Hard to just let go

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Old 12-12-2008, 10:47 AM
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Yes I have had many doubts that he was ever in recovery and I am seriously thinking of kicking him back out again bc he has told me many times that he feels like I dont love him anymore... which I still love him but I told him I needed time to get back any kind of trust to have for him... one month in my eyes is not very much time and he thinks i should have been back to normal by now... but in my eyes I had good and bad days where I wouldnt talk to him but I still made it a point to cook him dinner and be there for him and TRY to get things back to normal...he did go to his classes 2 days a week but that hasnt helped... he has good days where he knows what he needs to do and he even started a journal but his relapse was more of a punch in the face to me than anything else and everyday that goes by now makes me realize it more and more...I know I will get the courage to kick him out again even though I know he is gonna say its just a game with him moving out and he thinks we need to be together to solve this and make it work...but I know its not my problem to fix and I want to just run away from it all and start over but having a home together complicates things and the only thing he has ever done is work and I have done everything else, bills, insurance, dinner, etc. etc.
We dont have kids and I am 29 and he is 31 and I told him the other night I will not have kids with him if he cannot be responsible to me... he culture they have kids asap after marriage and his sisters always tell me just have a kid and he will want to change for that kid and I think yea ok but what about for me? Harsh to think? I dont know where I got the courage last time when I kicked him out but I need that strength back quick!!
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Old 12-12-2008, 10:53 AM
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If nothing changes, nothing changes.

I spent five very long and hard years with my EXAH.

Today I deserve better. Today there is no quacking in my life, and I am incredibly grateful for that.
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Old 12-12-2008, 10:54 AM
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wiating,

Please be careful about making family changes thinking that will help push someone to make self changes. I know we have had a little girl in the last year and that was not enough to make me understand the level of the problem I had and the help I needed, that had to come from me. If at all possible can you have these types of candid discussions with your man? and express your serious concerns?

JT
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Old 12-12-2008, 11:08 AM
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Do you have any ideas to share as to what you're going to do for yourself? Al-Anon? Counseling? Open AA meetings? Right now your feelings appear to hinge on what he is or is not doing.

He needs help. His addiction. He owns it. His side of the street. Get back on your side of the street. You have issues of your own you can work on. His addiction is his business. As harsh as this may sound, and I've said it before, you do NOT figure into the equation of his addiction.

Things became far calmer and saner for me once I left my AH to drink himself to death and respected his right to do so. Like it or not, his life is not my life to lead. Wishing and hoping things will change doesn't make things change. My actions and how I decided to live my own life brought about changes for me.
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Old 12-12-2008, 11:10 AM
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I have had many discussions on when I want to have kids with him.... he used to get angry with me bc I didnt want to have kids with him.. at first I was scared bc of his current illegal status and then my worries shifted to his drinking and I started to see a part of him that I could not bring kids up in..
He has days where he understands my reasoning for it and then there are other days when he gets angery and just raises his eyebrows and says whatever.... I will not have a child with somebody that cannot show me some respect and I do not want my kids to be at home and asking wheres daddy when he is out drinking or if he drives home drunk and he gets deported... he has no more chances with anything if he gets another DUI he gets deported , he is excluded off of our insurance bc of his record and he went to jail for a week when he got his 2nd Dui.... but all of those things have not scared him into wanting to change nor has his fear of losing me.... he tells me he is scared to lose me and I am beginning to see he isnt ready to change... I want kids soon but with the right guy... he is a very friendly guy and he has never said a bad word to me and he has kept his job through all of this and that is why it makes it hard for me to give up... but it isnt me giving up I feel like if he doesnt get what he wants he blames others for it ie:me, and so he goes from there
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Old 12-12-2008, 11:16 AM
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I have gone to a couple of Al anon meeting and they have helped me and I have learned how to communicate with him better and not let my anger get the best of me.. I thought my trip to St. Louis for work would have helped him but at dinner that night he was making lame comments such as "what is that red mark on ur neck" which was from my wool coat rubbing it and him saying he wants us to be alone for x mas this year instead of go to my parents house... so I immediately went back to not even wanting to be there with him... yesterday I came home sick from work with the flu and I didnt even care about anything pertaining to him but it gave me time to think again of why am I even here with him.... I dont even know if he is doing coke or not bc I dont wanna bring it up and he has been hanging out with his new friends and I told him his new friends have a negative influence on him and he shrugs it off... it is just hard to live with an active addict and still care so much for them
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Old 12-12-2008, 11:17 AM
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well waiting I understand he is a nice man, as am I. I also kept my job all through the travels I had and they were extensive. I used my job like an excuse to prove I was functional and things were ok. I would often say "hey I go to work everyday at 7 am, I hold a job so get over it". For me those types of things would be one of many items in my bag of excuses to continue down the same path. I was asked to move out in August and it was not until October did I finally realize how much help I truely needed. Once I was was clear and sober for a while I found it very obvious how I had been behaving. I would use any excuse to play upon feelings of others to conitinue my ways and the closer the person was the more leverage that allowed me.

