GettingBy

I'm struggling right now on how to set my boundaries, especially ones that I can actually defend. I'm very much aware of (and afraid of) misusing boundaries to try and control someone else's behavior. I know that my boundaries are to protect me.

The situation is that my husband has a drinking problem. He readily admits that he has gotten out of control, and his solution has been that he will control it. He has admitted that his drinking & driving is reckless and irresponsible, and 4 weeks ago he told me and our counselor that he was going to "work on it." In the past few weeks, "work on it" has boiled down to still drinking and driving but only 2 times a week (not the 3-4 that he was doing).

I guess to me "controlling it" is a completely ridiculous concept to even discuss with an alcoholic. My feeling right now is that I don't trust him to control the amount he drinks when he's out. I don't want alcohol to be a part of my life anymore. But I don't know how to say that to my husband. Or at least say it without sounding like a overbearing control freak. The counselor had suggested that B should try not drinking at all for a month or two... and then we could see how our relationship goes. B told the counselor that was a good idea, but we never discussed it once we left the room. I feel like I should bring the point back up... but I'm so freakin' scared to open my mouth.

The part that is the hardest is that I keep confusing the issue in my own head. I start making it really an issue about the drinking and driving, or about the amount of money that gets wasted. When that happens, there's NO WAY that I'm going to be able to clearly communication anything to my husband. I start talking in circles and nothing gets accomplished. Tension is building between us and if I don't figure out how to start talking.. I'm going to blow up!

I'd like any E,S&H that you folks can share. Tell me what you hear in my post because I feel like I can't even hear myself anymore.
Thanks in advance,
Shannon

minnie

Hmm. What does that mean to you? Does it mean that you don't want alcohol around you? Or does it mean you don't want to be with an active alcoholic?

I struggled with boundaries for a long time. But once I started to get the hang of them, they had more impact than anything else I have learned, I think. When I set a boundary for myself, I always make sure that I focus on the consequence. For example, I do not tolerate my ex verbally taking out his frustrations on me (we work together), so I focus on what I will do when he does so. It may be that I hang up the phone. If it continues, I switch off my phone. What I'm trying to say is that when I think it through totally, I have so much more clarity on the situation. Last year I came to the realisation that I could not live with an active alcoholic and pursue my own recovery. I actually gave him a few chances after I had made that decision, but in the end I followed through and left. He still doesn't quite get what happened, but that doesn't really matter, it only reinforces that I made the right decision.

Big picture thinking also helped me. We were going to couples counselling, but to be honest it was futile whilst he was not committed to his recovery. I had to think of the long term and realise that if this was going to work, I had to accept the relationship for how it was at that moment. And I just couldn't.

Ooops, I've rambled on a bit. In a nutshell, consequences and clarity.

walkingtheline

The thing that jumped off the page at me is this statement:

Can you figure out exactly what the fear is? What is it you think would happen if you expressed yourself?

Are you still seeing the counselor? Is it possible to bring this up with him/her to get some expert advice on communications?

The drinking and driving issue is HUGE to me. You can and probably should have a boundary that you will not ride with any driver that's been drinking. That's self-preservation at it's most basic. It's simply NOT safe. Walking beats dying, no question about it.

I don't know if this is of any help to you or not. Focus on you, ask your HP for some guidance...maybe some clarity will come.

(((GettingBy)))

meli2005

You need to tell him you cannot live any more with teh drinking. IF he can't stop on his own, then he needs to enter an alcohol treatment center. It does not sound as though he is very committed to be honest. He has to be the one to beat the alcoholism, not you.

It is a very tough thing to be in the middle of.

Alcoholics are masters of manipulation. A lot of them try to play games with teh disease as though they are gonig to beat it that way.

GettingBy

Minnie:

To me that means I don't want to live with an active alcohol, and all the things that go along with that. The worrying about where he is, how much he's be drinking, how much money is he spending, is he spending our savings or grocery money, is he driving drunk. The anxiety of when he gets home of trying to detach and seperate myself from the drunk version of him, which can be pretty verbally abusive. I've learned to detach and let go, but this to me is not a marriage. It seems more like a method to cope with the disease but does not help me foster any love or respect towards my husband. With the tools I have developed, I do find that I'm handling the everyday sober relationship issues MUCH better, but the alcohol is an issue I just can get by. When he's sober and actively participating in the marriage, things are really good. I just can't accept him the way he is RIGHT now. So if nothing changed, I wouldn't want this marriage anymore.

