Are you a REAL alcoholic?
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Join Date: Oct 2016
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Are you a REAL alcoholic?
When I first got sober I often questioned whether I'm a 'real' alcoholic or just had slightly unhealthy drinking habits. At 6 months sober I still go through phases of doubting it. And I think many of us do.
I often thought, I wasn't a 'real' alcoholic cause I rarely drank until I passed out, blacked out or acted drunk. I drank all day long though.
I read on other threads people saying they didn't think of themselves as 'real' alcoholics cause they were bingers and could make it a few days or even weeks without a drink. But when they drank, they drank until they passed out.
So it seems to be the case, that we often tend to doubt our alcoholism. Maybe because we would love to not have that label cause it would mean we could continue to drink.
When I went to AA and other groups I often witnessed people judging others, labelling themselves as 'real' alcoholics, stating that others weren't. That being based on differences in their drinking past or their approach to recovery. In the beginning of my recovery things like that kept me from going to meetings.
Now I feel like I can handle it a bit better but it makes me sad to hear people saying that kind of stuff.
It's such a dangerous thought to any alcoholics brain and I don't understand why one alcoholic feels the need to tell someone struggling with the same problem that they are less of an alcoholic.
If you're questioning your alcoholism because of what others say, please don't listen to them.
Sorry, that was partly a rant but I had to get it out of my chest.
I often thought, I wasn't a 'real' alcoholic cause I rarely drank until I passed out, blacked out or acted drunk. I drank all day long though.
I read on other threads people saying they didn't think of themselves as 'real' alcoholics cause they were bingers and could make it a few days or even weeks without a drink. But when they drank, they drank until they passed out.
So it seems to be the case, that we often tend to doubt our alcoholism. Maybe because we would love to not have that label cause it would mean we could continue to drink.
When I went to AA and other groups I often witnessed people judging others, labelling themselves as 'real' alcoholics, stating that others weren't. That being based on differences in their drinking past or their approach to recovery. In the beginning of my recovery things like that kept me from going to meetings.
Now I feel like I can handle it a bit better but it makes me sad to hear people saying that kind of stuff.
It's such a dangerous thought to any alcoholics brain and I don't understand why one alcoholic feels the need to tell someone struggling with the same problem that they are less of an alcoholic.
If you're questioning your alcoholism because of what others say, please don't listen to them.
Sorry, that was partly a rant but I had to get it out of my chest.
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Join Date: Jan 2014
Posts: 8,637
Put 100 people in a room, each with a blank sheet of paper and a pen.
Ask them to write down their definition of an alcoholic.
You'll get 100 different answers.
Which one is "real"?
The only answer to that question you need is:
I'm a REAL sober person.
Ask them to write down their definition of an alcoholic.
You'll get 100 different answers.
Which one is "real"?
The only answer to that question you need is:
I'm a REAL sober person.
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Join Date: Nov 2015
Location: East Coast USA
Posts: 1,068
For me it was an old timer at an AA meeting who provided a thought that solved this.
"Alcoholic" "hard drinker" does it matter? Are your family/friends asking you to drink more? Then he paused and said "What kind of man do you want to be?"
This ended the discussion/questions in my head.
"Alcoholic" "hard drinker" does it matter? Are your family/friends asking you to drink more? Then he paused and said "What kind of man do you want to be?"
This ended the discussion/questions in my head.
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Join Date: Jan 2014
Posts: 8,637
wherever there are more than one people gathered, we will find more than one perspective.
All that matters is you are clear in YOURS and remain true to it.
Let others have their opinion. Honor yours. Do what is right for your sobriety.
All that matters is you are clear in YOURS and remain true to it.
Let others have their opinion. Honor yours. Do what is right for your sobriety.
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Join Date: Apr 2017
Posts: 26
Personally for me, I knew I drank too much so that's why I'm here, what was normal drinking for other people isn't my normal when I was drinking, I his bottles so I could have more while everyone else was maybe having four or five I prob had ten, I don't know the difference between a real alcoholic and an alcoholic. If you think you have a problem then quit for yourself xx
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Join Date: Oct 2016
Location: Europe
Posts: 523
Okay just to clarify, I am 6 months sober and I know that I'm an alcoholic. Although, admittedly sometimes my AV tries to convince me that I'm not but I just have to remember my last drink. I personally don't divide in real / not real alcoholics.
It's something I have heard lots in AA, at least in the groups I have attended.
And I just think it's a bad idea to plant the idea into people's heads that their problem isn't big / real enough for AA or to call themselves 'alcoholics' when they are reaching out for help.
