My ex is now a homless man
Member
Join Date: Jul 2004
Location: Starting over all over again
Posts: 4,426
Hey there kermeeee 
um.... that's not the program I have over here. My program says that there is a _difference_ between "giving up" and "enabling".
When I do stuff for my addict that she is perfectly capable of doing for herself then what I am doing is giving up on _her_ ability to be a responsible adult. I am giving up on her ability to be responsible for herself and make her own decisions in life. You mention how you support your daughter in going to college, and _she_ is responsible for her own payments on her car. You are not "giving up" on her by allowing her to learn how to be financially responsible.
I was married 20yrs, have one daughter and 4 grandkids. What binds me to my ex-wife is _not_ the 20yrs, or the kids, or all the stuff we did together. What binds me to her is the promise I made my HP when I married her. The catch is that my ex-wife made the exact same promise, in front of our friends, our family, a preacher, and her HP.
My promise was _mutual_. My HP expects _both_ of us to follow thru on that promise, not just one of us. The whole point of marriage is that we do it together, as a team. When my ex-wife abandoned our marriage for three other guys and a bottle of pills her side of the promise was broken. The promise that bound us together was broken by her _choice_.
If my ex-wife were to call me and ask me to go drive her to rehab I would _first_ call the rehab and see if they have a bed for her, otherwise she'd just weasel her way into staying with me. If there is a rehab, salvation army, hospital, or such to take her in I would then call some women friends I have in AA and ask if _they_ would go get her, simply because they are in a much better position to teach her recovery than I am.
That, dear Kermee, is the best example of working our recovery that I have seen in a long time. I am honored to be your friend and grateful that you are willing to share your story with me. You keep working on your program, going to your meets and talking to your sponsor and you will make it thru life just fine, the same way all the rest of us are.
Mike (((((( hugs ))))))
Originally Posted by kermit 
... I won't give up on ANY human being and I feel that the program wnats me to....
When I do stuff for my addict that she is perfectly capable of doing for herself then what I am doing is giving up on _her_ ability to be a responsible adult. I am giving up on her ability to be responsible for herself and make her own decisions in life. You mention how you support your daughter in going to college, and _she_ is responsible for her own payments on her car. You are not "giving up" on her by allowing her to learn how to be financially responsible.
Originally Posted by kermit
... I have 20yrs and 3 chidren pain suffering hope and Love binding me to this man....
My promise was _mutual_. My HP expects _both_ of us to follow thru on that promise, not just one of us. The whole point of marriage is that we do it together, as a team. When my ex-wife abandoned our marriage for three other guys and a bottle of pills her side of the promise was broken. The promise that bound us together was broken by her _choice_.
If my ex-wife were to call me and ask me to go drive her to rehab I would _first_ call the rehab and see if they have a bed for her, otherwise she'd just weasel her way into staying with me. If there is a rehab, salvation army, hospital, or such to take her in I would then call some women friends I have in AA and ask if _they_ would go get her, simply because they are in a much better position to teach her recovery than I am.
Originally Posted by kermit
... I have grown so much in the last 2 years there is Nothing that I will not acomplish on my own. I need no man, no woman just me! ....
Mike (((((( hugs ))))))
When Pigs Fly
Thread Starter
Join Date: Jan 2006
Location: california
Posts: 894
now his girlfriend is e-mailing me, saying that he didn't come home but if he wants she will make a deal with him because it is so cold in ND. So I aasked what good would that do? Basically I told her to run as fast as she could,before she is sucked in by all his lies and empty promises...
Member
Join Date: Feb 2007
Location: To the East
Posts: 81
Hi Kermit,
I feel for you in my heart, I identify with you so much and because you shared this - I don't feel alone today. here it is Sunday, I am thinking what I had to do recently, have my AH committed to a 30 day incarceration, substance abuse program. He knows once he comes out of there, December 26th, he does not have a home to come to. He might be able to get into a half way house but I have no false hope he will stay sober. there is no family left, no friends, no job.
It sounds to me like you have been in recovery for awhile and are making great strides in dealing with the co-dependancy, my hat is off to you, I look up to folks like you and because of folks like you, I too have hope I can get there someday.
it does hurt that we cannot help "them". It does hurt that we have to see/hear about the decline of a once sober person we loved. Our love turns into pity, our hopes and dreams shattered. Dealing with the human being that has to hit a bottom so low that they would give up a good spouse, home, family, great jobs and for what? that clear liquid in a bottle that destroys all in its path.
