jstar

The AA big book talks about "problem drinkers" and "alcoholics". Maybe pick one up & read the first 164 pages & decide for yourself if you are an alcoholic. Some have to "do more research" so to speak. The book also says that most people who don't have a problem (or think thwy don't) should just lay off it for a year. Non alcoholics can do this, for instance my husband hasn't drank alcohol for over 2 years, not because he's sober, he just doesn't care to drink. Me on the other hand, 4 months has been my longest attempt over the past who-kniws-how-many years. I can't kick it, but I'm an alcoholic. Not everyone is an alcoholic. If you ate having problems due to alcohol, abstain and see how it goes. I'm not telling you to go drink, just that you really have to decide this for yourself.

Hugs

Melina

In my case, I did have to fail in moderation to accept I should have absolutely nothing to do with alcohol.

Your mileage may vary, but I finally realized I spent just as much time rationalizing my drinking and giving myself permission to pass the limits I set for myself as I did being drunk. It was a really sick cycle, in addition to the lies I told about my drinking to everyone around me.

I'm early in sobriety, but as much time as I accumulate, I'll never hit a date where there is some magical reset button that allows me to be satisfied with just a couple drinks. Ever.

Hope this helps.

jaynie04

My mother-in-law was visiting recently. She was telling a story about having a hard day at the hospital when my father-in-law was very ill. She mentioned going home that night and just wanting to veg. She got home and poured a glass of wine and sat down to just watch television.

The reason she was telling the story was that the dogs had taken the tv remote and hid it in the yard, and she didn't find it for a week. She said it was just the end of a horrible day, she stood up, poured the wine down the sink and went to bed.

All I could think was who would pour that wine down the sink??

PrincessJasmine

Thanks jstar-that's practical advice. Something I can actually "do" to determine where I am.
Lol jaynie-I have poured out cheap wine that's gross. I would never pour out "good" wine though. So, maybe just as bad?

jaynie04

She owns and lives on a vineyard in CA, so it was good wine...!

silentrun

I love your quote.
You can't escape until you know you're in prison.
That is exactly why I never moderated. One day I realized I was in prison. All at once it just hit me. Couldn't get far enough away fast enough.

jstar

[\QUOTE] All I could think was who would pour that wine down the sink??[/QUOTE]

I've poured nasty booze down the sink! Once when I was trying to "hide" my drinking, I bought these Kalua coffee drinks, they look like those Starbucks espresso drinks, anyways I badly wanted to drink but took one sip & knew it was bad stuff...dumped it and ran out to the store for "cigarettes"...I just couldn't drink it!

PrincessJasmine

Jaynie-oh then no, can't relate. Lol. (However, if one lives on and owns a vineyard those bottles of good wine aren't so hard to come by so...maybe.

ZeldaFan

For me it took failing at moderation before I realized I had to quit alcohol. However, I started trying to quit back when I was a few years younger and didn't look for support from places like SR for advice.

FeenixxRising

PJ, I'm not pusing AA, but jstar's suggestion is sound. Chapters 1 & 2 of the Big Book give a very good description of an alcoholic. You don't have to be in AA or work the program to benefit from these two chapters.

jdooner

PJ - first congrats on two weeks, a few hours and I hit my 14 day mark too. I think your plan sounds fairly logical. I have and maybe am struggling with some of the same questions. For me, 90% of the time was fine but that 10% was so wreckless that it has scared me sober and I am in AA now. I am not sure if I have bought into everything yet and that may be my AV/disease talking - I am not sure yet. I think this is where relapses come in - beat your head enough times on the wall and the answer becomes clear.

This is my first real shot at sobriety in roughly 20yrs. I have gone 30 days before but they were to see if I could or for an annual cleanse. 20yrs ago I came to these same crossroads and went to one AA meeting and some therapy. I met my now current wife and concluded I was not an alcoholic and the rest is history - deja vu 20 yrs later.

I can say nothing positive in my life has come from alcohol but nothing terrible has come yet either. The yet is the key to this statement, as I was flipping the coin and could have lost everything many times during some of my wreckless behavior. I too am continuing sobriety and trying to work the steps but from this post you can see I am struggling with the first one.

