Does brain chemistry return back to normal?
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Thread Starter
Join Date: Sep 2020
Posts: 38
Does brain chemistry return back to normal?
Hi guys
So does brain chemistry turn back to it's original state after not drinking for a while I know that it affect GABBA and glutamate and I take Campral to help get these levels back to normal but does the brain chemistry ever go back to normal?
My pattern of drinking was binge drinking over ten years so 2 - 3 days a week but drinking a lot of beer on them days.
Sam
So does brain chemistry turn back to it's original state after not drinking for a while I know that it affect GABBA and glutamate and I take Campral to help get these levels back to normal but does the brain chemistry ever go back to normal?
My pattern of drinking was binge drinking over ten years so 2 - 3 days a week but drinking a lot of beer on them days.
Sam
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Join Date: May 2019
Location: UK
Posts: 3,945
Interesting topic. I’ve looked at this and research papers (not that I’m an expert), and the conclusion is that long-term drinking permanent alters brain chemistry. I kind of get how more alcohol is needed to affect an alcoholic. I also know that if an ex-drinker relapses, their tolerance will be at previous levels (which is a terrifying prospect) which must be why relapses often involve large amounts of alcohol.
If you’ve been prescribed Campral, it’s safe to assume your brain chemistry won’t be changing back to “normal”, but does it matter? If you don’t drink, you’ll be just fine.
If you’ve been prescribed Campral, it’s safe to assume your brain chemistry won’t be changing back to “normal”, but does it matter? If you don’t drink, you’ll be just fine.
Member
Join Date: Jan 2020
Location: NC
Posts: 5,160
Towards alcohol? No
I've seen folks stay sober for years them start right back where they left off so the brain is and always will be addicted.
Everyday life ,however, gets much better.
I now have a clarity I have never had. I started as a teen so been in a fog a long time.
I can GUARANTEE one thing will not improve brain chemistry. Any guess what that is?
Don't overthink it Sam. Giving up booze is and will be one of if not The best thing you can do for yourself.
I've seen folks stay sober for years them start right back where they left off so the brain is and always will be addicted.
Everyday life ,however, gets much better.
I now have a clarity I have never had. I started as a teen so been in a fog a long time.
I can GUARANTEE one thing will not improve brain chemistry. Any guess what that is?
Don't overthink it Sam. Giving up booze is and will be one of if not The best thing you can do for yourself.
Member
Join Date: Jan 2021
Posts: 527
I have no idea how a person's brain chemistry responds to sobriety. What I do know is that if I stop working the A.A. program of recovery, then I'll get drunk again. And if I get drunk again, then I'll die (or wish for death) -- regardless of my brain chemistry. As the Big Book says: "If he did not work, he would surely drink again, and if he drank, he would surely die.... With us it is just like that." Beyond that, the Big Book also advises that "God has abundantly supplied this world with fine doctors, psychologists, and practitioners of various kinds. Do not hesitate to take your health problems to such persons."
Free.
Join Date: Apr 2020
Location: Saskatchewan.
Posts: 2,973
I was concerned about this too Sam. Usually in the first 2 months and beyond (several times) I wanted to be heading forward with my ‘brain health’.
The good news is that the fogginess, sluggish brain, headaches, memory and acuity issues vastly improve from 3 months sober through a year.
I’ve noticed marked improvements around the four month mark.
I’m an instructor so mental acuity, or lack thereof, is an important and noticed attribute.
I have taken a gaba supplement that you chew and place under your tongue. (Sublingual they said)
It had the calming effect that I used to get from a cigarette. The trouble for me is that one hour later I would get rage symptoms for a very brief period of time (maybe 1/2hr or less).
I have been subscribed thiamine for the first three weeks of recovery. (Vit B1).
Apparently we deplete this when consuming alcohol.
Today, if I take a multi-vitamin daily or near daily I’m happy.
It all improves markedly over time.
