Am I doing the right thing?
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Join Date: Apr 2012
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Am I doing the right thing?
My AH is begging me for "one more chance to change." I hear him saying that, but I don't see him taking ACTION. I think his alcohol issue is progressing. He used to go months, even a year, without going on a binge. Now, he's getting SUPER drunk every two weeks/every other week. It's affecting his business now. He gets drunk (he can handle a LOT of alcohol), drinks for 2-3 days, then feels sorry for himself for 2-3 days in bed (no shower, neglects feeding the dogs, etc.), then starts feeling better and proclaims he's going to change "this time" and "never do it again." I know now not to believe him. I'm just wondering what stage he's at. I know when I find a place and move out, he's going to keep doing this, probably more and more frequently. The best thing I can do for him (and me and my kids) is leave, right? Because if I gave him another chance, we both know he would just do the same thing, and we'll stay on this crazy cycle. He won't call himself an alcoholic. But yesterday he drank a bottle of wine because he felt so bad from the liquor and was feeling "shaky." He is at a really low point, but I feel so clear about the fact that moving out is the only thing that will ensure the boys' happiness. It will be really sad to see him descend further into this, though. I just don't see how he could possibly change if he doesn't accept that he's an alcoholic. Who knows, he may stay like this forever. It's going to suck always wondering if he's drank himself to death, wondering if I should go check on him since he has no family in this country.
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Join Date: May 2010
Location: USA
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Alcohol is a progressive disease, sounds like it has progressed for him quite a bit. Can you live like this anymore? Only you can decide this. There is always help and he is always free to reach out and get it. Maybe if his family lives out of the country he needs to go spend some time with them. It is for him to figure out. You have to do what is good and safe for you and your children, only you can decide what that is.
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Join Date: May 2010
Location: USA
Posts: 13,560
They say what they say when they can see you are serious about it. That you actually mean to walk your talk so to speak. When and if he is ever serious FOR HIMSELF is when it will be a success. That may never happen. It is not for you to decide, that is for him. What you have to decide is what you want for you and your children.
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Join Date: Dec 2012
Posts: 1,407
He's not really begging you for the chance to change....that's his decision to make. He's just begging you to stay. Please don't upset the status quo. Please be there for whatever he needs. Please don't make him have to face himself.
In the meantime, who looks after what your children really need? It won't be him, he's too caught up in his disease. If he needs an entire bottle of wine to offset the withdrawals from his last drink...he's in deep ( I say this because that's where my RABF was). Your kids don't need to be witness to this spiral. Take care of them and you. It's up to your AH to face his reality and seek help.
Don't feel guilty about your choices. He's making his, and you're making yours. It's okay to not take a front row seat to someone's addiction. It's okay to want a healthy peaceful life for you and your kids.
In the meantime, who looks after what your children really need? It won't be him, he's too caught up in his disease. If he needs an entire bottle of wine to offset the withdrawals from his last drink...he's in deep ( I say this because that's where my RABF was). Your kids don't need to be witness to this spiral. Take care of them and you. It's up to your AH to face his reality and seek help.
Don't feel guilty about your choices. He's making his, and you're making yours. It's okay to not take a front row seat to someone's addiction. It's okay to want a healthy peaceful life for you and your kids.
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Join Date: Dec 2013
Location: Silicon Valley, CA
Posts: 2,066
Originally Posted by Recovering2 
He's not really begging you for the chance to change....that's his decision to make. He's just begging you to stay. Please don't upset the status quo. Please be there for whatever he needs. Please don't make him have to face himself..
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Thread Starter
Join Date: Apr 2012
Posts: 485
I just don't understand why he doesn't stop. I mean, I know I can't fully understand because I'm not an alcoholic. But he's just so miserable. And he must feel physically awful. I guess I never believed it when people told me it's progressive, it gets worse. I never saw him as dependent on alcohol. I just thought he binged sometimes. Now, I've woken up and I see how bad it is.
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Join Date: Aug 2011
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EmmyG----when you find yourself growing weak---think of your boys and their innocent, sweet faces....and remind yourself that you are the only one who can save them from growing up in alcoholism.
dandylion
dandylion
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Join Date: May 2010
Location: USA
Posts: 13,560
Emmy...that is the exact reason we cannot be their support system. I do not understand it either, likely never will. But one thing I do know is that they have free tools out there and it is their choice if they use them or not. You don't have to figure him out, you just have to figure you out!
Hugs!
Hugs!
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Join Date: Oct 2013
Posts: 11,431
Hi Emmy;
I grew up with an alcoholic and it did keep progressing and my life became a nightmare more than a childhood much of the time.