It's not that I feel personally effected in my definition of alcoholism, it's just something that I think is very dangerous and not thoughtful behaviour.
Because 6 months ago statements like that kept me from going to meetings. Thankfully I had a therapist and other support though so I made it to 6 months now.
And I don't think either that people shouldn't have their opinions but maybe should be careful where to say them out loud.
It's something I have heard lots in AA, at least in the groups I have attended.
And I just think it's a bad idea to plant the idea into people's heads that their problem isn't big / real enough for AA or to call themselves 'alcoholics' when they are reaching out for help.
It's not that I feel personally effected in my definition of alcoholism, it's just something that I think is very dangerous and not thoughtful behaviour.
Because 6 months ago statements like that kept me from going to meetings. Thankfully I had a therapist and other support though so I made it to 6 months now.
And I don't think either that people shouldn't have their opinions but maybe should be careful where to say them out loud.
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Join Date: Jan 2014
Posts: 8,637
all good points. but you're probably not going to change people's minds who think there are 'real' alcoholics and not 'real' ones.
That's been the point of my responses.
In AA, in every day society, in work settings, in life.... I have discovered that there are lots of varied perspectives of what an alcoholic "is".
For the most part in the rooms, I find supportiveness and fellowship. Sometimes there are people with their own unique attitudes and even judgement. Those, I simply allow to BE. I'm not going to change them and don't need to.
The only requirement for AA membership is a desire to quit drinking.
There is nothing in the Big Book that suggest there are "real" alcoholics who are somehow more worthy or in need of recovery than others.
If you wish to live an abundant life, free of alcohol - then that's good enough. If alcohol has brought about negative consequences, then that's good enough. And if judgement is impairing others' motivation for recovery because they're questioning whether they're "real" - then speak up and offer another perspective to counter those naysaying judgie judgersons. Otherwise, bah... let 'em moan.
Time spent concerned with getting frustrated about others' opinions is time not spent deepening our own lives.
That's been the point of my responses.
In AA, in every day society, in work settings, in life.... I have discovered that there are lots of varied perspectives of what an alcoholic "is".
For the most part in the rooms, I find supportiveness and fellowship. Sometimes there are people with their own unique attitudes and even judgement. Those, I simply allow to BE. I'm not going to change them and don't need to.
The only requirement for AA membership is a desire to quit drinking.
There is nothing in the Big Book that suggest there are "real" alcoholics who are somehow more worthy or in need of recovery than others.
If you wish to live an abundant life, free of alcohol - then that's good enough. If alcohol has brought about negative consequences, then that's good enough. And if judgement is impairing others' motivation for recovery because they're questioning whether they're "real" - then speak up and offer another perspective to counter those naysaying judgie judgersons. Otherwise, bah... let 'em moan.
Time spent concerned with getting frustrated about others' opinions is time not spent deepening our own lives.
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Join Date: Jan 2016
Location: Phoenix, AZ
Posts: 292
I'm a guy who must avoid alcohol because I have a condition whereby, if I avail myself of it, I will very likely reach a point where I am unable to control my consumption, and will drink to blackout repeatedly, causing all manner of potential health, social, and financial problems. If that makes me an "alcoholic," real or otherwise, so be it. If it doesn't, that's fine too.
Some people concern themselves with the verbiage; I can think of few things less useful.
Some people concern themselves with the verbiage; I can think of few things less useful.
Being Sober is Awesome
Join Date: Apr 2017
Location: Oregon
Posts: 507
I know I am. Blackouts, injuries, jail, hospitals, etc. but I still had that thought in the back of my mind that maybe I was just a "problem drinker" til I finally surrendered once and for all 25 days ago. Also the only requirement for AA is a desire to stop drinking
All is Change
Join Date: Jun 2009
Location: Australia
Posts: 1,284
I've stated for myself, not intending it's a rule for others that I was an alcoholic from the start because I blacked out the first time I drank. I think "I drink too much" and "I have trouble stopping drinking" and "my life becomes a mess when I drink" all apply from the start when it was infrequent as well as how it was in the end when I drank from becoming conscious to becoming unconscious 24/7.
edit add : if you are one of the fortunates who don't need to wait for the end to stop. good. wonderful. hang on fiercely to that and beware of the Yets. Life's too good to waste.
edit add : if you are one of the fortunates who don't need to wait for the end to stop. good. wonderful. hang on fiercely to that and beware of the Yets. Life's too good to waste.
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Join Date: Oct 2016
Location: Europe
Posts: 523
Some good points made here. FreeOwl, you're right, it's a waste of energy to be frustrated about others' opinions.
