Intellectualising versus feeling
Member
Join Date: Aug 2010
Posts: 83
This is a hot topic for me too. I've also found myself at the therapist being pressed with how things make me feel and have find myself totally unable to put words to any of it.
I'm getting better at it, but also feel like its harder than ever. I grew up an only child and was always painfully shy. As I grew into adulthood I lacked self esteem because of it so I learned to go with the flow. If everyone else wanted to go to the mall then so did I. I never learned how to express my own needs and wants. Instead I was the girl that everyone liked because I was so easy to get along with.
I didn't realized how much of an impact this had until this past year in working with my therapist. In fact once I realized what an AH I had, I also realized how many of my needs and opinions had been suppressed.
Now with the separation and impending divorce. It's been really hard for me to separate what feelings I actually have from what I think I should be feeling, it makes me crazy.
For instance today I went to a museum and lunch with some new friends, had a very nice day and then boom the second I walked into my apartment I thought I was going to breakdown in tears thinking I was going to be alone for the rest of my life.
Now part of me is going come on give it a rest you just had a fabulous day and you've been alone all of 10 minutes suck it up and make yourself some dinner. Then there is another part of me that says of course your upset cry all you want your marriage is over, and soon you'll be 32, single and with no kids.
It all makes me feel very very bipolar, ugh.
I'm getting better at it, but also feel like its harder than ever. I grew up an only child and was always painfully shy. As I grew into adulthood I lacked self esteem because of it so I learned to go with the flow. If everyone else wanted to go to the mall then so did I. I never learned how to express my own needs and wants. Instead I was the girl that everyone liked because I was so easy to get along with.
I didn't realized how much of an impact this had until this past year in working with my therapist. In fact once I realized what an AH I had, I also realized how many of my needs and opinions had been suppressed.
Now with the separation and impending divorce. It's been really hard for me to separate what feelings I actually have from what I think I should be feeling, it makes me crazy.
For instance today I went to a museum and lunch with some new friends, had a very nice day and then boom the second I walked into my apartment I thought I was going to breakdown in tears thinking I was going to be alone for the rest of my life.
Now part of me is going come on give it a rest you just had a fabulous day and you've been alone all of 10 minutes suck it up and make yourself some dinner. Then there is another part of me that says of course your upset cry all you want your marriage is over, and soon you'll be 32, single and with no kids.
It all makes me feel very very bipolar, ugh.
Awakening
Join Date: Aug 2006
Location: Beautiful Texas hillcountry
Posts: 1,272
Originally Posted by sesh 
I believe most of you know about the whole ordeal I went through with my RAH in the last six months or so, and yet I almost feel nothing in regard to that too. I feel happy that he is doing well, that kids are relaxing, I feel empathy for his struggles, but in regard to me, what do I feel? NO idea. SO, I guess numb is right word for it.
Thanks and God bless us all,
Coyote
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Thread Starter
Join Date: Dec 2004
Location: europe
Posts: 624
Quite possible, coyote.
Last night when I went to bed, I was trying to think of some events in my childhood and remember the way I felt. I remembered an incident that often pops to my mind when I think of the worst things that happened to me when growing up. I think I was 12 at the time, and I was sitting with my friends at the door step of my home, and my AF came. He was staggering and had brown marks on his trousers as he evidently pooped himself. I remember sitting there, my friends around me, and I just froze, I was staring in one spot accross the yard, and everything around me became blurry, and I had cluntchy feeling in my stomach. He just passed by us and went in. Last night I was trying to figure out what was exactly that I was feeling in that moment , but nothing was coming to me. I guess I was ashamed as in that memory I'm well aware of the presence of my friends, and the way we all stopped talking. I'm thinking of all this and yet I'm not really feeling anything in particular. I'm even thinking something like OK so is that your worst memory, is that all you got?
I'm imagining myself on that door step, little girl I was and still nothing. Than I put my D's face on that girl and Oh, boy, the tears come and there was this sound coming out of me, like howling, and my chest is expanding, and I'm feeling wormth, and I can feel my muscles relaxing. And I want to run back to that girl and comfort her, and I say to her I'll take care of you, you can trust me, as I'm becoming aware she doesn't trust anyone or anything.
