My family knows. My friends know. He knows. Moving out after Christmas.
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Join Date: Jan 2016
Location: Northwest
Posts: 4,215
If you were to give in and delay until after Christmas, what kind of holiday would your children and you really have?
A self-pitying Daddy drunkathon in progress while you all tiptoe around trying to pretend everything’s fine?
I can tell you one thing, from my childhood: it isn’t the truth that messes kids up, it’s the “everything’s fine and we’re a happy family” lies. Kids know something isn’t right, they always do.
It’s math, really. If you stay just for the sake of the holiday, everyone is miserable. If you leave, at least your kids might have a happy holiday.
Sometimes there aren’t any good choices, just some that are slightly less awful than others.
Big hug.
A self-pitying Daddy drunkathon in progress while you all tiptoe around trying to pretend everything’s fine?
I can tell you one thing, from my childhood: it isn’t the truth that messes kids up, it’s the “everything’s fine and we’re a happy family” lies. Kids know something isn’t right, they always do.
It’s math, really. If you stay just for the sake of the holiday, everyone is miserable. If you leave, at least your kids might have a happy holiday.
Sometimes there aren’t any good choices, just some that are slightly less awful than others.
Big hug.
Member
Join Date: Jun 2019
Posts: 40
Oh FWN 
You really are doing a great job. I know it probably doesn’t feel like it to you right now, but you are. It’s so easy to lose perspective and focus when you’re in the thick of it all. There were so many times I questioned my own sanity, and wondered if I was blowing things out of proportion. And looking back now, that’s kind of exactly where AH wanted me. Off kilter and unsure, so I wouldn’t rock the boat and disrupt his comfortable routine. You’re exactly right when you say it’s his addict brain talking. It’s also his addict brain talking when he brings up your children and how they’ll be affected. That’s your soft spot, because you’re a mother... and if he can plant the seed that you are damaging your children and it takes root - maybe you won’t rock the boat.
In in my situation, as AH saw that I was actually serious and putting steps into action to separate, he spewed out a whole lot of craziness. Like yours, he asked who put the idea in my head, and he also accused me of cheating on him.. anything that would redirect the conversation away from his alcoholism and keep me off balance. It’s all deflection, and a desperate attempt to maintain status quo as he feels the tide starting to shift.
Keep on keepin on, FWN. We’re all here rooting for you!
You really are doing a great job. I know it probably doesn’t feel like it to you right now, but you are. It’s so easy to lose perspective and focus when you’re in the thick of it all. There were so many times I questioned my own sanity, and wondered if I was blowing things out of proportion. And looking back now, that’s kind of exactly where AH wanted me. Off kilter and unsure, so I wouldn’t rock the boat and disrupt his comfortable routine. You’re exactly right when you say it’s his addict brain talking. It’s also his addict brain talking when he brings up your children and how they’ll be affected. That’s your soft spot, because you’re a mother... and if he can plant the seed that you are damaging your children and it takes root - maybe you won’t rock the boat.
In in my situation, as AH saw that I was actually serious and putting steps into action to separate, he spewed out a whole lot of craziness. Like yours, he asked who put the idea in my head, and he also accused me of cheating on him.. anything that would redirect the conversation away from his alcoholism and keep me off balance. It’s all deflection, and a desperate attempt to maintain status quo as he feels the tide starting to shift.
Keep on keepin on, FWN. We’re all here rooting for you!
Sober since 10th April 2012
Join Date: Apr 2012
Location: Perth, Western Australia
Posts: 6,047
Originally Posted by fortworthnative 
I had this naive idea that everything would be fine with us until we left the day after Christmas but now I’m contemplating leaving this weekend and I feel like a terrible person.
And I’ll cancelling the Christmas party. He said he drank tonight because there was nothing he could do to stop me from leaving since I’d made up my mind and he may as well drink.
I cannot do this if this is what my next week and a half look like.
But I also don’t want to leave him alone on Christmas 😭
And I’ll cancelling the Christmas party. He said he drank tonight because there was nothing he could do to stop me from leaving since I’d made up my mind and he may as well drink.
I cannot do this if this is what my next week and a half look like.
But I also don’t want to leave him alone on Christmas 😭
Please take your focus off him and think about what's best for you and the kids re Christmas. He can always travel to you.