WTL,
My fear is that I won't say exactly what I'm feeling. I won't be able to say how much I don't like the alcohol and how it makes me feel. I'm afraid that I will back-peddle and end crumbling, and keep accepting what I don't really want. I did call the counselor but he can't see me until 2 weeks from now. In the meantime, I feel like I need to get some strength to talk, or like I said, I'm going to blow. It does neither of us any good when I don't talk.

The boundary on the drinking and driving has been that I will not allow myself to ride with him when he's been drinking. I did ride with him this past weekend after he had 2-3, and that is really driving me bonkers. I know that I can't beat myself up for it, but I also don't want to make that same mistake again.

The largest part of my problem is probably being very clear with MYSELF on what the boundaries are. I think I set them, and then I allow myself to settle on less. Because I have a hard time standing up to the alcohol, to me the solution is to eliminate it. I'm tired of the anxiety that alcohol gives me.

I will keep praying to my HP because at this point I know that I HAVE to talk to him. Something has to change.

Thanks for all the support!
Shannon

equus

You've got a great opener with what your counsellor said - why not use it?

I might be over simplifying it but it seems right now you would like that no - alcohol month?

If that is the case maybe you could just say you thought the idea was very good and that it is very important to you. Stick to the positive - that you were pleased he agreed with the idea, and ask outright if he would be willing to try.

Unless you want a boundary right now perhaps it's better to see what happens just having a chat first. If he asks lots of why questions - keep it simple, it's for your relationship, for you , it was the counsellors idea and you had both agreed.

None of that would stop you from making it a boundary issue if that was what you decided - even a day later.

minnie

GB, does he know, in very simple terms, that you don't want to live with an active alcoholic? I say that because my ex knew, but because all I did was demand and shout and cry about him stopping, he thought I wasn't serious. By staying it wasn't a boundary, just an empty threat. You don't have to make that boundary today - I gave myself a time limit. I know now that it really was a boundary, because I left and he still hasn't got recovery and it doesn't affect my life. I didn't do it to change him and get him to stop drinking. I did it because my boundary of not living with an active alcoholic is vitally important to me. Does this make sense?

Please know that I am not advocating that you get a divorce. Perhaps some time and space apart might help. Think of the bigger picture - about YOUR whole life, rather than your life right now.

I really feel for you, hon. I know how hard this is.

GettingBy

I wanted to *bump* this....

Because I dug it up, re-read it... and saw just how far my recovery has come. It's taken me 6 years to get here... but I'm finally at the point where I could say, "I won't live with the drinking"... and I actually meant it.

For years, and years, I confused the issue by arguing about the drinking because of the drinking and driving, because of the money... because of all the other bad things that went along with it. I muddied the issue, trying to break out smaller chunks of the untolerable so that maybe life could be tolerable. I was trying my hardest to "talk sense into him!"

Today I know... that didn't make life any better or happier for me.

Today I'm thinking about the big picture, and MY whole life.

I love you guys, and I'm so unbelievably grateful to have my "history" here to see, and to be able to share my journey with you all. I feel like the last 3 months of my life have been straight out of the movie "Awakenings"!! I don't ever want to go catatonic again.

stepsforward

Good for you!!!!

Tuffgirl

Wow - you have come far. And I can relate to the "scared to open my mouth" feeling. My read-end is permanently scared from the drunken a$$ chewings I've had, and I didn't stay in the relationship for as long as you have.

Stay strong - you are inspiring!

CXR

Shannon, thank for the post.

Boundaries is a tough one. Yes, we don't want to fall into the trap of misusing boundaries to try and control someone else's behavior. Agreed. Excellent point.

My wife has a drinking problem. She is an alcoholic. That said, controlling it? I hate to sound harsh -- but -- excuses, excuses, manipulation, buying time, conning, etc. Me believing all of that when my wife says all those things to me -- and me thinking it's OK, and accepting that -- is in my mind me enabling her. I won't do that. I don't have those discussions with her. I detach. Because of the past, she knows how I feel. Thus, she controls her drinking . . . and over and above that she hides it.

You are not supposed to believe he can control his drinking. You are right, you cannot communicate this to him. Detach. Don't enable. Focus on what YOU can do, and not what you want to do for him.

I think you are doing an excellent job. Keep up the good work -- on YOU! All the best.

Cyranoak

This scared the crap out of me. I thought you had completely collapsed/relapsed until I saw that you bumped it from 2005. It was very Twilight Zoney to read it, but now that I have context it is clear you are a completely different woman today, and a stronger one.