Please know that you are in everyones thoughts and prayers, you are a survivor and will get through this as well. The only time I haven't been worried about my AH in the past 7 years has been when he was in jail for DUI for 2 years.
You are reaching out and that makes me believe in you and that you will be okay.
KNOW you are not alone Kermit
L
I feel for you in my heart, I identify with you so much and because you shared this - I don't feel alone today. here it is Sunday, I am thinking what I had to do recently, have my AH committed to a 30 day incarceration, substance abuse program. He knows once he comes out of there, December 26th, he does not have a home to come to. He might be able to get into a half way house but I have no false hope he will stay sober. there is no family left, no friends, no job.
It sounds to me like you have been in recovery for awhile and are making great strides in dealing with the co-dependancy, my hat is off to you, I look up to folks like you and because of folks like you, I too have hope I can get there someday.
it does hurt that we cannot help "them". It does hurt that we have to see/hear about the decline of a once sober person we loved. Our love turns into pity, our hopes and dreams shattered. Dealing with the human being that has to hit a bottom so low that they would give up a good spouse, home, family, great jobs and for what? that clear liquid in a bottle that destroys all in its path.
Please know that you are in everyones thoughts and prayers, you are a survivor and will get through this as well. The only time I haven't been worried about my AH in the past 7 years has been when he was in jail for DUI for 2 years.
You are reaching out and that makes me believe in you and that you will be okay.
KNOW you are not alone Kermit
L
Wipe your paws elsewhere!
Join Date: Dec 2004
Posts: 3,672
It is very sad, Kermie. I found that when I stopped helping Richard, he started helping himself. Those eight months of sobriety he found just before he died he found all by himself at the lowest point in his life. He found the strength to help himself because I had stopped rescuing him. He was never able to become sober when I was helping him.
Sometimes the best help I can offer comes in the form of me doing nothing. It took me a long time to learn that. The folks here at SR wouldn't give up on me; they kept showing me the way.
I am so grateful that I stepped back and allowed Richard to find sobriety for himself. Those last eight sober months we spent together were really a gift from God. I was able to see one last glimpse of my special man before he died. I have many happy memories from that period of time. God was telling me how to help Richard. He was telling me to back away and let him take the reins. God did a much better job of taking care of Richard than I did. He knew exactly what was needed.
Sometimes the best help I can offer comes in the form of me doing nothing. It took me a long time to learn that. The folks here at SR wouldn't give up on me; they kept showing me the way.
I am so grateful that I stepped back and allowed Richard to find sobriety for himself. Those last eight sober months we spent together were really a gift from God. I was able to see one last glimpse of my special man before he died. I have many happy memories from that period of time. God was telling me how to help Richard. He was telling me to back away and let him take the reins. God did a much better job of taking care of Richard than I did. He knew exactly what was needed.
Member
Join Date: Dec 2007
Location: Peoria IL
Posts: 8
Kermit, I really feel for you. I have not been here for quite some time either, but I am so glad to be back and reading everyone's posts. When I first came to this site I felt much as you do. I have 3 children with the ex. don't get me wrong. I was married when I first came to Alanon and this site. It just gave me the strength to detach with love not just detach as I first thought I had to do. I took the exa to the mission twice myself after rehab was forced on him twice. We get through quite a bit together and he knows I still care about him. We were together for 24 years but as the kids got older I decided it was not fair to keep walking around the elephant in the livingroom. They were all doing so well and still are. Well, as good as acoa can. We are still and always will be a work in progress. They have seen it all just as I have. He said I was filling their heads full of stuff, but I never said anything, they were living it too. Kids are just so darn smart. They also know that he will always be their Dad. We just pray for him everyday to want to be healthy. If he can't, we will still be here, just not cleaning up his puke.
Member
Join Date: Feb 2007
Location: "Somewhere in Ohio" ... little joke from past
Posts: 481
Kermit, what you are experiencing is my biggest fear for my XABF. It may also be the only thing that saves him. I know I can't do it.
Like Denny said, don't assume that people on here don't think like you. I do. I have never given up hope for my XABF. I keep my distance which is easy because he doesn't want anything to do with me. But if he called and asked me for a ride to rehab, I bet I would hop in the car.
I just can't guarantee that I'll always do the "right" thing in life and I can't guarantee that what other people telling me is "right" anyway. If it's right, how come so many As are being buried? Something different has to happen, but I don't know what. I'm not saying I'm the one who has to do it, but as a whole, the problem of alcoholism isn't getting better.