It just somehow upset me. When I go to the doctors, no other patients in the waiting room suggest that I should go home cause I don't look / act / sound ill enough.
When I go to AA I would like to not hear people telling others that they're not alcoholic enough to attend. I know it's their opinions and not something the program represents but it made me sad.
I don't know if it's a general rule everywhere in AA but here in the meetings you're not allowed to talk about religion or politics or other programs you attend. So I wonder why saying things like 'I am more alcoholic than you are' for example are tolerated. Just seems weird to me. But then again I have to get better at accepting things the way they are.
Grymt, what I always want to ask you when I read your name, are you Swedish?
It just somehow upset me. When I go to the doctors, no other patients in the waiting room suggest that I should go home cause I don't look / act / sound ill enough.
When I go to AA I would like to not hear people telling others that they're not alcoholic enough to attend. I know it's their opinions and not something the program represents but it made me sad.
I don't know if it's a general rule everywhere in AA but here in the meetings you're not allowed to talk about religion or politics or other programs you attend. So I wonder why saying things like 'I am more alcoholic than you are' for example are tolerated. Just seems weird to me. But then again I have to get better at accepting things the way they are.
Grymt, what I always want to ask you when I read your name, are you Swedish?
All is Change
Join Date: Jun 2009
Location: Australia
Posts: 1,284
I was born in sweden but I'm australian today. Thank's for asking. The nicks from and old swedish joke : "Livet är hårt sa bonden - Grymt sa grisen" "Life is hard said the farmer, grunt (or grim) said the pig."
edit add : I had wondered about your nick which can be read as kevlar sjal with sjal meaning soul or scarf or shield.
edit add : I had wondered about your nick which can be read as kevlar sjal with sjal meaning soul or scarf or shield.
Member
Join Date: Feb 2017
Posts: 104
It doesn't matter how much time you have in this...it's how and why you do it that classifies you as an alcoholic. I went at it hard and fast with an unhealthy head start in my 20s and 30s. Unfortunately, yes...you might find that some folks take pride in their 'degree' of struggle in terms of comparison to others, or that are judgemental or intolerant. I haven't been in this state for long, but could just as easily drink myself to death alone in my living room. Path to hell short, long...we all arrive to the same place if we don't admit the truth.
We are all fighting, struggling, winning and losing ground, and then winning again. Most of us probably know in our gut when we realized we couldn't drink like other people. I'm rooting anyone on that figures out a healthy way to live, regardless of how long it took.
We are all fighting, struggling, winning and losing ground, and then winning again. Most of us probably know in our gut when we realized we couldn't drink like other people. I'm rooting anyone on that figures out a healthy way to live, regardless of how long it took.
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Thread Starter
Join Date: Oct 2016
Location: Europe
Posts: 523
Originally Posted by Grymt 
I was born in sweden but I'm australian today. Thank's for asking. The nicks from and old swedish joke : "Livet är hårt sa bonden - Grymt sa grisen" "Life is hard said the farmer, grunt (or grim) said the pig."
edit add : I had wondered about your nick which can be read as kevlar sjal with sjal meaning soul or scarf or shield.
edit add : I had wondered about your nick which can be read as kevlar sjal with sjal meaning soul or scarf or shield.
so it's kevlarsoul. It's the title of one of my favourite songs but also I just like the meaning.
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Join Date: Jan 2014
Posts: 8,637
Originally Posted by kevlarsjal
I don't know if it's a general rule everywhere in AA but here in the meetings you're not allowed to talk about religion or politics or other programs you attend. So I wonder why saying things like 'I am more alcoholic than you are' for example are tolerated. Just seems weird to me. But then again I have to get better at accepting things the way they are.
If there's something consistently happening at your meetings that is concerning you, you could try attending your group conscience meeting and bringing it up there for discussion. AA groups are made up of people, people are imperfect and have personalities and perspectives. Sometimes, those will clash. I think AA does a remarkably good job of self managing these sort of things, overall.
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Join Date: Apr 2017
Posts: 119
I have never been to AA but I do want to go. Inspite of my inexperience, I would say that if you think you have a problem, you do and if you think you need support, you do. Why worry about the definition beyond that? If I went to AA and someone told me I wasn't an alcoholic, I at 12 days in, would say 'Thank you very much, I am happy to share that with my mom and daughter who think I am.' Then I would immediately buy some wine to celebrate my non-alcoholism and drink the entire bottle in about 1.5-2 hours. Then I would be right back to doing that every night again, feeling sick and tired every morning, gaining weight and not having a life. So how would telling me that have helped me? It seems a peculiar message to give someone who feels the need to quit drinking so much they are willing to go to a meeting. Just saying....
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