steve1840

my last thread seemed to invoke some strong thoughts, opinions, support, dismay. i would like to address a couple of things. it is quite possible that the story of wednesday night is total bs. it is also possible it is true, and its also possible that the truth is somewhere in between. i do know that whatever happened, it had an effect.

as for staying with a male friend. some women have lots of guy friends and some guys have lots of women friends. i spend weekends every now and then with my friend (female) who lives in ny. I'd rather her stay with someone we know and trust than on the street.

she went to her meeting today and is excited about a long term rehab facility for women she seems able to get into. the first step is detox, andsheis going there tomorrow morning.


i am not getting my hopes up, i am prepared for whatever happens. i know everyone here wants what is best for me and my future. and i do too. i want time alone now andi want to rebuild. as with the addict, i had to get sick and tired of being sick and tired.

so it has taken me longer to get there, but the goal isthe same. now it is up to her to make recovery work for her. and the same goes for me.

Impurrfect

(((Steve))) - good for you for starting to take care of YOU! It goes against everything we've been taught, since childhood, when we're taught to help those we care about. Addiction is just the opposite, and it's HARD to accept that our "help" is actually hurting.

So, are you going away for the weekend?

Hugs and prayers,

Amy

URMYEVERYTHING

When is that time alone for you Steve?

I read the past post and in order for you to really want to be alone is to truly be alone. Turning the phone off, actually changing the number and disappearing from her life. That is truly alone.

Otherwise, as long as you leave contact open....she will always be there! Always there to suck you back in.

I will pray for you to let go and for her to find peace.

Callie

Are you sure this woman is deserving of any of your emotions?


Amen. Something to think about Steve. You deem her worthy or her emotions, but yet you hold yours in as not worthy?

Live

Steve,

I think it is codie of me to tell you what to do and place expectations on you to do as I advise.

It's a take it or leave type thing.

You've a right to do as you damned well please...but as long as you come here seeking feedback or advice...you know pretty much what to expect.

Best wishes!

Lizzaayy

i hope you mean he can expect to be encouraged, Live, because that is the whole purpose of this forum.

steve, if you slip up or if you go no contact, whatever the outcome is, know that you will always have support here on SR, that is what this forum is all about.

even when addicts come here continually falling into their drug use over and over, there are dozens who respond to their stories with words of wisdom and positive enforcement that they CAN and WILL do better if they make the effort. and when the addicts slip again, still they are met with those same words of encouragement. this treatment should also be given to codependents, in my opinion.

so forgive those who have been sarcastic or brash with you (come now guys, you know better). they are simply frustrated and you must not take their comments to heart.

good luck steve =)

Freedom1990

My first sponsor was a crusty old gal, already in her 70's, and maybe 5' tall (I'm 6' tall). She informed me that she was going to be my sponsor, no doubt about it.

She often reminded me when I was in self-pity mode that she was going to bring home a bedpan from the nursing home (she volunteered there 5 days a week) and paint "DeVon's Pity Pot" on it, and I could sit on it till I had a nice red ring around my keister.

She also told me more than once I could find sympathy between sh*t and syphilis in the dictionary.

That woman had a profound and lasting effect on my recovery. She's been dead for many years, but I still think of her fondly.

My sponsor of the last 20 years is a toughie too because that is exactly what this old broad needs.

Different strokes for different folks, I say. Some, like me, need the tough cookie approach. Others need a gentler approach.

Neither you or I are powerful enough to know what someone else might need at the moment.

Some here are gentle, others are tough, and many use both approaches.

I do know for a fact that untreated codependency can kill just as surely as addiction/alcoholism can.

Lizzaayy

quite right, freedom. on all accounts.
i agree with you whole heartedly, and thank you for responding to part of my comment.
however, there is most certainly a difference between giving tough (yet well meaning) advice and venting frustrations that have no positive purpose.
for example, saying it's no use, he doesn't get it, there's no point in trying, etc. comments like these, i fail to see where they would help anyone. why type that at all? to make someone see that you think there is no point? it would be much better, IMO, to just refrain from commenting at all, and go on about your day.
though maybe, there is a hidden use to comments like these, and i just can not see them.

Callie

there is most certainly a difference between giving tough (yet well meaning) advice and venting frustrations that have no positive purpose.
for example, saying it's no use, he doesn't get it, there's no point in trying, etc. comments like these, i fail to see where they would help anyone.

I got these comments about a year ago. It pi$$ed me off to no end. BUT a year later, I can see the same frustration that people felt about me yet again in this thread. People hope and pray and try until they're blue in the face. But until the original poster 'gets' it. It continues on. If you look at the previous postings, you'll see that he's had very sound advice that's not been taken. I'm guilty of the same. I too, thoght I knew best. I took what advice here that I could, but I 'sure has he[[ knew better than those that went before me. NOT.

People post because they care. If they didn't, they'd let you continue to suffer. I know I've been coddled AND nailed here on SR and 'I' needed them both.