It was really powerful and painful. It makes me realize there is so much more there that I need to address, search through my memories and give some comfort to the person I was at that time. Imagining it was my D instead of me is doing a trick for me. It is teaching me that I shoud care for myself the way I care for my kids. ANyways I think I'm on to something here.
Another thing was brought to my attention with this memory. After the incident in the yard eventually I went in. Nothing there was out of the ordinary. No one was saying anything, anything at all. No one said: Come on this is crazy. A father of the child is not to come home barely able to walk with pants pooped. Which is making me realize that is probably the main reason I never failed to react to my RAH to any of the crazy sh1t he used to pull. I guess I was sufocated with that silance of my childhood that when I was older I simply had to make a huge fuss over RAH's drunken behaviour. Each time I did everything I could possibly think of to prove what he's doing is crazy, unacceptable, horrible, ofensive, disrespectful, unloving, selfish, hurtful, (OMG, I could go forever with this list).
SO, I think this has made me realize few important things. I wish I could say I feel better this morning but I'm afraid I think I feel worse. But maybe that is good thing, a sign that I have started this process, and that I'm one step closer to healing.
Last night when I went to bed, I was trying to think of some events in my childhood and remember the way I felt. I remembered an incident that often pops to my mind when I think of the worst things that happened to me when growing up. I think I was 12 at the time, and I was sitting with my friends at the door step of my home, and my AF came. He was staggering and had brown marks on his trousers as he evidently pooped himself. I remember sitting there, my friends around me, and I just froze, I was staring in one spot accross the yard, and everything around me became blurry, and I had cluntchy feeling in my stomach. He just passed by us and went in. Last night I was trying to figure out what was exactly that I was feeling in that moment , but nothing was coming to me. I guess I was ashamed as in that memory I'm well aware of the presence of my friends, and the way we all stopped talking. I'm thinking of all this and yet I'm not really feeling anything in particular. I'm even thinking something like OK so is that your worst memory, is that all you got?
I'm imagining myself on that door step, little girl I was and still nothing. Than I put my D's face on that girl and Oh, boy, the tears come and there was this sound coming out of me, like howling, and my chest is expanding, and I'm feeling wormth, and I can feel my muscles relaxing. And I want to run back to that girl and comfort her, and I say to her I'll take care of you, you can trust me, as I'm becoming aware she doesn't trust anyone or anything.
It was really powerful and painful. It makes me realize there is so much more there that I need to address, search through my memories and give some comfort to the person I was at that time. Imagining it was my D instead of me is doing a trick for me. It is teaching me that I shoud care for myself the way I care for my kids. ANyways I think I'm on to something here.
Another thing was brought to my attention with this memory. After the incident in the yard eventually I went in. Nothing there was out of the ordinary. No one was saying anything, anything at all. No one said: Come on this is crazy. A father of the child is not to come home barely able to walk with pants pooped. Which is making me realize that is probably the main reason I never failed to react to my RAH to any of the crazy sh1t he used to pull. I guess I was sufocated with that silance of my childhood that when I was older I simply had to make a huge fuss over RAH's drunken behaviour. Each time I did everything I could possibly think of to prove what he's doing is crazy, unacceptable, horrible, ofensive, disrespectful, unloving, selfish, hurtful, (OMG, I could go forever with this list).
SO, I think this has made me realize few important things. I wish I could say I feel better this morning but I'm afraid I think I feel worse. But maybe that is good thing, a sign that I have started this process, and that I'm one step closer to healing.
Member
Join Date: May 2010
Posts: 1,057
Sesh, that was pretty powerful. Pretty amazing and wonderful really. You were able to do for yourself what I had to figure out how to do from the pages of a book -- face the reality, let your little girl (child self) feel, and then let your adult self take care of your little girl. Those painful memories are hard to face. Keep letting your child self express her feelings and let your adult self comfort and promise to take care of her (you). Thanks for sharing that with us. Hugs and peace to you.