The good news is that the fogginess, sluggish brain, headaches, memory and acuity issues vastly improve from 3 months sober through a year.
I’ve noticed marked improvements around the four month mark.
I’m an instructor so mental acuity, or lack thereof, is an important and noticed attribute.
I have taken a gaba supplement that you chew and place under your tongue. (Sublingual they said)
It had the calming effect that I used to get from a cigarette. The trouble for me is that one hour later I would get rage symptoms for a very brief period of time (maybe 1/2hr or less).
I have been subscribed thiamine for the first three weeks of recovery. (Vit B1).
Apparently we deplete this when consuming alcohol.
Today, if I take a multi-vitamin daily or near daily I’m happy.
It all improves markedly over time.
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Join Date: Jun 2013
Location: Sonoran Desert & Southeast Asia
Posts: 6,561
In my experience things improved markedly in the first 3-6 months and over the first year. I am also an avid cyclist and have read research that proves that things that are good for heart health are also good for brain health - proper diet and nutrition, sleep quality, exercise, etc. Brain scans of addicts who remain abstinent show significant improvement in areas of the brain associated with executive control.
https://www.recoveryanswers.org/reco...n-in-recovery/
Also:
"What is clear is that alcohol and marijuana do have neurotoxic effects and that, to some degree, this damage can be reversed. There is minimal evidence on how we can improve brain recovery from substance use, but emerging literature suggests that exercise as an intervention may improve brain recovery. Physical activity has been shown to improve brain health and neuroplasticity. In previous studies of adults, physical activity has improved executive control, cerebral blood flow, and white matter integrity. "
https://www.recoveryanswers.org/reco...n-in-recovery/
Also:
"What is clear is that alcohol and marijuana do have neurotoxic effects and that, to some degree, this damage can be reversed. There is minimal evidence on how we can improve brain recovery from substance use, but emerging literature suggests that exercise as an intervention may improve brain recovery. Physical activity has been shown to improve brain health and neuroplasticity. In previous studies of adults, physical activity has improved executive control, cerebral blood flow, and white matter integrity. "
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Join Date: Jun 2018
Posts: 278
Going from what I've heard people say (and from my own experience).... some parts revert to normal, and some don't.
Capacity for happiness and emotional resiliency -- this seems to go back to normal. You might still be occasionally depressed or anxious, but plenty of never-drinkers have periodic depression and anxiety as well. Once you stop drinking, though, that extra layer of guilt, shame, depression, and anxiety that are caused and worsened by the alcohol go away, and you're left with a pretty normally functioning brain in that regard.
Cravings -- this seems to go away as well for many (most?) people, in that you don't live a life of perpetually miserable "white knuckling" from one moment to the next. I can testify to this; I don't have cravings anymore. But see the next point.
Immunity to triggers -- this may not happen. Triggers may always remind you of drinking. But being reminded of drinking isn't the same as a craving. You can be reminded of drinking and then just decide not to drink, without the agony of craving alcohol. But triggers may remind you for years about the time when you were drinking. For me it's just a helpful reminder that I don't want to return to those old days.
Ability to moderate drinking -- this seems to never revert back to a "normal" state. If you have the type of brain that led to addictive drinking in the first place, then resuming drinking (for most people) just brings back the same addictive stuff: drinking more than you want, losing control over drinking, behaving badly, feeling terrible about it, and the rest of the doom spiral. So the standard advice (and I believe it is good advice) is to never assume you are back to being able to drink safely and moderately. After all, you still have the same brain that led you to overuse in the first place; that hasn't changed.
So this is mostly good news. You can get back to a more or less "normal" brain state when it comes to emotions and anxiety. And cravings eventually go away (for most people). But triggers can still remind you of past drinking experiences, and going back to drinking usually means ending up right where you were when you decided to quit, for all the same reasons.
As always, your individual mileage may vary.