No pitbull in that post-- at all. I like the new Shannon.

Cyranoak

Shellcrusher

Reading the whole thread is crucial.

Way to go GettingBy!
Just as it's a feeling of accomplishment to see how you've grown, it's also a great feeling for those of us struggling with the same concepts you've gone through.

GettingBy

Cyranoak... I'm glad you read through the whole post! Because that's what it was for me too... a freaky Twilight Zoney experience of, "OMG, look at where I was! Look at how clouded my thinking was! How confused and disoriented I had myself because I was trying to figure out the perfect words to get my husband sober!!!!"

I just didn't get it. But today, by the grace of God, I get it... maybe not all of "it"... but certainly a deeper understanding than I had then. There's certainly more work to do, and the thought of stepping away from the active drinking, so I CAN do that work... just makes me excited beyond words!!



BTW... Just picked up the new car. It's amazing. Far nicer than anything I've ever owned... drives beautifully!! I told them it had a tire out of balance (wobbled at highway speeds)... turns out a tire was bad... so I got 4 new tires too!!!

My HP loves me!

frances2011

I'm new here so I hope it's OK if I say something. I'm having a squishy boundaries day and I am reading SR to find something to ground me.

Here it is! Thank you for sharing your recovery.

GettingBy

Frances... thanks for posting! Squishy boundary day - boy, I've had more of those than I can count!!! And, I'm sure there are more in my future ;-)

It's all about having patience with yourself and doing the best you can with the tools you have right here and now!! I look back on 2005 me, and I remember how I felt then. I remember struggling to "get it"... but being so proud of myself that I was even going to Al-anon, and posting on SR!! I WAS making progress! I WAS getting new tools to help me live better!! I hadn't really figured out how to use them, but I HAD them!!!

I left the tools in the shed for a while... and recently dug them back out and am learning how to use them better now!!! Ah, more progress!! It's good stuff

Lunakim

It is so nice to see that i am not alone when it comes to my feelings and reactions.
I am newly married and my husband is a binge drinker, once he starts he will not stop.
I have tired to control his drinking and in the end it ends up ruining my evening/day and putting me in a bad mood. I then start to not trust him and find myself being very insecure. None of this his does himself, just my own mind doing this.
I have also tried to have a conversation with him when he drinks and it just goes in circles. His latest response is " i only had a few beers", and then i ask define "a few". Usually he states 6-8 is a few for him. "But i was not even wasted" is also what i hear. OMG it drives me insane.

fedup3

I'm so sorry Lunakim.

Vi0let

Lunakim -

Oh, man do i feel for you. I am not married, but i have known my boyfriend for about 18 years now.
I am in a situation that sounds very much like yours, and am new to recovery myself.
The whole situation has got me focusing on HIS issues, when i should be focusing on my own recovery.
Here is what i KNOW;
I left this man many years ago because of his drinking. And, guess what? 17 years later, he is still doing the same thing he did then.
Alcoholics are ill. There is nothing you can do to change them. They have to want to change themselves.
Now that i am working on recovery and have not had any alcohol in a mere 5 days, i can already see the situation so much more clearly than i could when we were both drinking.
Because i love him, and he is one of my dearest friends as well as a boyfriend, i don't want to leave him. But, ultimately, i love myself more. And to stay with an alcoholic who is not willing to get into recovery is to set yourself up for an endless cycle that will last for YEARS.
Now that i am fighting for my own life, i see that i have to set boundaries (which is probably one of the hardest things for an addict/person who loves an addict can do).

What i have decided to do is, after i have some solid recovery time of my own (say a month, with no relapses), is to tell him that i cannot, for the sake of my OWN life and recovery, be with him if he continues to drink the way he does. I will tell him i love him, but cannot make the choice for him. If he wants to stay in the relationship, he must get treatment. I will set a date so he has time to think about it - but not too long.
If he does not seek treatment, i will, even though it will break my heart, end the relationship.

I have already told him i can't be around him when he drinks. This has meant i have not seen him since the day i started AA.
And you know what? I miss him, but i value my life more.

I don't know if you are in recovery yourself, or if he is the only one with the disease. But i believe what i say applies either way. It is your life - don't let him entangle you in his disease. You will end up paying a price that is far too high.

I wish you strength.

V

kittykitty

I admit, I was quite confused when I started reading the thread as well. I was all, "i know I haven't been on in a couple days, but what the heck is going on here?"

It's nice to look back, and see how far we've come.

Yay and hooray for new tires!