I've been thinking
Member
Thread Starter
Join Date: Jun 2008
Location: Great Lake Country
Posts: 333
I've been thinking
I'd like to thank everyone for their input on my problems with the AW. I am at the situration now where I do realize that I have to make choices for my own life.
The question I have for all of you, is how did you work up the courage to do the things you had to do? In my analysis of my feelings, I guess I'm frozen in indecision because of al the messy feelings that are going to come out of changing my life. Please take the following as a compliment. How did several of you become such hard nosed people? I really need a dose of that in my personality.
Redd
The question I have for all of you, is how did you work up the courage to do the things you had to do? In my analysis of my feelings, I guess I'm frozen in indecision because of al the messy feelings that are going to come out of changing my life. Please take the following as a compliment. How did several of you become such hard nosed people? I really need a dose of that in my personality.
Redd
Member
Join Date: Feb 2008
Location: Kansas
Posts: 10,182
There was no magic formula for me, Redd. It was a matter of saving my life because I was literally losing my sanity.
The fear of going insane by staying where I was outweighed anything else in my mind.
If you wait for the courage, you may very well be there the rest of your life. That's just my personal experience.
The fear of going insane by staying where I was outweighed anything else in my mind.
If you wait for the courage, you may very well be there the rest of your life. That's just my personal experience.
Member
Join Date: Nov 2008
Location: British Columbia, Canada
Posts: 92
I don't know that I actually became hard-nosed. I just kept complaining about not being happy and wanting him to make changes or leave (not really wanting him to choose the option of leaving) and he decided to leave one day. Then you just deal with the grieving and rely on good friends, meetings, counsellors. One step in front of the other until you come out the other side. It hasn't been easy and all my friends were telling me that one day I would feel better, but I didn't believe them. This week it has been 6 months since he left and I have to say that I finally am starting to feel better.
I wouldn't recommend my method of just waiting until the other person takes action. I think it's easier to do the leaving if you can. Then you are coming from more of a position of strength and decision. Even though I initiated the leaving, the fact is that he moved out and I stayed and it felt like he'd left me. I think it feels alot different and better to be the one to leave. I'd never do it the way I did it again. But that's just me.
I wouldn't recommend my method of just waiting until the other person takes action. I think it's easier to do the leaving if you can. Then you are coming from more of a position of strength and decision. Even though I initiated the leaving, the fact is that he moved out and I stayed and it felt like he'd left me. I think it feels alot different and better to be the one to leave. I'd never do it the way I did it again. But that's just me.
Member
Join Date: Nov 2008
Location: My side of the street
Posts: 15
Redd:
I've found that if I think about all the things in the future that could get messy, etc. I remain frozen in place.
Instead I concentrate on just One Day At A Time. Sometimes even that is too much and I focus on a 1/2 day or maybe even just one hour. That way my mind doesn't get full of dread for the future.
Just do the right thing for you for today. Then do that again tomorrow. And when your mind gets off course and fills with all the "what if's" for the future try to remember, we only live one breath at a time.
Also, Alanon has literally saved my life.
Kaye
I've found that if I think about all the things in the future that could get messy, etc. I remain frozen in place.
Instead I concentrate on just One Day At A Time. Sometimes even that is too much and I focus on a 1/2 day or maybe even just one hour. That way my mind doesn't get full of dread for the future.
Just do the right thing for you for today. Then do that again tomorrow. And when your mind gets off course and fills with all the "what if's" for the future try to remember, we only live one breath at a time.
Also, Alanon has literally saved my life.
Kaye
Member
Join Date: Apr 2007
Location: Seattle, WA
Posts: 3,335
It's analysis paralysis. Don't think. Just do.
Funny choice of words - hard nosed. Why is it hardnosed to make self-preservation the priority in your life? Without sanity and stability in my life, I have nothing.
Funny choice of words - hard nosed. Why is it hardnosed to make self-preservation the priority in your life? Without sanity and stability in my life, I have nothing.
