over it is over. He may also try going to some NA meetings to start getting a network of clean friends that he can look to for support. A phone call when you are wavering can sometimes make the difference between sticking it out or giving up.
Those are some of the things that he can expect, but there is a whole laundry list of symptoms in addition to these. I do want to offer a friendly warning about getting too involved with the process. He will almost certainly get irritable, depressed, and downright mean. Withdrawal is a ****** process. Even with all of these OTC meds, baths, etc. it is going to test his strength. It is hard to watch someone you care about go through it, and it is frustrating because there is really little you can do to help him. Even if you do everything in your power to help it might not work out. He may go back to whatever he was on before suboxone to stop the withdrawal. It is all going to come down to how much pain he can handle and how bad he really wants to be done with it.
Good luck. Hopefully you will get additional feedback from folks that have sub specific withdrawal experience. Please let us know how things go.
First of all, can he talk to his doctor about some sort of tapering? Even if he only has a script for the rest of the month it would at least give him something to work with. If he has insurance that covers the visit or at least the script then it might help to squeeze that extra visit in. I think this is by far the most important part to figure out. If he can work out a tapering plan with his doctor (even an aggressive taper with what he has) it will probably provide a greater benefit than everything else on my list combined. Jumping off of a high dose of subs is going to be brutal regardless of any of this other stuff. If he can't do that for some reason then you might try checking taper schedules posted online. There are plenty of examples posted on this forum if you dig through the past threads.
Immodium AD can really help with stomach issues during withdrawal. It is an opi, but it doesn't cross the BBB (blood-brain barrier) for all practical purposes. So it can bind to the opi receptors in the gut, which curbs stomach issues during withdrawal.
As far as OTC meds go, I think the general OTC meds you would take for the flu are about the best you can do. Tylenol for leg pain, benadryl for sleep, etc.
The thing is that the withdrawal is going to suck no matter what you take as far as vitamins / OTC meds. I think it is natural to try to find some other drug to make withdrawal easy, but the only thing that really helps opi withdrawal is additional opis. Subs / methadone help folks coming off short-term opis (oxy, heroin, etc.), but that obviously isn't going to help in your situation. My point is that no matter what he does it will be a rough ride that is going to really test his inner strength. It wasn't until I really accepted the fact that I was going to have to endure some temporary hell that I was able to do it.
On your list of symptoms you have left off the two worse ones in my opinion. Lack of sleep is an awful part of the withdrawal. Again, I haven't come off of subs, but if you read the stories here you will see this is almost a universal issue for folks that did come off of them. When coming off of a short-acting opi I would typically get 3 - 4 hours of sleep total over the first 4 days. By day 5 I was able to finally go to sleep on my own, and I got 5 hours. I was actually lucky compared to some folks who aren't able to sleep at all for the first several days. It was only the first night that I wasn't able to sleep at all, and the following night I was able to sleep for an hour. The night after that I got 2 hours, and I would start taking 'micronaps' during the day. With those I would dose off for 5 minutes or so after closing my eyes. The sub withdrawal tends to be longer, and a lot of the guys on here were operating on low sleep <4 hours per night for quite a while. In some of the severe cases they were on no sleep for several days. You may start running into hallucinations and things like that when you start talking about zero hours of sleep for longer than a few days. One of my old junkie friends didn't sleep for a whole week, and he wash pushing the limits of sanity. The 8th day he slept, but when he got up he couldn't tell if he was asleep and dreaming that he was awake or if he was really awake. I am not a doctor, but I can't imagine that kind of insomnia is good for you.
The second major symptom that I found terrible was the RLS. That would make it impossible to get comfortable in bed. Every time I would get into a new position I would get a sensation that I had to move my legs. It is difficult to explain if you haven't experienced it before, but laying still becomes unbearably difficult. A mild case involves twitching slightly, and a more severe case involves literally kicking the bed. That restlessness can also move to your arms, and you end up flopping around the bed back and forth.
For the insomnia / RLS I found hot baths to be helpful. In fact, a hot bath was more helpful than OTC or prescription meds for the insomnia. Epsom salts can help with the bath because they will keep your skin from pruning if you are in for a long time. I found the RLS to only be unbearable when I was trying to force myself to sleep. If I couldn't get to sleep within say 10 minutes I got back up again. If he can force himself to exercise that will help work off some of that nervous energy. Of course, you feel like **** and are extremely fatigued during it. Exercise is the last thing you feel like doing, but it helps once you get started.