Just the same ... I would not allow my XABF to take me or my family down. No way.
Like Denny said, don't assume that people on here don't think like you. I do. I have never given up hope for my XABF. I keep my distance which is easy because he doesn't want anything to do with me. But if he called and asked me for a ride to rehab, I bet I would hop in the car.
I just can't guarantee that I'll always do the "right" thing in life and I can't guarantee that what other people telling me is "right" anyway. If it's right, how come so many As are being buried? Something different has to happen, but I don't know what. I'm not saying I'm the one who has to do it, but as a whole, the problem of alcoholism isn't getting better.
Just the same ... I would not allow my XABF to take me or my family down. No way.
Member
Join Date: Nov 2004
Location: USA
Posts: 346
I can identify where you are, Kermit. I filed for divorce and AH and I are still living in the same house. He looks older and more worn every day and it breaks my heart - because he's human - and was in recovery when we met -and he is the father of my children - and for what I've lost. Not that what I had was great but it is still a loss and deserves the grieving process.
My heart breaks for my children in that their dad is going down the path of destruction and is seemingly fantastic with his decision. Who gets that?!?!
Be kind to your heart and honor your feelings - even though they hurt.
My heart breaks for my children in that their dad is going down the path of destruction and is seemingly fantastic with his decision. Who gets that?!?!
Be kind to your heart and honor your feelings - even though they hurt.
Member
Join Date: Dec 2007
Location: The Jungle
Posts: 5,435
Compassion is a good thing. Sometimes those who seem least deserving are most in need of our compassion. But compassion isn't necessarily an action.....it's more of an emotion......it's sympathy or empathy. It's ok to have compassion for someone but not help them out of their pickle.
I have tremendous compassion for my A son as he struggles to overcome his demons. But I know that I can't (for his sake because I love him so very much) fight the demons for him.
gentle hugs to you
I have tremendous compassion for my A son as he struggles to overcome his demons. But I know that I can't (for his sake because I love him so very much) fight the demons for him.
gentle hugs to you
CindeRella is proof that a new pair of shoes can change your life!
Join Date: Aug 2004
Location: Spreading my wings
Posts: 7,163
Kermy 
Congrats on being almost done! 7 weeks to go! That is a great accomplishment! Be proud of you!
My hear goes out to you-many good things were said here-
Loving and caring for them and their well being is ok, it is the enabling that we cannot allow ourselves to do. Finding him is something you would like to do, I know that feeling all too well--Just let go and let HP ...
It is a hard situation-be gentle with yourself and take care of you! Go to the meetings, call your sponsor and live your life according to you now.
You are human hence the feelings and it is ok-
AHEM Honey! Keep shining your doing great!
Congrats on being almost done! 7 weeks to go! That is a great accomplishment! Be proud of you!
My hear goes out to you-many good things were said here-
Loving and caring for them and their well being is ok, it is the enabling that we cannot allow ourselves to do. Finding him is something you would like to do, I know that feeling all too well--Just let go and let HP ...
It is a hard situation-be gentle with yourself and take care of you! Go to the meetings, call your sponsor and live your life according to you now.
You are human hence the feelings and it is ok-
Originally Posted by kermit
... I have grown so much in the last 2 years there is Nothing that I will not acomplish on my own. I need no man, no woman just me! ....
... I have grown so much in the last 2 years there is Nothing that I will not acomplish on my own. I need no man, no woman just me! ....
Progress Not Perfection
Join Date: Nov 2007
Location: "Further up and further in!"---C.S. Lewis
Posts: 563
Thank you for this thread. It really touched a chord in me. Sorry if this is long.
"We're too old to lie about these things - it is possible that he might not make it. That's the painful reality. But the other part of that reality is that there are dozens of hands outstretched toward him even in this, his darkest hour. It is up to him to take one and lift himself up. If he does not, that is what he as an adult chose to do, as incomprehensible as it might seem to us to make that choice."---wants out
"My heart breaks for my children in that their dad is going down the path of destruction and is seemingly fantastic with his decision. Who gets that?!?!"--beautiful
My mom never kicked Dad out and he still died because of complications with his smoking and alcohol addiction. He was DETERMINED to die as an active alchoholic whether homeless or not.
This has been my biggest struggle to comprehend and I still don't understand I don't think I ever will.
As a child of 2 alchohlics I ask you, please focus on the children. You don''t want to "put him in the ground" but are you willing to expose your children to what could be a slow, painful, ugly death at home, and then still have to "put him in the ground" anyway?