The daily struggles are coming a bit easier. I have alcohol in the house, no drugs and have informed all around me about my problems noting I am an alcoholic. I have a full wine cellar that I refuse to get rid of but wine or other liquers were not my DOC. I have kept Vodka out of the house. But I do not have any desires to raid the cabinet, yet I have had urges but its the mental games I seem to play and always the DOC is the desire not the other stuff. I am going to start therapy this fall to try and get to the bottom of my issues, as I know I numbed my mind for two decades and need to deal with the issues not just the symptoms (alcohol and drugs). In part, I feel that I like/love the partying that alcohol opened the door too - call it a mid life crisis and fear of age. That said, in the process I have perhaps become the pickle never to return to my previous cucumber state.

I am not sure if any of this helps. Seeing your posts and others that I can relate to help me, so I thought I would let you know how I relate and what I am going through.

Emily2002

I also think much depends on the definitions of "moderation" and "standard drink size."

Most experts seem to agree on one standard drink per day for women and two for men. Some say up to two for women and three for men.

Not sure about everyone else, but my standard glass of wine is more than 5 ounces. And my mixed drinks typically have more than 1 1/2 to 2 ounces of alcohol in them.

I used to think that moderating meant not being hung over the next day, but the older I get and the more health issues I develop.... like hypertension, high blood glucose, and memory issues... the more I see the value of being honest about what I'm really drinking.

MythOfSisyphus

I have never had any desire to drink in moderation. When I drank the goal was always to get drunk. Every drinker knows what I mean- you know how much it takes to get you to "that place." Why on Earth would I want to be able to have three glasses of wine? That would never do for me.

That's why I don't drink at all.

Tranquilo

I went for 3 months last year with zero alcohol, I had one single beer as i was bored int he airport one day, that lead to 15 months of heavier drinking than before.

Everytime you stop and start, the addiction is kicked up a gear and you come back harder than before, that was the case with me and I've read countless similar stories.

Take the advice of the people who have gone through hell and just stop if you can. For me giving up alcohol the first time didn't work because i kept thinking, maybe it'll get better, maybe i'll start to enjoy life like i did before... Of course it didn't! Why? Because the only change i made was to stop drinking...

When you become a problem drinker you replace all your pastimes and relationships with alcohol, alcohol becomes your hobby, your relationship and so on.

Stopping drinking is great, but after that you need to get back into what used to make you happy, avoid friends who drink too much (you've probably collected a few of these on your journey) get back into your hobbies, set goals etc.

Without a balanced healthy life its easy to relapse, i honestly believe this is key to success in sobriety, understanding that you need to rebuild your life and yourself.

freshstart57

I thought your question was not if one could moderate successfully, but instead if one must (try and then) fail to moderate before quitting. For me, I never really tried to cut back on my drinking, just pushed it hard every day. And then I quit. Finito. Never another drink.

So, I guess the answer is no. We can indeed choose to quit, and quit.

patricia68

Yes Jasmine, I think we do.

I've only stopped drinking 4 days ago, so I don't know much about alcohol abuse...but I do know about other addictions. The body builds tolerance, and if you were able to handle a bottle of wine in one night, eventually your body will keep asking you for more.

When I was in my 20s I was addicted to benzos. I tried them all and I loved them all. My body had built such a tolerance that in the end they just wouldn't work anymore. Not even Valium. The day of my mom's funeral I took 23 Xanax...not because I wanted to kill myself, I just wanted to stop crying, just to be numb, so I would pop a pill every hour or so...and nothing. Didn't work at all.

Long story short, I quitted the happy pills 14 years ago. Recently, and because of my panic/anxiety, my doctor gave me some very mild benzos "as needed"...only 10 per prescription and regular visits to check up.

The first few helped me...but I can tell I'm already craving more. I am so grateful that this doctor is so stingy with the prescriptions...if I had easy access to benzos like I did in the past, I know for a fact that I would be popping pills 5 times a day.

On the other hand...I understand that being sober "for the rest of our lives" is a scary thought right now. So when my addictive thinking gets really strong I tell myself that this is "just an experiment". They say it takes 21 days to break a habit...so I tell myself that if in 21 days I don't see any improvement in my physical and mental health, then I'll reconsider sobriety...I am just trying to fool the addictive thinking and so far it works

DuhDave

Hmmm...Let me get this straight. The question is...do you HAVE to fail at moderation to realize that total abtenance is the answer ?

And the answer is...yes. So...why bother trying to moderate. It's not going to happen (moderation) and you are only prolonging your difficulties by trying.

Are you looking for a "Realization" to stop abusing yourself? My guess is...no. You are just looking for an excuse to continue.

Some times "Tough Love" means...loving yourself.

Like it or not.
Dave