Occasional poor taste poster
Join Date: Jul 2005
Posts: 2,542
Everyone has their own situation. In my case my father was a mean and nasty drunk back when I was a teenager so I had no desire to live through that again. Plus, I once struggled with a nasty addiction myself so I knew what to expect from an addict in denial doing what ever to maintain that addiction. PLUS.... I have two sons from a previous marriage and no way was I going to subject them to what I had to live with back when I was a teenager. M got her fair chances at getting sober, but my resolve was firm. On the third strike she was out. Was I hard nosed? You bet I was.
We each do what we do for our own reasons. Not all leave, not all stay, each situation is different, but we all go through the same thing.
We each do what we do for our own reasons. Not all leave, not all stay, each situation is different, but we all go through the same thing.
Member
Join Date: Nov 2008
Location: southern ohio
Posts: 7
I'm not hardnosed. That's the problem. I'm soft as mush and everyday i wake up wanting to go back to the security of "being in control". Eventhough I wasn't in control. I felt like if i did enough, loved him enough, was worthy enough, he'd realize. I came to the conclusion (after lurking here for a few weeks) that maybe he did think i was worthy enough. Maybe he didn't think HE was worthy enough. And i realized i couldn't DO ANYTHING ABOUT THAT! NOTHING! I also realized that by enabling him i was accomplishing two terrible tasks.
1. I was cushioning him from the ramifications of his own decisions. Be they good or bad. Ramifications are what help us learn and grow. I was in essence stifling him.
2. I was making him feel worse about himself by showing him that i could handle everything, and he couldn't. The only way he will learn to handle his life is if HE does it.
And then i made the hardest decision i've ever made. No contact. It's difficult. You know how an alcoholic wake up thinking about the bottle and thinks about that constantly? That's me. He's my bottle. Or rather, our relationship as it was is my bottle. I still have to fight off the need to call and offer myself up.
1. I was cushioning him from the ramifications of his own decisions. Be they good or bad. Ramifications are what help us learn and grow. I was in essence stifling him.
2. I was making him feel worse about himself by showing him that i could handle everything, and he couldn't. The only way he will learn to handle his life is if HE does it.
And then i made the hardest decision i've ever made. No contact. It's difficult. You know how an alcoholic wake up thinking about the bottle and thinks about that constantly? That's me. He's my bottle. Or rather, our relationship as it was is my bottle. I still have to fight off the need to call and offer myself up.
Awakening
Join Date: Aug 2006
Location: Beautiful Texas hillcountry
Posts: 1,272
analysis paralysis......I like that a lot!
Redd, I didn't have the courage to leave either. My Hp did for me what I couldn't do for myself. CPS judge put my wife out of the house, that gave me a practice run being a single dad.
Then the CPS dept told me if I allowed XAW back home after rehab, and she relapsed (dep on where you look, statistically 93-97% DO relapse) they'd remove DD from BOTH of us.
That conversation made my decision pretty easy. Save an adult who doesn't WANT to be saved, or save a 5 yo little girl.
Hp has also shown me over and over (though XAW's actions) that I absolutely did the right thing. It's EASY to see that now from where I stand today. Not so much 2 years ago.
I guess it boils down to a leap of faith. "I" know you will be O.K.. That is easy for me to see from over here.
I do know how you feel. I was paralyzed with fear. Today I'm O.K.
For me, once I got away from the daily drama and chaos, (a drunk was no longer living with me). I was able to SEE exactly how BAD it had really gotten. Things were WAY worse that I'd realized. That realization helped me "get over" the bad/sad feelings. I was like DAMN! I got MAD, that helped a lot.
My ONLY regret is staying so long. I've seen others post that as well.
That 5 min conversation with the CPS supervisor was MY bottom.
I feel like Alanon saved my life also. There's a lot of love and understanding there. Like here only f2f with real live hugs. I was never a hugger before. If I wasn't sleeping w/you, I wasn't hugging you. Boy was I missing out. There's one gal in my home group, when she hugs you, you can FEEL the transference of energy. That's good stuff.