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Join Date: Aug 2011
Posts: 16,246
FWN...…..it is really hard to give up the idea that we have some control over their drinking. It is hard for it to soak in, for us, that they are going to drink...no matter what. That they will lie about it...no matter what. We forget that they will say anything...anything...when they are intoxicated....
We forget that normal logic does't apply when dealing with an active alcoholic....
Their brain is ALTERED by the alcohol....and the usual rules of relationships don't work....
No point in keep touching the stove to see if it is still hot....
It is best to keep your head in charge, right now...as your heart is still too vulnerable.
There comes a point when you just have to steel yourself and do what you know that you gotta do....
We forget that normal logic does't apply when dealing with an active alcoholic....
Their brain is ALTERED by the alcohol....and the usual rules of relationships don't work....
No point in keep touching the stove to see if it is still hot....
It is best to keep your head in charge, right now...as your heart is still too vulnerable.
There comes a point when you just have to steel yourself and do what you know that you gotta do....
Member
Join Date: Mar 2013
Location: Midwest
Posts: 11,481
At this moment, he claims he's drinking b/c he "may as well", b/c you're leaving. But did your presence get him to stop in all the years prior? No? Well, then, might you perhaps detect the rank odor of BS in this?
The day XAH moved out of my house was the Friday after Thanksgiving. I was working 2nd shift then, and so I was home during the morning, absolutely aware of him and a couple of his friends going up and down the stairs, removing (most of) his stuff from the upper flat where he'd moved a few months before that. I drew the curtains on that side of the house so at least I wouldn't have to see the proceedings even if I could clearly hear everything that was going on.
I was so sad I thought I'd die, and I was so scared I didn't know how I'd even get out the door to go to my job later in the day. I was working as a lab courier, so lots of time alone in a car, which was good, b/c I cried on and off all afternoon and evening.
When I got home, I saw I had an email from an Alanon member who I'd never met. She got my email off a phone list and wanted to know if I wanted to go to a meeting the next day. This happened "out of the blue"--or did it? I went to the meeting w/her and we took a long walk around the neighborhood afterwards. I found 2 yellow roses on the sidewalk and took them home w/me (I dried them and still have the flower parts as a remembrance).
The first post in this thread https://www.soberrecovery.com/forums...iar-patch.html (Moving Out of the Briar Patch) tells more about that first day and night after he was out of the house. The Universe gifted me w/such beauty and peace, it was really incredible. Of course I can't guarantee what your holiday will be like, but it might be worth taking the chance that you and your kids could have a similar experience. You already know what misery you're in for if you don't make a change.
For myself, I've found that the less I have expectations of a "Hallmark Christmas" or any variation of that, the more space I have to truly appreciate whatever comes my way that day. And actually, that goes for pretty much any day...
I feel for you, FWN. It's very, very hard, but it can be done.
The day XAH moved out of my house was the Friday after Thanksgiving. I was working 2nd shift then, and so I was home during the morning, absolutely aware of him and a couple of his friends going up and down the stairs, removing (most of) his stuff from the upper flat where he'd moved a few months before that. I drew the curtains on that side of the house so at least I wouldn't have to see the proceedings even if I could clearly hear everything that was going on.
I was so sad I thought I'd die, and I was so scared I didn't know how I'd even get out the door to go to my job later in the day. I was working as a lab courier, so lots of time alone in a car, which was good, b/c I cried on and off all afternoon and evening.
When I got home, I saw I had an email from an Alanon member who I'd never met. She got my email off a phone list and wanted to know if I wanted to go to a meeting the next day. This happened "out of the blue"--or did it? I went to the meeting w/her and we took a long walk around the neighborhood afterwards. I found 2 yellow roses on the sidewalk and took them home w/me (I dried them and still have the flower parts as a remembrance).
The first post in this thread https://www.soberrecovery.com/forums...iar-patch.html (Moving Out of the Briar Patch) tells more about that first day and night after he was out of the house. The Universe gifted me w/such beauty and peace, it was really incredible. Of course I can't guarantee what your holiday will be like, but it might be worth taking the chance that you and your kids could have a similar experience. You already know what misery you're in for if you don't make a change.