Member
Join Date: Feb 2009
Posts: 2,059
after reading your sharing, sesh, i feel gratitude. i feel sad but in a good way. i feel encouraged.
someone once said to me that sadness, channelled properly though the emotional body, is a healing energy. i thought about that idea for a long time, trying to understand it because it rang true to me somehow but didn't fit in my logical mind.
i think i'm beginning to understand now.
sesh, my therapist always encourages me to assign the reciprical roles when new insight arises. from what you've shared, perhaps these are some new ones for you to consider....
traumatised <------> silenced, mute
traumatised <------> indignent
someone once said to me that sadness, channelled properly though the emotional body, is a healing energy. i thought about that idea for a long time, trying to understand it because it rang true to me somehow but didn't fit in my logical mind.
i think i'm beginning to understand now.
sesh, my therapist always encourages me to assign the reciprical roles when new insight arises. from what you've shared, perhaps these are some new ones for you to consider....
traumatised <------> silenced, mute
traumatised <------> indignent
Member
Join Date: Jul 2010
Posts: 143
i really appreciate this thread. thank you for saying how you look at your inner child as your D, that will help me a lot with my own healing. i have a hard time looking back at myself and feeling anything, but imagining her going through that tears me to shreds.
Member
Thread Starter
Join Date: Dec 2004
Location: europe
Posts: 624
I'm so glad that many of you is finding this thread helpful, as much as I do.
I'm feeling very positive today. It feels like I've started yet another important stage of my recovery. As to be honest I was feeling stuck for awhile (and unwilling to admit it to myself).
This discussion has brought me the revelation that I don't have to be strong and fearless all the time, that I can be weak, explore it and still move farward. That I really don't have to do anything but stay true to myself. HP issue is very important, and yet I constantly keep forgetting about it.
Naive I agree with you in what you said about sadness, that when channelled properly though the emotional body, is a healing energy. As in my mind, it is opposed to anger, which I take as fighting back, not accepting the reality for what it is. Sadness to me feels like the way to accept the reality for what it is, a path to peace.
missb89, imagining my D insted of me was a great start up point for me, but since yesterday I was acctually able to think of myself when young and feel things, that is a great break through for me. MIke (DesertEyes) suggested a great excercise for inner child in another thread that I'm finding most helpful, I think you might like to read it, here is a link:
http://www.soberrecovery.com/forums/...-now-what.html
Naive, the new reciprical roles you suggested sound right too, I'm trying to think of another ones but it is not happening yet, but I'll keep thinking about it. Thanks.
Also, I'd like to invite you all to share here some of your childhood memories and the way you felt than, so we can take this journey together, as I think we could all benefit from this kind of sharing. I don't think this thread should necesseraly be only about me. So don't feel like you hijacking, just go ahead and share.
I'm feeling very positive today. It feels like I've started yet another important stage of my recovery. As to be honest I was feeling stuck for awhile (and unwilling to admit it to myself).
This discussion has brought me the revelation that I don't have to be strong and fearless all the time, that I can be weak, explore it and still move farward. That I really don't have to do anything but stay true to myself. HP issue is very important, and yet I constantly keep forgetting about it.
Naive I agree with you in what you said about sadness, that when channelled properly though the emotional body, is a healing energy. As in my mind, it is opposed to anger, which I take as fighting back, not accepting the reality for what it is. Sadness to me feels like the way to accept the reality for what it is, a path to peace.
missb89, imagining my D insted of me was a great start up point for me, but since yesterday I was acctually able to think of myself when young and feel things, that is a great break through for me. MIke (DesertEyes) suggested a great excercise for inner child in another thread that I'm finding most helpful, I think you might like to read it, here is a link:
http://www.soberrecovery.com/forums/...-now-what.html
Naive, the new reciprical roles you suggested sound right too, I'm trying to think of another ones but it is not happening yet, but I'll keep thinking about it. Thanks.
