Post-Rehab for Kelly > Cutting the Grass
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Join Date: Mar 2011
Location: near Toronto, Ontario
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Post-Rehab for Kelly > Cutting the Grass
My new friend Rod, and myself, both finished rehab recently.
So, like, on Saturday we both cut the grass around lunch time, and worked up a sweat...which, naturally, gave us both triggers to swallow down 3 or 4 beers.
Thank God we didn't. Each of us chose other beverages - ice cold lemonade (in my case), and ice cold orange juice in Rod's case....so, we're still sober.
But, man oh man, you gotta watch for those triggers right out of the blue.
Good meeting yesterday, on the Big Book, also.
Kelly
So, like, on Saturday we both cut the grass around lunch time, and worked up a sweat...which, naturally, gave us both triggers to swallow down 3 or 4 beers.
Thank God we didn't. Each of us chose other beverages - ice cold lemonade (in my case), and ice cold orange juice in Rod's case....so, we're still sober.
But, man oh man, you gotta watch for those triggers right out of the blue.
Good meeting yesterday, on the Big Book, also.
Kelly
The scenario you mentioned sounds like one of those "suddenly" moments like our friend Jim had in the sandwhich shop or one of those "at certain times" moments I used to have. My problem is that I have no idea what "certain times" look like, I cut the grass, I don't...she leaves, she comes back...see I don't have a clue, so my defense M U S T must come from a Power greater than myself.
If I could choose to drink lemonade every time and be successful then I would not be alcoholic and have no need to come to those meetings, work those steps, and help all those fellow sufferers. I could just choose not to drink one day at a time and live a great life.
Recovered Alcoholic
Join Date: Jun 2011
Posts: 30
If you are alcoholic as described in that book you mentioned (page 21), then you did not choose lemonade and you didn't not choose beer. See, the man or woman on page 21 has lost the power of choice in drink.
The scenario you mentioned sounds like one of those "suddenly" moments like our friend Jim had in the sandwhich shop or one of those "at certain times" moments I used to have. My problem is that I have no idea what "certain times" look like, I cut the grass, I don't...she leaves, she comes back...see I don't have a clue, so my defense M U S T must come from a Power greater than myself.
If I could choose to drink lemonade every time and be successful then I would not be alcoholic and have no need to come to those meetings, work those steps, and help all those fellow sufferers. I could just choose not to drink one day at a time and live a great life.
The scenario you mentioned sounds like one of those "suddenly" moments like our friend Jim had in the sandwhich shop or one of those "at certain times" moments I used to have. My problem is that I have no idea what "certain times" look like, I cut the grass, I don't...she leaves, she comes back...see I don't have a clue, so my defense M U S T must come from a Power greater than myself.
If I could choose to drink lemonade every time and be successful then I would not be alcoholic and have no need to come to those meetings, work those steps, and help all those fellow sufferers. I could just choose not to drink one day at a time and live a great life.
From Page 21 of "Alcoholics Anonymous" (1st Edition):
"But what about the real alcoholic? He may start off as a moderate drinker; he may or may not become a continuous hard drinker; but at some stage of his drinking career he begins to lose all control of his liquor consumption, once he starts to drink."
From "The Doctor's Opinion" in "Alcoholics Anonymous" (1st Edition):
“All these [types of alcoholics], and many others, have one symptom in common: they cannot start drinking without developing the phenomenon of craving."
From Page 22 of "Alcoholics Anonymous" (1st Edition):
“This is by no means a comprehensive picture of the true alcoholic, as our behavior patterns vary. But this description should identify him roughly.”
From Page 24 of "Alcoholics Anonymous" (1st Edition):
"The fact is that most alcoholics, for reasons yet obscure, have lost the power of choice in drink."
"Most Alcoholics" = Not All AlcoholicsFrom Page 32 of "Alcoholics Anonymous" (1st Edition):
“We have heard of a few instances where people, who showed definite signs of alcoholism, were able to stop for a long period because of an overpowering desire to do so."
You know, sometimes I think too much preaching sends people running and screaming from the church.
However you managed that moment, for whatever reason Kelly, you have every reason to be proud of yourself, despite whether the particulars of your victory don't match someone else's definition of victory.
Good for you! I like sun tea myself.
However you managed that moment, for whatever reason Kelly, you have every reason to be proud of yourself, despite whether the particulars of your victory don't match someone else's definition of victory.
Good for you! I like sun tea myself.
From Page 21 of "Alcoholics Anonymous" (1st Edition):
From "The Doctor's Opinion" in "Alcoholics Anonymous" (1st Edition):
From Page 22 of "Alcoholics Anonymous" (1st Edition):
From Page 24 of "Alcoholics Anonymous" (1st Edition):
From Page 32 of "Alcoholics Anonymous" (1st Edition):
"But what about the real alcoholic? He may start off as a moderate drinker; he may or may not become a continuous hard drinker; but at some stage of his drinking career he begins to lose all control of his liquor consumption, once he starts to drink."
From "The Doctor's Opinion" in "Alcoholics Anonymous" (1st Edition):
“All these [types of alcoholics], and many others, have one symptom in common: they cannot start drinking without developing the phenomenon of craving."
From Page 22 of "Alcoholics Anonymous" (1st Edition):
“This is by no means a comprehensive picture of the true alcoholic, as our behavior patterns vary. But this description should identify him roughly.”