For myself, I've found that the less I have expectations of a "Hallmark Christmas" or any variation of that, the more space I have to truly appreciate whatever comes my way that day. And actually, that goes for pretty much any day...
I feel for you, FWN. It's very, very hard, but it can be done.
Member
Join Date: Feb 2013
Location: W Washington
Posts: 11,589
But I also don’t want to leave him alone on Christmas
who says he'll be alone? at the very least he'll have his buddy BOOZE with him. which he will drink whether you are there or not. he is drinking any day HE chooses. while you ARE there.
have you considered maybe he WANTS to be alone? so he skip right past trying to pretend like he's not drinking? even tho he has booze parked all over the place? and he won't have to keep trying to come up with excuses why he drinks? he isn't exactly putting up a fight..........is he?
who says he'll be alone? at the very least he'll have his buddy BOOZE with him. which he will drink whether you are there or not. he is drinking any day HE chooses. while you ARE there.
have you considered maybe he WANTS to be alone? so he skip right past trying to pretend like he's not drinking? even tho he has booze parked all over the place? and he won't have to keep trying to come up with excuses why he drinks? he isn't exactly putting up a fight..........is he?
Member
Join Date: Aug 2015
Location: Western US
Posts: 9,009
Originally Posted by AnvilheadII
But I also don’t want to leave him alone on Christmas
who says he'll be alone? at the very least he'll have his buddy BOOZE with him. which he will drink whether you are there or not. he is drinking any day HE chooses. while you ARE there.
have you considered maybe he WANTS to be alone? so he skip right past trying to pretend like he's not drinking? even tho he has booze parked all over the place? and he won't have to keep trying to come up with excuses why he drinks? he isn't exactly putting up a fight..........is he?
who says he'll be alone? at the very least he'll have his buddy BOOZE with him. which he will drink whether you are there or not. he is drinking any day HE chooses. while you ARE there.
have you considered maybe he WANTS to be alone? so he skip right past trying to pretend like he's not drinking? even tho he has booze parked all over the place? and he won't have to keep trying to come up with excuses why he drinks? he isn't exactly putting up a fight..........is he?
Member
Join Date: May 2010
Location: USA
Posts: 13,560
This. 100% this.....
Originally Posted by Seren
It seems to me that all he is talking about is what *you* are going to do and how it will affect the children. There doesn't seem to be any discussion of what he has already done to affect the children and how he plans to change things going forward to save the marriage.
Interesting....
Interesting....
Member
Join Date: Jun 2019
Posts: 63
What are you doing to your children? You're giving them the possibility of a future free from the trauma created by an alcoholic parent. The blame is all his. He caused his children to be uprooted from their neighborhood, friends, and school. But alcoholics can't accept the blame for the chaos they create.
Regardless, you will feel guilty in the coming weeks and months. Many of us do (in my case, did). Over time, the FOG (fear, obligation, guilt) will lift and you will see the situation much more clearly.....that of a husband and father who willingly chose a substance over his wife and children, and a mother strong and caring enough to extricate her kids from the madness. You are right in what you're doing. He is an alcoholic....delusional, selfish, weak, and self-absorbed. No need for guilt, now or ever. Stay strong and stay the course.
Regardless, you will feel guilty in the coming weeks and months. Many of us do (in my case, did). Over time, the FOG (fear, obligation, guilt) will lift and you will see the situation much more clearly.....that of a husband and father who willingly chose a substance over his wife and children, and a mother strong and caring enough to extricate her kids from the madness. You are right in what you're doing. He is an alcoholic....delusional, selfish, weak, and self-absorbed. No need for guilt, now or ever. Stay strong and stay the course.
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Join Date: Oct 2013
Posts: 11,431
I agree with others--this is a choice he has made, not you. You are following through on what is best for your kids in the long term.
If he really was concerned about their welfare above his own, he would move out and start intensive treatment. He wants it all--drink and family facade of normalcy.
Not fair to you or the kids.
When I had the same ultimatum--quit or lose my spouse, I chose my family and quit. He has choices, but just doesn't like them.
If he really was concerned about their welfare above his own, he would move out and start intensive treatment. He wants it all--drink and family facade of normalcy.
Not fair to you or the kids.
When I had the same ultimatum--quit or lose my spouse, I chose my family and quit. He has choices, but just doesn't like them.
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