The reality is that my mom, sister and brother went throught just that.
Peace at home for your childrens sake. Like others have said, protect them from the storm.
"God was telling me how to help Richard. He was telling me to back away and let him take the reins. God did a much better job of taking care of Richard than I did. He knew exactly what was needed." --former doormat
"After this extended period of time you still think you matter and can change something that has nothing to do with you. It’s about him, his emotions and his choice. You must remember that."--Mr. Christian
You are not responsible for any human being.
You are only responsible for yourself.
There are millions of "you" who could help him out in public, if our Higher Power so chooses to use them to help him.
"if I give up on him I might as well give up on me." In my humble opinion, this is chilling. Red Flag! Resist feeling like a martyr.
Danger! You WILL get sacrificed by alcohol.
Pt. 3
"If it's right, how come so many As are being buried?"--CBrown
After Dad died, I questioned the program and gave up on the program. I thought I had been lied to. My home group focused on my Dads hopeful recovery. He died and alchoholic. He never saw one sober day. He never wanted help or to help himself and he died.
I felt betrayed, like, if I worked the program, Dad would get sober.
It was not the programs fault that no one in my al-anon home group had an alcoholic die, yet. It wasn't the programs fault that I, in my pride, thought I could save my Dad by working the program.
That was a hard pill to swallow, so I licked my wounds for a while, seperate from the program.
Well, I hit another bottom and life was unmangageable again. lol
I am back in the program today. I am so grateful for this program today. I wasn't grateful for the program before. I only used the program to acheive the desired outcome *I* wanted.
For those of you who question the program, know that, IMHO, that is a part of the process. It was for me.
I had to step back for a while in order to value the program again.
We will always be here for you *when you are ready*.
love to my al-anon family,
Growing
"We're too old to lie about these things - it is possible that he might not make it. That's the painful reality. But the other part of that reality is that there are dozens of hands outstretched toward him even in this, his darkest hour. It is up to him to take one and lift himself up. If he does not, that is what he as an adult chose to do, as incomprehensible as it might seem to us to make that choice."---wants out
"My heart breaks for my children in that their dad is going down the path of destruction and is seemingly fantastic with his decision. Who gets that?!?!"--beautiful
My mom never kicked Dad out and he still died because of complications with his smoking and alcohol addiction. He was DETERMINED to die as an active alchoholic whether homeless or not.
This has been my biggest struggle to comprehend and I still don't understand I don't think I ever will.
As a child of 2 alchohlics I ask you, please focus on the children. You don''t want to "put him in the ground" but are you willing to expose your children to what could be a slow, painful, ugly death at home, and then still have to "put him in the ground" anyway?
The reality is that my mom, sister and brother went throught just that.
Peace at home for your childrens sake. Like others have said, protect them from the storm.
"God was telling me how to help Richard. He was telling me to back away and let him take the reins. God did a much better job of taking care of Richard than I did. He knew exactly what was needed." --former doormat
"After this extended period of time you still think you matter and can change something that has nothing to do with you. It’s about him, his emotions and his choice. You must remember that."--Mr. Christian
You are not responsible for any human being.
You are only responsible for yourself.
There are millions of "you" who could help him out in public, if our Higher Power so chooses to use them to help him.
"if I give up on him I might as well give up on me." In my humble opinion, this is chilling. Red Flag! Resist feeling like a martyr.
Danger! You WILL get sacrificed by alcohol.
Pt. 3
"If it's right, how come so many As are being buried?"--CBrown
After Dad died, I questioned the program and gave up on the program. I thought I had been lied to. My home group focused on my Dads hopeful recovery. He died and alchoholic. He never saw one sober day. He never wanted help or to help himself and he died.
I felt betrayed, like, if I worked the program, Dad would get sober.
It was not the programs fault that no one in my al-anon home group had an alcoholic die, yet. It wasn't the programs fault that I, in my pride, thought I could save my Dad by working the program.
That was a hard pill to swallow, so I licked my wounds for a while, seperate from the program.
Well, I hit another bottom and life was unmangageable again. lol
I am back in the program today. I am so grateful for this program today. I wasn't grateful for the program before. I only used the program to acheive the desired outcome *I* wanted.
For those of you who question the program, know that, IMHO, that is a part of the process. It was for me.
I had to step back for a while in order to value the program again.
We will always be here for you *when you are ready*.
love to my al-anon family,
Growing
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