From Page 24 of "Alcoholics Anonymous" (1st Edition):
"The fact is that most alcoholics, for reasons yet obscure, have lost the power of choice in drink."
"Most Alcoholics" = Not All AlcoholicsFrom Page 32 of "Alcoholics Anonymous" (1st Edition):
“We have heard of a few instances where people, who showed definite signs of alcoholism, were able to stop for a long period because of an overpowering desire to do so."
I operate on the morality of "is it working for you?" and if it is, then cool beans.
One consideration: Could all of those be drunk traps...for someone looking for a way to not do the work?
I was taught to match my experiences with those in our text, look for the similarities, not the differences. The ego likes to use hundreds of tools to make me think I am different.
Recovered Alcoholic
Join Date: Jun 2011
Posts: 30
How do you know his HP didn't step in to help him make the right choice there?
One consideration: Could all of those be drunk traps...for someone looking for a way to not do the work?
I was taught to match my experiences with those in our text, look for the similarities, not the differences. The ego likes to use hundreds of tools to make me think I am different.
I was taught to match my experiences with those in our text, look for the similarities, not the differences. The ego likes to use hundreds of tools to make me think I am different.
I've heard quite a few people introduce themselves as a "real alcoholic" or a "page 21 alcoholic" in order to sound important.
Although the text uses the the term "real alcoholic" there is no functional distinction in the Big Book between alcoholic and real alcoholic. In fact, the terms are used interchangeably.
On pages 20-21, it describes the moderate drinker, the hard drinker, and the real alcoholic.
If the authors had intended to imply that there is a difference between alcoholic and real alcoholic, they would have described an alcoholic right after the hard drinker and right before the real alcoholic.
What it does promise is that I will be placed in a position of neutrality, safe and protected.
In a position of neutrality I have about as much choice to drink as I have choice to not drink. Hence, "neutral."
And Resume, you're right in one important way, "...most alcoholics..." It specifically does NOT say ALL. As Omega mentioned, if you have the power to choose to not drink......and you continue to make the right choice.......then choose not to drink and keep yourself sober. Unfortunately, for most alcoholics, they don't have that power. The AA book separates these two groups by calling the ones with choice "hard drinnkers" and the ones with no choice "alcoholics." For some reason, EVERY "hard drinker" I've ever run into seems to like to call themselves alcoholic......then go on to talk about having the power of choice......but that's another story and I don't want to derail Kelly's thread any further.
KELLY......gotta admit......I read the "3 or 4 beers" line and slammed my mouse against my desk! .......then I read the next sentence. Ya jerk.....you scared me.
One thing about "triggers": they're not real. I repeat, IF you're an alcoholic, "not being drunk" is your only trigger. The thought to drink can and will come at you from a million different angles and with little consistency. What triggers you today, might not tomorrow, yet will again in a month. So.......if being dry is THE trigger, what does one do? ---GET RECOVERED. Get to the point where that insanity of taking the next first drink goes away. Some ppl can do this by deciding to......many can't. Find your truth (whether you can decide to not have those thoughts anymore or not) and make your move.
Early in sobriety, most ppl hit a place where, upon being dry for a while, start to feel pretty good, their mood picks up, their health improves a bit, relationships with family, friends, and co-workers start to improve........we start feeling good. For many ppl, the next thought is, "I'm doing better.....one or two won't hurt THIS TIME, given everything I've learned about alcoholism and addiction in treatment."
I couldn't stop "those thoughts" myself. And I know me......self-centered to the core.......get me thinking I want something....or "need something........badly enough......long enough.......and I'm GOING to act upon it. In this scenario, where booze is concerned, I can't take the chance that I'll be able to control those urges. AA was the only place I FOUND that not only told me buy promised AND guaranteed me that IF I did the work, my drinking and "living" problems would be a thing of the past.
The choice is, obviously, yours to make. Don't take those "warning shots" of the insanity of the next first drink lightly though. Sometimes we need reminders like that to keep us moving down the path of recovery rather than standing around smelling the roses.......standing still while our alcoholism catches up to us.
xoxo........glad yer home, glad you're out of rehab, and glad you learned a lot there - don't forget to put it into action.
Recovered Alcoholic
Join Date: Jun 2011
Posts: 30
What they do say is that God will do for us what we cannot do for ourselves; in this case, make the right choice.
As stated earlier, the text also makes clear that not all alcoholics have lost the power of choice. It even gives the story of the man who had definite signs of alcoholism and was able to stay bone dry for twenty-five years on page 32.
From page 85, Alcoholics Anonymous, 1st Ed:
We feel as though we had been placed in a position of neutrality—safe and protected.
The text also does not say that we will never be tempted. From page 84, BB, 1st Ed:We will seldom be interested in liquor. If tempted, we recoil from it as from a hot flame.
Recovered Alcoholic
Join Date: Jun 2011
Posts: 30
But, "real" is used as an adjective, so "real alcoholic" is not a noun, a separate entity, even though some people like to use it that way.
It doesn't mean something different from alcoholic. Real alcoholic refers to someone who is really, actually, alcoholic, not someone who is some special kind of alcoholic.
If the the authors wanted to say the two were different, they would have described "alcoholic" after "hard drinker" and before describing the "real alcoholic."
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