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Old 12-12-2008, 11:39 AM
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hello again
I can say this for sure, when I was still using I would use anything I could to contiue my addiction. THis of course included manipulating those that were close to me. I too worked the entire time and again would use that as another tool in my bag of tricks/lies to further my arguements. I would often say "hey I work, I go in every day at 7 am and ern a decent living, I am fine so deal with it". I was asked to move out in August of this year and it took me until October to understand the help I needed and the state that I am in. SO be careful for the cunning of manipulation as he may not even be aware of the level in which he is doing this, that makes it even harder to spot or recognize as he is sincere in his mind while in his addiction.

JT
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Old 12-12-2008, 11:53 AM
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Originally Posted by waiting551 View Post
As you may know from my postings my AH is back in the house after I kicked him out for one month..yesterday I called him on his not going to AA and yes I know its only been a week since he has been home but I thought he meant it when he said he wanted to change..

Last night we talked and it went nowhere... he ended up going to his class after I told him he needed to go ..
I really felt better when he wasnt home because I wasnt putting my entire life around him with me worrying if he is drinking or is he doing cocaine again.. we were in constant contact the entire month which may have been bad to do but it was something I was new to ... I still felt like I needed to be there for him..

Last night he told me "If you need more time and want me to leave I will not be coming back"! I was at a loss for words...do I tell him ok just leave or do I fight some more for us to work it out... He also told me "I will give it 2 months and I will keep going to my classes and after that if you dont feel any different about me then im outta ur life forever..

He got pissed of that I was saying anything about him not going when I told him b4 that I didnt think I had to tell him to go to AA... He started to give me the excuses of well it was snowing and its hasnt been a week yet.. I am going to start going to Al Anon and I am to the point that I am done and just want to give up.... its been 5 years of the same thing on and off and nothing has changed..
I really need the time apart from him but I feel like he is trapping me into keeping him home by saying its over if he has to leave again ..Or is his threatening me by saying its over his addiction talking again.. I am only so strong with this and I want to have kids someday but his actions are holding me back...

I think to myslef maybe I should just tell him I need more time and if he is going to want to end it on that condition then its his option...
:wtf2
So what can you do take care of yourself and allow him the space to take care of himself as well?

If he really is "changing" or not it will become apparent with time, How can you take care of yourself in the meantime?

I really feel, that in my opinion, both people in a relationship need to be able to bring 100% "to the table" and I have been both the "alcoholic" with a codie, and the codie with an alcoholic, and in both cases unless we both got well trying to have a "real"ationship was futile.

That translates to me getting healthy, not making "them" get healthy, and I have found that if I am healthy, I make healthy decisions.

I have also had to leave "unhealthy" situations in order to "get healthy" but recovery begins and ends with me, not "them" in my experience.
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Old 12-12-2008, 12:05 PM
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Hi JonOthan.

Waiting-----its really hard to understand when you are in the midst of this life with an addict why they dont see what you see. I would hit my head up against the wall day after day saying things like "this just isnt him" "he would never have done that if he werent on those pills" "why cant he see how this is affecting our family" Truth be told they dont see anything but their romance with their doc.

It hurts and its painful but there is nothing and I mean nothing you can do for him. What you can do for yourself is distance yourself from him as much as possible. Go another way. Find another path and see where that takes you.