If you talk to a pharmacist I would take some time to pick out a specific one to ask. I know particular pharmacists that are outstanding at their professional, and honestly know more than a lot of doctors about medications. However, a lot of the pharmacists will get sheepish if you ask them, and won't have a clue. They will probably think you are the junkie, because everyone says that they are helping a friend / boyfriend / etc. with withdrawal rather than saying they are going through it. If you find a good one they might be able to give you some solid guidance. I don't see how it could hurt except for the fact about them possibly thinking you are the junkie.
As far as preparing your mind / body for it, I think you can do the same things you would normally do for good health. If he isn't currently exercising that would be something he could start doing. Exercise does help a lot, and if he is in better shape heading into it the more exercise he should be able to do. I am not sure what someone could do to prepare their mind for it other than to accept the fact that it is going to be a tough process, but they are going to do it come hell or high water. It did help me to remind myself that I never have to go through it ever again. Once it is over it is over. He may also try going to some NA meetings to start getting a network of clean friends that he can look to for support. A phone call when you are wavering can sometimes make the difference between sticking it out or giving up.
Those are some of the things that he can expect, but there is a whole laundry list of symptoms in addition to these. I do want to offer a friendly warning about getting too involved with the process. He will almost certainly get irritable, depressed, and downright mean. Withdrawal is a ****** process. Even with all of these OTC meds, baths, etc. it is going to test his strength. It is hard to watch someone you care about go through it, and it is frustrating because there is really little you can do to help him. Even if you do everything in your power to help it might not work out. He may go back to whatever he was on before suboxone to stop the withdrawal. It is all going to come down to how much pain he can handle and how bad he really wants to be done with it.
Good luck. Hopefully you will get additional feedback from folks that have sub specific withdrawal experience. Please let us know how things go.
Member
Join Date: May 2014
Posts: 21
OPIPhobe
I CAN NOT THANK YOU ENOUGH for all the info you have just written to help prepare me for what will happen. I pray he will listen to the helpful hints and I already know to not be sensitive because he will become a diff person going thru this. I LOVE him and PRAY TO the Dear Lord above for the strength he will need.
THANK YOU AGAIN NEW YORK!!!
THIS KY GIRL IS VERY GRATEFUL!!!!
I CAN NOT THANK YOU ENOUGH for all the info you have just written to help prepare me for what will happen. I pray he will listen to the helpful hints and I already know to not be sensitive because he will become a diff person going thru this. I LOVE him and PRAY TO the Dear Lord above for the strength he will need.
THANK YOU AGAIN NEW YORK!!!
THIS KY GIRL IS VERY GRATEFUL!!!!
Member
Join Date: Mar 2015
Location: Mi
Posts: 1,318
Hi Leelee,
Everything Opio told you was spot on. I would just like to add 2 things.
I quit subs in Feb. & would like to emphasize Opio's point about the 2 worst aspects of subs w/d's....lack of sleep & rls.
I didn't sleep through the night for about a mo. I didn't sleep "well" through the night for 6wks. This was due to both rls & the feeling of not being comfortable in my own skin ( hard to describe. )
Hot ebson salt baths & exercise helped me out a lot. 2 other things that helped me a lot were soaking in the sun & Highlands Restful Legs.
It was still very cold in Feb & Mar. in Mi, but thank goodness the sun was shining on some days. Soaking in the sun feels similiar to the hot baths ( I almost felt "normal." )
The Highlands Restful Legs is available at any pharmacy & probably won't help much at 1st, but helped w/rl a couple of wks into my w/d's. It was very helpful for helping to sleep a bit.
Good luck & as Opio also said, your bf is going to be very, very cranky, so "in 1 ear, out the other" is my advice.
((( Hugs )))
Everything Opio told you was spot on. I would just like to add 2 things.
I quit subs in Feb. & would like to emphasize Opio's point about the 2 worst aspects of subs w/d's....lack of sleep & rls.
I didn't sleep through the night for about a mo. I didn't sleep "well" through the night for 6wks. This was due to both rls & the feeling of not being comfortable in my own skin ( hard to describe. )
Hot ebson salt baths & exercise helped me out a lot. 2 other things that helped me a lot were soaking in the sun & Highlands Restful Legs.
It was still very cold in Feb & Mar. in Mi, but thank goodness the sun was shining on some days. Soaking in the sun feels similiar to the hot baths ( I almost felt "normal." )
The Highlands Restful Legs is available at any pharmacy & probably won't help much at 1st, but helped w/rl a couple of wks into my w/d's. It was very helpful for helping to sleep a bit.
Good luck & as Opio also said, your bf is going to be very, very cranky, so "in 1 ear, out the other" is my advice.
((( Hugs )))
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