allthatsgood

When they are lying to you and themselves whats the best thing to do? Call them out on their lies or just let it go?

overit263

I'm glad you just posted this. Mine sent an email today saying he got a great paying job and that he's going to pay some of the loans he left me with. I got very upset and uncomfortable and for all I know he's still lying. He won't acknowledge all the pain and wreckage he's caused. Very upsetting/frustrating. I don't know if its worth responding or not.

I guess it depends on the situation. Since they are using, they probably don't care if you call them out because they will just throw more lies on top of it.

anotherfool

Alter conditions, so that your happiness is not dependent on their honesty.

allthatsgood

Alter conditions, so that your happiness is not dependent on their honesty.

Very true. Just wondering if by going along with their lies if we are doing them any good.

anotherfool

I guess I don't think that what WE are doing for THEM is all that important. Haven't we all done enough for them? And for what? More of the same?

I got it easy compared to the veterans, but the endless tragedy continues for so many here. I'm lucky I wasn't a spouse or parent of an addict, and I could just walk away.

More important is what are we doing for ourselves.

anotherfool

And in case the above reads funny, I've got a ton of admiration for you spouses and parents out there. Your strength and resilience is astonishing, your love and compassion (against all odds) commendable, and your faith and hope only demonstrates the best qualities of humanity.

AnvilheadII

WE know they are lying, and THEY know they are lying.

I guess the bigger question is.....why would we let people who lie in close enough to affect our lives? and if they are already close, why aren't we moving them further away?

overit263

Thank you Anvil!

allthatsgood

I guess you are recommending no contact Anvil?

Twofish

Hey, I can usually tell when I'm being lied to especially if it's the ADs are doing the lying. The lies are so out of the realm of believable, it's almost like a joke, seriously, do you expect me to believe that? I hold my tongue a lot especially the lies that are repeats of last weeks; "I lost my purse and all the money in it", heard that one a lot. Unless they are in trouble or someone else is in trouble, I don't let it bother me so much, it's part of the disease. TF

allforcnm

Lying is a symptom of the disease of addiction. It's so hard not to take it personally but as I understand it now a person lies to protect the addiction because their brain can make them feel like drugs are as necessary for survival as food and water. A person will also lie to try to protect relationships knowing what they are doing is unacceptable and afraid of the response if they talk openly. The lies get so crazy and unbelievable because the drugs effect the areas of the brain where people rationalize and sort information- my husband told some ridiculous lies when he was actively using. No one in their right mind would have spouted off such stuff and expected to be believed.... He is not getting off free and clear of lying though; little by little it builds up in guilt and a sense of shame. If done long enough lying also just becomes a habit and reflex all of it's own. Those are my thoughts on why the lying....

What would I do?

I think it depends on the lie; if it is insignificant then I would let it go. If he is lying about his addiction in some way then if it was my husband I would call him out on it. I think it's best to get addiction out in the open in as much of a non confrontational way as possible to keep communication honest and hopefully maintain it at a level where some of the shame/fear will fall away. If the lie caused damage to you then I would also call him out on it because he needs to know its damaged your relationship (negative consequence).

As always, a lot of what we do I think depends on where we are at emotionally.

zoso77

I'm not you. My boundaries have firmed up exponentially since the days of my AXGF. These days, I simply don't tolerate dishonesty.

So, you have a decision to make, and each course of action has its intended and unintended consequences. Ultimately, you have to be honest with yourself in terms of what you're willing to tolerate.

I will ask this, however: if you had a kid brother or sister asking you what you're asking us, what would you tell them?

ZoSo

hopeful4

Well, I usto scream, cry, and beg for him to change. Ha...that did not happen. What did happen is that I have changed. I have detatched. That means I still call him out on his lies, calmly. Then I say nothing else. I don't listen to reasons. I don't listen to excuses. I am done with all of that. I call him out on it not because of him but for my own sanity. I will not allow someone to lie to me and not at least acknowledge to them that I KNOW. I don't make some huge deal about it because really...what is the point. I expect nothing else.