It also affected my adulthood and the choices and relationships I formed--I became an alcoholic myself (role model I saw for dealing with problems) and I dated unhealthy people for many years to keep my co-dependency going. That's just the tip of the iceberg.
Please think of the impact this will have on your boys even if you are willing to put up with it. (Which I do not think is a good idea for you either).
I'm not saying he will be like my mother, but there is not any way on earth you will be able to control your home environment with him in it to protect your kids
if he is getting worse. It's already starting to happen now.
As others have said, he can get sober while you are living elsewhere "out of the range of fire" as Hammer says and chances are perhaps better that he will start to see he has a big problem when you walk out the door. But that's for him to worry about and not you.
Please take care of yourself and know that we support you in your choices always.
I grew up with an alcoholic and it did keep progressing and my life became a nightmare more than a childhood much of the time.
It also affected my adulthood and the choices and relationships I formed--I became an alcoholic myself (role model I saw for dealing with problems) and I dated unhealthy people for many years to keep my co-dependency going. That's just the tip of the iceberg.
Please think of the impact this will have on your boys even if you are willing to put up with it. (Which I do not think is a good idea for you either).
I'm not saying he will be like my mother, but there is not any way on earth you will be able to control your home environment with him in it to protect your kids
if he is getting worse. It's already starting to happen now.
As others have said, he can get sober while you are living elsewhere "out of the range of fire" as Hammer says and chances are perhaps better that he will start to see he has a big problem when you walk out the door. But that's for him to worry about and not you.
Please take care of yourself and know that we support you in your choices always.
Recovered People Pleaser
Join Date: Dec 2013
Location: Heart of Dixie
Posts: 391
If Nothing changes NOTHING changes.
The alcoholism is lying to him. There is no managed nor controlled drinking for an alcoholic. As hopeful4 points out It IS progressive (degenerative actually might be a better term). He is likely in denial..but so are you if you think his word with regard to an addiction is believable. This is not an insult..denial is part of the process on both parts, that of the A and the family.
12 Step programs are about gut level honesty. Action is the only thing that demonstrates change, until action exists the rest is just rhetoric. Change is hard even when we want to, and virtually impossible if we don't.
We ALL become engrained in habits and even those that do not involve addictive substances are hard to change. We find our sub conscious mind a hard combatant. You are not just asking him to quit drinking you are asking for him to make a lifestyle change.
To get an idea of what you are asking him to do I have a challenge for you. Make a change in a habit you have had established for some years for 7 days in a row, simply because it has been asked.
It is called the Bath Challenge:
If you take a shower in the am..take a bath in the pm or vice-versa. A Simple change. I promise you it will require focus, have a ripple effect into other areas of your life and that you will not be without resentment (or a battle in your mind) saying "I don't need to do this, I get it"..but you don't. It's only for 7 days IN A ROW, if you forget, or skip it one day..you are to begin again until you complete the task for 7 consecutive days. Also while you try it-do not complain nor discuss it with anyone other than to say "I just felt like trying something different" IF asked by others in your household about the change. If you yap/or complain add an additional change of a similar habit. Exmaple Swap cabinets in your kitchen..Put the glasses where the plates or pots were and vice versa.
This is an exercise I give all my sponsees when we study change so that they may understand just how small changes effect their entire life and how resistant their attitudes are toward the idea after the 1st day or two.
When I did this challenge it took me 3 weeks to complete it and I had to do the additional task, because I complained and discussed the matter with/to a friend (a lot LOL) and immediately I reverted back to my old habit of regular bath time once the exercise was over...Give it a go (any of you for that matter...who think the A simply chooses to drink..and not make a simple change) and tell me how it goes for you.
Remember action always speaks louder than words and is the only thing that you should listen to from an active addict/alcoholic. You can grant a 2nd chance after they have completed detox, become involved in recovery and made progress, even a 3rd chance after a relapse should they begin again, but with no action..there is no 2nd or 100th chance..just a continuation of the "merry-go-round" dance with the gorilla.
The alcoholism is lying to him. There is no managed nor controlled drinking for an alcoholic. As hopeful4 points out It IS progressive (degenerative actually might be a better term). He is likely in denial..but so are you if you think his word with regard to an addiction is believable. This is not an insult..denial is part of the process on both parts, that of the A and the family.
12 Step programs are about gut level honesty. Action is the only thing that demonstrates change, until action exists the rest is just rhetoric. Change is hard even when we want to, and virtually impossible if we don't.
We ALL become engrained in habits and even those that do not involve addictive substances are hard to change. We find our sub conscious mind a hard combatant. You are not just asking him to quit drinking you are asking for him to make a lifestyle change.
To get an idea of what you are asking him to do I have a challenge for you. Make a change in a habit you have had established for some years for 7 days in a row, simply because it has been asked.
