needuall

I have active addicts, recovering addicts, and enablers in my family. Two have very rigid boundaries, which to me looks like my way or the highway. Those with rigid boundaries give no consideration of others, in my opinion, and my tendency is to choose the highway. I do considerate myself a moderate type person, no addictions. It is difficult because they are family. How can you think no consideration of others is ok?

Hawkeye13

Why is the sky blue? Some people just don’t ever think about others first, or at all. It is hurtful and frustrating, but even more so when I try to analyze the selfishness and make some sort of sense out it.

I think you are smart to choose the highway because all the reasoning, analysis, and empathy in the world won’t make self-centered people change if they don’t seek that change themselves.

It is a family disease no matter what part one plays—healing yourself is the only true recovery possible.

SparkleKitty

Here's the thing about other people's boundaries -- you don't get any say in them whatsoever. Just as they don't get any say in yours. Choosing the highway is your best option, family or no.

biminiblue

Well, you don't give much context. Also, it usually takes one to know one - and I don't mean that in a mean way.

I'm sure you get tired of the addicts, right? Does anything you say or do stop their behavior?

I'm guessing not.

I honestly don't have the emotional bandwidth to deal with addicts nor with enablers. Addicts/alcoholics/gamblers/smokers/hoarders etc. are choosing the behavior and to be a tornado in everyones' lives. I am far better off if I stay far far away from them. Try it. It's nice and peaceful.

sage1969

I agree in choosing the highway simply because I know what I am willing to tolerate in my own life, and often others' ways, especially in those kind of toxic situations, are just not conducive to my best kind of life for me. That being said, others may think my own boundaries are too rigid -- that's fine with me. Other's opinions of me and my boundaries are none of my business, and if those people can't respect or love me enough to stand by me doing what is best for my wellbeing, then those are people I'm willing to let go, with love and peace. (Coming from a highly dysfunctional family of origin, there are those whom I've let go, or disconnected from with love, who've said I'm the family problem for not remaining connected; I see it as not being willing to perpetuate that sick cycle for my children and descendants).

velma929

You don't get a chance to arbitrate others' boundaries, so I guess it's the highway.

After all, if said you had boundaries, but they were open to debate / arbitration / discussion, they're not boundaries, they're just suggestions.

The idea of addicts appropriating the idea of boundaries to justify treating others poorly is rich in irony, though. It reminds me of a former colleague, whose addict/convict son insisted what he did was nobody else's business because it didn't affect anyone else - until the police came to work to ask colleague if she knew where her son was. She was mortified.

Eauchiche

I have known others whose "boundaries" included darting towards me for an attack, then retreating.
Highway

trailmix

I see this as more about your boundaries, not theirs. No one ever has to tolerate another's behaviour or boundaries - that's just true.

So as an example, say my boundary is, you can't drink in front of my children. If we come to visit, you need to be sober. Ok, that's my boundary.

Theirs may be, if you come to my house, this is my sanctuary and I will do what I want here, when I want to, it's my home. This includes drinking when others are here, if you don't like it, please don't come over or just leave.

See how the second person's boundary is irrelevant to you? You already have a boundary around this scenario. Is your boundary better or worse? No, it's yours, it just is, this is your choice. The other person doesn't have to "do" anything. The behaviour isn't within your boundaries, so of course you take the "highway".

You might think their boundary is selfish or rigid, they might believe that of yours, but again, it doesn't actually matter.

needuall

The case I am referring to is a keep the secret boundary that abusers want others to adhere to. There will be those who are conditioned to go along with it. Walking away totally is not the option I want but I know I have.

Hawkeye13

You are being pretty vague, so perhaps more details might help us be more helpful if you choose to share, but as others have said, a boundary isn’t really negotiable and they are often unspoken (secret) since they are signposts for the self, not rules for others.

If it is troubling to you, or conflicts with your own boundaries your only healthy option is to step away, since we cannot control another adult’s choices, however misguided, unfair, or unhealthy we perceive them to be.

Wishing you peace. Dealing with addiction whatever your involvement is so difficult 😞

velma929

Something one expects others to adhere to isn't a boundary. It's a rule. We don't talk about rules much here because honestly, one person can't control whether someone else adheres to a rule or not. (Maybe an employer can impose a rule on an employee.)