I just don't think you're ready yet Redd. :sorry I think you need more evidence, more research! That's more pain. But don't worry. When you've had enough, NOTHING/NO ONE will be able to stop you. You'll know with every fiber of your being.
Thanks and God bless us all, :praying
Coyote
Redd, I didn't have the courage to leave either. My Hp did for me what I couldn't do for myself. CPS judge put my wife out of the house, that gave me a practice run being a single dad.
Then the CPS dept told me if I allowed XAW back home after rehab, and she relapsed (dep on where you look, statistically 93-97% DO relapse) they'd remove DD from BOTH of us.
That conversation made my decision pretty easy. Save an adult who doesn't WANT to be saved, or save a 5 yo little girl.
Hp has also shown me over and over (though XAW's actions) that I absolutely did the right thing. It's EASY to see that now from where I stand today. Not so much 2 years ago.
I guess it boils down to a leap of faith. "I" know you will be O.K.. That is easy for me to see from over here.
I do know how you feel. I was paralyzed with fear. Today I'm O.K.
For me, once I got away from the daily drama and chaos, (a drunk was no longer living with me). I was able to SEE exactly how BAD it had really gotten. Things were WAY worse that I'd realized. That realization helped me "get over" the bad/sad feelings. I was like DAMN! I got MAD, that helped a lot.
My ONLY regret is staying so long. I've seen others post that as well.
That 5 min conversation with the CPS supervisor was MY bottom.
I feel like Alanon saved my life also. There's a lot of love and understanding there. Like here only f2f with real live hugs. I was never a hugger before. If I wasn't sleeping w/you, I wasn't hugging you. Boy was I missing out. There's one gal in my home group, when she hugs you, you can FEEL the transference of energy. That's good stuff.
I just don't think you're ready yet Redd. :sorry I think you need more evidence, more research! That's more pain. But don't worry. When you've had enough, NOTHING/NO ONE will be able to stop you. You'll know with every fiber of your being.
Thanks and God bless us all, :praying
Coyote
Member
Join Date: Jun 2007
Location: Arlington, VA
Posts: 4,290
I finally realized that I was slowly dieing inside and had to get out. It was one of the hardest things I ever did, especially since I did not warn xAH before I left, but I know it was the best thing for me and my sons.
Belgian Sheepdog Adictee
Join Date: Apr 2004
Location: In Today
Posts: 6,101
How did I get to the point of no more? Hmmmmmmm
I too had suffered from addiction and I had found recovery. My husband found a recovery of sorts, and decided that gambling would take the place of his alcoholism and it got bad, real bad. Yes I had to hide everything, money, anything that he could take to the pawn shop, try and pay the bills with no help and I reached the point of not wanting the insanity any longer. I couldn't worry about what tomorrow would bring, I was in H*ll right now.
I knew, that there would be pain, grief of the loss of the person I thought I loved, but I had support there, both in AA and Alanon. I wanted the rest of my life. If I stayed I would not have a life, I would continue to have the H8LL.
So.........................I went to an attorney. I found a new place to live that would take my dogs, I contacted folks in the programs that could help and who had pick up trucks and I moved............................while he was once again at the casino.
The after affects, thed pain, the grief, yep it was all there, and at times I questioned myself, but all I had to do was sit and 'listen' in my quiet house, no yelling, no lies, no excuses, yes it was worth it and as I worked through the grief and the 'what ifs' and all the other bull, I believe to this day it made me a better person.
You too can do this. Never, ever let FEAR hold you back from anything that will enrich your life.
J M H O
Love and hugs,
I too had suffered from addiction and I had found recovery. My husband found a recovery of sorts, and decided that gambling would take the place of his alcoholism and it got bad, real bad. Yes I had to hide everything, money, anything that he could take to the pawn shop, try and pay the bills with no help and I reached the point of not wanting the insanity any longer. I couldn't worry about what tomorrow would bring, I was in H*ll right now.
I knew, that there would be pain, grief of the loss of the person I thought I loved, but I had support there, both in AA and Alanon. I wanted the rest of my life. If I stayed I would not have a life, I would continue to have the H8LL.