Since my ex has been in rehab I have been looking for changes and well I see some they just arent enough. I feel that the last conversation we had I wasnt on the hamster wheel (talking talking and getting no where with him) thats progress but he isnt really working the program and that hurts because then I start saying "if he would just get ahold of this and start to make changes he would see that his desire to get better is greater then his problems" but of course thats me expecting him to see what I see.

Its so much easier to get off the rollercoaster and live your own life. There is nothing you can do for him. Make your life better. Do for you. Make your own dreams come true. Noone else is gonna do that for you but you.....
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Old 12-12-2008, 12:44 PM
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anvil, these are some great non-drinking analogies you've been coming up with. I think you should consider a book LOL!
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Old 12-12-2008, 12:45 PM
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Anvil and others thank you soo much ... I have gotten my life back lil by lil this past month... and his family hasnt even contacted me once to say hang in there or we are here for ya!! That is just going to show me they are fine with his alcohol and maybe even posibly thinking it will just go away... He has all the right things to say to me like Jonathan has said and once again I thought he would change from his month away but I see now that he needs some serious detachment bc its just hurting me more to keep him there and see him everyday than it would be for me to kick him out again and cut communication and see how he reacts to that... he has told me prior that if I did kick him out again he wouldnt be back and he would go back to MX and I told him well good luck.... Hurts to know he can just walk away when I have invested 5 years of this vicous cycle and he cant even work on it for more than a month... almost like he cant handle the pressure and he gets embarrassed when ppl know about his prob and he gets angery..
First step is the hardest but after that first step the rest will follow.. so I hope my 1st step is soon..
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Old 12-12-2008, 02:36 PM
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waiting, I would suggest you go back to the beginning of this thread and read every one of your posts. I know a tremendous amount about the addict because your posts are all about him. Do you know what enmeshment is about? It's when things get out of balance.

Perhaps you might begin to recognize that some well-meaning people here are giving you some suggestions as to what worked for them and why it worked. You might also begin to see a pattern where you don't respond to what people are saying but continue to discuss the addict.

I'm trying to understand what is keeping you tied to this man. Wishful thinking? Memories of what he was like "back then"? Even if that's the case, I hope you'll consider that everything you're telling us is pretty much revolving around his life and not your's.
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Old 12-15-2008, 07:38 AM
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You are 100% right when you say that..... I can say I did let him back in to leave myself with a clear view that yes I gave it another shot and he didnt change... for myself I wanted one last chance to see if he had hit his rock bottom to see what he is gonna miss when he does lose me but it didnt sink in deep enough... I have gotten back in touch with all of my old friends from my home town ....when I moved here to my new town 5 years ago I lost touch and made my AH my main thing in my life.... I have gone to AA and I have learned to communicate to my AH and to help me realize it isnt my fault and I can recognize now when he flips things around and puts the blame on me... I no longer feel sorry for myself nor do I feel sorry for him... letting him back in this time was a step to either his recovery or a step towards acceptance that it was over... I can read and see I was still worrying about what he does... thank you for that as I see I also have a journey to understanding the still embedded codie habits I have....
I told him last night after he acted standoffish when I didnt want to get intimate with him... I feel as if I am on a mountain hiking towards him and he is at the top with his stop watch and his alcohol within reach and when I dont hike fast enough he tells me I am not doing it fast enough and I am not showing him enough love so he drinks and then pushes me back down the hill to the bottom again to start over again .... but now I am hiking but taking a different route to the top... trying to find my own way and not worrying about what he is doing at the top bc eventually he will look for me and I wont be there so he will go Down that hill like a rock looking for me but I will be at the top bc I took my own way to get there....
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Old 12-15-2008, 07:56 AM
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Hello and Happy Monday Waiting,

We all know these are difficult things to do and of course make informed decisions when matters of the heart are involved as well. What I have found in people is this, I believe all people to be fundamentally good inside and I do really believe that to be true. I have also further found that unhealthy people with diseases that affect the decision making allow for and often allow for confusing behaviors. These behaviors typically continue to exude from the untreated individual. I know this as I am without question and alcoholic who is with a codie as well ( to steal your term) we both take care of our mental selves with AL-Anon and AA along with the weekly couples therapist. For us I do know without the input from the above groups we tend to return to the same travels quickly and consistently. This of course did not come about over night as I said before, it takes true honesty in three ways, Self, Each Other, Others (outside help) to move anywhere. Maybe this approach would allow you to either move on or be assured you have done all you believe you can in way that does not leaving you holding anything in your emotional bag at the end of the day. Again I know I dont have all the answers nor do I know all the details of your situation, but I do know at heart the way this has been for me and mine.