Also, I'd like to invite you all to share here some of your childhood memories and the way you felt than, so we can take this journey together, as I think we could all benefit from this kind of sharing. I don't think this thread should necesseraly be only about me. So don't feel like you hijacking, just go ahead and share.
To thine own self be true.
Join Date: May 2009
Location: U.S.A.
Posts: 5,924
I used to be the most emotional person I ever met. My feelings would get hurt very easily, which led me to believe that I was very in touch with them. Lately, though, I have begun to think that the emotional part of me is actually out of balance. Now I think I am actually kind of emotionally dull or numb, out of touch with my feelings. Or something. Like I don't know what they really are. I think I was just so very reactive for so very long, that I THOUGHT I was emotionally healthy whereas everybody else seemed so emotionally dead. Who knew that I was the one out of whack? LOL
I do know from practice though that my emotions tend to follow my thoughts. I trained myself how to regulate my emotions by regulating my thoughts. I certainly am a novice at it, and am not the first to do this. I was looking for more info about it related to Eastern religions a few months ago but I did not get very far. I know people who do karate are trained in this. Not sure how it works.
I don't think you necessarily need to remember horrible things and cry about them. Try watching a really sad movie just to get your feelings out. I don't think you need to express yourself in words just to get those feelings out. Someone else on another post (I think it was Naive??) suggested that I move when I feel anger. So maybe take up physical exercise like running.
One thing is for sure, emotions are tied to the breath. If you want to release those pent-up emotions, go to yoga. Especially if you want to cry. When I haven't practiced yoga in a while, once I start back up, I will just sob thru the first session or two. It's funny to me now because I know what is going on. For others it might be a little scary the first time it happens but it's just the breath. Very cleansing.
I do know from practice though that my emotions tend to follow my thoughts. I trained myself how to regulate my emotions by regulating my thoughts. I certainly am a novice at it, and am not the first to do this. I was looking for more info about it related to Eastern religions a few months ago but I did not get very far. I know people who do karate are trained in this. Not sure how it works.
What do I need to do? I wish I could remember all horrible things and cry about it, but I can't.
Have I gone numb or frozen, or what is exactly going on here? Is it fear or is it that I didn't really forgive my self, even though I think I did. IDK.
What do you think of this?
Have I gone numb or frozen, or what is exactly going on here? Is it fear or is it that I didn't really forgive my self, even though I think I did. IDK.
What do you think of this?
One thing is for sure, emotions are tied to the breath. If you want to release those pent-up emotions, go to yoga. Especially if you want to cry. When I haven't practiced yoga in a while, once I start back up, I will just sob thru the first session or two. It's funny to me now because I know what is going on. For others it might be a little scary the first time it happens but it's just the breath. Very cleansing.
Member
Join Date: Dec 2009
Location: -
Posts: 118
Sesh,
I really appreciate this thread. I have had an opportunity to visit with my Dad. It has brought up so much anxiety and fear. I realized its all from little me. I have had opportunities to love on her, and I see where in the past I allowed my Dad to bowl me over.
For little me I think I need to create better boundaries and learn to stick up for myself. In the present there really is no reason to fear my father.
I really appreciate the challenge of thinking about my inner children.
Thank you.
I really appreciate this thread. I have had an opportunity to visit with my Dad. It has brought up so much anxiety and fear. I realized its all from little me. I have had opportunities to love on her, and I see where in the past I allowed my Dad to bowl me over.
For little me I think I need to create better boundaries and learn to stick up for myself. In the present there really is no reason to fear my father.
I really appreciate the challenge of thinking about my inner children.
Thank you.
Member
Thread Starter
Join Date: Dec 2004
Location: europe
Posts: 624
Hi L2L,
I agree the breathing is very important, and I do agree with all other things you said, but in regard to my emotions following my thoughts, I thought I was doing that too, but it turned out I wasn't as succesful at it, as I liked to think. I rationalized too much. I learned logical solutions/explainations to each of my problems, and tried to follow with my emotions, but now I'm realizing it was more what I liked to think I was feeling than what my actual feelings were. maybe I wasn't really there on the spiritual level so much, maybe that kind of thing would have made a greater difference. IDK.