If the 'others' you're concerned about go along with the rule (Not a boundary, because boundaries are about our own behavior, not others) and you think that's not fair / ill-advised / not in the anyone's best interest, guess what, you still can't control what the 'others' do.

An addict who decides "anyone who nags me about my drinking will never be invited back to my home" has a right to live life any way he or she chooses. That is a rule, but other people can go along with it, or not. They can keep going over, not mentioning it, under the idea that somehow their presence changes things.

People can even decide for themselves "I'm not going to go over to Simon's house because every visit is just watching him drink himself to death."

A secret rule? A secret rule like 'anyone who says the word pineapple will be cut from my life and I'll never tell him/her why': that certainly is unfair, but still not something you can fix.

But since you seem to know what the rule is, is it really a secret?

biminiblue

Once again, that's pretty vague.

If keeping a secret is harmful to yourself or others and if you exposing this secret would also be harmful - that's a pretty tough thing to sort out.

Do you have a really close family friend who you can discuss it with?

Abuse is way different than addiction. If someone is doing something illegal and you can report it - I hope you'll do so. I know how scary it can be to have to be around someone who is a loose cannon. I hope you get some face-to-face help on this.

choublak

A “secret boundary”? As in, someone is abusing others but wants them to keep it a secret? Is that what you’re getting at here?

Are there kids involved?

needuall

Thank you all for responding. This was excellent regarding rigid boundaries (to avoid being accountable for wrongs) from recovery blog!!
Recognizing Spiritualized Ego.

velma929

Ahh, yes. I worked with one of these individuals. All the jargon boils down to 'dry drunk.' He had stopped drinking, but nothing else had changed. The language of recovery was there, but no real accountability or change had taken place. His life was still a mess, and it was everybody else's fault. His house was in foreclosure, but it had nothing to do with the fact that he and his wife had lied about their income, purchased something way beyond their means, and were now spending tons of money on stuff they didn't need to maintain the points in the MLM they had joined.

He and his wife were having problems, but it had nothing to do with the fact that he was cheating on her.

He kept getting speeding tickets, but it wasn't his fault because the wrong sized tires were on his car. (For some reason, putting the right sized tires on or keeping that in mind and going slower were not options.

One morning he sulked around for long enough to me to [regrettably] ask what was wrong. We worked retail, in a store that was open 'late,' until 7 o' clock, Thursdays. He was mad he had to work until 7. But he had asked not to open Thursdays, because Wednesday nights he had choir practice at church. You see the problem - right? He didn't.

There's nothing we can do about these things. I had to work with "Henry" until the second time the boss caught his stealing. I tried to cover my behind and seriously - not speak to him - because his avoidance of any responsibility was so infuriating. You can't change or outwit a person like that. Sometimes you just have to outlast him.

We can't force people to change. We just can't. Understanding and accepting that takes a large burden off of our shoulders. It's not our job to live others' lives for them.

thequest

Sometimes rigid boundaries are needed. I've seen family enablers do exactly that with less than rigid boundaries. Some, not all only seem to understand or respond to rigid boundaries. (Going to stray briefly but I've had nuisance/addict neighbors as well that sort of tempered their behavior after talking to landlord. Another neighbor called the police on them. Anytime that neighbor is around they're extra 'calm/quiet', point being sometimes in your face boundaries are needed and work).

Others wind up putting fuel on a fire or make a bad situation worse ie it's not worth tough rules because they simply don't work. This is where one must learn to pick and chose their battles.

I will say those paying the bills, providing shelter, doing the work should have a say sober or not. Family issues get messy because of alot of co mingled business and 'the family' card is pulled out anytime someone wants a break.

Sounds like this is a situation where it's best to detach or remain neutral. Too hard to deal multiple issues and people at the sametime. And long term alkies and addicts learn how to play/manipulate people individually sometimes against each other. If someone says no they know who to go to for a 'yes'.

Good Luck Stay Safe!

meldavis99

Boundaries are about you and yourself. I am not really even sure where consideration of others fits into it.