Capacity for happiness and emotional resiliency -- this seems to go back to normal. You might still be occasionally depressed or anxious, but plenty of never-drinkers have periodic depression and anxiety as well. Once you stop drinking, though, that extra layer of guilt, shame, depression, and anxiety that are caused and worsened by the alcohol go away, and you're left with a pretty normally functioning brain in that regard.
Cravings -- this seems to go away as well for many (most?) people, in that you don't live a life of perpetually miserable "white knuckling" from one moment to the next. I can testify to this; I don't have cravings anymore. But see the next point.
Immunity to triggers -- this may not happen. Triggers may always remind you of drinking. But being reminded of drinking isn't the same as a craving. You can be reminded of drinking and then just decide not to drink, without the agony of craving alcohol. But triggers may remind you for years about the time when you were drinking. For me it's just a helpful reminder that I don't want to return to those old days.
Ability to moderate drinking -- this seems to never revert back to a "normal" state. If you have the type of brain that led to addictive drinking in the first place, then resuming drinking (for most people) just brings back the same addictive stuff: drinking more than you want, losing control over drinking, behaving badly, feeling terrible about it, and the rest of the doom spiral. So the standard advice (and I believe it is good advice) is to never assume you are back to being able to drink safely and moderately. After all, you still have the same brain that led you to overuse in the first place; that hasn't changed.
So this is mostly good news. You can get back to a more or less "normal" brain state when it comes to emotions and anxiety. And cravings eventually go away (for most people). But triggers can still remind you of past drinking experiences, and going back to drinking usually means ending up right where you were when you decided to quit, for all the same reasons.
As always, your individual mileage may vary.
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Join Date: Apr 2007
Location: Australia
Posts: 211,444
My experience pretty much matches Radix’s although I have enough years away from alcohol, and years of sober problem solving, not to be bothered by the things that used to trigger me
Hows it going Sam?
D
Hows it going Sam?
D
Member
Join Date: Dec 2019
Posts: 2,426
Hi Sam. There are so many mysteries and unknowns about what happens to our brains after we did what we did to our precious bodies. So much returns to normal but there are aspects of our brains that are changed permanently. I don't know the science of it, but I do see proof of some profound things, one being the legion of tales here on SR of people having years of sobriety and then picking up a drink again. That is all the proof that I need that in some important ways, our brains are changed forever, or were never wired right to begin with as pertains to alcohol and addiction.
But I think in the most comforting ways, our brains do indeed heal and return to "normal" that is a quiet and peaceful state during which we can deal calmly with what comes at us each day.
But I think in the most comforting ways, our brains do indeed heal and return to "normal" that is a quiet and peaceful state during which we can deal calmly with what comes at us each day.
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Join Date: Feb 2008
Location: 49 degrees north
Posts: 1,036
What's "normal" anything? I tend to agree with Dr Gabor Mate, that normal is a myth (his new book "The Myth of Normal" may interest you). I doubt my brain chemistry was ever that of most people, and remains so. That said, I think it varies widely among people and in different stages of development. An equanimous person is one who is able to be with what is. I suggest that should be our goal - to allow what is to simply be and to realize that the spectrum is very wide indeed. There are simply too many variables (age, diet, stress, experience, to name a few) at play. Suffering comes from wanting things to be other than what they are. Nearly 11 years sober, my neurochemistry is way better than it was when drinking, but the vicissitudes of life go on like the waves in the ocean. THAT does NOT change. As it is said, you cannot stop the waves, but you can learn to surf.
Namaste
Namaste
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Join Date: Mar 2013
Location: St. Paul Minnesota
Posts: 4,360
I'd say you will heal to baseline, whatever that was for you. I had crippling anxiety and depression toward the end of my drinking. That went away within the first year. Right around 9 months sober everything flipped back to where I was before the compulsions. I know this because my problem didn't start until my 30s so I know what being me without addiction feels like. I still had plenty of maladaptive ways of thinking I had to address. Im still uncovering what I now refer to as cognitive errors that cause me anxiety like symptoms but I am getting very efficient at solving them. I see non addicts still stuck in these thought patterns but they don't seem to address them. I must because it means my survival so in that regard addiction is a catalyst for continued personal growth.