I have made a plan for myself and for my children. I am working through detatchment..for me. It has helped me immensely in that I am no longer carrying around this anger that about buries me every day. I just am. I am trying to live in the moment and plan for the future of my children and I. I cannot rely on him for anything and that is just what I expect out of his part of the plan..nothing. He can be a great father. He can also be a total scumbag. It's up to him and I have very calmly explained that. He is free to choose whatever behavior he chooses. I am free to not have to tolerate that behavior. The difference is, I don't expect him to change it, I expect my behaviors to change, and they are.

It has taken me literally years to get where I am and I feel stronger each day. What I know and have said over and over is that I hate being lied to. More than admitting you relapsed..just tell the truth as I always know anyways....

Good Luck!

allthatsgood

Hopeful4- I also call my son out when he is not being totally honest and lying to me. My question was asked to see our others handled this situation. Some people assumed I had no boundaries regarding this.

hopeful4

Totally understand....that is the reason I call him out on it is for my own boundary and for my own benefit (sanity)...not because I expect it to have any results.

bookreader

But truly Anvil and everyone else,
After time , I think we parents/spouses develop a good radar about lies.
When my AS was active, I could see it in his face, hear it in his voice -
Now that he is working recovery - I find that I still have doubt, but it is different - the doubt is based on what has happened rather than his actions. Example - I lost my ipad; me and other family members immediately went to AS; and it was like a trigger for me - he has always been guilty, why not now?
And that led to anxiety, stress, and all the emotions that this site has been helping me distance....
ipad was under the backseat of my car.......
b.

Lily1918

D and I had a code for calling each other out on our lies.

In the movie Liar Liar, Jim Carrey tries to say that the pen is red, when really it is blue.

If one of us was lying then the other would simply say "whatever, we both know that the pen is blue" 9 times out of 10 the conversation would stop there.

It worked for us because as posted above, there is no point in calling out lies specifically, because more lies will be poured on top of it, but at the same time, pretending to believe the lie is enabling the addict to continue lying.

Another one that we both say is "Although what you are saying may be true, I do not believe you" This way it is not an outright "you're a liar!!!!" and there is less need to be defensive. It turns a "you" statement into an "I" statement, and is less argumentative in approach.

It works for us.

sojourner

If I thought someone were blatantly lying to me, I'd somehow call it out. Like the poster above, I would not be dramatic about it. With my personality, I might say something like "Uh, well I don't know about that" or some form thereof. The conversation would definitely end at that point because of the drama that could happen. My big go-to statement is "I guess we will have to agree to disagree."

I have found that to let a lie go un-challenged by me, I lose part of myself, a very important and ethical part of myself. It also builds my courage to do that. Being that someone else's active addiction reduced me to a fear-filled life, building my courage and self-confidence back is essential.

That's my take on it. Take what helps and leave the rest.. Everyone's situation is different.

needingabreak

"Alter conditions, so that your happiness is not dependent on their honesty. " Wow. That says it all right there. I need to work on that! Hopeful I could have written a lot of what you wrote. The begging, screaming, crying, the anger I hold is deep. My son is still lying but about his relationship issues and what he is doing. Its a long story but he is not happy within himself so looks to others and of course that doesn't work so he goes back and forth from one to another hurting everyone involved. We had a huge blow out last night. I said some things that were harsh but needed to be said. He is seeing a therapist but God knows if he helps at all and that is all he does for recovery. To me, he isn't serious enough. Maybe I shouldn't assume that but it's my gut reaction and what I heard from all the counselors at the rehab. No meetings. I am sick of lying awake at night wondering where he is and what he is doing. The immaturity, the complete selfishness is beyond anything Ive ever seen. He uses everyone. It makes me sick, literally. I told my husband I want to run away. I can't take it anymore. He may not be using at the moment but he is like a dry drunk. The personality has not changed. Thanks for this thread. Great question. And by the way, yes I call my AD out. I want him to know I know he is lying so he knows he isn't fooling anyone.

LovesToTravel

Oh the lying...can't stand it myself. Can't beleive some of the stories I am told. I call my AS out but he just comes up with another one. And I am so tired of hearing "what are you talking about?" I love:

I will try to remember that one.

Oh that is so me but I don't know where I would go. But I like to think about it.

Pray for us all.