It is called the Bath Challenge:
If you take a shower in the am..take a bath in the pm or vice-versa. A Simple change. I promise you it will require focus, have a ripple effect into other areas of your life and that you will not be without resentment (or a battle in your mind) saying "I don't need to do this, I get it"..but you don't. It's only for 7 days IN A ROW, if you forget, or skip it one day..you are to begin again until you complete the task for 7 consecutive days. Also while you try it-do not complain nor discuss it with anyone other than to say "I just felt like trying something different" IF asked by others in your household about the change. If you yap/or complain add an additional change of a similar habit. Exmaple Swap cabinets in your kitchen..Put the glasses where the plates or pots were and vice versa.
This is an exercise I give all my sponsees when we study change so that they may understand just how small changes effect their entire life and how resistant their attitudes are toward the idea after the 1st day or two.
When I did this challenge it took me 3 weeks to complete it and I had to do the additional task, because I complained and discussed the matter with/to a friend (a lot LOL) and immediately I reverted back to my old habit of regular bath time once the exercise was over...Give it a go (any of you for that matter...who think the A simply chooses to drink..and not make a simple change) and tell me how it goes for you.
Remember action always speaks louder than words and is the only thing that you should listen to from an active addict/alcoholic. You can grant a 2nd chance after they have completed detox, become involved in recovery and made progress, even a 3rd chance after a relapse should they begin again, but with no action..there is no 2nd or 100th chance..just a continuation of the "merry-go-round" dance with the gorilla.
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Join Date: Mar 2013
Location: TX
Posts: 380
Originally Posted by dandylion
Ifnotforgrace----Wowzers!! What an excellent exercise. I am sure that I would fall on my face, day one!.dandylion
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Join Date: Feb 2013
Location: W Washington
Posts: 11,589
grace, i'm familiar with a similar exercise....only it's brushing your teeth. whatever hand you normally brush with, change to the other hand. a habit like teeth brushing is so automatic we don't really THINK about it, we just grab the brush and the toothpaste and go! especially if this is early in the morning, we are already operating on auto pilot.
it takes careful THOUGHT to change a habit. our hand reaches out, we go thru the motions, and maybe during the frothy brushing we remember, oh yeah, that's right I was going to use the other hand. and so we switch, and it's all awkward and uncomfortable.
our habits aren't just created in our minds.....our bodies respond thru motion memory. we become conditioned. and making any change to that conditioning takes time and work, lather rinse repeat.
but addictions are more than just habits. it's a mental obsession coupled with a physical compulsion....we crave/need the substance at a cellular level. our bodies have adapted so that the substance becomes a necessary part of the equation to feel "normal" - even tho our normal is skewed. that's why we go into withdrawals if the substance is withheld. and why we have cravings....in those moments all the addict knows is that MORE will make the insanity stop. (former crack addict here).
the desire to quit has to come from a very deep place, you could call it as being at the level of the soul. talk won't cut it. pleading, tears, threats rarely can reach to that dark place. you might as well say, well just stop breathing. i'm not trying to give the addict an out....it ain't the quitting that's hard....it's the staying quit.
it takes careful THOUGHT to change a habit. our hand reaches out, we go thru the motions, and maybe during the frothy brushing we remember, oh yeah, that's right I was going to use the other hand. and so we switch, and it's all awkward and uncomfortable.
our habits aren't just created in our minds.....our bodies respond thru motion memory. we become conditioned. and making any change to that conditioning takes time and work, lather rinse repeat.
but addictions are more than just habits. it's a mental obsession coupled with a physical compulsion....we crave/need the substance at a cellular level. our bodies have adapted so that the substance becomes a necessary part of the equation to feel "normal" - even tho our normal is skewed. that's why we go into withdrawals if the substance is withheld. and why we have cravings....in those moments all the addict knows is that MORE will make the insanity stop. (former crack addict here).
the desire to quit has to come from a very deep place, you could call it as being at the level of the soul. talk won't cut it. pleading, tears, threats rarely can reach to that dark place. you might as well say, well just stop breathing. i'm not trying to give the addict an out....it ain't the quitting that's hard....it's the staying quit.
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EmmyG-
One of the things I had to remember when I was struggling with similar feelings was this.
If I could love him sober, or if staying with me/staying together was going to make him sober....he already would be.
I stayed a long time, tried multiple times etc.....at least me changing what I was doing was changing the routine.
Hugs.
One of the things I had to remember when I was struggling with similar feelings was this.
If I could love him sober, or if staying with me/staying together was going to make him sober....he already would be.
I stayed a long time, tried multiple times etc.....at least me changing what I was doing was changing the routine.
Hugs.
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