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Join Date: Jun 2019
Posts: 433
It's dependent on the years of drinking mixed with years of getting older, I also truly believe back to baseline for the vast majority.
Speaking from my own experience everything eventually returned to "normal" and quickly. Getting a tiny bit anxious or a tiny bit nervous before a big meeting, important date, moving to different apartment/house, new job, friend or family reunion that is very normal and usually more excitement that many confuse with anxiety.
Getting beyond anxious to the point of panic driving to work, leaving work and rushing to the nearest store for booze while having a panic attack at the cash register paying for the booze those types of events go away if caused by withdrawals (that's what caused mine)
Speaking from my own experience everything eventually returned to "normal" and quickly. Getting a tiny bit anxious or a tiny bit nervous before a big meeting, important date, moving to different apartment/house, new job, friend or family reunion that is very normal and usually more excitement that many confuse with anxiety.
Getting beyond anxious to the point of panic driving to work, leaving work and rushing to the nearest store for booze while having a panic attack at the cash register paying for the booze those types of events go away if caused by withdrawals (that's what caused mine)
Member
Join Date: Feb 2019
Posts: 158
I'm pretty sure I fried my Gaba receptors badly with alcohol. They are def not back to normal after 7 months, yet, although I do feel more positive and upbeat at times, I still suffer from bad anxiety at times from the alcohol abuse. But I do hear around here that it will come back at least to some extent, maybe all! Probably dependent on how much you drank and the amount of time you are sober. Science has found recently, if I am correct, that the brains plasticity and neuron regeneration has much greater rebuilding power than they used to believe and that the rebuilding can continue for months and even into years.
Your attitude, not your aptitude, will determine your altitude
Join Date: Dec 2006
Location: Oxnard (The Nard), CA, USA.
Posts: 13,955
The brain does heal after addiction. Depending on the variable's of alcohol use I'm seeing good improvement at 4 months now.
Neuroplasticity happens for me with new sober activities, hobbies, new and much improved behavior, in essence work the brain!
It is possible to help the brain heal along with a recovery program of action, at least that's my experience, Your mileage may vary
https://www.webmd.com/connect-to-car...from-addiction
Neuroplasticity happens for me with new sober activities, hobbies, new and much improved behavior, in essence work the brain!
It is possible to help the brain heal along with a recovery program of action, at least that's my experience, Your mileage may vary
https://www.webmd.com/connect-to-car...from-addiction
Member
Join Date: Oct 2012
Posts: 5,937
I'm not a doctor nor an expert on the brain but my experience has been that the body has a huge capacity to start healing virtually the minute we stop poisoning it. I'll agree that some pathways might be altered forever (eg. you probably can never "learn to moderate" once your addiction has reached an advanced state) but clarity and focus does improve over time. In my own case it's hard to say what "back to normal" means in this context. I starting drinking in my late teens, right after high school, and right from the beginning my drinking was problematic. There were times I'd tone it down a little but when tracked over time it just go worse and worse. Ten years ago I quit entirely. So my profoundly-drunk years encompassed my life from age 18 up til 43 or so, a veritable lifetime! No one's brain is the same at 53 as it was at 25 so I missed learning what "normal" was. But I can say if I hadn't stopped it's highly unlikely I'd alive today so I'll take whatever tradeoffs that brings with a smile.
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Join Date: May 2019
Location: UK
Posts: 3,945
If an athlete stopped training altogether, over time they’d lose their fitness and have to start again from scratch. The scary thing for ex-drinkers, though, is we keep our previous tolerance to alcohol. We wouldn’t get drunk on a small glass of wine like a “novice” drinker. That says it all for me. Our brains never fully recover from our drinking days. Drinking again is seriously bad news for any of us here.
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