Katchie

Was reading a sticking under Alcoholism titled Under the Influence. According to the writer the urge to drink cannot be helped and it's not just a problem of the mind but if the physical body too. I can kind of understand what they are saying but I seems like an alcoholic could use that as an excuse to continue drinking.
I also noticed that it seems to be an enzyme problem within the liver. I wonder why an alcoholic receives a new liver only to drink that liver and life away too?
Just thinking out loud!

lillamy

OK, so here's what I think that writer means (and I may be wrong):

Addiction is not just a problem of addiction in your head, it does have physical consequences. For example: I'm a recovering nicotine addict. When I was using nicotine, a few hours without the drug would make me shaky and nervous and irritable. When I quit, I would have trouble sleeping; I would get constipated; my body would be SCREAMING for That Cure That Was The Poison I Was Addicted To.

Did that mean my body drove me to the store for more nicotine, while my mind was saying "no, no, evil body, don't do this to me"?

Of course not. You still have control over your actions. The only thing "physical addiction" means is that it's really effing uncomfortable (sometimes dangerous) to NOT provide your body with a drug you've become addicted to. It sucks, plain and simple.

So of course addicts can use that as an excuse. I don't know how many times I have. As in "My boss is being a jerk and this project is so stressful I NEED JUST ONE CAN OF CHEW and then I'll quit when the project is over" or "This divorce is stressing me out and really, why would chew be so much worse than Xanax?" etc.

Addicts will FIND A REASON TO USE. If there isn't one, they'll make up one. You know the joke that alcoholics only drink on days than end in "y"? Yeah. That's about it. With all addictions. You use, and if someone asks, you make up a reason why.

The liver part is infuriating to me. I honestly do not understand why an actively drinking alcoholic would get a new liver. AXH (I still can't think about this without my blood pressure going up) actually said to me once that if his liver failed, he wasn't worried because I was the same blood type so he could just get part of mine. Yes. He actually said that. (I think it was about that time that I realized that I wasn't a human being to him but an object.)

caboblanco

sure it can be helped. helped by the alcoholic himself and thats it

dandylion

Katchie, I don't think it is the "excuse"---it is the REASON. It is real.

Also---By the time the alcoholic receives a new liver---the brain is well into the disease. Abstainence is the only thing that puts alcoholism into remission (abstainence plus a strong program that addresses the thinking, attitudes--and, eventually the behaviors that are part of the disease). Abstainence, alone, often just produces a "dry drunk".

dandylion

suki44883

From what I understand, an active alcoholic will not be given a new liver. The patient must have at least six months of continued sobriety before they will even be considered for a new liver.

Katchie

"Dry drunk"--now there's one to look up and understand! What in the world!!

spiderqueen

I know, right? It's like peeling (and eating) a damn onion. Raw. Crying and all.

How great that you are diving in, anyway. Keep it up!!

LightInside

Wow! That's one for the threads about quacking! Yikes!

I am a nurse and I learned in school that addicts are not allowed liver transplants unless they have been clean for a certain long period of time. This wasn't always true and I don't know if it's only true in the US or internationally.

Also, we can differentiate between physical and mental addiction. Marijuana is a drug that is supposedly not physically addictive the way that alcohol, opioids and nicotine are. People can get mentally addicted though, the same way we can become addicted to gambling, video games, shopping, etc. It's about the "reward" that our brain perceives from the behavior. Still, drugs that are physically addictive are mentally addictive too. I have heard of IV drug users who become addicted to the process of shooting up just as much as the physical high that follows. Sad, but true.

Hammer

Let me tune that up a bit.

Money works most anywhere. US or internationally.

Geezzzz, from China, you can get Custom Killed To Order Organs.

Hammer

Back to Katchie --

Since you seem to be stuck on thinking a bit too much, please understand there are various levels and drivers behind different A's or heavy drinkers.

There is not one cookie cutter answer cause, but we can dig into some of them.

Even back in 1939 when the AA Big Book was written, they separated cause agents along several lines. The "To Wives" Chapter covers four levels. (yeah, I know, I know. Chapter 8 is totally demeaning, written by Bill pretending to be Lois, and Bill is really a total douchebag. Got all that, we agree)

http://aa.org/bigbookonline/en_bigbook_chapt8.pdf

If you want to poke a little through that, we can move up to more advance fMRI brain scans, current addiction theory, and underlying Mental Disorders. Or not. All good.

NYCDoglvr

Alcoholism is a disease of the body, mind and spirit (not a disease of the elbow!).
Keep in mind that the American Medical Association classifies alcoholism as a mental illness.

I just celebrated 22 years of sobriety. "You can't change a pickle back to a cucumber" is a phrase I've heard in the rooms many times. As an alcoholic I can not drink today but once I pick up a drink I can't stop, have no control over how much I drink, blackouts and what I say or do. (That's what the first step means as "powerless")

However, I have a choice been drinking or not drinking today. I have a daily reprieve from alcoholism as long as I don't drink. A craving may turn up from time to time (very rarely for me) but I know it will pass and have tools to get through it. Someone said "you're either walking towards a drink or away from a drink" and it's true. So even though I'm sober two decades I'm still an alcoholic. Denial and rationalization are always perched on my shoulder. If I stop going to meetings my disease gets stronger and the odds are excellent I'll drink again. Alcoholics newly sober have the maturity of a ten year old kid. What we learn is that we are responsible for everything we do and say.
We grow up!

AnvilheadII

this^^^^^^^!!! times ten!

Katchie

Ya know, I've secretly wanted him to get an MRI since he's part owner of one...

fairlyuncertain

if alcoholism is a disease, i think it's probably like diabetes or heart disease. you can go down the road to dementia, amputations, passing out, scaring your family, continuing to smoke and eat awful food--or you can accept the challenge of self-care, and manage the condition, in good health. Maybe never 'normal,' and maybe despite best efforts, still suffering health consequences.

I think in each of those diseases, and alcoholism, the person w/the disease has a lot of free will to try to improve or worsen the situation. And all we can do is watch, and pray.

spiderqueen

Or decide not to watch.

tomsteve

"...but it seems like an alcoholic could use that as an excuse to continue drinking. "

and that's all it would be.

Katchie

I'm trying to learn not to watch, but pray fervently--to detach lovingly, in love & out of love for my AH, children as well as for myself. It appears to be Mt Everest in the distance, but I'm lacing up my hiking boots.