But the things is, in the past I was able to vent my emotions by watching a sad movie or listening to a sad song, or do some meditation or deep breathing, but this time none of it was helpful. I was too numb, didn't feel almost anything in regard to anything, the world, the life on the rational level (intellectually) made perfect sense, but yet I kept feeling like I'm having some kind of quiet nervous break down. I know the reason for this now is not the incidents that happened with my AF when I was a child, but the recent events with my RAH, but I understood the only way to break from that rational, intellectual approach to the whole mess is to dive deep into that emotions at the first moment in my life when I started surpressing them. I believe if I keep caring for my inner child, that girl that felt so lonely and scared, I will slowly learn that I am trully able to care for myself, and in time address the recent issues as well.
I feel there is this knot inside of me, and I just want to untangle it and be able to feel things again. (as for now my most honest thought/feeling to everything bad that is happening is: well, that's life).
When I say: well few months ago, when my RAH went to hospital with liver cirrhosis, and the docs told me he is not likely to survive, and than he had DT and run away from the hospital, and frieds found him the next morning wondering the streets, all wet, and bruised, and his clothes torn, shaking, barely able to speak, and than I took him to psyhiatric clinic, and... I want to feel how terrible all of that really was, as at that point I have shut down, and I've been numb ever since, and that numbness has me by my troath right now, and I feel if I don't deal with it some time soon, it will just break me.
So I guess revisting my childhood memories, and learning how to care for my inner child, I am really only finally learning how to care for myself and love myself. IDK, it is working for now, and I'm so grateful for it. I just hope it will keep working for me in the future too, as I'm learning lately I'm a really quick learner but I have tendency to forget things even quicker (and round and round in circles I go) - or maybe that is just typical for early recovery, IDK.
I agree the breathing is very important, and I do agree with all other things you said, but in regard to my emotions following my thoughts, I thought I was doing that too, but it turned out I wasn't as succesful at it, as I liked to think. I rationalized too much. I learned logical solutions/explainations to each of my problems, and tried to follow with my emotions, but now I'm realizing it was more what I liked to think I was feeling than what my actual feelings were. maybe I wasn't really there on the spiritual level so much, maybe that kind of thing would have made a greater difference. IDK.
But the things is, in the past I was able to vent my emotions by watching a sad movie or listening to a sad song, or do some meditation or deep breathing, but this time none of it was helpful. I was too numb, didn't feel almost anything in regard to anything, the world, the life on the rational level (intellectually) made perfect sense, but yet I kept feeling like I'm having some kind of quiet nervous break down. I know the reason for this now is not the incidents that happened with my AF when I was a child, but the recent events with my RAH, but I understood the only way to break from that rational, intellectual approach to the whole mess is to dive deep into that emotions at the first moment in my life when I started surpressing them. I believe if I keep caring for my inner child, that girl that felt so lonely and scared, I will slowly learn that I am trully able to care for myself, and in time address the recent issues as well.
I feel there is this knot inside of me, and I just want to untangle it and be able to feel things again. (as for now my most honest thought/feeling to everything bad that is happening is: well, that's life).
When I say: well few months ago, when my RAH went to hospital with liver cirrhosis, and the docs told me he is not likely to survive, and than he had DT and run away from the hospital, and frieds found him the next morning wondering the streets, all wet, and bruised, and his clothes torn, shaking, barely able to speak, and than I took him to psyhiatric clinic, and... I want to feel how terrible all of that really was, as at that point I have shut down, and I've been numb ever since, and that numbness has me by my troath right now, and I feel if I don't deal with it some time soon, it will just break me.
So I guess revisting my childhood memories, and learning how to care for my inner child, I am really only finally learning how to care for myself and love myself. IDK, it is working for now, and I'm so grateful for it. I just hope it will keep working for me in the future too, as I'm learning lately I'm a really quick learner but I have tendency to forget things even quicker (and round and round in circles I go) - or maybe that is just typical for early recovery, IDK.
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