So.........................I went to an attorney. I found a new place to live that would take my dogs, I contacted folks in the programs that could help and who had pick up trucks and I moved............................while he was once again at the casino.
The after affects, thed pain, the grief, yep it was all there, and at times I questioned myself, but all I had to do was sit and 'listen' in my quiet house, no yelling, no lies, no excuses, yes it was worth it and as I worked through the grief and the 'what ifs' and all the other bull, I believe to this day it made me a better person.
You too can do this. Never, ever let FEAR hold you back from anything that will enrich your life.
J M H O
Love and hugs,
Member
Join Date: Jan 2006
Location: Los Angeles, CA
Posts: 5,075
In one week I went crying from the doctor's office, to xAH's therapist's office, to Al Anon for 90 in 90 and then to my first meeting with my own therapist. Crying, crying, crying.
Everyone helped me through the first days of the tough realities and decisions. As I made good and healthy choices for me - but extremely painful ones - I became more confident I was doing the right thing. I felt BETTER. I went through an extremely nasty divorce trial for 2 years and I stil felt BETTER than I had felt in the last 5 years of my marriage.
I can be hard-nosed but I have a soft heart and the occasional soft head so I reach out for support.
Good luck, Redd!
Everyone helped me through the first days of the tough realities and decisions. As I made good and healthy choices for me - but extremely painful ones - I became more confident I was doing the right thing. I felt BETTER. I went through an extremely nasty divorce trial for 2 years and I stil felt BETTER than I had felt in the last 5 years of my marriage.
I can be hard-nosed but I have a soft heart and the occasional soft head so I reach out for support.
Good luck, Redd!
Member
Join Date: Jan 2008
Location: Hertfordshire, UK
Posts: 111
To me, it's not a matter of being "hard-nosed". It's a matter of realising that my own health and happiness are both important and no-one's responsibility but mine. I had unwittingly placed my happiness in the hands of my AGF and that was a really dumb place to put it. She didn't have my best interests at heart. All the time I was sitting there, trying to persuade her to stop drinking so we could even have a chance of fixing our relationship, I was leaving her in control of my life and, quite honestly, she's not even in control of her own life so she's got no place being in control of mine.
The night I told her it was finally over was the moment when I wrested back control over what happened to me. It was scary as anything, but it was also liberating. No matter what the future held it could not be worse than what I was living through at the time. If nothing else, at least it would be different. I needed that because I couldn't continue to live my life with someone who regarded a cheap bottle of wine as more attractive and important to her than I was. I'm worth more than that.
I'm about two and half years out, now. As we've got young children together it's been a rocky ride so far as I have to maintain contact with her and the conflict over the children has been intense at times. If I could have just walked away and never had any further contact with the woman it would've been a hell of a lot easier. But that's something that's obvious to me only in hindsight; at the time I was much more willing to maintain a degree of contact and involvement that turned out to be unhealthy. Meh. What's done is done. She's still drinking, my contact with her is as minimal as I can possibly arrange, my children live full-time with me, and my life is good. Most importantly, my life is mine to control.
Mr B.
The night I told her it was finally over was the moment when I wrested back control over what happened to me. It was scary as anything, but it was also liberating. No matter what the future held it could not be worse than what I was living through at the time. If nothing else, at least it would be different. I needed that because I couldn't continue to live my life with someone who regarded a cheap bottle of wine as more attractive and important to her than I was. I'm worth more than that.
I'm about two and half years out, now. As we've got young children together it's been a rocky ride so far as I have to maintain contact with her and the conflict over the children has been intense at times. If I could have just walked away and never had any further contact with the woman it would've been a hell of a lot easier. But that's something that's obvious to me only in hindsight; at the time I was much more willing to maintain a degree of contact and involvement that turned out to be unhealthy. Meh. What's done is done. She's still drinking, my contact with her is as minimal as I can possibly arrange, my children live full-time with me, and my life is good. Most importantly, my life is mine to control.
Mr B.