JesusSaves

I am glad that you have decided to try to go sober, and good luck with it, my prayers go out to you and your future

Lizzaayy

thank you for responding to my comment, callie. i understand where you are coming from.

i have read steve's story, and have commented on a few things here and there. i know that he has been given advice by many people, please do not assume that i would make my comments without first knowing what i'm talking about. it was good advice too, and i am not condeming or minimalizing any of it, period.

i still do not see the point in telling someone in any situation like the ones here on SR that you think there is no point in trying to talk to them, don't bother, etc. it seems a little absurd to do so. how does that help, i wonder?

Babyblue

I'm with Lizzaayy, it doesn't help. In fact, it reinforces that feeling of powerlessness about ourselves that we are trying to overcome. Lots of projection of our own hurt, sadness, confusion onto someone who may or may not be giving the full story. There is no such thing as absolute anything in my book. Just as we can't assume we know why people do what they do in their relationships with the addict. To me 'codependence' oversimplifies some deeper issues some of us have.

I never understand the woman who stays more than one second with a man who hits her or degrades her emotionally yet I see countless posts on SR by women who put up with ongoing abuse for too long. Not what I would have done but all I can do is point out the facts about domestic violence (irrespective of addiction/alcoholism) and hope they get help. How would it help these women if I rolled my eyes (virtually) and 'gave up hope' on them. It wouldn't because the solutions to their problems in abusive relationships go way deeper than telling them 'just get out!'.

I'm using that as an example of how complex these issues. While there are common themes and similarities in our stories, we all come from different walks of life, have different values and perspectives. I don't expect what I say to go far with anyone on here. If it does, great, if they don't use it, that is fine too. I don't get frustrated with them and if they want to keep discussing an issue, even if I don't agree with how they are handling it, then maybe that is all they are wanting, just someone to listen.

my two bits!

MaryGoRound

Oh boy!

Steve, all I can say is keeping doing what you're doing - just be careful of those "but if" thoughts (they STILL get ME I know that) and things of that nature. In the least allow yourself enough space to gain some perspective.

I agree with the others, there are different types of "help" but ultimately its your choice what to believe in and what to do about it all.

Know yourself, your TRUTHS, and your BOUNDARIES.

That's really all its about. What have you done for yourself lately Steve? I always like to hear what others are doing to help themselves heal - gives me ideas

I think ultimately the goal is to lead a fulfilling life WITHOUT the addict in our lives, and if they recover great. if not, then who cares..we're happy ne way!

Lizzaayy

well said mary and blue.

i can not wait to hear about how steve's weekend went. i hope it went well. but if not, i will be here to listen.

Lizzaayy

you're right, cynical. the two worlds are different, obviously. and no, validating and hand-holding will not help. though i think the death scenario is a bit dramatic. i am simply not that powerful, no one is.

i will always be here to listen to what steve, or anyone else on SR has to say, whether it be in steps towards recovery or backtracks from it. and i will never, ever tell anyone that there is no point in talking to them. because that doesn't help either.

Chino

Everything everyone posts here is a projection of their reality.

My therapist told me about someone who kept coming to the rooms of AA, but was in such deep denial and therefore not able to receive any ES&H from anyone. He was taking time away from people who wanted help and were willing to do the work. My therapist said the chair finally said, when you're ready, we're here, then everyone continued on with the meeting, essentially ignoring the man in denial. He left, then came back when he was ready to take the first step.

I won't tell anyone how they should or should not respond, that is a control issue as well and that is not my place here. Instead I'll end my post with a message to Steve:

I hope your friend finds recovery and you do, too. For all I know, she could be the daughter or sister of someone here. If my daughter wasn't playing on the wii right now, I'd wonder if it's her. I'd hope someone out there loved and cared for her. I'd also hope they were taking care of themselves and didn't let her drag them down with her, like the friends who did die. I went to two of the funerals but couldn't do it again, it hurt so bad.

I can't save you Steve, and I can't give you the desire to save yourself. I hope you'll understand and forgive me for walking away now, but I'll be here when you're ready. I'll keep you both in my thoughts and prayers.

Lizzaayy

please, you misunderstand me cynical. i was not saying a crack house was not dramatic. please do not assume that i would be so ignorant. =(
i was saying that this:


"Holding his hand and validating his stinking thinking could get him dead."

that statement was dramatic, because i know i am simply not powerful enough to get someone dead, cynical. nothing i say will cause that. that is what i was saying. i was most assuredly not minimalizing the atrocities that go on in a crack house.

i am sorry for the confusion. though it does sadden me to know that i was so misunderstood, especially about something that is obviously common sense. i feel as if my comments don't mean much, if people think that i am, for lack of a better words, stupid.

when really, i feel as though i have a firm grasp on the realities of the situation, and my opinion is actually quite valid.
that telling anyone here on SR that there is no point in talking to them is not helpful.
there is no benefit to those statments, and more often than not, i bet they end up simply hurting the person that they are directed towards. that should never be the outcome of anything said to anyone in the stories on these forums. isn't there already enough pain in our lives, without having others making snide remarks?
there is no purpose to such comments. my opinion remains the same.

cece1960

Lets remember to stay on topic, and not turn this into a three page off-topic debate.
Thanks