LOVE
JT
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Old 01-11-2009, 01:32 PM
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well I have tried my hardest and went to Al Anon and to no avail!!

Me and my Ah got into it last night again bc he got mad when I didnt want to be intimate with him.. maybe had something to do with me having my annual gyno visit!!!

He then started in that I havent got to being the same ol wife as before and I told him I feel as if I have did a lot for myself lately and he should be able to see the big difference.
All the reasons he can give me are not kising the same not same amount of intimate times and I have just changed!!
Hmm well lets see I have been going to Al Anon and taking care of myslef and doing what makes me happy. am in the process of getting enrolled in school.
It does make it hard to spend 5 years fighting for your marriage and then to put it in the hands of my Ah you after 2 months of being back doesnt see what he likes and tells you he doesnt feel like I am giving him enough love. and to top it off he tells me he isnt gonna go to AA classes anymore after one month of him telling me he is gonna go and he never went for an entire month.. It feels like he is just giving up on us and that is what hurts the most..
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Old 01-11-2009, 01:43 PM
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Waiting,

I'm not sure what you mean by "you have tried your hardest....but to no avail"

Just what was it you were trying to accomplish? Al-Anon and recovery programs are about building & growing & educating YOU, and you have clearly grown in yourself, so it appears it has worked. If you were trying to manipulate his behavior by going to Al-Anon, then no, THAT hasn't worked, but that's entirely the wrong reason to do it anyway.

It's your AH that hasn't changed. You dare to not want to be intimate for one night and he attacks you. He isn't in a recovery program. He's just as abusive as he was before. It's all about him, just as it always was. You are trying and he is not.

Only you can decide whether this is the way you want to live.

Stop thinking of it as "he's giving up on you" and start thinking about whether this is the life you want. It's YOUR choice, not his.

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Old 01-11-2009, 02:19 PM
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Guess it was just a sad thought of mine if I got my life back together then he would see he can do the same thing. I go back and forth with myslef saying he is in recovery and saying he is not. He drank a half of glass of whine on Xmas eve and then 3 days later a beer with my brother ( my brother doesnt know about his problem) I asked him why it would have been so hard to just tell him "look i dont wanna drink right now" there didnt need to be any lenghty explanation.. it would have shown me he was in recovery..
I am sad and sickened right now from all of this he has left to go to church right when I was bawling and telling him that he is too blind to see he has a wife who loves him and is sad to see him act like he has no problem.. He just continues to say " this is how its gonna be years from now and you have lost the love you felt for me"
Now I wonder if he was just going to AA to appease me bc simple enough he say " Im not going to AA anymore Im going to do some church programs.. I was yea ok those really helped ya in the past.... I was doing so good and now I am sitting here bawling and trying to grasp what has just happened... was he ever really in recovery or just a cover up.. He wants to see me just forgive and forget but I try to tell him everytime it takes time to heal a heart and he just thinks that once you get hurt that bad that you dont come back around... but one month isnt long enough nor do I know how much time it takes to heal but like I told him I was coming back around when on Dec 6th you made the choice to go drinking and drive home..
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Old 01-11-2009, 02:30 PM
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The higher my expectations of others, the lower my serenity.

There's a huge difference between someone truly in recovery, and someone just trying to get a monkey off their back.

Alanon has helped me tremendously in moving forward in my life.
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Old 01-11-2009, 02:42 PM
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I'm so sorry this is all so painful for you, waiting.

I can only suggest that get very clear on what you're willing to accept, and practice setting some boundaries around it. You can't rely on him to act as you want him to act....but you can protect yourself.
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