Member
Join Date: Apr 2008
Posts: 282
I waited until I got dumped. I was so twisted from living with a A for so many yeasr and I thought I was making lemonade with all the lemons but it wasn't the case.
I was just existing and waiting for him to change.Whatever I tried to change about myself was never good enough for him or he just didn't care. I could have been perfect and it wouldn't have mattered. I couldn't figure out why but now I know its because you can't change yourself to please someone else, especially an addict.
there were many times I wanted us to be over but I really wanted him to wake up and be a man instead of a 12 year old boy in a man's body. I went over every scenario in my mind day after day and I NEVER found a way out of the chaos and lies.
The only way out would have been to leave, or to make him leave and I was not successful at doing either. He made the decision to leave when he found someone who would accept his lifestyle. I was getting sick of it and stopped enabling little by little and he left.
I didn't want him to just drop me and leave me with all the bills and all the confusion but that's how it happened. As bad as it was it has made me have to stand up and take care of myself. At first i didn't know how but I am learning little by little. Maybe my HP knew that I would never make a move so it was made for me. I don't know. I guess my X did me a favor but looking back I sometimes wish I had the stones to be the one that ended it.
If he hadn't left me I don't know that I ever would have forced him to go. It sucks when you love an addict. I can say I still love him as a person and wish he would get better but it's not so we can be together because that can never be possible.
I'm a different person now as is he. We have gone on two different directions. I have fought to move forward and he has taken a nose dive into insanity.
I know it must be very hard for you but when you take away all the reasons why you can't leave, I remember you had some financial reasons. what is left?
Can you count on anything besides being hurt and lied to?
Do you become stressed when you know she is drinking?
Do you KNOW in your heart that this won't resolve itself?
I think you are getting close Redd. Hang in there and do what you KNOW is right. The really frightening thing is usually the right one. Things may work out much differently than you think they will.
I was just existing and waiting for him to change.Whatever I tried to change about myself was never good enough for him or he just didn't care. I could have been perfect and it wouldn't have mattered. I couldn't figure out why but now I know its because you can't change yourself to please someone else, especially an addict.
there were many times I wanted us to be over but I really wanted him to wake up and be a man instead of a 12 year old boy in a man's body. I went over every scenario in my mind day after day and I NEVER found a way out of the chaos and lies.
The only way out would have been to leave, or to make him leave and I was not successful at doing either. He made the decision to leave when he found someone who would accept his lifestyle. I was getting sick of it and stopped enabling little by little and he left.
I didn't want him to just drop me and leave me with all the bills and all the confusion but that's how it happened. As bad as it was it has made me have to stand up and take care of myself. At first i didn't know how but I am learning little by little. Maybe my HP knew that I would never make a move so it was made for me. I don't know. I guess my X did me a favor but looking back I sometimes wish I had the stones to be the one that ended it.
If he hadn't left me I don't know that I ever would have forced him to go. It sucks when you love an addict. I can say I still love him as a person and wish he would get better but it's not so we can be together because that can never be possible.
I'm a different person now as is he. We have gone on two different directions. I have fought to move forward and he has taken a nose dive into insanity.
I know it must be very hard for you but when you take away all the reasons why you can't leave, I remember you had some financial reasons. what is left?
Can you count on anything besides being hurt and lied to?
Do you become stressed when you know she is drinking?
Do you KNOW in your heart that this won't resolve itself?
I think you are getting close Redd. Hang in there and do what you KNOW is right. The really frightening thing is usually the right one. Things may work out much differently than you think they will.
Member
Join Date: Sep 2008
Location: The Swish Alps, SF CA
Posts: 2,144
Originally Posted by Freedom1990 
There was no magic formula for me, Redd. It was a matter of saving my life because I was literally losing my sanity.
The fear of going insane by staying where I was outweighed anything else in my mind.
If you wait for the courage, you may very well be there the rest of your life. That's just my personal experience.
The fear of going insane by staying where I was outweighed anything else in my mind.
If you wait for the courage, you may very well be there the rest of your life. That's just my personal experience.
When the pain of staying became gretaer then the pain of leaving I left, I closed my eyes and jumped and asked for help half way down, at first, the first week it hurt more, then it got better and better.
I made the "leap" when you started posting, I have since "moved on"
come on in, the waters fine
Member
Join Date: Jan 2008
Location: Hertfordshire, UK
Posts: 111
Originally Posted by coyote21
For me, once I got away from the daily drama and chaos, (a drunk was no longer living with me). I was able to SEE exactly how BAD it had really gotten. Things were WAY worse that I'd realized. That realization helped me "get over" the bad/sad feelings. I was like DAMN! I got MAD, that helped a lot.
My ONLY regret is staying so long. I've seen others post that as well.
My ONLY regret is staying so long. I've seen others post that as well.
It took me a good few months after she moved out to actually become used to the quiet and the calm. I'd become so used to the chaos and drama, the walking on eggshells and the undercurrents of tension, that once it was gone I felt almost adrift. Now, though, I relish it. My home is my haven, my place with my children for us to be happy and together. Damn, it's a good feeling.
Sitting here now, with my children fast asleep upstairs and calm pervading my home... I still cannot properly understand why it took me so long to wake up to what was really going on, and why I was so passive for so many years. It's something I'm still working on.
On the other hand, I could've left it for longer. I could've let her beat out the last remnants of my self-respect and been stuck in a deeply dysfunctional alcoholic/codie relationship until the day I died. Nine years down the crapper is way better than forty, and it wasn't all bad - I got to be a daddy!
Mr B.
Member
Join Date: Jun 2007
Posts: 633
My ex's escalating behavior towards our son (guilt tripping, manipulation, campaigning against me for detaching) flipped a switch in my head. Things were already messy, getting a divorce couldn't possibly be worse than what we were living with already.
Awakening
Join Date: Aug 2006
Location: Beautiful Texas hillcountry
Posts: 1,272
Originally Posted by Mr B
I couldn't continue to live my life with someone who regarded a cheap bottle of wine as more attractive and important to her than I was. I'm worth more than that.
Thanks and God bless us all, :praying
Coyote
Wipe your paws elsewhere!
Join Date: Dec 2004
Posts: 3,672
I just copped a feel of my nose, and it feels soft and pliable, so I KNOW you weren't referring to me, but I'll answer anyways.
Think about the worst thing that could happen to you if you stayed in your current situation. Now think about the worst thing that could happen to you if you leave.
The answer quickly becomes clear.
I don't regret leaving; not even for a moment. Leaving wasn't nearly as hard as I had imagined--emotionally, physically, or financially.
Think about the worst thing that could happen to you if you stayed in your current situation. Now think about the worst thing that could happen to you if you leave.
The answer quickly becomes clear.
I don't regret leaving; not even for a moment. Leaving wasn't nearly as hard as I had imagined--emotionally, physically, or financially.
Being Silent so I can Hear
Join Date: Nov 2008
Location: USA
Posts: 2,521
Originally Posted by Freedom1990
There was no magic formula for me, Redd. It was a matter of saving my life because I was literally losing my sanity.
The fear of going insane by staying where I was outweighed anything else in my mind.
If you wait for the courage, you may very well be there the rest of your life. That's just my personal experience.
The fear of going insane by staying where I was outweighed anything else in my mind.
If you wait for the courage, you may very well be there the rest of your life. That's just my personal experience.
Sigh.
I found out today that he has removed all the money in our joint accounts, and shut off the credit cards. He also never put my name on the car I'm driving, and he took the insurance information out of it. So, here I am with no money, no job, a car that can be taken away from me at any time, no phone, etc. I went and applied for welfare today. I'm having a very hard time with that, I feel like such a loser. An absolute and complete loser.
But you know what? We have a roof over our heads tonight, and some food, and it's warm. And safe. I feel pathetic for being grateful for such basic things, but I am grateful, my heart aches I'm so very grateful.
We're making a Christmas wreath for our friend here who had the heart to offer us help when we needed it. We're making it out of pinecones and things we got in the woods, since we have no money. It's soothing for some reason.
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